Boiling Water [Archive] - Wizards Community

Boiling Water [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Zodan
04-06-05, 03:04 PM One of my players recently discovered a Cauldron of Warming, and while that will make an awesome tool for alchemy or a wonderful present to a cook, I foresee it becoming weaponized first, being as no one in the party has a cook or practices alchemy. so my question now is what kind of damage does a up to a gallon of boiling water present. For those not familar with the Cauldron - it is a small sized iron cauldron which will hold up to a gallon of liquid comfortably. I don't see anywhere in the rules that this type of damage is addressed, so I was just wondering what yall's input would be. Obviously the user is going to have to find a way to keep hold of the pot while it's got boiling liquid in it, then dump it somehow, but after that, what happens to the poor sap who gets soaked?
Alynn
04-06-05, 03:16 PM Well its a burn so I'd say 1d6 like most fire damage. And hitting someone in the face with it, well I'd say probably blinded for 1d4 rounds...

Oh and I believe it would be a touch attack (if the threw the water a ranged touch attack 5' range increment 15 foot max).

Just a thought
Slider33
04-06-05, 03:18 PM are there any rules of a boiling oil cauldron? I would assume the damage would be slightly less than an oil cauldron.

You can't set water on fire, and (without going into too much of a scientific explanation) the specific heat of water is much less dangerous than oil. Basically, when oil is hot it STAYS hot for a lot longer than water does, thus being much more deadly.

I'm not sure what a cauldron does, but I'm sure it's in the rules somewhere? If so, just reduce the damage down slightly and that should do the trick.
ManinDarkness
04-06-05, 03:21 PM From The SRD, Wilderness and Environment, Heat Dangers

Boiling water deals 1d6 points of scalding damage, unless the character is fully immersed, in which case it deals 10d6 points of damage per round of exposure.
green_yawgmoth
04-06-05, 03:25 PM From The SRD, Wilderness and Environment, Heat Dangers
So boiling water immersion does as much damage as immersion in lava? :uh-huh:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
Janus Krug
04-06-05, 03:30 PM Lava is 2d6 and 20d6. Boiling water is equivalent to acid.
Alcari Ambaron
04-06-05, 03:33 PM how much would boiling oil do??
it being hotter and more viscous and stuff
tarkin
04-06-05, 03:44 PM I would say that Boiling Oil might do 1d8
ManinDarkness
04-06-05, 03:44 PM I'd compromise oil damage with 2d6 and 15d6.
lukelightning
04-06-05, 03:55 PM Throwing a bunch of boiling water (a gallon?) on someone should do 1d3 or 1d4 damage, I think. It shouldn't be equal to alchemist's fire. While it's painful and damages tissue, I don't think its nescessarily lethal.
Phrennzy
04-06-05, 04:26 PM Boiling water is REALLY hot - I found out last night cooking spaghetti. I believe I took about 1d6. But I had cool water right there - so the damage was quickly reduced.
ManinDarkness
04-06-05, 04:30 PM Yep, boiling water can do third degree burns I should know, I took a second dgree one making instant soup. Don't ask. :embarrass
Lord Ian Stark
04-06-05, 04:48 PM Boiling water is REALLY hot - I found out last night cooking spaghetti. I believe I took about 1d6. But I had cool water right there - so the damage was quickly reduced.

HAHAHA :mage:

Perhaps we should add Charisma point damage to someone getting immersed in boiling water, oil or lava?
DM Denubis
04-06-05, 05:17 PM HAHAHA :mage:

Perhaps we should add Charisma point damage to someone getting immersed in boiling water, oil or lava?

That's a great idea. I mean, I always lose a bit of my force of personality by burning myself.
Alluvian
04-06-05, 05:22 PM Boiling water is REALLY hot - I found out last night cooking spaghetti. I believe I took about 1d6. But I had cool water right there - so the damage was quickly reduced.

In DND you would be at best a level 1 commoner I would think. Could boiling water thrown in your face KILL YOU? Would make it non-lethal damage personally unless we are talking about immersion. I could see a faceful of boiling water knocking a commoner unconscious for sure due to the pain and shock.
Law S
04-06-05, 05:46 PM In DND you would be at best a level 1 commoner I would think. Could boiling water thrown in your face KILL YOU? Would make it non-lethal damage personally unless we are talking about immersion. I could see a faceful of boiling water knocking a commoner unconscious for sure due to the pain and shock.

