Another Paladin situation [Archive] - Wizards Community

Another Paladin situation [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Imric
06-17-04, 07:53 AM we have a thief in our party... and he thieves everything he sees... and we also have the paladin with wisdom of 8 and int of 16... our thief usualy bluffs his way out but the paladin is onto him now and the paladin wants to leave the party.... so then the thief says i wont steal, and steals and bluffs the paladin...
then paladin gets in trouble and the thief comes and risks his life and saving the paladin with 1 hp left, after which he goes steals everything and the paladin catches him stealing from a merchent...
Paladin says something like... WTF! and starts beating up the thief (in game and in real life) drags him back to the in tells the party, heals the thief to full hp and tells him if he does it one more time she will cut his hands off!
after that the thief stops thieving for a while... then the paladin gets into trouble and the thief finds out who did it which is a person that the paladin knows, so the thief without notice goes and kills him and all his evil undead and steals the "bad guys" staff and other awsome magic iteams, Paladin finds out in the morning and investigates without the thief and following clues finds out it was their rogue and she also finds him with all the magic iteams, she does believe a word the thief says. and the session ends. I had a talk with the paladin and she said she hates ppl stealing and i had a talk with the rogue and he said he LOVES stealing i told him he should try to steal from bad guys only and he said he tried and now the Paladin lost ALL her trust she had for the rogue and hates him.
I think i might have to
A) make them leave the city so there is nothing that the rogue can steal... except for gound and leaves which the druid wont be too happy with...
B) let them go thier ways and then make them fight the same enemy together
C) get the rest of the party to kick the rogues ass (the party doesnt really like the rogues stealing since they are more towards NG but really like the stuff he brings them out of no where)
D) kill the rogue and the pal:D
E)Destroy the only city in my world within 40 days of riding by a Black dragon so he cant steal anything and they can go kill the dragon.
F) put a curse on the thief so that he cant steal or otherwise he starts laughing and farting no stop for 10 mins
G) chop of the ends of the thieves fingures so he cant steal but can fight with weapons
H) ban the thief from the city

btw my players will not roll up new PC. also very late, so im very sleepy.
Jenny With The Lantern
06-17-04, 08:48 AM The paladin is unable to punish the thief, what she should do is bring the thief to the local authorities every time she catches him doing something wrong.
Even if she suspects he's doing something wrong, until she has solid proof she can't act. The rogue should just be more careful if he knows the paladin is watching.

If your players dislike the way this is going, have THEM decide which party member they wish to keep and send the other one away.

And next time, make sure the PCs have a good reason to join a certain party and a good reason to STAY with that party.
Henchcritter
06-17-04, 09:02 AM Why doesn't the pally simple turn the rogue over to authority, pallies are suppose to respect fair authority. Being judge jury and executioner is not paladin like if a court of law is available.

If I were you, as GM, I would let the PCs sort out their own business. Sure, you can dish out the results of their actions. If the pally cuts of the hands, his order might get angry at him. Thieves often face harsh punishments when caught.

What would I do:

I would have a talk with the rogue's player. Playing a thieving rogue that does his thieving in the pally's presence is asking for trouble. Ask him to either play his rogue smarter, don't thieve in the party's presence or switch to another character.

I would also talk to the pally's player. The fact the pally dislikes the rogue stealing from an innocent merchant is great. However, stealing from the BBEG should make the pally a bit more pragmatic. Sure, he doesn't need to like it but theft is better then a fully equipped BBEG. "Here Mr BBEG, here's your artifact of ultimate evil(tm) back. Sorry my friend took it from you. As a token of your appreciation I would like it if you didn't use it to enslave the city" is not the paladin way. Also tell him pallies aren't executioners. The must prove the guilt of their suspects and if a court of law is available, use it.

Also one thing should be made clear to both players: play your character in a way it's fun for the whole group. D&D is a social game where a group solves challenges. If you want an ego trip, play a computer game. If you want something highly compatible where you can smash your opponent, play a wargame. Sure, PCs have their differences and disagreement but when they cause a fraction in the party it has gone too far.

