Blasphemy? [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Blasphemy? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
beaver1024
11-06-03, 06:25 AM Hi,

I am about to confront my players with the cohort of the BBEG. The PCs are between 12 - 14th lvl. The NPC that they will face is a 13th lvl cleric of Hextor with Law and Evil domain. The cleric has a Strand of Prayer Beads with a bead of Karma and an Orange Ioun stone. The PCs are not evil. Am I right in thinking that unless they can stop the cleric from casting Blasphemy, they are basically dead?

Given that the cleric will have initiative (they are adventuring in the lands ruled by the BBEG) what can the players do to prevent their inevitable demise? Also if the players were to use this trick, what kinds of monsters can I throw at them that will still suit the appropriate EL but not be affected by this trick? I know that I can no longer use NPCs within +5 HDs of the players cleric level.

In order to avoid a TPK, I guess I should use something much more inferior like a 13th lvl Necromancer with Waves of Exhaustion instead?

Blasphemy and its sister spells seems like the new Harm in 3.5.
Rabe
11-06-03, 07:53 AM Is the limit for death not 10 HD?

Second, there are ways to protect themselves from Blasphemy, like Energy Immunity (sonic) from T&B, as Blasphemy is a sonic spell.
Then, initiative is not everything. Ok, the boss knows the PCs are in his domain, but so should they...if they know, what an evil cleric can do, they might wander around in a sphere of Silence, which would protect them too (somewhat).
The spell has also certain limits: its centered on the caster and has a given spread, so the evil one has actually to stand among them.
The most common defense a caster can have (although many dont learn it) is counterspelling. Given the right feats he could counterspell the Blasphemy with Dispel Magic even on a surprise round.

Blasphemy is now certainly dangerous, but much depends on the experience of the players and what their characters are.

Rabe
Neonsamurai
11-06-03, 09:26 AM Energy immunity does NOT help, since blasphemy does not deal damage it just outright kills you. Blasphemy is a very dangerous spell and the only way to protect against it is to win initiative and throw a silence spell on the caster or the area where the caster stands (just hope he cannot move too easily out of the silenced area).

Effectively this cohort is 6 caster levels above the average of the party, this is VERY dangerous, especially with blade barrier, flamestrike and the like. Also remember that 13th levell clerics can use destruction to get rid of enemy wizards/sorcs/rogues pretty easily.

Maybe deathward helps against blasphemy but i am not too sure about that. It should - at least - help versus the death effect, however paralysis is bad enough. Freedom of movement might help here. Scrolls of greater spell immunity may also be good, though expensive until you got (N)PCs who can cast 8th level spells.
Wayward Son
11-06-03, 09:54 AM Originally posted by beaver1024
Hi,

I am about to confront my players with the cohort of the BBEG. The PCs are between 12 - 14th lvl. The NPC that they will face is a 13th lvl cleric of Hextor with Law and Evil domain. The cleric has a Strand of Prayer Beads with a bead of Karma and an Orange Ioun stone. The PCs are not evil. Am I right in thinking that unless they can stop the cleric from casting Blasphemy, they are basically dead?

Short answer: no. Long answer: As I read it, the goodies give your BBEG an effective caster level of 18 (13 +1 (stone)+ 4 (Bead)). According to the description of Blasphemy, the effects (cumulative) depend on the target's level compared to the caster level. I see where you might think it's a death spell, but read the wording carefully. "Up to (level)" means all the levels between the next listing and the current one. For example:
Equal level:Dazed
Up to caster level - 1: Weakened, dazed. (This would be from caster level - 4 "up to" caster level - 1)
Up to caster level - 5: Paralyzed, weakened, dazed. (This would be from caster level - 9 "up to" caster level - 5)
Up to caster level - 10: Killed, paralyzed, weakened, dazed. (This is all levels caster level - 10 or lower)

Your party, being level 12 - 14, falls between the -1 and -5 categories. The 14th level characters will find themselves alone for a little while, and hurting, while the 13th and 12th level characters will be paralyzed. It's a tough spell, and meant to cause problems, but the magical toys are making it a really tough one for this group. If you're really worried about it, drop the beads and the BBEG will still be slowing them down, but not paralyzing them.

