Being Descriptive [Archive] - Wizards Community

Being Descriptive [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
RyanTheMagus
08-02-07, 09:58 PM I am having trouble coming up with ways to describe certain areas and towns, both indoor and outdoor scenes, in ways that are really descriptive but don't keep sounding repetitive.

Does anyone have any suggestions? Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used?
Kouk
08-02-07, 10:47 PM Not really. DMG2 says to read things like travel brochures.

Generally I just envision it in my head, and try to put that into words. Players don't tend to care much after the first 2 sentences anyway...

DM: "You enter the bustling town of Eqolafeola. You see the merchants hawking their wares from well-kept stalls, haggling with potential buyers. The buildings --"

PCs: "OK, is there a magic item shop? Well, let's go to the inn and sleep for now, we can do that tomorrow."
Ics
08-03-07, 01:46 AM Keep any description down to a sentence, highlighting only the major details or theme of the area or item. For example, for a marketplace, "The bustling street is littered with innumerable haphazardly placed merchant booths, giving the impression that you could find anything here." This describes both the function and limitations of the area (a market whose gp limit surpasses the player's wealth).

It's only worth being truly descriptive when those descriptions translate directly into relevant game mechanics. The bottom line is, unless you players are unusually involved in you world, they won't care to hear about the battle depicted on the intricately-woven tapestry hung on the wall of the grand entryway, or about the unfamiliar tannish-yellow stone than composes the walls in the entryway, worn from decades of neglect (which is further evident in the heavy cobwebs in every corner), or about the macabre urn sitting on the darkwood table... but you get the idea.

The only way to justify an extensive description (to your players) is if the described is of central importance, or if there is something in it for the players; for example, maybe the tapestry reminds a knowledgeable character that there was a nearby barrow built for a fallen dark knight (and of course they left most of his gear and a few undead guardian with him), or that the urn most likely contains the ashes of a saint (which function as keoghtom's ointment).
wizardguy2003
08-03-07, 01:52 AM I tend to try and give real world examples after my descriptions to help.

"You enter a bustling shop of gargantuan proportions, with all manner of item from the odd to the mundane just a touch away. Aisle upon aisle of goods are presented before you as are the flowing bodies of other patrons, moving from section to section, like flocks of geese in multiple formations."

"Basically picture Walmart with elves!" ;)
Kouk
08-03-07, 04:47 AM "Basically picture Walmart with elves!" ;)

Hmm, using real world things like that would sort of kill the mood for me.

The bottom line is, unless you players are unusually involved in you world, they won't care to hear about the battle depicted on the intricately-woven tapestry hung on the wall of the grand entryway, or about the unfamiliar tannish-yellow stone than composes the walls in the entryway, worn from decades of neglect (which is further evident in the heavy cobwebs in every corner), or about the macabre urn sitting on the darkwood table...

"What? An urn, he said there's an urn on the table. I cast Detect Magic. Does it look valuable? Who's gonna open it? I'm not going to, there might be a trap, search for traps. Yes you, you're the Rogue aren't you?!?"
Ics
08-03-07, 09:49 AM "What? An urn, he said there's an urn on the table. I cast Detect Magic. Does it look valuable? Who's gonna open it? I'm not going to, there might be a trap, search for traps. Yes you, you're the Rogue aren't you?!?"Said the one player who listened to the whole thing :P

Seriously though, imagine if I described nearly everything in a dungeon with such detail. Or even just the rooms. It'd be like casting sleep on a bunch of 1st-level orc warriors.
Optimized_Commoner
08-03-07, 09:52 AM Imagine it until you can see the room/location in your mind's eye and then try to describe it.

Engage all the senses.

Give people appropriate information for their skills and classes. Let the wizard recognize the rune that you describe on the wall, let the ranger spot the footprints in the dust on the floor.

In real life try to have a few experiences that help you understand what a fantasy environment is like. Go abseiling in caves with a flaming torch for light (they really do not illuminate very far or well), go to a medieval feast, wear a suit of armour... whatever you can do so that your descriptions are based on experience rather than cliche.

Pick out what's unique about this location... if there's nothing unique about it, then why are you bothering to have PCs there.

Less is more. People get bored by a ten minute description, but a 20 second evocative description that touches on the really interesting points gets them enthused and asking questions.

