Awakened Hominid Characters? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Awakened Hominid Characters? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Black Kitten
10-21-03, 03:08 PM Here's another curiosity I thought up. Now I don't want to hear rules here that don't allow certain characters. With the DM's approval the average color of the human skin can become blue.

Some Druids leave a lasting legacy: awakened animals. These intelligent creatures live on like normally, just more intelligent. But some creatures, the homonids (apes, humans, elves, goblins etc (NOT HUMANOIDS)), have comprehensile hands and would make great characters, I'd say. I want to know if anyone has ever used them this way already and what their experiences were with them.
Gingerbread Guy
10-21-03, 03:23 PM Hiho,

I've always wanted to play a small monkey monk. I think that would be hilariously fun - for about ten minutes. Hence why I haven't done it yet.

~Ginger
Kalidor
10-21-03, 03:26 PM Originally posted by Black Kitten
Here's another curiosity I thought up. Now I don't want to hear rules here that don't allow certain characters. With the DM's approval the average color of the human skin can become blue.

Some Druids leave a lasting legacy: awakened animals. These intelligent creatures live on like normally, just more intelligent. But some creatures, the homonids (apes, humans, elves, goblins etc (NOT HUMANOIDS)), have comprehensile hands and would make great characters, I'd say. I want to know if anyone has ever used them this way already and what their experiences were with them.

I know you don't care, but my chain fighter, who is called Raj Uhl from the Drylands (desert) is a guy of basically arab decent. He used a Rod of Wonder and he turned permanently blue. Then later, he became a wererat. So now he's a blue wererat.

Just thought I'd fill you in.

I think an awakened ape-man would be kind of... weird. I'd rather have a little monkey with a tail.
Black Kitten
10-21-03, 03:34 PM Well... actually I was more thinking towards the Shaman from the Lion King style like. Monkey's have 12 Wisdom, so they wouldn't be that silly... themselves. It would totally depend on what the world would make of them. And, to be honest, getting arrows in your back after you pulled a monkeytail isn't the best introduction... ;)
Ojuice5001
10-21-03, 06:32 PM Originally posted by Gingerbread Guy
Hiho,

I've always wanted to play a small monkey monk. I think that would be hilariously fun - for about ten minutes. Hence why I haven't done it yet.

~Ginger

That makes me think of Monkeyfist, a villain from Kim Possible. The character could have lasting appeal if you modeled him on Monkeyfist. I would think he's more of a multiclass monk/druid than a straight monk though.
MinusInnocence
10-21-03, 08:09 PM It's hard to say what the social reaction in-game would be like to see an adventuring party comprised of an elf, a dwarf, a halfling... and a gorilla.

In such a world, stranger things HAVE happened. In addition, something equally or more bizarre is likely to follow suit either while the PCs are still in town, or a few weeks afterwards. So, I'm inclined to believe the populace would just consider the ape some sort of evolutionary kickback (if they acknowledge evolution); it wouldn't take much to convince them there is an entire society of intelligent apes roaming around in some wild place.

Now, as to the playability of such a character... it wouldn't be unplayable at all. You could have a lot of fun doing X number of things that other Awakened creatures deal with: the struggle to reconcile your innately magical nature; the bestiality of your kin; the knowledge that unless you have a similar spell cast on another of your kind, you will never have a meaningful relationship, or even a mate.

Exploring the conflict between Instinct and Intellect could actually turn out to be an amazing roleplaying experience, and given our own culture's topsy-turvy views on the near-humanness of other primates, the prize would only be sweeter. I say, go for it!
AlteredEgo
10-22-03, 12:05 AM An Awakened Monkey (3E, not sure if anything's changed in 3.5 with Awaken or the Monkey write-up) would be ECL 3.

It has 3HD, and no special abilities except a climb speed, which would add +1 LA, but it's size drops that back to +0 LA.

Currently trying to talk my DM into letting me play an Awakened Monkey Rogue/Shadowdancer with a Hat of Disguise that he is going to use to change his appearance (clothes and weaponry) to look like a given party member.