If you don't want to do that, there are ways to drop hints to the party. Let rumors abound about this guy's terrible evil and how he's killed entire villages with a word (rumors exaggerate a bit). Knowledge (arcana or religion) checks could suggest what spell he's using, and the pcs can prep for it. If the cleric can get off a Holy Word before the Blasphemy, he'll turn the tables on the BBEG. Alternately, anything that wards against Evil or Sonic spells will help. (If your party cleric were a level or two higher, Holy Aura is the best defense on this one.) If you have a bard, he can Countersong the Blasphemy. Also, anything that grants spell resistance gives the PCs a chance to ignore the effects. Finally, if your players are clever, they will send in some summoned critters first, perhaps even a planar ally, to engage the cleric and get him to use the Blasphemy, then rush in from outside the 40' radius to press the attack. (Blasphemy will send the summoned creatures back to their home plane.)

So, no, it's not an instant-TPK unless the PCs rush without protection into a situation where the cleric can use this spell effectively. If they do, well, that's part of the breaks, and maybe the players will learn that not all foes should be taken on directly. If they get some warning it's coming and prepare for it, the spell is less of a threat.
Taran Alvein
11-06-03, 11:12 AM Just because the BBEG knows they're there doesn't automatically give him Initiative. He has to roll just like they do. And if he rolls a 3 while they all roll 14, 15+? Well, that's his problem.
beaver1024
11-06-03, 05:44 PM Just for your information, the Bard's countersong ability only works for spells that give saves. Counterspelling is problematic because the party's cleric is good aligned. Using Dispel Magic as a counter is going to be difficult to pull of as well because of the disparity in caster levels.
beaver1024
11-06-03, 05:46 PM Originally posted by Taran Alvein
Just because the BBEG knows they're there doesn't automatically give him Initiative. He has to roll just like they do. And if he rolls a 3 while they all roll 14, 15+? Well, that's his problem.

Even if he survives the first round of combat, the moment he has a chance to act the party may be as good as dead.
Rabe
11-07-03, 05:22 AM As far as I understand it, Energy Immunity makes you immun to spells with the sonic descriptor (like Blasphemy), not to hp damage caused by sonic spells, Neonsamurai, but I have to look it up ;)

Counterspelling with Dispel: nobody said its going to work, its just a chance...13 against 18 is still 25%.
Alignment does not matter with Counterspelling, unless you mean they cannot use Blasphemy themselves.

The paralysis effect of Blasphemy can be countered by spells and items, which prevent paralysis from taking effect. Some PrCs and templates can also help...but I guess there are no undead in the group :)

