Bad rolls = Grumpy players [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bad rolls = Grumpy players [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
IU_Judoka
07-04-06, 04:39 PM Ok I am offically taking claim as the DM with the unluckiest party around...

My PCs tend to roll more 1s and 2s than any other numbers. This provides me with two very difficult problems.

One: This may not seem so bad but their luck is sooo bad that it is actually dependable. This is countered by the fact that i tend to roll high, not always but more than the PCs(lvl9). The creatures they fight have a decent AC (anything from 20-27) and they all have rather high ABs that require they must roll higher than a 7 or an 8. This does not seem to difficult, until one considers the number of times they don't. My group fails checks to the point where I almost dont bother rolling. Should I lower the DC, AC, HP, and AB to accomidate the terrible luck embodied by the dice? This might work but if the luck ever does change then they will tear through the dungeon or cave or where ever they are with little difficulty.

Two: At least two members of my group (the other three realize that a bad roll isnt the end of the world for them) will become rather depressed when they don't roll well. One will sit there with his head on the table and hardly says anything. Then they both act like the game is over and they may as well die because this character sucks and waa waa waa etc

So, my fellow DMs, how would one remedy the situation?
roguken
07-04-06, 04:49 PM I think I know where your players are coming from. I seem to have exactly the opposite problem to you. I roll terribly, whilst my players can roll nothing below a fourteen. I have found that running a few roleplaying-intensive encounters can help make them feel less bad, although they may want to consider getting some new dice. I don't believe that there is some mystical energy field surrounding all dice, but in this case there may be no such thing as luck.
Also, you should look on the bright side. You may be the only DM out there who does not have to use some cheeze explination if you want the party to get captured. Just write it in and they'll probably roll low enough to be defeated by whatever you want to do the capturing.
Evingolis
07-04-06, 04:55 PM I wouldn´t adjust other things. if they really are that unlucky, give them a second chance. and sometimes a third if necessary

use other dice. yes, there ARE cursed dice in dnd ;)
IU_Judoka
07-04-06, 05:01 PM Haha, dont worry, as a group we buy dice on a regular baises. The RP option seems good and maybe things will go well...

Still having issues with problem number two though...
hmmmm
07-04-06, 05:28 PM Burn their dice? :P
Bob Loblaw
07-04-06, 05:38 PM Ok I am offically taking claim as the DM with the unluckiest party around...

My PCs tend to roll more 1s and 2s than any other numbers. This provides me with two very difficult problems.

One: This may not seem so bad but their luck is sooo bad that it is actually dependable. This is countered by the fact that i tend to roll high, not always but more than the PCs(lvl9). The creatures they fight have a decent AC (anything from 20-27) and they all have rather high ABs that require they must roll higher than a 7 or an 8. This does not seem to difficult, until one considers the number of times they don't. My group fails checks to the point where I almost dont bother rolling. Should I lower the DC, AC, HP, and AB to accomidate the terrible luck embodied by the dice? This might work but if the luck ever does change then they will tear through the dungeon or cave or where ever they are with little difficulty.

The players should learn how to adapt to their situations. They should become more familiar with the combat rules and find those bonuses that they need. I don't roll high very often, but I know how to add a few points here and there when I need to. Charging, flanking, higher ground, aid another, that's +7 to hit right there. They can learn to use Aid Another. By putting enough ranks into a skill, they can garauntee the DC 10 needed to give someone else a +2 to success. Two or three PCs helping, and that can be +6 to whatever they were trying to do.

Two: At least two members of my group (the other three realize that a bad roll isnt the end of the world for them) will become rather depressed when they don't roll well. One will sit there with his head on the table and hardly says anything. Then they both act like the game is over and they may as well die because this character sucks and waa waa waa etc

So, my fellow DMs, how would one remedy the situation?

Maybe you should throw them some "easy" situations for a while. Let them feel like they are playing heroes. Lower the CRs they are up against. Give them some more roleplaying options. This is great because it gets them away from the math part of the game and into what the idea is anyway...getting into character and interacting with the world.