(thus, everyone will believe that he is the party member's "pet" monkey! MWUAHAHAHAHA!)
Black Kitten
10-22-03, 04:31 AM For your information:

In 3.5 the Monkey is a tiny animal with 1HD, or a Small Animal with 2 HD (progression)
The Baboon is a medium 1HD animal (most playable)
The Gorilla is a Large 4HD animal

So, especially a baboon would be playable, though you would have to stand on 4 legs often, which could be a problem. I myself are considering all medium apes (not African Hound Monkeys (like baboons)) like the baboon. So you would have a good character, I'd say. Just unfair that all animals are considered 2 Int'ed.

After seeing some half-Orc barbarians, I would consider a Chimp really intelligent...
Millennium
10-22-03, 10:16 AM Others have spoken to monkey roleplaying ideas; I'd like to take a second to discuss classes. These will assume that you're using the ECL-1 3.5ed monkey as the base.

A monk monkey would be interesting, but keep in mind that if you played an ECL-1 monkey, your damage and movement would be severely impaired. They don't even have tables for monks that small, so you'd be at the mercy of your DM (which, thanks to Rule 0, you would be anyway, I suppose, but at least you wouldn't quite be handing him carte blanche). It's an excellent roleplaying opportunity, but if it's raw combat power you want, look elsewhere. For the same reason, fighters are probably Right Out.

A monkey rogue would be just disgustingly useful; the Tiny size, inevitable Dex bonus, prehensile tail, and "aww look at the cute widdle monkey" factor all act in your favor. No DM in his right mind would let you do something like that. If your DM isn't in his right mind, though, the opportunities for getting away with Neat Stuff are limited only by your imagination. AlteredEgo's idea of a monkey Rogue/Shadowdancer is even more game-breakingly overpowered.

Monkey rangers shouldn't be discounted, either. You may be able to convince your DM to let a monkey ranger take Multiweapon Fighting instead of Two-Weapon Fighting by counting the tail as a third weapon. Obviously you'd be limited to tail spikes and similar weapons for your tail, but it's still a good possibility.

I mentioned the "aww look at the cute widdle monkey" factor before. This could also be used to make a very interesting and effective monkey bard character, as part of a troupe. Give him bongo drums to maximize the cuteness.

If you're just feeling silly, you could go with a monkey barbarian. Again, this is basically a silly option; the extra HP would be nice, but a raging monkey, while initially frightening, wouldn't work too well.

Most deities, except nature deities, probably wouldn't accept a monkey cleric. However, a monkey druid could be quite interesting to play. Think Rafiki from The Lion King (as Black Kitten suggested). You could also play a monkey druid as someone studying the powers that created him, so that he might in turn create others of his kind. Would the offspring of two awakened animals also be awakened? You could very well play an advanturer who is the forefather of a new humanoid race, many generations down the line.

Monkey sorcerers would probably work better than monkey wizards, since a monkey sorcerer wouldn't have to lug around a spellbook that is probably bigger than he is. Either way, with monkey spellcasters, I need only three words: Element Of Surprise.

Monkey paladins face the same problem as monkey clerics: most deities probably wouldn't accept them. Besides that, what would you use for a mount?

And another possible munchkinly tactic: if your DM uses the Book of Exalted Deeds, you can be even sicker by giving your monkey Vow of Poverty. You wouldn't lose much (how much equipment does a monkey really need, anyway?) and gain significant benefits. This could even work well with my NG monkey druid idea of creating a new race.
pookha
10-22-03, 03:47 PM I was working on a treant druid with awakened animal companions in 3.0 (before I found out awakening them made them a magical beast rather than an animal). The way I worked it was to have the treant take leadership and have some of them as cohorts/followers. Nothing like a bunch of monkeys/orangutans casting magic missile at you (or hold person, etc.)
bitnine
10-22-03, 03:53 PM That reminds me... Once I played a sea druid who used her magics to create a path of water between her and her enemies and then lured them to her hominid spawning bed to feed her precious pets.