Your solutions;
a) Won’t work, if the player is out to steal, he'll find something. It may even make things worse as the fellow partymembers are the only potential victims.
b) That means splitting the gaming time in half, which is impractical.
c) As a GM, you should remain neutral.
d) Railroadish
e) See a
f) see c and d
g) See c
h) Only if he gets caught, however this means a splitting of the party or the a problem

Here's what I should do.
Have one of the pally's superior in the order come to inspect the pally. The rogue question should come up. The superior should give the pally a reprimand for not turning the rogue over to authority. He'll tell the rogue that his theft from the merchant is a harsh crime. However there are mitigating circumstances. The fact he managed to sneak into the BBEG's den and stole some vital equipment means the rogue is brave and might prove useful for the forces of good. Then he makes the rogue an offer: either quit stealing from the innocent and help the pally defeat the BBEG or face the paladin's order’s wrath. The rogue should be smart enough to know he'd better mend his ways. Let the pally elder give the party some items to help them in their fight, this to put a positive bend on all the reprimands.
Imric
06-18-04, 07:33 AM Well we had our game and the pally decided to give our rouge one last chance and believed that there is a BBEG and the whole party went inside killed lots of guys got xp solved stuff BBEG got away and cast spells on the rogue and pally and destroyed some of their equipment and now they are hunting him and made the whole party follow them :) i was soo glad that happened, also the rogue got hold of a class thats like a good assassin so everything turned out for the best.
thanx for the input.
Autosponge
06-18-04, 08:23 AM You can't use the bluff skill on a player.

It's always a bad idea to put a cleptomaniac in the party with a pally.

If a character wants out, let him go. But so there aren't hard feelings, have both players make new characters. If that's not something they want to do, they need to grow up and make it work.