Don't forget that you have options as DM. You can give them circumstance bonuses (or the enemies penalties). Just a bonus and a penalty will give a difference of +4 to their results. Make sure that they know why they are getting the bonuses. This will encourage them to find more on their own. You will find that they may get really creative on their actions.

Also, consider action points (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/adventuring/actionPoints.htm) from Unearthed Arcana.

It might be a good idea for you to record all their die rolls for a session or two. Don't worry about what the roll was for, just keep track by die type and value. At the end, you can take a look at the numbers and see if it's a perception issue or if there is actually a problem that needs addressing. I think it may be a perception issue more than anything else. We tend to associate things with significant events . So if they had to make a balance check to avoid falling on their rumps, Craft check to make a dagger, and an attack roll, they will probably remember the attack roll more since there is more at stake.
Coven
07-04-06, 06:36 PM give the 3d6 variant a try instead of 1d20. see how your players like that. iv met hardcore D&D people who absolutely loathed d20s and loved this rule.
DarkNick
07-04-06, 06:52 PM Let them suck it up. Their luck will turn eventualy.

From another perspective as a DM you get to roll heaps more dthan the players, you are going to get lucky more often than they do, it is just a matter of time.
IU_Judoka
07-04-06, 07:34 PM The action points system might work but im a bit hesitant to use it like that, along with the 3d6 method. Also the "suck it up" option is the one that I almost expect them to do. Although each has its merits.
zae
07-04-06, 08:18 PM 1. You could make things a little weaker, then if they go through a good run, well, they have a run of good luck and you can go back to normal.

2. Encourage them to optimise. If the dice are that bad to them, they should try to take dice out of the equation - essentially, optimise to the point where an average roll for one of them will succeed. So if someone never rolls above 4, usually getting 3 or 4, they need to optimise so that they need a 3+ to succeed on their big trick.

3. Find a way of legitimising cheating. Action points, for instance. I basically see it as "Every player will at some time feel the urge to fudge their dice roll. Most will ignore the urge. Action points let you spend points from a pool to legitimately fudge your roll as needed, and you can't just do it for every roll, but it gives you that little something on rolls where you need to succeed."