Wait, that was a magic deck with a sea singer/hominid spawning bed/slight of mind combo.
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht
10-22-03, 04:36 PM MONKEY!
Black Kitten
10-22-03, 04:47 PM Okey, we've now found out that 'monkey's are very useful characters.
Now imagine not the cute gold-collector type, but the stirdy chimpansee. He would be medium and would carry loads of arms (they are actually stronger than the average human). What would you say then?
Kalanth
10-22-03, 05:00 PM On my Homebrew world, the Centaur race was created because a Druid Awakened a horse. The horse grew fond of the Druid, and the two went about with one another. During one particularly boring day, the druid was ambushed by an old enemy, an Orc Wizard. The Wizard Cast Polymorph on the Druid, intending to permenently turn the Druid into a horse, but the spell was partially disrupted by the Druids other Animal friend (a Dire Badger) and the spell went ary. When the Druid came to he noticed that his lower half had become a horse, but the upper half was the same as before. The Druid lived misserably in the forest for years before a young female Wizard (Human) came along. She was fascinated and enamored with the Centaur, and the two fell in love. Doing the proper reasurch, the wizard learned the secret to changing herself, and she two became a Centaur (Components of the spell are an Animal Companion: Horse, and 5000gp Diamond Dust). Shortly after this, they discovered that they could reproduce, and the offspring were also Centaur, and so a new race was born. All of this was actually RPed out in a game session, the female Wizard was an NPC that came after the initial player had begun to grow weary of being a centaur, so I gave him a Noble and memorable way to end his characters rein.
Kalidor
10-22-03, 05:10 PM Shortly after this, they discovered that they could reproduce,

Huh huh... huh..

You know, I don't know anything about "awakened animals". Where do I find this out? The SRD has Level Adjustment: -- on all the animals in there.
fistanthius
10-22-03, 05:12 PM Awww, thats soo sweet....
Kalanth
10-22-03, 05:20 PM You mock me, so now you die!

:fight!: :fight!: :hoppingma :fight!: :fight!:
bitnine
10-22-03, 05:23 PM Originally posted by Kalanth
On my Homebrew world, the Centaur race was created because a Druid Awakened a horse. The horse grew fond of the Druid, and the two went about with one another.

Shortly after this, they discovered that they could reproduce, and the offspring were also Centaur, and so a new race was born. All of this was actually RPed out in a game session,

I like this version better.
Kalanth
10-22-03, 05:50 PM Ya'll are sick. I provide something related to the topic and all you can think of are dirty jokes.
.
.
.
.
.

You are so my kind of people:smirk:
Donnavin Snowolf
10-22-03, 10:14 PM I don't think baboons are hominids. I think they are hominoids. I could be mistaken. The nid is either a human or its ancestor. The noid is any ape.

Personally I'd like to play a Gorrila paladin.

However chimpanzes (tiny cridders) wouldn't be so bad. As long as you can resist a governments urge to shoot you out into space...

I think fighting classes wouldn't be very fun. You'd look pretty ridiculous, which for the first few times might be ok, but theres really not an intimidation (except for the extremely mindbending experinece of a chimp coming at you with a knife, evil puppet style). A monk mightn'd be so bad. As a partial fighting class I could see it being enjoyable.

What I think would be the funnest would be an arcane spell caster, like a sorcerer or wizard (wu jen, shujensha...).

Chimpo backflips, forming? A fireball of course. BOOM.
AlteredEgo
10-23-03, 12:28 AM Well, I've managed to talk my DM into it...though he rejected the name "Buh Bulls" so I went with Ika -- did our playtest run today at +0LA, 3HD/Rogue4/Shadowdancer5, since it was a 12th level game.

Anywho, to whomever stated the awakened monkey/rogue/shadowdancer was overpowered, I'd be inclined to disagree. Compared to a halfling rogue/shadowdancer, there is little benefit beyond an additional +1 to hit/AC, +4 size to hide, and low-light vision. In fact, the halfling has many more skills, better sneak attack, and better Uncanny Dodge.

Oh, and there is the whole, I-can-climb-a-snot-slicked-glass-ceiling effect that comes with a ring of climbing, a climb movement rate, a +8 racial to climb, skill-focus: climb, and a total dex of 27...but really, that's a coolness factor, as you can't make many effective attacks with a monkey on a wall/ceiling.

There were a couple times I wished that I'd gone with the halfling instead for mechanical advantages...but then I think of how much fun it was to take a leak on the table of a merc who was insulting my friends -- and have the whole thing written off as a misunderstanding of nature...as I scampered off with his moneypouch. :D
Black Kitten
10-23-03, 05:52 AM To answer Donnavin's question: Baboons are monkeys, Afrikan Dog Monkeys (direct translation from Dutch, not sure if that's it in English), but they have comprehansile hands, which is the main thing to make a character.

