Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Schatten9 01-05-05, 03:32 PM	What would be an appropriate penalty to a character who's had his tooth melted down, the root dissolved, and an infection spread in the gums? I was thinking he should suffer -1 to all skill checks requiring the Intelligence modifier because it's so hard to concentrate with that much pain going on in your mouth, but is this too little of a penalty? Any ideas? -Schatten
Jack Greylock 01-05-05, 03:40 PM	What happened? Did the party get in a fight with the Cavity Creeps? :D Personally I think a -1 to all skill checks, Even just all Int based skill checks, is a little stiff. IMO this is something for Role Playing only and should incur no actual penality.
Schatten9 01-05-05, 03:52 PM	Well, if you must know, there's a nasty little creature called a "Tooth Fly" that likes to prey on sleeping characters, get inside their mouth, dissolve a hole in a tooth with its acidic spittle, burrow in and feast on the nerve ending/root (his spittle numbs it so they won't notice until later), then lay eggs and leave. The maggots burrow into the gums and have a feast. This, I think you could imagine, is rather excruciating. You still think the -1 penalty is too steep? Maybe something more? -Schatten
Thoronmir 01-05-05, 04:09 PM	How does one defend one’s self from the “Tooth Fly”? How long does the effect last? How does one cure one’s self of this infliction? IMO, the easier it is to cure, the harsher the effect can be … and the converse is true as well, the harder it is to cure, the milder the effect ought to be. Since you didn’t ask what we think about piling up random plagues upon the party members, I’ll keep my opinion on that issue to myself.
Gereli 01-05-05, 04:11 PM	I would say it depends heavily on how hard it will be to get rid of or fix. If a simple Heal check will do it, heavy penalties are fine because only an idiot will walk around with the condition for long. However, if something along the lines of a greater restoration (I have no idea whether this would be appropriate, I'm just throwing it out) is needed, and if such magic is not readily available in your campaign, the character will probably be suffering for a while longer, and you have to take that into account.
primemover003 01-05-05, 04:25 PM	Treat it as a disease, like mindfire or red ache. Use a Heal check (DC 15) to identify and treat.
Thoronmir 01-05-05, 04:41 PM	Treat it as a disease. Use a Heal check (DC 15) to identify and treat.That certainly makes the most sense and it's how I would handle it as a DM. But then, I'm not prone to burdening my players with such arbitary infestations. I just see no purpose for such a creature as a "Tooth Fly" ... unless you have a player who insists on roleplaying his PC's snoring. Then I might have some bug fly into the PC's mouth.
primemover003 01-05-05, 04:55 PM	Well that would depend on the campaign of course... If my PC's are searching a Jungle for a ruin that they have only a partial location for I would certainly think about using the environment (heat and water dangers) as well as disease to challenge them. For the most part this is meaningless to mid-to high level PC's. But for low levels this is a significant hindrance. Want to make a tribe of Tasloi more dangerous??? If your PC's are already suffering from the local strength sapping disease or are fatigued then encounters can be much more interesting... I guess it's all in how you present it. I for one am disgusted with the Real World creature known as the Bot fly Look at this ugly sucker!!! (http://entomology.unl.edu/images/botflies/torsalo2.jpg) . It's in the amazon and lays its eggs in you. Those eggs hatch into the nastiest looking dire maggots I've ever seen!!! It's the only think more gross to me than the frog in the rio negro that gives birth to it's young THROUGH it's skin.... :yuck: :yuck: :yuck:
Vharuck 01-05-05, 04:56 PM	I'd say just a -2 penalty to Concentration checks. However, this certain skill is often underused and underestimated by those not of the spellcasting type. I'd say that were something like this to come up, call up a concentration check whenever it may be harmful. Also, maybe a -2 to Bluff, Diplomacy, and Intimidate as he might whistle on his S's :devil:
Schatten9 01-05-05, 05:33 PM	Thanks for the comments so far--I appreciate the feedback. Actually, the Botfly is inspiration for this creature. I know someone who had one in his heel, it was disgusting! He could feel it grinding around and feeding at night, whenever he turned the lights off. As for the penalties, I think the suggested ratio is fair: hard to heal, low penalties, easy to heal, high penalties. I'm toying with a few possibilities, but one involves a Cure Disease to get rid of the maggots and Regeneration to regrow the tooth. If left untended, I was even willing to get as extreme as allowing several teeth to fall out (because of the maggot infestation), thus affecting arcane spellcasting that required verbal components. Again, I appreciate the help on tweaking this idea. I know some of you might feel there's not much use for something like this in a campaign, but sometimes the little unexpected details such as an annoying critter like this really can add a lot to the atmosphere. My PCs can get too used to dealing with the large, obvious threats, and it's fun to challenge them in unpredictable ways. If there are any more ideas/comments, it would definitely help me continue to refine this idea. Thanks, Schatten
Thoronmir 01-05-05, 05:44 PM	Primemover raises a valid point, one which I did not intend to discard. I, too, enjoy inflicting the PCs with environmental effects. If the party chooses to drink the foul jungle water, you bet there’ll be Fort saves for everyone. It’s just that this Tooth Fly (as described) seemed too arbitrary for my tastes. Infection sounded like a foregone conclusion. As a player, I’d be a little perturbed if my PC just woke up one morning to find maggots wriggling in his gums.