Players asking questions is a sign that they're interested and involved in the world. Answer them and remember what kind of things they're interested in for your future descriptions.

Get your players to help you. Tell them you're trying to improve your descriptions and ask them to keep track and at the end of the session say which area description was their favourite and least preferred. As a sneaky bonus, this means for one session they'll be paying attention to all of your descriptions because they'll get to critique at the end ;).

If playing music, keep it vaguely appropriate the the area they're in where possible. However leaping up every room to change the CD you're playing isn't worth the bother.
pres_man
08-03-07, 10:08 AM I am having trouble coming up with ways to describe certain areas and towns, both indoor and outdoor scenes, in ways that are really descriptive but don't keep sounding repetitive.

Does anyone have any suggestions? Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used?
Is this really an issue? Most players I have seen begin to zone out when a DM starts getting too descriptive. Heck, if you start sounding repetitive go with it. Like in Pokemon where every town has a Nurse Jenny (is that her name?, I've only seen like 5 episodes), make a joke of it.
Optimized_Commoner
08-03-07, 10:16 AM Like in Pokemon where every town has a Nurse Jenny (is that her name?, I've only seen like 5 episodes), make a joke of it.

Or sliders, where every episode they travel into a parallel dimension but always stay at the Hotel Dominion and keep running into doubles of people they know (or doubles of themselves).
Optimized_Commoner
08-03-07, 10:44 AM Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used?

I'll try to remember some I've used in the past and write them as verbatim as I can manage.

Towns

"You've just arrived in the port town known as 'the fingers', on the way to the docks to meet the boat that will take you out to the threshold. The town is built amongst many canals, brimming with stinking waste. The streets are impossibly narrow, you feel like you could reach out your hands and touch the walls on both sides at once if it weren't for the constant bustle of activity around you. Craftsmen working out on the streets, beggars and merchants alike crying out for your money and people moving backwards and forwards everywhere. As you narrowly step your way past a precarious arrangement of drying pottery without breaking anything, you spot the ship you're looking for, the Qin-lo, sitting on the docks rocking gently in the incoming tide."

"Everything looks like it was built to much the same plan as every other building and all laid out in neat squares. The one exception at the center of a town is a garish building that resembles a step pyramid with its upper level an open air tent, squinting you can make out a large sign on the building that spells out the word "Jade Serpent" in oversized mah-jong tiles. On one side of the town there are hills where rice is growing in walled off ponds in steps going up the hills. On the other side there is a forest with signs of logging around the edge. While the ship captain argues with a port commissioner, the dragon-blooded magistrate who shared the ride with you ignores the spruikers for the town's hotels and casinos, making his way towards the imperial satrapy sending ripples through the crowd as people step out of his way and bow to him."

People

"The man looks as though he is the oldest person you have ever seen. His face must have originally been amazingly round but now it has sagged further to the point where it is wider than it is long. His moustache dangles down in two neatly braided ribbons down to his waist and he leans heavily on a staff shaped like a shepherd's crook, with a dream-weaver type design of knotted threads strung around the hook at the end. He coughs and weezes as he hobbles into your room with each step as though it's going to be his last before his long-delayed natural death."
_Jayne_Cobb_
08-03-07, 10:56 AM I am having trouble coming up with ways to describe certain areas and towns, both indoor and outdoor scenes, in ways that are really descriptive but don't keep sounding repetitive.

Does anyone have any suggestions? Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used?

The standard school of thought used by many DMs is to always start every scene with an evocative general overview intro, but this is not always the case and, even when it is, is not always appropriate to every PC or situation.

The thing to remember is that you, the DM, are the characters' perceptions. You are their eyes and ears. They can only perceive of the world what you essentially perceive for them. With that in mind describe things as people in such a situation are likely to perceive them.

A country boy, upon entering a major city for the first time, is likely to be awed by the size of the buildings, the number of people, the myriad of smells, etc. so your descriptions should be drawn in these broad, general, and even somewhat unfocused and fragmented terms.

A steel-eyed urban assassin, entering the same city at the same moment in search of a mark, is not going to be in awe of the city and it's denizens. He is sued to this kind of thing and is focused on his task at hand. His attention is going to be drawn with laser-like sharpness and clarity to the guards, the weapons they carry and how attentive they are, any dangers in the crowd, scoping for his mark and where he might have gone, etc.