Official laydown:
Monkeys - Lower homonids WITH tail (in general): Ghostmonkeys, Baboons, etc.
Apes - Higher (intelligent) homonids WITHOUT tail (in general): (Complete list) Gorilla's (both kinds), Chimpansee, Bonobo (or Pigmechimp), Humanoids, Orangutan
(You could even argue to add Chimps and Bonobo's to the 'humanoid' list since they are very intelligent (I'd personally give them Int 5 or even higher)

As I've read your things I come to see it this way (I consider them rolled as adventurers to keep them in balance with the rest of the party)
Barbarian - Apes (Gorilla), Humanoids, Chimps(look under Baboon for stats
Bard - 2HD Monkeys, Humanoids, Chimps
Cleric - None
Druid - All
Fighter - Apes, 2HD Monkeys
Monk - All
Paladin - Apes
Ranger - All
Rogue - All but Apes
Sorcerer - All but Apes
Wizard - All but Apes
Millennium
10-23-03, 09:20 AM New question: if you were playing a monkey, and you put a magic ring on your tail, would it function as a third ring? Assume the tail is prehensile, so that it could theoretically be used as a third hand.
Millennium
10-23-03, 09:27 AM Originally posted by AlteredEgo
Oh, and there is the whole, I-can-climb-a-snot-slicked-glass-ceiling effect that comes with a ring of climbing, a climb movement rate, a +8 racial to climb, skill-focus: climb, and a total dex of 27...but really, that's a coolness factor, as you can't make many effective attacks with a monkey on a wall/ceiling.
Claim your tail as a second hand (so that you can take one hand off the wall). If your DM lets you do that, then two words: Halfling Skiprocks.
There were a couple times I wished that I'd gone with the halfling instead for mechanical advantages...but then I think of how much fun it was to take a leak on the table of a merc who was insulting my friends -- and have the whole thing written off as a misunderstanding of nature...as I scampered off with his moneypouch. :D
Ah, yes. As always, the best reason to play outside the core rules is the uber-cool roleplaying opportunities.

I might try playing a monkey bard who plays cymbals at some point. Another case of "aww, look at the cute widdle monkey", but probably even more so than my original bongo-drums idea. Do you suppose such a character should get a bonus on Perform checks just from the sheer, nauseating cuteness of it all?
Black Kitten
10-23-03, 12:34 PM Just one problem... where does the monkey goes when the not-so-charmed Ogre decided to step on it? :P

