Assassin alignment question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Assassin alignment question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Rumple_Cragstan
04-13-06, 06:06 PM Long story short, I'm developing a holy nation in my CS and I want to even give the assassins a bit of the honor. Before anyone jumps to conclusions, I'm not talking about making the assassins good. In fact, I have the concept, and I'm asking you all to do a few things to help me develop it further.

A) Tell me what alignment you think it is, because it just dosn't seem *evil*

B) Give suggestions on things I can add/change about it to make it better

Concept for the Pronteran assassin's guild:

The assassin's guild does operate on the unfriendly side of the law, and its business is still in killing people for money. However, there are a few rules within the guild that must be obeyed by all who claim the title of 'assassin'.

- Before you strike your mark, you must give them some sort of warning that someone is out for thier life. This dosn't require any more details than "someone wants you dead" and the message dosn't need to be delivered by the assassin. Most common ways of dispensing this warning is by attatching a note simply labeled 'warning' to an arrow and shooting the mark with it (so long as the shot is in a nonlethal place, such as the leg).

- The mark must be given at least 3 days between the initial warning and the hit. Once they know someone has hired an assassin, they get one chance to appease whoever hired the killer and get them to call off the hit.

- All assassins within the guild must have a signature of some sort that they can apply to both thier warning and the body of the dead mark. This is not only used as a calling card, but gives the mark the chance to find out who his killer will be and defend himself adequately.

Now truth be known, this assassin's guild is ruthless in the enforcement of these rules. If you are caught breaking them, you are killed and any jobs you where working at the time get re-assigned. Any non-guild assassins operating within the city get one chance to join the guild. If they refuse, they must either find a new line of business or face the wrath of the guild (usually death after a prolonged period of torture).

So far, I think this is a great fluff base for assassins, but there seems to be something missing from it. I'm not sure what though. And for note, I'm aiming for a LE type of organization here, is there anything I could do better?
woodwalker
04-13-06, 06:24 PM um, you are aware that assassins like very much for you not to know that you are about to be killed. if this is the case, do the assassins have the assassin PrC or are they just fighters?
kelvinaw273
04-13-06, 06:36 PM Sounds like a standard LE organisation. It has its rules, but it should not be possible to identify who is going to kill you. You have had the warning, that is enough. If you are going to do it any other way you may as well have it as an organisation of paid duelists who challenge people to the death.

Other spins you could put on it:

1) They only kill people who have dones something deserving of death.

2) They make a point of being serious by killing somebody close to the mark to show that they can.

3) They accept or reject targets based on a political agenda.

4) They have to kill in a ritualized manner (always with a certain dagger, always with poison, etc).

5) People they kill are replaced by dopplegangers who push their agenda.

6) Targets of the guild may achallenge the guild to a duel. The guilld then sends a duelist to fight the target, if the target wins, the assassination is withdrawn. If he wins really well, they may offer him membership!
Arganis
04-13-06, 06:45 PM My thoughts:

1) This is obviously LE... I'm sure a case could be made for LN, but I prolly wouldn't buy it.

2) I don't think I like the idea of a "vague" warning requirement. It's stereotypical I know, but the Assassin's Guild should probably have a specific calling-card that is delivered to the target in advance. Whether it be a Black Rose, Ace of Spades, or a Rabbit's foot.

Heh, I kinda like the Rabbit's Foot idea. It's sporting. Sort of a "Good luck!"

3) The way I interpret this, you aren't told who the hirer is, but you could learn through other means. I mean, if you owe someone money, that's a good start. I like the idea of having a chance to get the hit called off. Sort of a political maneuvering opportunity there. Get to the boss before the assassin gets to you.

3) What you need to do is ask why the Assassin's Guild is this way. Is this procedure set down by their leader, or their god? Was it negotiated decades ago with the ruling class, who agreed not to persecute the guild in return for a chance to keep themselves from killing eachother off by proxy? Was it a curse cast by a good wizard to protect the city?