Funny you should mention that; I was wondering earlier today, what would be the physiological effects of just swallowing scalding hot/boiling water, particularly, drowning in it (even if it was just a quick burst, instead of prolongued exposure).

Thinking over the effects of soft tissue damage versus scalding water, it'd probably be pretty safe to say that a quick cooking of your alveoli = dead, in the very immediate future. The question then becomes, does sudden heat trigger aspiration, much like sudden cold? Meaning, if you were caught in the face with a rush of boiling water, would you suddenly gasp and take out the lining of your throat and lungs? If so, it very well could be fatal.

This is also not considering the risk of infection and long term blood-poisoning and the like from improper treatment of the burns, which could also lead to death, at least in the long run.
hussey_graham
04-06-05, 06:06 PM I'd say that it should be 1d6. I am a huge camper and I have burnt myself on the fire, boiling water, the grill etc. they are al about the same. I'd just say they would have to roll a percentile dice (if they don't get killed before this) to see if blister apear. If the blisters are on hands or face I'd give them a -2 circumstance on fighting for a day or 2. I'd say this also equals it out a little because fire damage will burn off burnable clothing...
Aliquid
04-06-05, 06:16 PM In DND you would be at best a level 1 commoner I would think. Could boiling water thrown in your face KILL YOU? Would make it non-lethal damage personally unless we are talking about immersion. I could see a faceful of boiling water knocking a commoner unconscious for sure due to the pain and shock.Don't forget that a level 1 commoner can quite easily and quickly be killed by a house-cat.
Law S
04-06-05, 06:24 PM Don't forget that a level 1 commoner can quite easily and quickly be killed by a house-cat.

Well, actually, if you take into account "cat scratch fever" and the tissue swelling around the brain that can come from it...

..Anyway, yes, I think the point I presume being made here is a valid one; an abstract of realism is fine in a game, but dwelling on it too long will pick it apart.
Phrennzy
04-06-05, 06:46 PM Don't forget that a level 1 commoner can quite easily and quickly be killed by a house-cat.

Dude, my cat is vicious.

It's the sneak attack from him I fear the most.
Riznar
04-06-05, 06:59 PM I don't know Phrennzy's age, but Phrennzy's class is probably at least expert1. Remember that in a society with required education, trained workers are produced, not simple laborers.

Plus, Phrennzy probably wasn't hit directly with the water, more likely the damage was 1 because of something similar to the spash effect that thrown weapons have.

So assuming Phrennzy has 10 Con, that means Phrennzy's HP was at 2/3. 1/3 the way to disabled. If Phrennzy was hit with a pot of boiling water, that could definately be enough damage to send one's body into shock. (-1 or below)

So I think 1d6 damage is about right.
Meshakhad
04-06-05, 09:03 PM Y'know, lava does WAY too little damage. I mean, a first level barbarian with 12 con could wade through it and he's GUARANTEED to survive.
Count Arioch the 28th
04-06-05, 09:09 PM Yeah, because everyone knows that level 1 barbarians can take 20d6 damage per round without breaking a sweat. :P
Shadowmagyk
04-06-05, 09:48 PM Im starting to think that lvl 1 commoners are like those chickens and deer that are strapped to a table until they are ready to be eaten. How can a person, who has lived for many years, especially those working in the fields, be that frail. Newborns get bitten by dogs, and scratched by cats all the time. I never see them die, unless it is from an infection, in which case, they failed their FORT save.
Aliquid
04-06-05, 10:01 PM Im starting to think that lvl 1 commoners are like those chickens and deer that are strapped to a table until they are ready to be eaten. How can a person, who has lived for many years, especially those working in the fields, be that frail. Newborns get bitten by dogs, and scratched by cats all the time. I never see them die, unless it is from an infection, in which case, they failed their FORT save.Unfortunately, the D&D hitpoint system is a very irrational system. The only two solutions I can think of are... 1 - ignore it and have fun anyway, or 2 - play a different system.

There might be other ways to deal with it.... but that's the best I can think of
Lord Ian Stark
04-07-05, 01:01 AM That's a great idea. I mean, I always lose a bit of my force of personality by burning myself.

Oh, I'm sorry, I thought the look of scars and the loss of living tissue on a characters' skin counted towards his Charisma score. My bad. :rolleyes:
SnowbearK
04-07-05, 02:35 AM Im starting to think that lvl 1 commoners are like those chickens and deer that are strapped to a table until they are ready to be eaten. How can a person, who has lived for many years, especially those working in the fields, be that frail. Newborns get bitten by dogs, and scratched by cats all the time. I never see them die, unless it is from an infection, in which case, they failed their FORT save.