My suggestion is that you ignore every action the thief takes that starts with "I steal..." or "I try to steal..." After a while he'll get tired of wasting his breath and give up, at which point you can continue to enjoy your game without his childish antics getting in the way.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Imric 06-17-04, 07:53 AM	we have a thief in our party... and he thieves everything he sees... and we also have the paladin with wisdom of 8 and int of 16... our thief usualy bluffs his way out but the paladin is onto him now and the paladin wants to leave the party.... so then the thief says i wont steal, and steals and bluffs the paladin... then paladin gets in trouble and the thief comes and risks his life and saving the paladin with 1 hp left, after which he goes steals everything and the paladin catches him stealing from a merchent... Paladin says something like... WTF! and starts beating up the thief (in game and in real life) drags him back to the in tells the party, heals the thief to full hp and tells him if he does it one more time she will cut his hands off! after that the thief stops thieving for a while... then the paladin gets into trouble and the thief finds out who did it which is a person that the paladin knows, so the thief without notice goes and kills him and all his evil undead and steals the "bad guys" staff and other awsome magic iteams, Paladin finds out in the morning and investigates without the thief and following clues finds out it was their rogue and she also finds him with all the magic iteams, she does believe a word the thief says. and the session ends. I had a talk with the paladin and she said she hates ppl stealing and i had a talk with the rogue and he said he LOVES stealing i told him he should try to steal from bad guys only and he said he tried and now the Paladin lost ALL her trust she had for the rogue and hates him. I think i might have to A) make them leave the city so there is nothing that the rogue can steal... except for gound and leaves which the druid wont be too happy with... B) let them go thier ways and then make them fight the same enemy together C) get the rest of the party to kick the rogues ass (the party doesnt really like the rogues stealing since they are more towards NG but really like the stuff he brings them out of no where) D) kill the rogue and the pal:D E)Destroy the only city in my world within 40 days of riding by a Black dragon so he cant steal anything and they can go kill the dragon. F) put a curse on the thief so that he cant steal or otherwise he starts laughing and farting no stop for 10 mins G) chop of the ends of the thieves fingures so he cant steal but can fight with weapons H) ban the thief from the city btw my players will not roll up new PC. also very late, so im very sleepy.
Jenny With The Lantern 06-17-04, 08:48 AM	The paladin is unable to punish the thief, what she should do is bring the thief to the local authorities every time she catches him doing something wrong. Even if she suspects he's doing something wrong, until she has solid proof she can't act. The rogue should just be more careful if he knows the paladin is watching. If your players dislike the way this is going, have THEM decide which party member they wish to keep and send the other one away. And next time, make sure the PCs have a good reason to join a certain party and a good reason to STAY with that party.
Henchcritter 06-17-04, 09:02 AM	Why doesn't the pally simple turn the rogue over to authority, pallies are suppose to respect fair authority. Being judge jury and executioner is not paladin like if a court of law is available. If I were you, as GM, I would let the PCs sort out their own business. Sure, you can dish out the results of their actions. If the pally cuts of the hands, his order might get angry at him. Thieves often face harsh punishments when caught. What would I do: I would have a talk with the rogue's player. Playing a thieving rogue that does his thieving in the pally's presence is asking for trouble. Ask him to either play his rogue smarter, don't thieve in the party's presence or switch to another character. I would also talk to the pally's player. The fact the pally dislikes the rogue stealing from an innocent merchant is great. However, stealing from the BBEG should make the pally a bit more pragmatic. Sure, he doesn't need to like it but theft is better then a fully equipped BBEG. "Here Mr BBEG, here's your artifact of ultimate evil(tm) back. Sorry my friend took it from you. As a token of your appreciation I would like it if you didn't use it to enslave the city" is not the paladin way. Also tell him pallies aren't executioners. The must prove the guilt of their suspects and if a court of law is available, use it. Also one thing should be made clear to both players: play your character in a way it's fun for the whole group. D&D is a social game where a group solves challenges. If you want an ego trip, play a computer game. If you want something highly compatible where you can smash your opponent, play a wargame. Sure, PCs have their differences and disagreement but when they cause a fraction in the party it has gone too far. Your solutions; a) Won’t work, if the player is out to steal, he'll find something. It may even make things worse as the fellow partymembers are the only potential victims. b) That means splitting the gaming time in half, which is impractical. c) As a GM, you should remain neutral. d) Railroadish e) See a f) see c and d g) See c h) Only if he gets caught, however this means a splitting of the party or the a problem Here's what I should do. Have one of the pally's superior in the order come to inspect the pally. The rogue question should come up. The superior should give the pally a reprimand for not turning the rogue over to authority. He'll tell the rogue that his theft from the merchant is a harsh crime. However there are mitigating circumstances. The fact he managed to sneak into the BBEG's den and stole some vital equipment means the rogue is brave and might prove useful for the forces of good. Then he makes the rogue an offer: either quit stealing from the innocent and help the pally defeat the BBEG or face the paladin's order’s wrath. The rogue should be smart enough to know he'd better mend his ways. Let the pally elder give the party some items to help them in their fight, this to put a positive bend on all the reprimands.
Imric 06-18-04, 07:33 AM	Well we had our game and the pally decided to give our rouge one last chance and believed that there is a BBEG and the whole party went inside killed lots of guys got xp solved stuff BBEG got away and cast spells on the rogue and pally and destroyed some of their equipment and now they are hunting him and made the whole party follow them :) i was soo glad that happened, also the rogue got hold of a class thats like a good assassin so everything turned out for the best. thanx for the input.
Autosponge 06-18-04, 08:23 AM	You can't use the bluff skill on a player. It's always a bad idea to put a cleptomaniac in the party with a pally. If a character wants out, let him go. But so there aren't hard feelings, have both players make new characters. If that's not something they want to do, they need to grow up and make it work. My suggestion is that you ignore every action the thief takes that starts with "I steal..." or "I try to steal..." After a while he'll get tired of wasting his breath and give up, at which point you can continue to enjoy your game without his childish antics getting in the way.