Also, anything which you specifically single out is likely to be taken by the players to be of importance because you, acting as their sense, have focused on it. Sometimes this may be the case, but people often focus on wrong or extraneous things. It is okay to throw a red-herring at them, the key is to do so purposely, with intent.

A general rule of thumb is to keep your descriptions to two sentences/10 seconds or less. You may have a great description planned out but it is useless if the players' attention begins to wander. Exposition should never get in the way of gameplay.
Hospitaller
08-03-07, 12:43 PM This probably isn't a suggestion you'd like to hear, but it's certainly improved my DMing ability regarding descriptions... read several fantasy books and remember (or write down, I suppose) descriptions of things that you find very well written.

Try to keep track of themes that seem to work and try writing your own.
ccerose
08-03-07, 04:02 PM There is a company called Tabletop Adventures that came out with a product called Bits of Darkness. Essentially, it is a pdf that contains 100 dungeon descriptions. They also released a version for caverns, swamps, forests, and cities.

Basically, each of the 100 entries can be printed out as a 3"x5" card. When you are short for a description, you just pull one of the cards and read from it. It provides plenty of description, but nothing that will affect gameplay elements. It just makes it easier for the players to visualize. Most of the descriptions are only a sentence or two, so it's really not enough to put the players to sleep or bore them.

The only drawback is, if your players aren't used to elaborate descriptions, then they might think what your reading is a clue or story element. I bought a couple of the pdfs from drivethrurpg.com. They were only a few bucks. I've been using them for a while and my players have gotten used to them. That being said, I don't use one of those cards for each room they enter. I'll read one card when the first enter a swamp, for example, just to give them enough to provide some imagery.
Commodore
08-04-07, 08:29 AM Is this really an issue? Most players I have seen begin to zone out when a DM starts getting too descriptive. Heck, if you start sounding repetitive go with it. Like in Pokemon where every town has a Nurse Jenny (is that her name?, I've only seen like 5 episodes), make a joke of it.

