Black Powder [Archive] - Wizards Community

Black Powder [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Finarin Panjoro
09-27-07, 12:06 PM How much damage would you allow a charge of black powder to do?

I believe a light cannon from Stormwrack takes 1 pound of black powder to fire a cannon ball for 3d10 damage. So how much would an explosion of 10 pounds of powder do?

This will probably be coming up in a game in the near future as the PCs are acquiring blackpowder and they're going to be forced into a postion of using it to deal with a monster of much greater than their CR would normally allow.

I was thinking of 1d6 damage in a 5 foot radius for the first pound, +1d6 per additional pound and an extra 5 feet to the radius every time you double the poundage (So 10 ft radius for 2 lbs, 15 foot for 4 lbs, 20 ft for 8 lbs., etc). Reflex DC 15+1 per lb for half damage and Fortitude Save (same DC) to avoid deafness for 2d6+1 rd per pound.

Does that sound reasonable?

Also if an explosion of about 20 lbs of powder went off in the center of 20 tons of silver coins (2 million coins) in a swamp how much of the coinage would you allow the PCs to recover?
_Jayne_Cobb_
09-27-07, 12:15 PM How much damage would you allow a charge of black powder to do?

I believe a light cannon from Stormwrack takes 1 pound of black powder to fire a cannon ball for 3d10 damage. So how much would an explosion of 10 pounds of powder do?

This will probably be coming up in a game in the near future as the PCs are acquiring blackpowder and they're going to be forced into a postion of using it to deal with a monster of much greater than their CR would normally allow.

I was thinking of 1d6 damage in a 5 foot radius for the first pound, +1d6 per additional pound and an extra 5 feet to the radius every time you double the poundage (So 10 ft radius for 2 lbs, 15 foot for 4 lbs, 20 ft for 8 lbs., etc). Reflex DC 15+1 per lb for half damage and Fortitude Save (same DC) to avoid deafness for 2d6+1 rd per pound.

Does that sound reasonable?

Not quite. Each doubling actually requires an eight-fold multiplication of volume. You are dealing on a spherical radius, not just a circular one.

1 lb = 5 ft
8 lb = 10 ft
64 lb = 20 ft
512 lb = 40 ft
etc…
TwiddleStootch
09-27-07, 12:18 PM For Blackpowder rules, its really up to the DM.
It all depends how strong he wants Blackpowder to be as a weapon.

In my camapign, it is fairly weak when set off as an explosive.
But some DMs might want to make it stronger.
But what you suggest sounds ok, but I would put a cap on how much blackpowder can be blown up together.

And for the coins, that depends on what the DM decides the Blakcpowder does when set off, and on how densely packed the coins are, which would determine how much is effected by the explosion.
Some_call_me_Tim
09-27-07, 12:18 PM Does that sound reasonable?
Sounds pretty good. You might want to take a look at the d20 modern SRD:
Dynamite
Perhaps one of the most common and straightforward explosives, dynamite is very stable under normal conditions. A stick of dynamite requires a fuse or detonator to set it off. Additional sticks can be set off at the same time if they are within the burst radius of the first stick, increasing the damage and burst radius of the explosion. Each additional stick increases the damage by +1d6 (maximum 10d6) and the burst radius by 5 feet (maximum 20 feet).
It’s possible to wire together several sticks of dynamite for even greater explosive effect. Doing so requires a Demolitions check (DC 10 + 1 per stick). If the character succeeds on the check, the damage or the burst radius of the explosion increases by 50% (the character’s choice).
Dynamite is sold in boxes of 12 sticks. It is considered to be a simple explosive for the purpose of using a Craft (chemical) check to manufacture it.
To set off dynamite using a fuse, the fuse must first be lit, requiring a move action (and a lighter or other source of flame). The amount of time until the dynamite explodes depends on the length of the fuse—a fuse can be cut short enough for the dynamite to detonate in the same round (allowing it to be used much like a grenade), or long enough to take several minutes to detonate. Cutting the fuse to the appropriate length requires a move action.

Also if an explosion of about 20 lbs of powder went off in the center of 20 tons of silver coins (2 million coins) in a swamp how much of the coinage would you allow the PCs to recover?Largely depend on time an technology used. Simply walking around and picking up what you see and perhaps digging around just outside the blast--30%. Take days to weeks and using sifters and sluices maybe 80-90%. This highly-detailed analysis is simply numbers coming out of my arse (cause I can't ******-extraction, apparently).
Ddraiglais
09-27-07, 12:37 PM Damage to who? I would rule that packing more and more black powder into a cannon would increase it's chances of going boom in the PC's faces.
TwiddleStootch
09-27-07, 01:12 PM Damage to who? I would rule that packing more and more black powder into a cannon would increase it's chances of going boom in the PC's faces.

I think the question here is when containers of the stuff (IE. barrels) are set off to explode, not when a cannon is over packed.
Finarin Panjoro
09-27-07, 01:31 PM Right, we're talking bombs here, not cannons. Cannons were just the only reference I had for this sort of thing.