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Black Kitten 10-21-03, 03:08 PM	Here's another curiosity I thought up. Now I don't want to hear rules here that don't allow certain characters. With the DM's approval the average color of the human skin can become blue. Some Druids leave a lasting legacy: awakened animals. These intelligent creatures live on like normally, just more intelligent. But some creatures, the homonids (apes, humans, elves, goblins etc (NOT HUMANOIDS)), have comprehensile hands and would make great characters, I'd say. I want to know if anyone has ever used them this way already and what their experiences were with them.
Gingerbread Guy 10-21-03, 03:23 PM	Hiho, I've always wanted to play a small monkey monk. I think that would be hilariously fun - for about ten minutes. Hence why I haven't done it yet. ~Ginger
Kalidor 10-21-03, 03:26 PM	Originally posted by Black Kitten Here's another curiosity I thought up. Now I don't want to hear rules here that don't allow certain characters. With the DM's approval the average color of the human skin can become blue. Some Druids leave a lasting legacy: awakened animals. These intelligent creatures live on like normally, just more intelligent. But some creatures, the homonids (apes, humans, elves, goblins etc (NOT HUMANOIDS)), have comprehensile hands and would make great characters, I'd say. I want to know if anyone has ever used them this way already and what their experiences were with them. I know you don't care, but my chain fighter, who is called Raj Uhl from the Drylands (desert) is a guy of basically arab decent. He used a Rod of Wonder and he turned permanently blue. Then later, he became a wererat. So now he's a blue wererat. Just thought I'd fill you in. I think an awakened ape-man would be kind of... weird. I'd rather have a little monkey with a tail.
Black Kitten 10-21-03, 03:34 PM	Well... actually I was more thinking towards the Shaman from the Lion King style like. Monkey's have 12 Wisdom, so they wouldn't be that silly... themselves. It would totally depend on what the world would make of them. And, to be honest, getting arrows in your back after you pulled a monkeytail isn't the best introduction... ;)
Ojuice5001 10-21-03, 06:32 PM	Originally posted by Gingerbread Guy Hiho, I've always wanted to play a small monkey monk. I think that would be hilariously fun - for about ten minutes. Hence why I haven't done it yet. ~Ginger That makes me think of Monkeyfist, a villain from Kim Possible. The character could have lasting appeal if you modeled him on Monkeyfist. I would think he's more of a multiclass monk/druid than a straight monk though.
MinusInnocence 10-21-03, 08:09 PM	It's hard to say what the social reaction in-game would be like to see an adventuring party comprised of an elf, a dwarf, a halfling... and a gorilla. In such a world, stranger things HAVE happened. In addition, something equally or more bizarre is likely to follow suit either while the PCs are still in town, or a few weeks afterwards. So, I'm inclined to believe the populace would just consider the ape some sort of evolutionary kickback (if they acknowledge evolution); it wouldn't take much to convince them there is an entire society of intelligent apes roaming around in some wild place. Now, as to the playability of such a character... it wouldn't be unplayable at all. You could have a lot of fun doing X number of things that other Awakened creatures deal with: the struggle to reconcile your innately magical nature; the bestiality of your kin; the knowledge that unless you have a similar spell cast on another of your kind, you will never have a meaningful relationship, or even a mate. Exploring the conflict between Instinct and Intellect could actually turn out to be an amazing roleplaying experience, and given our own culture's topsy-turvy views on the near-humanness of other primates, the prize would only be sweeter. I say, go for it!
AlteredEgo 10-22-03, 12:05 AM	An Awakened Monkey (3E, not sure if anything's changed in 3.5 with Awaken or the Monkey write-up) would be ECL 3. It has 3HD, and no special abilities except a climb speed, which would add +1 LA, but it's size drops that back to +0 LA. Currently trying to talk my DM into letting me play an Awakened Monkey Rogue/Shadowdancer with a Hat of Disguise that he is going to use to change his appearance (clothes and weaponry) to look like a given party member. (thus, everyone will believe that he is the party member's "pet" monkey! MWUAHAHAHAHA!)
Black Kitten 10-22-03, 04:31 AM	For your information: In 3.5 the Monkey is a tiny animal with 1HD, or a Small Animal with 2 HD (progression) The Baboon is a medium 1HD animal (most playable) The Gorilla is a Large 4HD animal So, especially a baboon would be playable, though you would have to stand on 4 legs often, which could be a problem. I myself are considering all medium apes (not African Hound Monkeys (like baboons)) like the baboon. So you would have a good character, I'd say. Just unfair that all animals are considered 2 Int'ed. After seeing some half-Orc barbarians, I would consider a Chimp really intelligent...