Because a Level 1 Commoner is what a person is when they are still an adolescent, have little to no exposure to violence & survival-threatening peril, are fairly uneducated, and rely mostly on others for most of their basic needs (food, clothing, shelter).

Most folks nowadays are pretty well educated (I've worked customer service, so believe me, I'm shocked to actually type that so...comparatively speaking of course), exposed to a lot of peril early on, and could readily make do on their own for basic needs (barter in one form or another is not necessarily reliance).

As well most folk nowadays have a much higher FORT save against diseases. We've pretty well eradicated, medicated, or hygenically blasted the major medieval diseases to the point where it's almost unimagineable now for someone to die of a cold, and 3000 deaths from the flu is horrific to us.
SnowbearK
04-07-05, 02:37 AM Oh, I'm sorry, I thought the look of scars and the loss of living tissue on a characters' skin counted towards his Charisma score. My bad. :rolleyes:

Only if you choose to apply it to that. Charisma is a combination of appearance and force of personality. If you were fugly to begin with, but had a personality of gold, folks likely wouldn't notice the difference.

If your character was Prince Charming before, then you might have a reason to take a Charisma hit.

Charisma's quite personal to the character in question.
Lord Ian Stark
04-07-05, 12:44 PM Only if you choose to apply it to that. Charisma is a combination of appearance and force of personality.

Fiend Folio pg 96 & 97, The creature Hullathoin has the Deform (Su) ability. Basically it can twist and deform your flesh into obscene, fantastic shapes. If you fail the Fort Save you take 1D6 CHA damage.

That is by the RAW. If you want to house rule that your CHA is not effected by your outside appreance than thats fine. I know a Bard and Sorceror don't get to cast spells because they have baby soft skin. It's all rolled up into Charisma.

PH pg. 9, Charisma - Charisma measures a character's force of personality, persuasiveness, personal magnetism, ability to lead, and physical attractiveness.
mercurial67
04-07-05, 01:20 PM Don't forget the AoO for tossing the boiling water. It should be considered a ranged attack for this purpose. They should also get a -4 for using an improvised weapon. I don't think many characters have pots of water as something they are proficient with.

As for babies & children being bit by dogs and surviving, they weren't MAULED by dogs. A single bite is not the same as a bite attack. Look at what trained attack dogs do, they grab with their mouth and shake and tear. THAT is a bite attack.
SnowbearK
04-08-05, 12:57 PM PH pg. 9, Charisma - Charisma measures a character's force of personality, persuasiveness, personal magnetism, ability to lead, and physical attractiveness.

Only if you choose to apply it to that. Charisma is a combination of appearance and force of personality.

Sooo...what I said. :rolleyes:

A: Fiend Folio is not Core rules. Good example though, if it weren't for B and C, below.

B: That's a specific rule for that particular ability.

C: Allow me to clarify, since we're in the What's A DM To Do board, I supposed I was speaking to a DM, thus the you in my quote is specifically targeted to the DM, who makes the ruling on what any given attack does.
Mula
04-08-05, 02:03 PM Boiling water deals 1d6 points of scalding damage, unless the character is fully immersed, in which case it deals 10d6 points of damage per round of exposure.

Scalding damage, eh? Can a wizard develop a ball of scalding, which is like a fireball but creates a sphere of boiling water, dealing 1d6/lvl scalding damage. Watch out, red dragons! Kind of reminds me of this article. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/bs/20050218a)
Lord Ian Stark
04-08-05, 02:36 PM C: Allow me to clarify, since we're in the What's A DM To Do board, I supposed I was speaking to a DM, thus the you in my quote is specifically targeted to the DM, who makes the ruling on what any given attack does.

Yes sir. And that's why I am talking to this DM about a possibility of what a boiling pot of water can do to a person's flesh and the negative effects it may cause to them.

Mummy Rot is a nasty disease where the persons body starts to decay and whither down to nothing. Accordingly, the ability's Con and CHA are dropped due to the destruction of your body and how you look when the disease is killing you.

Look at some of the player races that have a negative to the Charisma score (Orc, Ogre, Tiefling, Troll, etc.). It's either because they have no people skills or are as ugly as sin. They may not be core character races but are still in the core books as player races. ;)
gleep
04-08-05, 03:18 PM Forget the water. How much damage does a small cauldron do?