Looks like I guesstimated the dynamite rules fairly closely, thanks for posting them Some_call_me_Tim.

_Jayne_Cobb_, that makes sense to me, but its actually a hemishperical radius assuming that its set off on the ground. So I assume it would require a power of four increase in explosives (1 lb=5 ft, 4 lbs=10 ft, 16 lbs=20 feet, 64 lbs=40 feet).

It looks like my guess is probably close enough for my purposes.

I know the coin question is tricky. The correct answer is probably: allow them to find enough to feel well rewarded for their efforts. :D
The_Cheat137
09-27-07, 08:17 PM Well, isn't that almost always the correct answer? Give them enough to feel well-rewarded. After all, happy gaming is far more important than realistic gaming :P
Grumman
09-27-07, 08:39 PM _Jayne_Cobb_, that makes sense to me, but its actually a hemishperical radius assuming that its set off on the ground. So I assume it would require a power of four increase in explosives (1 lb=5 ft, 4 lbs=10 ft, 16 lbs=20 feet, 64 lbs=40 feet).
No, it would still be an eight-fold increase, it's just that you would start off with 1/2 lb=5 ft.
Finarin Panjoro
09-28-07, 10:17 AM So it would be

.5 lbs = 5 ft.
4 lbs = 10 ft.
32 lbs = 20 ft.
(80 lbs = 30 ft) estimated.
128 lbs = 40 ft.

And I found out that a light cannon uses 4 lbs of powder per shot, not one.

I'm also thinking of treating the explosion like light and having a secondary radius that suffers half damage, and allows an easier Reflex Save for half damage and no deafness (DC 10+1 per radius increase).
_Jayne_Cobb_
09-28-07, 11:25 AM So it would be

.5 lbs = 5 ft.
4 lbs = 10 ft.
32 lbs = 20 ft.
(80 lbs = 30 ft) estimated.
128 lbs = 40 ft.

No.

.5 = 5 ft
4 (.5 x 8) = 10 ft
13.5 (4 x 3.375) = 15 ft
32 (4 x 8) = 20 ft
108 (32 x 3.375) = 30 ft
256 (32 x 8) = 40 ft
864 (256 x 3.375) = 60 ft
2048 (256 x 8) = 80 ft
4000 (4 x 1000) = 100 ft