Millennium 10-22-03, 10:16 AM	Others have spoken to monkey roleplaying ideas; I'd like to take a second to discuss classes. These will assume that you're using the ECL-1 3.5ed monkey as the base. A monk monkey would be interesting, but keep in mind that if you played an ECL-1 monkey, your damage and movement would be severely impaired. They don't even have tables for monks that small, so you'd be at the mercy of your DM (which, thanks to Rule 0, you would be anyway, I suppose, but at least you wouldn't quite be handing him carte blanche). It's an excellent roleplaying opportunity, but if it's raw combat power you want, look elsewhere. For the same reason, fighters are probably Right Out. A monkey rogue would be just disgustingly useful; the Tiny size, inevitable Dex bonus, prehensile tail, and "aww look at the cute widdle monkey" factor all act in your favor. No DM in his right mind would let you do something like that. If your DM isn't in his right mind, though, the opportunities for getting away with Neat Stuff are limited only by your imagination. AlteredEgo's idea of a monkey Rogue/Shadowdancer is even more game-breakingly overpowered. Monkey rangers shouldn't be discounted, either. You may be able to convince your DM to let a monkey ranger take Multiweapon Fighting instead of Two-Weapon Fighting by counting the tail as a third weapon. Obviously you'd be limited to tail spikes and similar weapons for your tail, but it's still a good possibility. I mentioned the "aww look at the cute widdle monkey" factor before. This could also be used to make a very interesting and effective monkey bard character, as part of a troupe. Give him bongo drums to maximize the cuteness. If you're just feeling silly, you could go with a monkey barbarian. Again, this is basically a silly option; the extra HP would be nice, but a raging monkey, while initially frightening, wouldn't work too well. Most deities, except nature deities, probably wouldn't accept a monkey cleric. However, a monkey druid could be quite interesting to play. Think Rafiki from The Lion King (as Black Kitten suggested). You could also play a monkey druid as someone studying the powers that created him, so that he might in turn create others of his kind. Would the offspring of two awakened animals also be awakened? You could very well play an advanturer who is the forefather of a new humanoid race, many generations down the line. Monkey sorcerers would probably work better than monkey wizards, since a monkey sorcerer wouldn't have to lug around a spellbook that is probably bigger than he is. Either way, with monkey spellcasters, I need only three words: Element Of Surprise. Monkey paladins face the same problem as monkey clerics: most deities probably wouldn't accept them. Besides that, what would you use for a mount? And another possible munchkinly tactic: if your DM uses the Book of Exalted Deeds, you can be even sicker by giving your monkey Vow of Poverty. You wouldn't lose much (how much equipment does a monkey really need, anyway?) and gain significant benefits. This could even work well with my NG monkey druid idea of creating a new race.
pookha 10-22-03, 03:47 PM	I was working on a treant druid with awakened animal companions in 3.0 (before I found out awakening them made them a magical beast rather than an animal). The way I worked it was to have the treant take leadership and have some of them as cohorts/followers. Nothing like a bunch of monkeys/orangutans casting magic missile at you (or hold person, etc.)
bitnine 10-22-03, 03:53 PM	That reminds me... Once I played a sea druid who used her magics to create a path of water between her and her enemies and then lured them to her hominid spawning bed to feed her precious pets. Wait, that was a magic deck with a sea singer/hominid spawning bed/slight of mind combo.
Raymond_Luxury_Yacht 10-22-03, 04:36 PM	MONKEY!
Black Kitten 10-22-03, 04:47 PM	Okey, we've now found out that 'monkey's are very useful characters. Now imagine not the cute gold-collector type, but the stirdy chimpansee. He would be medium and would carry loads of arms (they are actually stronger than the average human). What would you say then?
Kalanth 10-22-03, 05:00 PM	On my Homebrew world, the Centaur race was created because a Druid Awakened a horse. The horse grew fond of the Druid, and the two went about with one another. During one particularly boring day, the druid was ambushed by an old enemy, an Orc Wizard. The Wizard Cast Polymorph on the Druid, intending to permenently turn the Druid into a horse, but the spell was partially disrupted by the Druids other Animal friend (a Dire Badger) and the spell went ary. When the Druid came to he noticed that his lower half had become a horse, but the upper half was the same as before. The Druid lived misserably in the forest for years before a young female Wizard (Human) came along. She was fascinated and enamored with the Centaur, and the two fell in love. Doing the proper reasurch, the wizard learned the secret to changing herself, and she two became a Centaur (Components of the spell are an Animal Companion: Horse, and 5000gp Diamond Dust). Shortly after this, they discovered that they could reproduce, and the offspring were also Centaur, and so a new race was born. All of this was actually RPed out in a game session, the female Wizard was an NPC that came after the initial player had begun to grow weary of being a centaur, so I gave him a Noble and memorable way to end his characters rein.
Kalidor 10-22-03, 05:10 PM	Shortly after this, they discovered that they could reproduce, Huh huh... huh.. You know, I don't know anything about "awakened animals". Where do I find this out? The SRD has Level Adjustment: -- on all the animals in there.
fistanthius 10-22-03, 05:12 PM	Awww, thats soo sweet....