Nurse Joy in every Pokemon Center and, to a lesser extent, Officer Jenny in each area for the police.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
RyanTheMagus 08-02-07, 09:58 PM	I am having trouble coming up with ways to describe certain areas and towns, both indoor and outdoor scenes, in ways that are really descriptive but don't keep sounding repetitive. Does anyone have any suggestions? Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used?
Kouk 08-02-07, 10:47 PM	Not really. DMG2 says to read things like travel brochures. Generally I just envision it in my head, and try to put that into words. Players don't tend to care much after the first 2 sentences anyway... DM: "You enter the bustling town of Eqolafeola. You see the merchants hawking their wares from well-kept stalls, haggling with potential buyers. The buildings --" PCs: "OK, is there a magic item shop? Well, let's go to the inn and sleep for now, we can do that tomorrow."
Ics 08-03-07, 01:46 AM	Keep any description down to a sentence, highlighting only the major details or theme of the area or item. For example, for a marketplace, "The bustling street is littered with innumerable haphazardly placed merchant booths, giving the impression that you could find anything here." This describes both the function and limitations of the area (a market whose gp limit surpasses the player's wealth). It's only worth being truly descriptive when those descriptions translate directly into relevant game mechanics. The bottom line is, unless you players are unusually involved in you world, they won't care to hear about the battle depicted on the intricately-woven tapestry hung on the wall of the grand entryway, or about the unfamiliar tannish-yellow stone than composes the walls in the entryway, worn from decades of neglect (which is further evident in the heavy cobwebs in every corner), or about the macabre urn sitting on the darkwood table... but you get the idea. The only way to justify an extensive description (to your players) is if the described is of central importance, or if there is something in it for the players; for example, maybe the tapestry reminds a knowledgeable character that there was a nearby barrow built for a fallen dark knight (and of course they left most of his gear and a few undead guardian with him), or that the urn most likely contains the ashes of a saint (which function as keoghtom's ointment).
wizardguy2003 08-03-07, 01:52 AM	I tend to try and give real world examples after my descriptions to help. "You enter a bustling shop of gargantuan proportions, with all manner of item from the odd to the mundane just a touch away. Aisle upon aisle of goods are presented before you as are the flowing bodies of other patrons, moving from section to section, like flocks of geese in multiple formations." "Basically picture Walmart with elves!" ;)
Kouk 08-03-07, 04:47 AM	"Basically picture Walmart with elves!" ;) Hmm, using real world things like that would sort of kill the mood for me. The bottom line is, unless you players are unusually involved in you world, they won't care to hear about the battle depicted on the intricately-woven tapestry hung on the wall of the grand entryway, or about the unfamiliar tannish-yellow stone than composes the walls in the entryway, worn from decades of neglect (which is further evident in the heavy cobwebs in every corner), or about the macabre urn sitting on the darkwood table... "What? An urn, he said there's an urn on the table. I cast Detect Magic. Does it look valuable? Who's gonna open it? I'm not going to, there might be a trap, search for traps. Yes you, you're the Rogue aren't you?!?"
Ics 08-03-07, 09:49 AM	"What? An urn, he said there's an urn on the table. I cast Detect Magic. Does it look valuable? Who's gonna open it? I'm not going to, there might be a trap, search for traps. Yes you, you're the Rogue aren't you?!?"Said the one player who listened to the whole thing :P Seriously though, imagine if I described nearly everything in a dungeon with such detail. Or even just the rooms. It'd be like casting sleep on a bunch of 1st-level orc warriors.
Optimized_Commoner 08-03-07, 09:52 AM	Imagine it until you can see the room/location in your mind's eye and then try to describe it. Engage all the senses. Give people appropriate information for their skills and classes. Let the wizard recognize the rune that you describe on the wall, let the ranger spot the footprints in the dust on the floor. In real life try to have a few experiences that help you understand what a fantasy environment is like. Go abseiling in caves with a flaming torch for light (they really do not illuminate very far or well), go to a medieval feast, wear a suit of armour... whatever you can do so that your descriptions are based on experience rather than cliche. Pick out what's unique about this location... if there's nothing unique about it, then why are you bothering to have PCs there. Less is more. People get bored by a ten minute description, but a 20 second evocative description that touches on the really interesting points gets them enthused and asking questions. Players asking questions is a sign that they're interested and involved in the world. Answer them and remember what kind of things they're interested in for your future descriptions. Get your players to help you. Tell them you're trying to improve your descriptions and ask them to keep track and at the end of the session say which area description was their favourite and least preferred. As a sneaky bonus, this means for one session they'll be paying attention to all of your descriptions because they'll get to critique at the end ;). If playing music, keep it vaguely appropriate the the area they're in where possible. However leaping up every room to change the CD you're playing isn't worth the bother.
pres_man 08-03-07, 10:08 AM	I am having trouble coming up with ways to describe certain areas and towns, both indoor and outdoor scenes, in ways that are really descriptive but don't keep sounding repetitive. Does anyone have any suggestions? Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used? Is this really an issue? Most players I have seen begin to zone out when a DM starts getting too descriptive. Heck, if you start sounding repetitive go with it. Like in Pokemon where every town has a Nurse Jenny (is that her name?, I've only seen like 5 episodes), make a joke of it.
