Armor Spikes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Armor Spikes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Shodo Panda
08-23-05, 04:23 AM Question from one of my players:

Is it allowed or an option to use Armor Spikes for trip and disarm attempts. Disarm yes I think, trip however, I'm not too sure off so I come seeking advice.

And does it also hold true for shield spikes.
Telperion
08-23-05, 05:54 AM There's a short list of weapons in the PHB that you can use for Trip attacks and armor spikes isn't in that list. There's a feat in Player's Guide to Fighters and Barbarians that allows you to trip with a polearm, but that isn't Core.

Aside from that: no real reason why you couldn't disarm with armor spikes, since you are already taking a -4 penalty on the account of using a light weapon for the disarm attempt. If you fail the disarm attempt and your opponent successfully disarms you an evil DM could decide that you lose part of your armor spikes in the attempt. After several failed attempts you could be out of armor spikes and walking around in an armor needing some serious repair :devil: .
WizardlyFriend
08-23-05, 06:04 AM There's a short list of weapons in the PHB that you can use for Trip attacks and armor spikes isn't in that list. There's a feat in Player's Guide to Fighters and Barbarians that allows you to trip with a polearm, but that isn't Core.

Aside from that: no real reason why you couldn't disarm with armor spikes, since you are already taking a -4 penalty on the account of using a light weapon for the disarm attempt. If you fail the disarm attempt and your opponent successfully disarms you an evil DM could decide that you lose part of your armor spikes in the attempt. After several failed attempts you could be out of armor spikes and walking around in an armor needing some serious repair :devil: .

an evil DM would say that you lose your armor AND that the enemy is now wearing it
Lord Ian Stark
08-24-05, 12:24 AM Speaking of armor spikes. Do you get to use your STR damage to them on a successful grapple attack? If so, is it .5, full, or 1.5.

I would think they would be used "off-hand" like so .5 to damage as the primary attack is the grapple. Anyone? Did I miss a RAW part? My wife would like to know and for some reason I am brainfarting here.
PH3NOmenon
08-24-05, 04:04 AM Taken from http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20041102a

Adjacent Squares and Reach Weapons: There are some tricks you can use to threaten those adjacent squares when you're using a reach weapon. If you're a monk, your unarmed attacks continue to threaten the squares adjacent to you. Even if you're not a monk, you can use a smaller weapon to threaten the adjacent squares. You'll have to hold the reach weapon in one hand and wield the smaller weapon in the other hand. Since most reach weapons are two-handed weapons, you're only holding onto the reach weapon, not wielding it, and you don't threaten an area with it. Although the rules don't mention it, letting go of a two-handed weapon with one hand or putting a free hand back on the weapon is a free action for you. Drawing the smaller weapon requires an action, but if you have the Quick Draw feat, it's a free action. Note that you can take a free action only during your turn.

That's pretty clear, apart from one thing: If you "hold" the reach weapon in 1 hand, (not wielding it) and you attack with your smaller weapon, do you incur the TWF penalties?

Also, from the SRD:
Unarmed Strike: At 1st level, a monk gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. A monk’s attacks may be with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may even make unarmed strikes with her hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed.

Does This mean you can even threaten the adjecent squares with both hands full?
Tytalus
08-24-05, 04:12 AM That's pretty clear, apart from one thing: If you "hold" the reach weapon in 1 hand, (not wielding it) and you attack with your smaller weapon, do you incur the TWF penalties?

No, since you are not using it. It's like holding a shield.

Does This mean you can even threaten the adjecent squares with both hands full?

Yes. But you do incur penalties for fighting with two weapons.
PH3NOmenon
08-24-05, 04:27 AM Yes. But you do incur penalties for fighting with two weapons.

That seems odd to me. If you were taking TWF penalties for that, you'd have to decide wich is your main hand and which is your offhand (something that's impossible for a monk using his feet as weapons)

You're not Two Weapon Fighting since you're not looking for an extra attack, it would seem to me that you're "Two Weapon Threatening".

Either you get an extra attack during your turn for TWF but you'd have to treat your "elbows, knees, and feet." as your offhand and even then "There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed."

Or you only use them to make AoOs, which incurs no penalties on your extra attacks.

Either way, to effectively threaten your adjecant squars with a reach weapon, you need to spend a feat. Just using armor spikes is not effective as you would have to decide duringyour turn if you were usingyourreach weapon 2handed or just striking with the spikes (a light weapon no less)

So, either you shell out a feat for Improved Unarmed or you Take Spiked Chain EWP.