:D

--gleep

PS: And there's a reason my cat is named The Cat from Hell.
SnowbearK
04-08-05, 11:34 PM Yes sir. And that's why I am talking to this DM about a possibility of what a boiling pot of water can do to a person's flesh and the negative effects it may cause to them.

Mummy Rot is a nasty disease where the persons body starts to decay and whither down to nothing. Accordingly, the ability's Con and CHA are dropped due to the destruction of your body and how you look when the disease is killing you.

Look at some of the player races that have a negative to the Charisma score (Orc, Ogre, Tiefling, Troll, etc.). It's either because they have no people skills or are as ugly as sin. They may not be core character races but are still in the core books as player races. ;)

:blink:

So essentially you agree with me, you just enjoy arguing a point to death.
Kaligrad
04-08-05, 11:57 PM Technically, falling ten feet is enough to potentially kill a 1st commoner, given the rules. These rules aren't really geared towards realism with regards to filler NPC's.
pawtucket_pat
04-09-05, 12:11 AM Look at some of the player races that have a negative to the Charisma score (Orc, Ogre, Tiefling, Troll, etc.). It's either because they have no people skills or are as ugly as sin. They may not be core character races but are still in the core books as player races. ;)

But the problem is that it doesn't work the opposite way. Some of the high charisma monsters are ugly as sin too. Take the illithid. He's got tons of charisma, and the face of a squid. Not winning any beauty pageants any time soon, but they still have high charisma.
Edymnion
04-09-05, 12:25 AM Technically, falling ten feet is enough to potentially kill a 1st commoner, given the rules. These rules aren't really geared towards realism with regards to filler NPC's.People have been known to trip and kill themselves from the fall.

And yeah, a dog biting your leg is not making a Bite attack.
The trained attack dog or wolf going for your throat is making a Bite attack.

And while having a gallon of boiling water thrown on you is unlikely to kill you immediantly, it is also unlikely that taking a full gout of flame will immediantly kill you. You are far more likely to die within a day or two due to tissue damage and infection.

Was just a few weeks ago I was watching an Emergency Room show on Discovery Health that had this nice old man that scalded himself in the bathtub when he accidentally turned it up too hot and couldn't get out quick enough. His entire back, from head to toe, was a solid third degree burn. He was totally alert and what I'd call "normal" while in the ER on tape, aside from half his body being lobster red. It flashed a thing up after his clips that he died that night from his burns.

Even people that get caught with full on flames often don't die from them immediantly, they die hours or days later from the burns. Yeah, I'd say 1d6 damage would be quite sufficient for being hit with a large amount of scalding water.
wolf_mage
04-09-05, 12:43 AM As I see it, a commoner (2.5 hp) falling 10ft (-3.5hp) would be in the "dying" thing momentarily. Either he gets up relatively unharmed 6 seconds later (10% chance), or he's knocked out for some period of time. As for the rare occasion in which he goes from -1 to -10 in one minute and dies, that would represent a particularly terrible fall.

Likewise, a dog biting your leg is making a bite attack � he just rolled a 1 for damage. A leg bite does not represent a "1d6 damage bite attack", it represents "rolling a 1 on a 1d6 bite attack". A bite to the neck would be a critical hit, most likely.

And so on. If you get killed by the boiling water, it's because you accidentally inhaled it or something.
SnowbearK
04-09-05, 12:43 AM Even people that get caught with full on flames often don't die from them immediantly, they die hours or days later from the burns. Yeah, I'd say 1d6 damage would be quite sufficient for being hit with a large amount of scalding water.

And on that note, it's worthy of stating that burns are the WORST injury to have when you're trying to avoid infections.

Burnt flesh might as well be doused in DSMO when it comes to keeping unwanted diseases, poisons, etc., out of your body.
Riznar
04-09-05, 01:21 AM I thought falling only 10' did non-lethal damage?
Norseman
04-09-05, 01:33 AM One of my players recently discovered a Cauldron of Warming, and while that will make an awesome tool for alchemy or a wonderful present to a cook, I foresee it becoming weaponized first, being as no one in the party has a cook or practices alchemy. so my question now is what kind of damage does a up to a gallon of boiling water present. For those not familar with the Cauldron - it is a small sized iron cauldron which will hold up to a gallon of liquid comfortably. I don't see anywhere in the rules that this type of damage is addressed, so I was just wondering what yall's input would be. Obviously the user is going to have to find a way to keep hold of the pot while it's got boiling liquid in it, then dump it somehow, but after that, what happens to the poor sap who gets soaked?