The Shaman 01-05-05, 05:56 PM	I know some of you might feel there's not much use for something like this in a campaign, but sometimes the little unexpected details such as an annoying critter like this really can add a lot to the atmosphere. My PCs can get too used to dealing with the large, obvious threats, and it's fun to challenge them in unpredictable ways. I like to include diseases and parasites as well, and for the same reasons. It adds depth to the game-world, and it adds a subtle challenge for the players and their characters to overcome. I created a couple of different diseases that were prevalent in tombs and catacombs - one of them, crypt cough, was scary enough to make them think twice about entering a necropolis without wearing masks over their noses and mouths and preparing cure disease spells and some herbal remedies to enhance Heal checks. I understand that some players and GMs don't like this level of grim 'n' gritty play, but I enjoy it, and my players like tolerate it.
Schatten9 01-05-05, 07:01 PM	Here's a tentative write-up. Perhaps the part about arcane spell failure for spells requiring verbal components is a bit much, but I can't help thinking about Ash from "Army of Darkness" mispronouncing the words to unlock the Necronomicon. Comments and criticism welcome. -Schatten ----- DC 19 Listen Check while sleeping or the fly gets inside the character’s mouth and uses its acidic spittle to numb and dissolve the PC’s tooth. It then begins to feed upon the nerve ending, and unless the character awakens naturally within 2 hours, the fly will successfully consume the nerve ending, lay eggs in the cavity, and leave. The PC will feel excruciating pain in 3 hours, causing a -1 on Int related skill checks. If left untreated, the eggs will hatch in 2d4 +1 hours and the maggots will burrow into the gums. For every day left untreated, the maggots will cause an additional -1. After 3 days, they will mature and erupt from the gums after feeding on the roots; 1d4 of the victim’s teeth will be so damaged they will fall out, impairing speech causing a 5% chance of arcane spells to fail for spellcasters casting anything requiring a Verbal component. Cure Disease will destroy the maggots. The tooth, however, can only return by a Regenerate spell. Unless the tooth is regrown, the PC will forever suffer a 5% chance of arcane spell failure for anything with a verbal component. A Heal check will identify the condition and treat the pain, but Cure Disease is necessary for maggot removal.
Shard of Suzail 01-05-05, 07:10 PM	I`m so glad i play a cleric. A spell a day keeps the "tooth fly" away.
krichaiushii 01-05-05, 10:53 PM	Gum disease = tooth loss. Tooth loss = difficulty speaking. Difficulty speaking = hard to cast spells and communicate effectively. Hard to cast spells and communicate effectively = concentration checks (DC 19) to cast any spell with a verbal component and -2 penalty (at least) that involves any skill check that deals with opening one's mouth. Or not.
The Shaman 01-05-05, 11:12 PM	I`m so glad i play a cleric. A spell a day keeps the "tooth fly" away. :clap: :bow: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :bow: :bow: :clap: :clap: :clap: Okay, that was funny!