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
IU_Judoka 07-04-06, 04:39 PM	Ok I am offically taking claim as the DM with the unluckiest party around... My PCs tend to roll more 1s and 2s than any other numbers. This provides me with two very difficult problems. One: This may not seem so bad but their luck is sooo bad that it is actually dependable. This is countered by the fact that i tend to roll high, not always but more than the PCs(lvl9). The creatures they fight have a decent AC (anything from 20-27) and they all have rather high ABs that require they must roll higher than a 7 or an 8. This does not seem to difficult, until one considers the number of times they don't. My group fails checks to the point where I almost dont bother rolling. Should I lower the DC, AC, HP, and AB to accomidate the terrible luck embodied by the dice? This might work but if the luck ever does change then they will tear through the dungeon or cave or where ever they are with little difficulty. Two: At least two members of my group (the other three realize that a bad roll isnt the end of the world for them) will become rather depressed when they don't roll well. One will sit there with his head on the table and hardly says anything. Then they both act like the game is over and they may as well die because this character sucks and waa waa waa etc So, my fellow DMs, how would one remedy the situation?
roguken 07-04-06, 04:49 PM	I think I know where your players are coming from. I seem to have exactly the opposite problem to you. I roll terribly, whilst my players can roll nothing below a fourteen. I have found that running a few roleplaying-intensive encounters can help make them feel less bad, although they may want to consider getting some new dice. I don't believe that there is some mystical energy field surrounding all dice, but in this case there may be no such thing as luck. Also, you should look on the bright side. You may be the only DM out there who does not have to use some cheeze explination if you want the party to get captured. Just write it in and they'll probably roll low enough to be defeated by whatever you want to do the capturing.
Evingolis 07-04-06, 04:55 PM	I wouldn´t adjust other things. if they really are that unlucky, give them a second chance. and sometimes a third if necessary use other dice. yes, there ARE cursed dice in dnd ;)
IU_Judoka 07-04-06, 05:01 PM	Haha, dont worry, as a group we buy dice on a regular baises. The RP option seems good and maybe things will go well... Still having issues with problem number two though...
hmmmm 07-04-06, 05:28 PM	Burn their dice? :P
Bob Loblaw 07-04-06, 05:38 PM	Ok I am offically taking claim as the DM with the unluckiest party around... My PCs tend to roll more 1s and 2s than any other numbers. This provides me with two very difficult problems. One: This may not seem so bad but their luck is sooo bad that it is actually dependable. This is countered by the fact that i tend to roll high, not always but more than the PCs(lvl9). The creatures they fight have a decent AC (anything from 20-27) and they all have rather high ABs that require they must roll higher than a 7 or an 8. This does not seem to difficult, until one considers the number of times they don't. My group fails checks to the point where I almost dont bother rolling. Should I lower the DC, AC, HP, and AB to accomidate the terrible luck embodied by the dice? This might work but if the luck ever does change then they will tear through the dungeon or cave or where ever they are with little difficulty. The players should learn how to adapt to their situations. They should become more familiar with the combat rules and find those bonuses that they need. I don't roll high very often, but I know how to add a few points here and there when I need to. Charging, flanking, higher ground, aid another, that's +7 to hit right there. They can learn to use Aid Another. By putting enough ranks into a skill, they can garauntee the DC 10 needed to give someone else a +2 to success. Two or three PCs helping, and that can be +6 to whatever they were trying to do. Two: At least two members of my group (the other three realize that a bad roll isnt the end of the world for them) will become rather depressed when they don't roll well. One will sit there with his head on the table and hardly says anything. Then they both act like the game is over and they may as well die because this character sucks and waa waa waa etc So, my fellow DMs, how would one remedy the situation? Maybe you should throw them some "easy" situations for a while. Let them feel like they are playing heroes. Lower the CRs they are up against. Give them some more roleplaying options. This is great because it gets them away from the math part of the game and into what the idea is anyway...getting into character and interacting with the world. Don't forget that you have options as DM. You can give them circumstance bonuses (or the enemies penalties). Just a bonus and a penalty will give a difference of +4 to their results. Make sure that they know why they are getting the bonuses. This will encourage them to find more on their own. You will find that they may get really creative on their actions. Also, consider action points (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/adventuring/actionPoints.htm) from Unearthed Arcana. It might be a good idea for you to record all their die rolls for a session or two. Don't worry about what the roll was for, just keep track by die type and value. At the end, you can take a look at the numbers and see if it's a perception issue or if there is actually a problem that needs addressing. I think it may be a perception issue more than anything else. We tend to associate things with significant events . So if they had to make a balance check to avoid falling on their rumps, Craft check to make a dagger, and an attack roll, they will probably remember the attack roll more since there is more at stake.
Coven 07-04-06, 06:36 PM	give the 3d6 variant a try instead of 1d20. see how your players like that. iv met hardcore D&D people who absolutely loathed d20s and loved this rule.
DarkNick 07-04-06, 06:52 PM	Let them suck it up. Their luck will turn eventualy. From another perspective as a DM you get to roll heaps more dthan the players, you are going to get lucky more often than they do, it is just a matter of time.
IU_Judoka 07-04-06, 07:34 PM	The action points system might work but im a bit hesitant to use it like that, along with the 3d6 method. Also the "suck it up" option is the one that I almost expect them to do. Although each has its merits.
zae 07-04-06, 08:18 PM	1. You could make things a little weaker, then if they go through a good run, well, they have a run of good luck and you can go back to normal. 2. Encourage them to optimise. If the dice are that bad to them, they should try to take dice out of the equation - essentially, optimise to the point where an average roll for one of them will succeed. So if someone never rolls above 4, usually getting 3 or 4, they need to optimise so that they need a 3+ to succeed on their big trick. 3. Find a way of legitimising cheating. Action points, for instance. I basically see it as "Every player will at some time feel the urge to fudge their dice roll. Most will ignore the urge. Action points let you spend points from a pool to legitimately fudge your roll as needed, and you can't just do it for every roll, but it gives you that little something on rolls where you need to succeed."