No?
Wolf72
08-24-05, 08:33 AM Yes. But you do incur penalties for fighting with two weapons.

you sure about that? ... from the sage excerpt it seemed the monk could kick out with no problem with his hands full (with a large bag of apples for example)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Shodo Panda 08-23-05, 04:23 AM	Question from one of my players: Is it allowed or an option to use Armor Spikes for trip and disarm attempts. Disarm yes I think, trip however, I'm not too sure off so I come seeking advice. And does it also hold true for shield spikes.
Telperion 08-23-05, 05:54 AM	There's a short list of weapons in the PHB that you can use for Trip attacks and armor spikes isn't in that list. There's a feat in Player's Guide to Fighters and Barbarians that allows you to trip with a polearm, but that isn't Core. Aside from that: no real reason why you couldn't disarm with armor spikes, since you are already taking a -4 penalty on the account of using a light weapon for the disarm attempt. If you fail the disarm attempt and your opponent successfully disarms you an evil DM could decide that you lose part of your armor spikes in the attempt. After several failed attempts you could be out of armor spikes and walking around in an armor needing some serious repair :devil: .
WizardlyFriend 08-23-05, 06:04 AM	There's a short list of weapons in the PHB that you can use for Trip attacks and armor spikes isn't in that list. There's a feat in Player's Guide to Fighters and Barbarians that allows you to trip with a polearm, but that isn't Core. Aside from that: no real reason why you couldn't disarm with armor spikes, since you are already taking a -4 penalty on the account of using a light weapon for the disarm attempt. If you fail the disarm attempt and your opponent successfully disarms you an evil DM could decide that you lose part of your armor spikes in the attempt. After several failed attempts you could be out of armor spikes and walking around in an armor needing some serious repair :devil: . an evil DM would say that you lose your armor AND that the enemy is now wearing it
Lord Ian Stark 08-24-05, 12:24 AM	Speaking of armor spikes. Do you get to use your STR damage to them on a successful grapple attack? If so, is it .5, full, or 1.5. I would think they would be used "off-hand" like so .5 to damage as the primary attack is the grapple. Anyone? Did I miss a RAW part? My wife would like to know and for some reason I am brainfarting here.
PH3NOmenon 08-24-05, 04:04 AM	Taken from http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20041102a Adjacent Squares and Reach Weapons: There are some tricks you can use to threaten those adjacent squares when you're using a reach weapon. If you're a monk, your unarmed attacks continue to threaten the squares adjacent to you. Even if you're not a monk, you can use a smaller weapon to threaten the adjacent squares. You'll have to hold the reach weapon in one hand and wield the smaller weapon in the other hand. Since most reach weapons are two-handed weapons, you're only holding onto the reach weapon, not wielding it, and you don't threaten an area with it. Although the rules don't mention it, letting go of a two-handed weapon with one hand or putting a free hand back on the weapon is a free action for you. Drawing the smaller weapon requires an action, but if you have the Quick Draw feat, it's a free action. Note that you can take a free action only during your turn. That's pretty clear, apart from one thing: If you "hold" the reach weapon in 1 hand, (not wielding it) and you attack with your smaller weapon, do you incur the TWF penalties? Also, from the SRD: Unarmed Strike: At 1st level, a monk gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. A monk’s attacks may be with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may even make unarmed strikes with her hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed. Does This mean you can even threaten the adjecent squares with both hands full?
Tytalus 08-24-05, 04:12 AM	That's pretty clear, apart from one thing: If you "hold" the reach weapon in 1 hand, (not wielding it) and you attack with your smaller weapon, do you incur the TWF penalties? No, since you are not using it. It's like holding a shield. Does This mean you can even threaten the adjecent squares with both hands full? Yes. But you do incur penalties for fighting with two weapons.
PH3NOmenon 08-24-05, 04:27 AM	Yes. But you do incur penalties for fighting with two weapons. That seems odd to me. If you were taking TWF penalties for that, you'd have to decide wich is your main hand and which is your offhand (something that's impossible for a monk using his feet as weapons) You're not Two Weapon Fighting since you're not looking for an extra attack, it would seem to me that you're "Two Weapon Threatening". Either you get an extra attack during your turn for TWF but you'd have to treat your "elbows, knees, and feet." as your offhand and even then "There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed." Or you only use them to make AoOs, which incurs no penalties on your extra attacks. Either way, to effectively threaten your adjecant squars with a reach weapon, you need to spend a feat. Just using armor spikes is not effective as you would have to decide duringyour turn if you were usingyourreach weapon 2handed or just striking with the spikes (a light weapon no less) So, either you shell out a feat for Improved Unarmed or you Take Spiked Chain EWP. No?
Wolf72 08-24-05, 08:33 AM	Yes. But you do incur penalties for fighting with two weapons. you sure about that? ... from the sage excerpt it seemed the monk could kick out with no problem with his hands full (with a large bag of apples for example)