Boiling water will give third degree burns within seconds of contact with the skin, so I'd give it 1d6 fire damage, with the limitation that it will not ignite anything.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Zodan 04-06-05, 03:04 PM	One of my players recently discovered a Cauldron of Warming, and while that will make an awesome tool for alchemy or a wonderful present to a cook, I foresee it becoming weaponized first, being as no one in the party has a cook or practices alchemy. so my question now is what kind of damage does a up to a gallon of boiling water present. For those not familar with the Cauldron - it is a small sized iron cauldron which will hold up to a gallon of liquid comfortably. I don't see anywhere in the rules that this type of damage is addressed, so I was just wondering what yall's input would be. Obviously the user is going to have to find a way to keep hold of the pot while it's got boiling liquid in it, then dump it somehow, but after that, what happens to the poor sap who gets soaked?
Alynn 04-06-05, 03:16 PM	Well its a burn so I'd say 1d6 like most fire damage. And hitting someone in the face with it, well I'd say probably blinded for 1d4 rounds... Oh and I believe it would be a touch attack (if the threw the water a ranged touch attack 5' range increment 15 foot max). Just a thought
Slider33 04-06-05, 03:18 PM	are there any rules of a boiling oil cauldron? I would assume the damage would be slightly less than an oil cauldron. You can't set water on fire, and (without going into too much of a scientific explanation) the specific heat of water is much less dangerous than oil. Basically, when oil is hot it STAYS hot for a lot longer than water does, thus being much more deadly. I'm not sure what a cauldron does, but I'm sure it's in the rules somewhere? If so, just reduce the damage down slightly and that should do the trick.
ManinDarkness 04-06-05, 03:21 PM	From The SRD, Wilderness and Environment, Heat Dangers Boiling water deals 1d6 points of scalding damage, unless the character is fully immersed, in which case it deals 10d6 points of damage per round of exposure.
green_yawgmoth 04-06-05, 03:25 PM	From The SRD, Wilderness and Environment, Heat Dangers So boiling water immersion does as much damage as immersion in lava? :uh-huh: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
Janus Krug 04-06-05, 03:30 PM	Lava is 2d6 and 20d6. Boiling water is equivalent to acid.
Alcari Ambaron 04-06-05, 03:33 PM	how much would boiling oil do?? it being hotter and more viscous and stuff
tarkin 04-06-05, 03:44 PM	I would say that Boiling Oil might do 1d8
ManinDarkness 04-06-05, 03:44 PM	I'd compromise oil damage with 2d6 and 15d6.
lukelightning 04-06-05, 03:55 PM	Throwing a bunch of boiling water (a gallon?) on someone should do 1d3 or 1d4 damage, I think. It shouldn't be equal to alchemist's fire. While it's painful and damages tissue, I don't think its nescessarily lethal.
Phrennzy 04-06-05, 04:26 PM	Boiling water is REALLY hot - I found out last night cooking spaghetti. I believe I took about 1d6. But I had cool water right there - so the damage was quickly reduced.
ManinDarkness 04-06-05, 04:30 PM	Yep, boiling water can do third degree burns I should know, I took a second dgree one making instant soup. Don't ask. :embarrass
Lord Ian Stark 04-06-05, 04:48 PM	Boiling water is REALLY hot - I found out last night cooking spaghetti. I believe I took about 1d6. But I had cool water right there - so the damage was quickly reduced. HAHAHA :mage: Perhaps we should add Charisma point damage to someone getting immersed in boiling water, oil or lava?
DM Denubis 04-06-05, 05:17 PM	HAHAHA :mage: Perhaps we should add Charisma point damage to someone getting immersed in boiling water, oil or lava? That's a great idea. I mean, I always lose a bit of my force of personality by burning myself.
Alluvian 04-06-05, 05:22 PM	Boiling water is REALLY hot - I found out last night cooking spaghetti. I believe I took about 1d6. But I had cool water right there - so the damage was quickly reduced. In DND you would be at best a level 1 commoner I would think. Could boiling water thrown in your face KILL YOU? Would make it non-lethal damage personally unless we are talking about immersion. I could see a faceful of boiling water knocking a commoner unconscious for sure due to the pain and shock.
Law S 04-06-05, 05:46 PM	In DND you would be at best a level 1 commoner I would think. Could boiling water thrown in your face KILL YOU? Would make it non-lethal damage personally unless we are talking about immersion. I could see a faceful of boiling water knocking a commoner unconscious for sure due to the pain and shock. Funny you should mention that; I was wondering earlier today, what would be the physiological effects of just swallowing scalding hot/boiling water, particularly, drowning in it (even if it was just a quick burst, instead of prolongued exposure). Thinking over the effects of soft tissue damage versus scalding water, it'd probably be pretty safe to say that a quick cooking of your alveoli = dead, in the very immediate future. The question then becomes, does sudden heat trigger aspiration, much like sudden cold? Meaning, if you were caught in the face with a rush of boiling water, would you suddenly gasp and take out the lining of your throat and lungs? If so, it very well could be fatal. This is also not considering the risk of infection and long term blood-poisoning and the like from improper treatment of the burns, which could also lead to death, at least in the long run.