4) How can the Assassins use the card to their advantage? Scrying perhaps?
Rumple_Cragstan
04-13-06, 06:57 PM I don't think I like the idea of a "vague" warning requirement. It's stereotypical I know, but the Assassin's Guild should probably have a specific calling-card that is delivered to the target in advance. Whether it be a Black Rose, Ace of Spades, or a Rabbit's foot.

The reason I didn't set a specific calling card is because I had the concept of each assassin's trademark to be different.

3) The way I interpret this, you aren't told who the hirer is, but you could learn through other means. I mean, if you owe someone money, that's a good start. I like the idea of having a chance to get the hit called off. Sort of a political maneuvering opportunity there. Get to the boss before the assassin gets to you.

This is exactly the purpose of the 3 days, glad you caught it.

3) What you need to do is ask why the Assassin's Guild is this way. Is this procedure set down by their leader, or their god? Was it negotiated decades ago with the ruling class, who agreed not to persecute the guild in return for a chance to keep themselves from killing eachother off by proxy? Was it a curse cast by a good wizard to protect the city?

I havn't gotten to this, but I now that you've gotten the idea in my mind I have a few things I could use. The one that came to mind first was this: The first leader of the assassin's guild (yet to be named as of yet) was a fallen paladin that didn't turn to blackguard but didn't want to repent. Still working on this concept, obviously.
bitswordmaker
04-13-06, 07:10 PM Just because you're evil, does not mean you break the laws all the time.
I'd go with LE as well.
Actually, I've had a few PC assassins on my world, and they played very similiar to that.
I thought it ended up serving two purposes.
1) Put fear into the target, usually.
2) Made it so the actual confrontation could be a little more difficult, or actually getting to the target could be, so the players had little more fun with it.