Optimized_Commoner 08-03-07, 10:16 AM	Like in Pokemon where every town has a Nurse Jenny (is that her name?, I've only seen like 5 episodes), make a joke of it. Or sliders, where every episode they travel into a parallel dimension but always stay at the Hotel Dominion and keep running into doubles of people they know (or doubles of themselves).
Optimized_Commoner 08-03-07, 10:44 AM	Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used? I'll try to remember some I've used in the past and write them as verbatim as I can manage. Towns "You've just arrived in the port town known as 'the fingers', on the way to the docks to meet the boat that will take you out to the threshold. The town is built amongst many canals, brimming with stinking waste. The streets are impossibly narrow, you feel like you could reach out your hands and touch the walls on both sides at once if it weren't for the constant bustle of activity around you. Craftsmen working out on the streets, beggars and merchants alike crying out for your money and people moving backwards and forwards everywhere. As you narrowly step your way past a precarious arrangement of drying pottery without breaking anything, you spot the ship you're looking for, the Qin-lo, sitting on the docks rocking gently in the incoming tide." "Everything looks like it was built to much the same plan as every other building and all laid out in neat squares. The one exception at the center of a town is a garish building that resembles a step pyramid with its upper level an open air tent, squinting you can make out a large sign on the building that spells out the word "Jade Serpent" in oversized mah-jong tiles. On one side of the town there are hills where rice is growing in walled off ponds in steps going up the hills. On the other side there is a forest with signs of logging around the edge. While the ship captain argues with a port commissioner, the dragon-blooded magistrate who shared the ride with you ignores the spruikers for the town's hotels and casinos, making his way towards the imperial satrapy sending ripples through the crowd as people step out of his way and bow to him." People "The man looks as though he is the oldest person you have ever seen. His face must have originally been amazingly round but now it has sagged further to the point where it is wider than it is long. His moustache dangles down in two neatly braided ribbons down to his waist and he leans heavily on a staff shaped like a shepherd's crook, with a dream-weaver type design of knotted threads strung around the hook at the end. He coughs and weezes as he hobbles into your room with each step as though it's going to be his last before his long-delayed natural death."
_Jayne_Cobb_ 08-03-07, 10:56 AM	I am having trouble coming up with ways to describe certain areas and towns, both indoor and outdoor scenes, in ways that are really descriptive but don't keep sounding repetitive. Does anyone have any suggestions? Or perhaps a few examples of descriptions they have used? The standard school of thought used by many DMs is to always start every scene with an evocative general overview intro, but this is not always the case and, even when it is, is not always appropriate to every PC or situation. The thing to remember is that you, the DM, are the characters' perceptions. You are their eyes and ears. They can only perceive of the world what you essentially perceive for them. With that in mind describe things as people in such a situation are likely to perceive them. A country boy, upon entering a major city for the first time, is likely to be awed by the size of the buildings, the number of people, the myriad of smells, etc. so your descriptions should be drawn in these broad, general, and even somewhat unfocused and fragmented terms. A steel-eyed urban assassin, entering the same city at the same moment in search of a mark, is not going to be in awe of the city and it's denizens. He is sued to this kind of thing and is focused on his task at hand. His attention is going to be drawn with laser-like sharpness and clarity to the guards, the weapons they carry and how attentive they are, any dangers in the crowd, scoping for his mark and where he might have gone, etc. Also, anything which you specifically single out is likely to be taken by the players to be of importance because you, acting as their sense, have focused on it. Sometimes this may be the case, but people often focus on wrong or extraneous things. It is okay to throw a red-herring at them, the key is to do so purposely, with intent. A general rule of thumb is to keep your descriptions to two sentences/10 seconds or less. You may have a great description planned out but it is useless if the players' attention begins to wander. Exposition should never get in the way of gameplay.
Hospitaller 08-03-07, 12:43 PM	This probably isn't a suggestion you'd like to hear, but it's certainly improved my DMing ability regarding descriptions... read several fantasy books and remember (or write down, I suppose) descriptions of things that you find very well written. Try to keep track of themes that seem to work and try writing your own.
ccerose 08-03-07, 04:02 PM	There is a company called Tabletop Adventures that came out with a product called Bits of Darkness. Essentially, it is a pdf that contains 100 dungeon descriptions. They also released a version for caverns, swamps, forests, and cities. Basically, each of the 100 entries can be printed out as a 3"x5" card. When you are short for a description, you just pull one of the cards and read from it. It provides plenty of description, but nothing that will affect gameplay elements. It just makes it easier for the players to visualize. Most of the descriptions are only a sentence or two, so it's really not enough to put the players to sleep or bore them. The only drawback is, if your players aren't used to elaborate descriptions, then they might think what your reading is a clue or story element. I bought a couple of the pdfs from drivethrurpg.com. They were only a few bucks. I've been using them for a while and my players have gotten used to them. That being said, I don't use one of those cards for each room they enter. I'll read one card when the first enter a swamp, for example, just to give them enough to provide some imagery.
Commodore 08-04-07, 08:29 AM	Is this really an issue? Most players I have seen begin to zone out when a DM starts getting too descriptive. Heck, if you start sounding repetitive go with it. Like in Pokemon where every town has a Nurse Jenny (is that her name?, I've only seen like 5 episodes), make a joke of it. Nurse Joy in every Pokemon Center and, to a lesser extent, Officer Jenny in each area for the police.