hussey_graham 04-06-05, 06:06 PM	I'd say that it should be 1d6. I am a huge camper and I have burnt myself on the fire, boiling water, the grill etc. they are al about the same. I'd just say they would have to roll a percentile dice (if they don't get killed before this) to see if blister apear. If the blisters are on hands or face I'd give them a -2 circumstance on fighting for a day or 2. I'd say this also equals it out a little because fire damage will burn off burnable clothing...
Aliquid 04-06-05, 06:16 PM	In DND you would be at best a level 1 commoner I would think. Could boiling water thrown in your face KILL YOU? Would make it non-lethal damage personally unless we are talking about immersion. I could see a faceful of boiling water knocking a commoner unconscious for sure due to the pain and shock.Don't forget that a level 1 commoner can quite easily and quickly be killed by a house-cat.
Law S 04-06-05, 06:24 PM	Don't forget that a level 1 commoner can quite easily and quickly be killed by a house-cat. Well, actually, if you take into account "cat scratch fever" and the tissue swelling around the brain that can come from it... ..Anyway, yes, I think the point I presume being made here is a valid one; an abstract of realism is fine in a game, but dwelling on it too long will pick it apart.
Phrennzy 04-06-05, 06:46 PM	Don't forget that a level 1 commoner can quite easily and quickly be killed by a house-cat. Dude, my cat is vicious. It's the sneak attack from him I fear the most.
Riznar 04-06-05, 06:59 PM	I don't know Phrennzy's age, but Phrennzy's class is probably at least expert1. Remember that in a society with required education, trained workers are produced, not simple laborers. Plus, Phrennzy probably wasn't hit directly with the water, more likely the damage was 1 because of something similar to the spash effect that thrown weapons have. So assuming Phrennzy has 10 Con, that means Phrennzy's HP was at 2/3. 1/3 the way to disabled. If Phrennzy was hit with a pot of boiling water, that could definately be enough damage to send one's body into shock. (-1 or below) So I think 1d6 damage is about right.
Meshakhad 04-06-05, 09:03 PM	Y'know, lava does WAY too little damage. I mean, a first level barbarian with 12 con could wade through it and he's GUARANTEED to survive.
Count Arioch the 28th 04-06-05, 09:09 PM	Yeah, because everyone knows that level 1 barbarians can take 20d6 damage per round without breaking a sweat. :P
Shadowmagyk 04-06-05, 09:48 PM	Im starting to think that lvl 1 commoners are like those chickens and deer that are strapped to a table until they are ready to be eaten. How can a person, who has lived for many years, especially those working in the fields, be that frail. Newborns get bitten by dogs, and scratched by cats all the time. I never see them die, unless it is from an infection, in which case, they failed their FORT save.
Aliquid 04-06-05, 10:01 PM	Im starting to think that lvl 1 commoners are like those chickens and deer that are strapped to a table until they are ready to be eaten. How can a person, who has lived for many years, especially those working in the fields, be that frail. Newborns get bitten by dogs, and scratched by cats all the time. I never see them die, unless it is from an infection, in which case, they failed their FORT save.Unfortunately, the D&D hitpoint system is a very irrational system. The only two solutions I can think of are... 1 - ignore it and have fun anyway, or 2 - play a different system. There might be other ways to deal with it.... but that's the best I can think of
Lord Ian Stark 04-07-05, 01:01 AM	That's a great idea. I mean, I always lose a bit of my force of personality by burning myself. Oh, I'm sorry, I thought the look of scars and the loss of living tissue on a characters' skin counted towards his Charisma score. My bad. :rolleyes:
SnowbearK 04-07-05, 02:35 AM	Im starting to think that lvl 1 commoners are like those chickens and deer that are strapped to a table until they are ready to be eaten. How can a person, who has lived for many years, especially those working in the fields, be that frail. Newborns get bitten by dogs, and scratched by cats all the time. I never see them die, unless it is from an infection, in which case, they failed their FORT save. Because a Level 1 Commoner is what a person is when they are still an adolescent, have little to no exposure to violence & survival-threatening peril, are fairly uneducated, and rely mostly on others for most of their basic needs (food, clothing, shelter). Most folks nowadays are pretty well educated (I've worked customer service, so believe me, I'm shocked to actually type that so...comparatively speaking of course), exposed to a lot of peril early on, and could readily make do on their own for basic needs (barter in one form or another is not necessarily reliance). As well most folk nowadays have a much higher FORT save against diseases. We've pretty well eradicated, medicated, or hygenically blasted the major medieval diseases to the point where it's almost unimagineable now for someone to die of a cold, and 3000 deaths from the flu is horrific to us.
SnowbearK 04-07-05, 02:37 AM	Oh, I'm sorry, I thought the look of scars and the loss of living tissue on a characters' skin counted towards his Charisma score. My bad. :rolleyes: Only if you choose to apply it to that. Charisma is a combination of appearance and force of personality. If you were fugly to begin with, but had a personality of gold, folks likely wouldn't notice the difference. If your character was Prince Charming before, then you might have a reason to take a Charisma hit. Charisma's quite personal to the character in question.
Lord Ian Stark 04-07-05, 12:44 PM	Only if you choose to apply it to that. Charisma is a combination of appearance and force of personality. Fiend Folio pg 96 & 97, The creature Hullathoin has the Deform (Su) ability. Basically it can twist and deform your flesh into obscene, fantastic shapes. If you fail the Fort Save you take 1D6 CHA damage. That is by the RAW. If you want to house rule that your CHA is not effected by your outside appreance than thats fine. I know a Bard and Sorceror don't get to cast spells because they have baby soft skin. It's all rolled up into Charisma. PH pg. 9, Charisma - Charisma measures a character's force of personality, persuasiveness, personal magnetism, ability to lead, and physical attractiveness.
mercurial67 04-07-05, 01:20 PM	Don't forget the AoO for tossing the boiling water. It should be considered a ranged attack for this purpose. They should also get a -4 for using an improvised weapon. I don't think many characters have pots of water as something they are proficient with. As for babies & children being bit by dogs and surviving, they weren't MAULED by dogs. A single bite is not the same as a bite attack. Look at what trained attack dogs do, they grab with their mouth and shake and tear. THAT is a bite attack.
SnowbearK 04-08-05, 12:57 PM	PH pg. 9, Charisma - Charisma measures a character's force of personality, persuasiveness, personal magnetism, ability to lead, and physical attractiveness. Only if you choose to apply it to that. Charisma is a combination of appearance and force of personality. Sooo...what I said. :rolleyes: A: Fiend Folio is not Core rules. Good example though, if it weren't for B and C, below. B: That's a specific rule for that particular ability. C: Allow me to clarify, since we're in the What's A DM To Do board, I supposed I was speaking to a DM, thus the you in my quote is specifically targeted to the DM, who makes the ruling on what any given attack does.
Mula 04-08-05, 02:03 PM	Boiling water deals 1d6 points of scalding damage, unless the character is fully immersed, in which case it deals 10d6 points of damage per round of exposure. Scalding damage, eh? Can a wizard develop a ball of scalding, which is like a fireball but creates a sphere of boiling water, dealing 1d6/lvl scalding damage. Watch out, red dragons! Kind of reminds me of this article. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/bs/20050218a)
Lord Ian Stark 04-08-05, 02:36 PM	C: Allow me to clarify, since we're in the What's A DM To Do board, I supposed I was speaking to a DM, thus the you in my quote is specifically targeted to the DM, who makes the ruling on what any given attack does. Yes sir. And that's why I am talking to this DM about a possibility of what a boiling pot of water can do to a person's flesh and the negative effects it may cause to them. Mummy Rot is a nasty disease where the persons body starts to decay and whither down to nothing. Accordingly, the ability's Con and CHA are dropped due to the destruction of your body and how you look when the disease is killing you. Look at some of the player races that have a negative to the Charisma score (Orc, Ogre, Tiefling, Troll, etc.). It's either because they have no people skills or are as ugly as sin. They may not be core character races but are still in the core books as player races. ;)
gleep 04-08-05, 03:18 PM	Forget the water. How much damage does a small cauldron do? :D --gleep PS: And there's a reason my cat is named The Cat from Hell.
