Blissful Ignorance or Extra Simplicity... Help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Blissful Ignorance or Extra Simplicity... Help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Neo_Leviathan
06-26-07, 10:58 AM Everyone in one of my games or thinking of being in my gestalt game, leave now.

Hi all. Got a bit of a conundrum here I'm hoping you can help out with.

Ok, when my current game finishes I'm going to be running a gestalt campaign, 6 players, all the 'players are the chosen ones' shebang.
There will be 6 'main' BBEGs and one 'mega' BBEG.

The BBEGs are brothers, but several centuries old, each one having his own stronghold, schemes, goals etc. They dont work directly against each other, but nor are they a 'family group' for such purposes, though there are of course the occasional alliances and deals between them.

Now, I've got nine or ten people wanting to play, so obviously several people are going to miss out, so I came up with an idea that will hopefully make those that miss out less annoyed and likely to lynch me.

Those that miss out will get to play a BBEG. I'll let them know the details of the game world (which the PCs wont immediately know), give them a rough CR for their character, a vauge theme (ie, schemy spellcaster, nasty brute), location of their stronghold, advise whatever manpower they have, all those kinds of things. They'll then get to decide what they want to focus on, where they want to spend their resources, how they want to build their defenses, and then they'll play the character when the PCs get to their stronghold.
Depending on if they build up a spy network, they'll be advised week-by-week as to the happenings in the world, the PCs will show up on the rader every now and then, etc etc you get the idea.

Now, heres the part that I need help on.
Do you guys think I should *not* let the PCs know the those who missed out on playing are playing BBEGs, and let them stew in blissful ignorance until the secret comes up to bite them, OR should I say before deciding on which 6 players to take what I'm planning for those that aren't PCs, and let them decide who plays a villain and who a PC.

One side is far more amusing and a much greater surprise, the other makes things a bit more simple in figuring out who to take..

Any ideas?
beeps
06-26-07, 11:20 AM My honest advice to you is to not go forward with that plan.

Here is my reasoning: For most players the fun of running a character is in watching that character grow and develop through your actions. Playing a BBEG is not the same thing, your character doesn't advance, or if he does its by some arbitrary method and not from adventuring and other DND activities.

Furthermore unless you have reason to think the main PCs will encounter a particular BBEG on a particular night there is no reason to invite them, and they'll be missing out on the social aspect that many enjoy.

Let me offer you another option for dealing with a large number of players: Have you considered running two groups? and if all the players are friends you could run both in the same world, where the events of one group could affect the other, possibly even have them compete for the same goals? The PCs could hear of the fame or notoriety of the other adventuring group from NPCS. It could be a competition between the two groups.

With that said: if you insist on your approach.

I'd tell the players up front that you had something "special" planned for those who didn't fit the main group. I wouldn't go into details however I would tell them it might not be as intensive as running a character but should be fun and a different experience. Surprise is good, run with it.
Neo_Leviathan
06-26-07, 11:43 AM My honest advice to you is to not go forward with that plan.

Here is my reasoning: For most players the fun of running a character is in watching that character grow and develop through your actions. Playing a BBEG is not the same thing, your character doesn't advance, or if he does its by some arbitrary method and not from adventuring and other DND activities.

Hmm.. I guess this is true. I simply thought that the opportunity to control virtually a small kindgom and act counter to other players might make for a nice change and certainly an interesting challenge.
Plus, would this level of involvement be *worse* than not getting to play at all?

Furthermore unless you have reason to think the main PCs will encounter a particular BBEG on a particular night there is no reason to invite them, and they'll be missing out on the social aspect that many enjoy.

I figure that it'd be very unusual for the PCs to decide to go against this particular stronghold, attack it and get right the way into the BBEG's chamber all in the one session. We play in evenings after uni/work, so getting such a large amount of content through so quickly would be very unusual.

Quite true on the social aspect, though we all meet each other socially at different times. Again though, which would be worse, this or not being involved at all?

Let me offer you another option for dealing with a large number of players: Have you considered running two groups? and if all the players are friends you could run both in the same world, where the events of one group could affect the other, possibly even have them compete for the same goals? The PCs could hear of the fame or notoriety of the other adventuring group from NPCS. It could be a competition between the two groups.

I briefly considered doing this, but it'd be rather hard to run two groups of 'chosen ones', and in order to accomodate such a thing I'd need to completely change the entire world background, story and a lot of the rules for the setting too.

With that said: if you insist on your approach.

I'd tell the players up front that you had something "special" planned for those who didn't fit the main group. I wouldn't go into details however I would tell them it might not be as intensive as running a character but should be fun and a different experience. Surprise is good, run with it.

This could be a decent compromise.. :)
Neo_Leviathan
06-27-07, 12:03 AM Any other ideas?
Radiun
06-27-07, 12:06 AM Run Two Groups, one Good, one Evil...
I think you can tell what the Bards will sing about to the other group and what the Final Showdown will be.