/agree with Wayward

Rabe

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
beaver1024 11-06-03, 06:25 AM	Hi, I am about to confront my players with the cohort of the BBEG. The PCs are between 12 - 14th lvl. The NPC that they will face is a 13th lvl cleric of Hextor with Law and Evil domain. The cleric has a Strand of Prayer Beads with a bead of Karma and an Orange Ioun stone. The PCs are not evil. Am I right in thinking that unless they can stop the cleric from casting Blasphemy, they are basically dead? Given that the cleric will have initiative (they are adventuring in the lands ruled by the BBEG) what can the players do to prevent their inevitable demise? Also if the players were to use this trick, what kinds of monsters can I throw at them that will still suit the appropriate EL but not be affected by this trick? I know that I can no longer use NPCs within +5 HDs of the players cleric level. In order to avoid a TPK, I guess I should use something much more inferior like a 13th lvl Necromancer with Waves of Exhaustion instead? Blasphemy and its sister spells seems like the new Harm in 3.5.
Rabe 11-06-03, 07:53 AM	Is the limit for death not 10 HD? Second, there are ways to protect themselves from Blasphemy, like Energy Immunity (sonic) from T&B, as Blasphemy is a sonic spell. Then, initiative is not everything. Ok, the boss knows the PCs are in his domain, but so should they...if they know, what an evil cleric can do, they might wander around in a sphere of Silence, which would protect them too (somewhat). The spell has also certain limits: its centered on the caster and has a given spread, so the evil one has actually to stand among them. The most common defense a caster can have (although many dont learn it) is counterspelling. Given the right feats he could counterspell the Blasphemy with Dispel Magic even on a surprise round. Blasphemy is now certainly dangerous, but much depends on the experience of the players and what their characters are. Rabe
Neonsamurai 11-06-03, 09:26 AM	Energy immunity does NOT help, since blasphemy does not deal damage it just outright kills you. Blasphemy is a very dangerous spell and the only way to protect against it is to win initiative and throw a silence spell on the caster or the area where the caster stands (just hope he cannot move too easily out of the silenced area). Effectively this cohort is 6 caster levels above the average of the party, this is VERY dangerous, especially with blade barrier, flamestrike and the like. Also remember that 13th levell clerics can use destruction to get rid of enemy wizards/sorcs/rogues pretty easily. Maybe deathward helps against blasphemy but i am not too sure about that. It should - at least - help versus the death effect, however paralysis is bad enough. Freedom of movement might help here. Scrolls of greater spell immunity may also be good, though expensive until you got (N)PCs who can cast 8th level spells.
Wayward Son 11-06-03, 09:54 AM	Originally posted by beaver1024 Hi, I am about to confront my players with the cohort of the BBEG. The PCs are between 12 - 14th lvl. The NPC that they will face is a 13th lvl cleric of Hextor with Law and Evil domain. The cleric has a Strand of Prayer Beads with a bead of Karma and an Orange Ioun stone. The PCs are not evil. Am I right in thinking that unless they can stop the cleric from casting Blasphemy, they are basically dead? Short answer: no. Long answer: As I read it, the goodies give your BBEG an effective caster level of 18 (13 +1 (stone)+ 4 (Bead)). According to the description of Blasphemy, the effects (cumulative) depend on the target's level compared to the caster level. I see where you might think it's a death spell, but read the wording carefully. "Up to (level)" means all the levels between the next listing and the current one. For example: Equal level:Dazed Up to caster level - 1: Weakened, dazed. (This would be from caster level - 4 "up to" caster level - 1) Up to caster level - 5: Paralyzed, weakened, dazed. (This would be from caster level - 9 "up to" caster level - 5) Up to caster level - 10: Killed, paralyzed, weakened, dazed. (This is all levels caster level - 10 or lower) Your party, being level 12 - 14, falls between the -1 and -5 categories. The 14th level characters will find themselves alone for a little while, and hurting, while the 13th and 12th level characters will be paralyzed. It's a tough spell, and meant to cause problems, but the magical toys are making it a really tough one for this group. If you're really worried about it, drop the beads and the BBEG will still be slowing them down, but not paralyzing them. If you don't want to do that, there are ways to drop hints to the party. Let rumors abound about this guy's terrible evil and how he's killed entire villages with a word (rumors exaggerate a bit). Knowledge (arcana or religion) checks could suggest what spell he's using, and the pcs can prep for it. If the cleric can get off a Holy Word before the Blasphemy, he'll turn the tables on the BBEG. Alternately, anything that wards against Evil or Sonic spells will help. (If your party cleric were a level or two higher, Holy Aura is the best defense on this one.) If you have a bard, he can Countersong the Blasphemy. Also, anything that grants spell resistance gives the PCs a chance to ignore the effects. Finally, if your players are clever, they will send in some summoned critters first, perhaps even a planar ally, to engage the cleric and get him to use the Blasphemy, then rush in from outside the 40' radius to press the attack. (Blasphemy will send the summoned creatures back to their home plane.) So, no, it's not an instant-TPK unless the PCs rush without protection into a situation where the cleric can use this spell effectively. If they do, well, that's part of the breaks, and maybe the players will learn that not all foes should be taken on directly. If they get some warning it's coming and prepare for it, the spell is less of a threat.
Taran Alvein 11-06-03, 11:12 AM	Just because the BBEG knows they're there doesn't automatically give him Initiative. He has to roll just like they do. And if he rolls a 3 while they all roll 14, 15+? Well, that's his problem.
beaver1024 11-06-03, 05:44 PM	Just for your information, the Bard's countersong ability only works for spells that give saves. Counterspelling is problematic because the party's cleric is good aligned. Using Dispel Magic as a counter is going to be difficult to pull of as well because of the disparity in caster levels.
beaver1024 11-06-03, 05:46 PM	Originally posted by Taran Alvein Just because the BBEG knows they're there doesn't automatically give him Initiative. He has to roll just like they do. And if he rolls a 3 while they all roll 14, 15+? Well, that's his problem. Even if he survives the first round of combat, the moment he has a chance to act the party may be as good as dead.
Rabe 11-07-03, 05:22 AM	As far as I understand it, Energy Immunity makes you immun to spells with the sonic descriptor (like Blasphemy), not to hp damage caused by sonic spells, Neonsamurai, but I have to look it up ;) Counterspelling with Dispel: nobody said its going to work, its just a chance...13 against 18 is still 25%. Alignment does not matter with Counterspelling, unless you mean they cannot use Blasphemy themselves. The paralysis effect of Blasphemy can be countered by spells and items, which prevent paralysis from taking effect. Some PrCs and templates can also help...but I guess there are no undead in the group :) /agree with Wayward Rabe