SnowbearK 04-08-05, 11:34 PM	Yes sir. And that's why I am talking to this DM about a possibility of what a boiling pot of water can do to a person's flesh and the negative effects it may cause to them. Mummy Rot is a nasty disease where the persons body starts to decay and whither down to nothing. Accordingly, the ability's Con and CHA are dropped due to the destruction of your body and how you look when the disease is killing you. Look at some of the player races that have a negative to the Charisma score (Orc, Ogre, Tiefling, Troll, etc.). It's either because they have no people skills or are as ugly as sin. They may not be core character races but are still in the core books as player races. ;) :blink: So essentially you agree with me, you just enjoy arguing a point to death.
Kaligrad 04-08-05, 11:57 PM	Technically, falling ten feet is enough to potentially kill a 1st commoner, given the rules. These rules aren't really geared towards realism with regards to filler NPC's.
pawtucket_pat 04-09-05, 12:11 AM	Look at some of the player races that have a negative to the Charisma score (Orc, Ogre, Tiefling, Troll, etc.). It's either because they have no people skills or are as ugly as sin. They may not be core character races but are still in the core books as player races. ;) But the problem is that it doesn't work the opposite way. Some of the high charisma monsters are ugly as sin too. Take the illithid. He's got tons of charisma, and the face of a squid. Not winning any beauty pageants any time soon, but they still have high charisma.
Edymnion 04-09-05, 12:25 AM	Technically, falling ten feet is enough to potentially kill a 1st commoner, given the rules. These rules aren't really geared towards realism with regards to filler NPC's.People have been known to trip and kill themselves from the fall. And yeah, a dog biting your leg is not making a Bite attack. The trained attack dog or wolf going for your throat is making a Bite attack. And while having a gallon of boiling water thrown on you is unlikely to kill you immediantly, it is also unlikely that taking a full gout of flame will immediantly kill you. You are far more likely to die within a day or two due to tissue damage and infection. Was just a few weeks ago I was watching an Emergency Room show on Discovery Health that had this nice old man that scalded himself in the bathtub when he accidentally turned it up too hot and couldn't get out quick enough. His entire back, from head to toe, was a solid third degree burn. He was totally alert and what I'd call "normal" while in the ER on tape, aside from half his body being lobster red. It flashed a thing up after his clips that he died that night from his burns. Even people that get caught with full on flames often don't die from them immediantly, they die hours or days later from the burns. Yeah, I'd say 1d6 damage would be quite sufficient for being hit with a large amount of scalding water.
wolf_mage 04-09-05, 12:43 AM	As I see it, a commoner (2.5 hp) falling 10ft (-3.5hp) would be in the "dying" thing momentarily. Either he gets up relatively unharmed 6 seconds later (10% chance), or he's knocked out for some period of time. As for the rare occasion in which he goes from -1 to -10 in one minute and dies, that would represent a particularly terrible fall. Likewise, a dog biting your leg is making a bite attack � he just rolled a 1 for damage. A leg bite does not represent a "1d6 damage bite attack", it represents "rolling a 1 on a 1d6 bite attack". A bite to the neck would be a critical hit, most likely. And so on. If you get killed by the boiling water, it's because you accidentally inhaled it or something.
SnowbearK 04-09-05, 12:43 AM	Even people that get caught with full on flames often don't die from them immediantly, they die hours or days later from the burns. Yeah, I'd say 1d6 damage would be quite sufficient for being hit with a large amount of scalding water. And on that note, it's worthy of stating that burns are the WORST injury to have when you're trying to avoid infections. Burnt flesh might as well be doused in DSMO when it comes to keeping unwanted diseases, poisons, etc., out of your body.
Riznar 04-09-05, 01:21 AM	I thought falling only 10' did non-lethal damage?
Norseman 04-09-05, 01:33 AM	One of my players recently discovered a Cauldron of Warming, and while that will make an awesome tool for alchemy or a wonderful present to a cook, I foresee it becoming weaponized first, being as no one in the party has a cook or practices alchemy. so my question now is what kind of damage does a up to a gallon of boiling water present. For those not familar with the Cauldron - it is a small sized iron cauldron which will hold up to a gallon of liquid comfortably. I don't see anywhere in the rules that this type of damage is addressed, so I was just wondering what yall's input would be. Obviously the user is going to have to find a way to keep hold of the pot while it's got boiling liquid in it, then dump it somehow, but after that, what happens to the poor sap who gets soaked? Boiling water will give third degree burns within seconds of contact with the skin, so I'd give it 1d6 fire damage, with the limitation that it will not ignite anything.