Edit: I hope it's different enough from Beep's suggestion to count:P

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Neo_Leviathan 06-26-07, 10:58 AM	Everyone in one of my games or thinking of being in my gestalt game, leave now. Hi all. Got a bit of a conundrum here I'm hoping you can help out with. Ok, when my current game finishes I'm going to be running a gestalt campaign, 6 players, all the 'players are the chosen ones' shebang. There will be 6 'main' BBEGs and one 'mega' BBEG. The BBEGs are brothers, but several centuries old, each one having his own stronghold, schemes, goals etc. They dont work directly against each other, but nor are they a 'family group' for such purposes, though there are of course the occasional alliances and deals between them. Now, I've got nine or ten people wanting to play, so obviously several people are going to miss out, so I came up with an idea that will hopefully make those that miss out less annoyed and likely to lynch me. Those that miss out will get to play a BBEG. I'll let them know the details of the game world (which the PCs wont immediately know), give them a rough CR for their character, a vauge theme (ie, schemy spellcaster, nasty brute), location of their stronghold, advise whatever manpower they have, all those kinds of things. They'll then get to decide what they want to focus on, where they want to spend their resources, how they want to build their defenses, and then they'll play the character when the PCs get to their stronghold. Depending on if they build up a spy network, they'll be advised week-by-week as to the happenings in the world, the PCs will show up on the rader every now and then, etc etc you get the idea. Now, heres the part that I need help on. Do you guys think I should not let the PCs know the those who missed out on playing are playing BBEGs, and let them stew in blissful ignorance until the secret comes up to bite them, OR should I say before deciding on which 6 players to take what I'm planning for those that aren't PCs, and let them decide who plays a villain and who a PC. One side is far more amusing and a much greater surprise, the other makes things a bit more simple in figuring out who to take.. Any ideas?
beeps 06-26-07, 11:20 AM	My honest advice to you is to not go forward with that plan. Here is my reasoning: For most players the fun of running a character is in watching that character grow and develop through your actions. Playing a BBEG is not the same thing, your character doesn't advance, or if he does its by some arbitrary method and not from adventuring and other DND activities. Furthermore unless you have reason to think the main PCs will encounter a particular BBEG on a particular night there is no reason to invite them, and they'll be missing out on the social aspect that many enjoy. Let me offer you another option for dealing with a large number of players: Have you considered running two groups? and if all the players are friends you could run both in the same world, where the events of one group could affect the other, possibly even have them compete for the same goals? The PCs could hear of the fame or notoriety of the other adventuring group from NPCS. It could be a competition between the two groups. With that said: if you insist on your approach. I'd tell the players up front that you had something "special" planned for those who didn't fit the main group. I wouldn't go into details however I would tell them it might not be as intensive as running a character but should be fun and a different experience. Surprise is good, run with it.
Neo_Leviathan 06-26-07, 11:43 AM	My honest advice to you is to not go forward with that plan. Here is my reasoning: For most players the fun of running a character is in watching that character grow and develop through your actions. Playing a BBEG is not the same thing, your character doesn't advance, or if he does its by some arbitrary method and not from adventuring and other DND activities. Hmm.. I guess this is true. I simply thought that the opportunity to control virtually a small kindgom and act counter to other players might make for a nice change and certainly an interesting challenge. Plus, would this level of involvement be worse than not getting to play at all? Furthermore unless you have reason to think the main PCs will encounter a particular BBEG on a particular night there is no reason to invite them, and they'll be missing out on the social aspect that many enjoy. I figure that it'd be very unusual for the PCs to decide to go against this particular stronghold, attack it and get right the way into the BBEG's chamber all in the one session. We play in evenings after uni/work, so getting such a large amount of content through so quickly would be very unusual. Quite true on the social aspect, though we all meet each other socially at different times. Again though, which would be worse, this or not being involved at all? Let me offer you another option for dealing with a large number of players: Have you considered running two groups? and if all the players are friends you could run both in the same world, where the events of one group could affect the other, possibly even have them compete for the same goals? The PCs could hear of the fame or notoriety of the other adventuring group from NPCS. It could be a competition between the two groups. I briefly considered doing this, but it'd be rather hard to run two groups of 'chosen ones', and in order to accomodate such a thing I'd need to completely change the entire world background, story and a lot of the rules for the setting too. With that said: if you insist on your approach. I'd tell the players up front that you had something "special" planned for those who didn't fit the main group. I wouldn't go into details however I would tell them it might not be as intensive as running a character but should be fun and a different experience. Surprise is good, run with it. This could be a decent compromise.. :)
Neo_Leviathan 06-27-07, 12:03 AM	Any other ideas?
Radiun 06-27-07, 12:06 AM	Run Two Groups, one Good, one Evil... I think you can tell what the Bards will sing about to the other group and what the Final Showdown will be. Edit: I hope it's different enough from Beep's suggestion to count:P