Kalanth 10-22-03, 05:20 PM	You mock me, so now you die! :fight!: :fight!: :hoppingma :fight!: :fight!:
bitnine 10-22-03, 05:23 PM	Originally posted by Kalanth On my Homebrew world, the Centaur race was created because a Druid Awakened a horse. The horse grew fond of the Druid, and the two went about with one another. Shortly after this, they discovered that they could reproduce, and the offspring were also Centaur, and so a new race was born. All of this was actually RPed out in a game session, I like this version better.
Kalanth 10-22-03, 05:50 PM	Ya'll are sick. I provide something related to the topic and all you can think of are dirty jokes. . . . . . You are so my kind of people:smirk:
Donnavin Snowolf 10-22-03, 10:14 PM	I don't think baboons are hominids. I think they are hominoids. I could be mistaken. The nid is either a human or its ancestor. The noid is any ape. Personally I'd like to play a Gorrila paladin. However chimpanzes (tiny cridders) wouldn't be so bad. As long as you can resist a governments urge to shoot you out into space... I think fighting classes wouldn't be very fun. You'd look pretty ridiculous, which for the first few times might be ok, but theres really not an intimidation (except for the extremely mindbending experinece of a chimp coming at you with a knife, evil puppet style). A monk mightn'd be so bad. As a partial fighting class I could see it being enjoyable. What I think would be the funnest would be an arcane spell caster, like a sorcerer or wizard (wu jen, shujensha...). Chimpo backflips, forming? A fireball of course. BOOM.
AlteredEgo 10-23-03, 12:28 AM	Well, I've managed to talk my DM into it...though he rejected the name "Buh Bulls" so I went with Ika -- did our playtest run today at +0LA, 3HD/Rogue4/Shadowdancer5, since it was a 12th level game. Anywho, to whomever stated the awakened monkey/rogue/shadowdancer was overpowered, I'd be inclined to disagree. Compared to a halfling rogue/shadowdancer, there is little benefit beyond an additional +1 to hit/AC, +4 size to hide, and low-light vision. In fact, the halfling has many more skills, better sneak attack, and better Uncanny Dodge. Oh, and there is the whole, I-can-climb-a-snot-slicked-glass-ceiling effect that comes with a ring of climbing, a climb movement rate, a +8 racial to climb, skill-focus: climb, and a total dex of 27...but really, that's a coolness factor, as you can't make many effective attacks with a monkey on a wall/ceiling. There were a couple times I wished that I'd gone with the halfling instead for mechanical advantages...but then I think of how much fun it was to take a leak on the table of a merc who was insulting my friends -- and have the whole thing written off as a misunderstanding of nature...as I scampered off with his moneypouch. :D
Black Kitten 10-23-03, 05:52 AM	To answer Donnavin's question: Baboons are monkeys, Afrikan Dog Monkeys (direct translation from Dutch, not sure if that's it in English), but they have comprehansile hands, which is the main thing to make a character. Official laydown: Monkeys - Lower homonids WITH tail (in general): Ghostmonkeys, Baboons, etc. Apes - Higher (intelligent) homonids WITHOUT tail (in general): (Complete list) Gorilla's (both kinds), Chimpansee, Bonobo (or Pigmechimp), Humanoids, Orangutan (You could even argue to add Chimps and Bonobo's to the 'humanoid' list since they are very intelligent (I'd personally give them Int 5 or even higher) As I've read your things I come to see it this way (I consider them rolled as adventurers to keep them in balance with the rest of the party) Barbarian - Apes (Gorilla), Humanoids, Chimps(look under Baboon for stats Bard - 2HD Monkeys, Humanoids, Chimps Cleric - None Druid - All Fighter - Apes, 2HD Monkeys Monk - All Paladin - Apes Ranger - All Rogue - All but Apes Sorcerer - All but Apes Wizard - All but Apes
Millennium 10-23-03, 09:20 AM	New question: if you were playing a monkey, and you put a magic ring on your tail, would it function as a third ring? Assume the tail is prehensile, so that it could theoretically be used as a third hand.
Millennium 10-23-03, 09:27 AM	Originally posted by AlteredEgo Oh, and there is the whole, I-can-climb-a-snot-slicked-glass-ceiling effect that comes with a ring of climbing, a climb movement rate, a +8 racial to climb, skill-focus: climb, and a total dex of 27...but really, that's a coolness factor, as you can't make many effective attacks with a monkey on a wall/ceiling. Claim your tail as a second hand (so that you can take one hand off the wall). If your DM lets you do that, then two words: Halfling Skiprocks. There were a couple times I wished that I'd gone with the halfling instead for mechanical advantages...but then I think of how much fun it was to take a leak on the table of a merc who was insulting my friends -- and have the whole thing written off as a misunderstanding of nature...as I scampered off with his moneypouch. :D Ah, yes. As always, the best reason to play outside the core rules is the uber-cool roleplaying opportunities. I might try playing a monkey bard who plays cymbals at some point. Another case of "aww, look at the cute widdle monkey", but probably even more so than my original bongo-drums idea. Do you suppose such a character should get a bonus on Perform checks just from the sheer, nauseating cuteness of it all?
Black Kitten 10-23-03, 12:34 PM	Just one problem... where does the monkey goes when the not-so-charmed Ogre decided to step on it? :P