I think it's a good idea. Try it out.
Doopliss
04-13-06, 07:10 PM That sounds quite cool, and quite LE. Just out of curiosity, are the PCs inspectors, victims, or members? :)
The first leader of the assassin's guild (yet to be named as of yet) was a fallen paladin that didn't turn to blackguard but didn't want to repent. Still working on this concept, obviously.Doesn't seem terribly hard to pull off, the Abyss/Nine Hells/Gray wastes are something plenty of Evil folks can despise.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rumple_Cragstan 04-13-06, 06:06 PM	Long story short, I'm developing a holy nation in my CS and I want to even give the assassins a bit of the honor. Before anyone jumps to conclusions, I'm not talking about making the assassins good. In fact, I have the concept, and I'm asking you all to do a few things to help me develop it further. A) Tell me what alignment you think it is, because it just dosn't seem evil B) Give suggestions on things I can add/change about it to make it better Concept for the Pronteran assassin's guild: The assassin's guild does operate on the unfriendly side of the law, and its business is still in killing people for money. However, there are a few rules within the guild that must be obeyed by all who claim the title of 'assassin'. - Before you strike your mark, you must give them some sort of warning that someone is out for thier life. This dosn't require any more details than "someone wants you dead" and the message dosn't need to be delivered by the assassin. Most common ways of dispensing this warning is by attatching a note simply labeled 'warning' to an arrow and shooting the mark with it (so long as the shot is in a nonlethal place, such as the leg). - The mark must be given at least 3 days between the initial warning and the hit. Once they know someone has hired an assassin, they get one chance to appease whoever hired the killer and get them to call off the hit. - All assassins within the guild must have a signature of some sort that they can apply to both thier warning and the body of the dead mark. This is not only used as a calling card, but gives the mark the chance to find out who his killer will be and defend himself adequately. Now truth be known, this assassin's guild is ruthless in the enforcement of these rules. If you are caught breaking them, you are killed and any jobs you where working at the time get re-assigned. Any non-guild assassins operating within the city get one chance to join the guild. If they refuse, they must either find a new line of business or face the wrath of the guild (usually death after a prolonged period of torture). So far, I think this is a great fluff base for assassins, but there seems to be something missing from it. I'm not sure what though. And for note, I'm aiming for a LE type of organization here, is there anything I could do better?
woodwalker 04-13-06, 06:24 PM	um, you are aware that assassins like very much for you not to know that you are about to be killed. if this is the case, do the assassins have the assassin PrC or are they just fighters?
kelvinaw273 04-13-06, 06:36 PM	Sounds like a standard LE organisation. It has its rules, but it should not be possible to identify who is going to kill you. You have had the warning, that is enough. If you are going to do it any other way you may as well have it as an organisation of paid duelists who challenge people to the death. Other spins you could put on it: 1) They only kill people who have dones something deserving of death. 2) They make a point of being serious by killing somebody close to the mark to show that they can. 3) They accept or reject targets based on a political agenda. 4) They have to kill in a ritualized manner (always with a certain dagger, always with poison, etc). 5) People they kill are replaced by dopplegangers who push their agenda. 6) Targets of the guild may achallenge the guild to a duel. The guilld then sends a duelist to fight the target, if the target wins, the assassination is withdrawn. If he wins really well, they may offer him membership!
Arganis 04-13-06, 06:45 PM	My thoughts: 1) This is obviously LE... I'm sure a case could be made for LN, but I prolly wouldn't buy it. 2) I don't think I like the idea of a "vague" warning requirement. It's stereotypical I know, but the Assassin's Guild should probably have a specific calling-card that is delivered to the target in advance. Whether it be a Black Rose, Ace of Spades, or a Rabbit's foot. Heh, I kinda like the Rabbit's Foot idea. It's sporting. Sort of a "Good luck!" 3) The way I interpret this, you aren't told who the hirer is, but you could learn through other means. I mean, if you owe someone money, that's a good start. I like the idea of having a chance to get the hit called off. Sort of a political maneuvering opportunity there. Get to the boss before the assassin gets to you. 3) What you need to do is ask why the Assassin's Guild is this way. Is this procedure set down by their leader, or their god? Was it negotiated decades ago with the ruling class, who agreed not to persecute the guild in return for a chance to keep themselves from killing eachother off by proxy? Was it a curse cast by a good wizard to protect the city? 4) How can the Assassins use the card to their advantage? Scrying perhaps?
Rumple_Cragstan 04-13-06, 06:57 PM	I don't think I like the idea of a "vague" warning requirement. It's stereotypical I know, but the Assassin's Guild should probably have a specific calling-card that is delivered to the target in advance. Whether it be a Black Rose, Ace of Spades, or a Rabbit's foot. The reason I didn't set a specific calling card is because I had the concept of each assassin's trademark to be different. 3) The way I interpret this, you aren't told who the hirer is, but you could learn through other means. I mean, if you owe someone money, that's a good start. I like the idea of having a chance to get the hit called off. Sort of a political maneuvering opportunity there. Get to the boss before the assassin gets to you. This is exactly the purpose of the 3 days, glad you caught it. 3) What you need to do is ask why the Assassin's Guild is this way. Is this procedure set down by their leader, or their god? Was it negotiated decades ago with the ruling class, who agreed not to persecute the guild in return for a chance to keep themselves from killing eachother off by proxy? Was it a curse cast by a good wizard to protect the city? I havn't gotten to this, but I now that you've gotten the idea in my mind I have a few things I could use. The one that came to mind first was this: The first leader of the assassin's guild (yet to be named as of yet) was a fallen paladin that didn't turn to blackguard but didn't want to repent. Still working on this concept, obviously.
bitswordmaker 04-13-06, 07:10 PM	Just because you're evil, does not mean you break the laws all the time. I'd go with LE as well. Actually, I've had a few PC assassins on my world, and they played very similiar to that. I thought it ended up serving two purposes. 1) Put fear into the target, usually. 2) Made it so the actual confrontation could be a little more difficult, or actually getting to the target could be, so the players had little more fun with it. I think it's a good idea. Try it out.
Doopliss 04-13-06, 07:10 PM	That sounds quite cool, and quite LE. Just out of curiosity, are the PCs inspectors, victims, or members? :) The first leader of the assassin's guild (yet to be named as of yet) was a fallen paladin that didn't turn to blackguard but didn't want to repent. Still working on this concept, obviously.Doesn't seem terribly hard to pull off, the Abyss/Nine Hells/Gray wastes are something plenty of Evil folks can despise.