Comparisons to dynamite aren't overly apt as Dynamite is a high-explosive and black powder is a low-explosive.
Finarin Panjoro
09-28-07, 01:06 PM Shiny.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Finarin Panjoro 09-27-07, 12:06 PM	How much damage would you allow a charge of black powder to do? I believe a light cannon from Stormwrack takes 1 pound of black powder to fire a cannon ball for 3d10 damage. So how much would an explosion of 10 pounds of powder do? This will probably be coming up in a game in the near future as the PCs are acquiring blackpowder and they're going to be forced into a postion of using it to deal with a monster of much greater than their CR would normally allow. I was thinking of 1d6 damage in a 5 foot radius for the first pound, +1d6 per additional pound and an extra 5 feet to the radius every time you double the poundage (So 10 ft radius for 2 lbs, 15 foot for 4 lbs, 20 ft for 8 lbs., etc). Reflex DC 15+1 per lb for half damage and Fortitude Save (same DC) to avoid deafness for 2d6+1 rd per pound. Does that sound reasonable? Also if an explosion of about 20 lbs of powder went off in the center of 20 tons of silver coins (2 million coins) in a swamp how much of the coinage would you allow the PCs to recover?
_Jayne_Cobb_ 09-27-07, 12:15 PM	How much damage would you allow a charge of black powder to do? I believe a light cannon from Stormwrack takes 1 pound of black powder to fire a cannon ball for 3d10 damage. So how much would an explosion of 10 pounds of powder do? This will probably be coming up in a game in the near future as the PCs are acquiring blackpowder and they're going to be forced into a postion of using it to deal with a monster of much greater than their CR would normally allow. I was thinking of 1d6 damage in a 5 foot radius for the first pound, +1d6 per additional pound and an extra 5 feet to the radius every time you double the poundage (So 10 ft radius for 2 lbs, 15 foot for 4 lbs, 20 ft for 8 lbs., etc). Reflex DC 15+1 per lb for half damage and Fortitude Save (same DC) to avoid deafness for 2d6+1 rd per pound. Does that sound reasonable? Not quite. Each doubling actually requires an eight-fold multiplication of volume. You are dealing on a spherical radius, not just a circular one. 1 lb = 5 ft 8 lb = 10 ft 64 lb = 20 ft 512 lb = 40 ft etc…
TwiddleStootch 09-27-07, 12:18 PM	For Blackpowder rules, its really up to the DM. It all depends how strong he wants Blackpowder to be as a weapon. In my camapign, it is fairly weak when set off as an explosive. But some DMs might want to make it stronger. But what you suggest sounds ok, but I would put a cap on how much blackpowder can be blown up together. And for the coins, that depends on what the DM decides the Blakcpowder does when set off, and on how densely packed the coins are, which would determine how much is effected by the explosion.
Some_call_me_Tim 09-27-07, 12:18 PM	Does that sound reasonable? Sounds pretty good. You might want to take a look at the d20 modern SRD: Dynamite Perhaps one of the most common and straightforward explosives, dynamite is very stable under normal conditions. A stick of dynamite requires a fuse or detonator to set it off. Additional sticks can be set off at the same time if they are within the burst radius of the first stick, increasing the damage and burst radius of the explosion. Each additional stick increases the damage by +1d6 (maximum 10d6) and the burst radius by 5 feet (maximum 20 feet). It’s possible to wire together several sticks of dynamite for even greater explosive effect. Doing so requires a Demolitions check (DC 10 + 1 per stick). If the character succeeds on the check, the damage or the burst radius of the explosion increases by 50% (the character’s choice). Dynamite is sold in boxes of 12 sticks. It is considered to be a simple explosive for the purpose of using a Craft (chemical) check to manufacture it. To set off dynamite using a fuse, the fuse must first be lit, requiring a move action (and a lighter or other source of flame). The amount of time until the dynamite explodes depends on the length of the fuse—a fuse can be cut short enough for the dynamite to detonate in the same round (allowing it to be used much like a grenade), or long enough to take several minutes to detonate. Cutting the fuse to the appropriate length requires a move action. Also if an explosion of about 20 lbs of powder went off in the center of 20 tons of silver coins (2 million coins) in a swamp how much of the coinage would you allow the PCs to recover?Largely depend on time an technology used. Simply walking around and picking up what you see and perhaps digging around just outside the blast--30%. Take days to weeks and using sifters and sluices maybe 80-90%. This highly-detailed analysis is simply numbers coming out of my arse (cause I can't ******-extraction, apparently).
Ddraiglais 09-27-07, 12:37 PM	Damage to who? I would rule that packing more and more black powder into a cannon would increase it's chances of going boom in the PC's faces.
TwiddleStootch 09-27-07, 01:12 PM	Damage to who? I would rule that packing more and more black powder into a cannon would increase it's chances of going boom in the PC's faces. I think the question here is when containers of the stuff (IE. barrels) are set off to explode, not when a cannon is over packed.
Finarin Panjoro 09-27-07, 01:31 PM	Right, we're talking bombs here, not cannons. Cannons were just the only reference I had for this sort of thing. Looks like I guesstimated the dynamite rules fairly closely, thanks for posting them Some_call_me_Tim. _Jayne_Cobb_, that makes sense to me, but its actually a hemishperical radius assuming that its set off on the ground. So I assume it would require a power of four increase in explosives (1 lb=5 ft, 4 lbs=10 ft, 16 lbs=20 feet, 64 lbs=40 feet). It looks like my guess is probably close enough for my purposes. I know the coin question is tricky. The correct answer is probably: allow them to find enough to feel well rewarded for their efforts. :D
The_Cheat137 09-27-07, 08:17 PM	Well, isn't that almost always the correct answer? Give them enough to feel well-rewarded. After all, happy gaming is far more important than realistic gaming :P
Grumman 09-27-07, 08:39 PM	_Jayne_Cobb_, that makes sense to me, but its actually a hemishperical radius assuming that its set off on the ground. So I assume it would require a power of four increase in explosives (1 lb=5 ft, 4 lbs=10 ft, 16 lbs=20 feet, 64 lbs=40 feet). No, it would still be an eight-fold increase, it's just that you would start off with 1/2 lb=5 ft.
Finarin Panjoro 09-28-07, 10:17 AM	So it would be .5 lbs = 5 ft. 4 lbs = 10 ft. 32 lbs = 20 ft. (80 lbs = 30 ft) estimated. 128 lbs = 40 ft. And I found out that a light cannon uses 4 lbs of powder per shot, not one. I'm also thinking of treating the explosion like light and having a secondary radius that suffers half damage, and allows an easier Reflex Save for half damage and no deafness (DC 10+1 per radius increase).
_Jayne_Cobb_ 09-28-07, 11:25 AM	So it would be .5 lbs = 5 ft. 4 lbs = 10 ft. 32 lbs = 20 ft. (80 lbs = 30 ft) estimated. 128 lbs = 40 ft. No. .5 = 5 ft 4 (.5 x 8) = 10 ft 13.5 (4 x 3.375) = 15 ft 32 (4 x 8) = 20 ft 108 (32 x 3.375) = 30 ft 256 (32 x 8) = 40 ft 864 (256 x 3.375) = 60 ft 2048 (256 x 8) = 80 ft 4000 (4 x 1000) = 100 ft Comparisons to dynamite aren't overly apt as Dynamite is a high-explosive and black powder is a low-explosive.
Finarin Panjoro 09-28-07, 01:06 PM	Shiny.