Campaign idea in need of critique please [Archive] - Wizards Community

Campaign idea in need of critique please [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
HamHam
06-17-04, 09:34 PM I'm planning out a campaign to run sometime, and I was hoping to expound it here and get some critques, suggestions, ideas, etc. Or give other people ideas. Or just entertian those of us with overactive imaginations.

So, here goes:

The contenent the campaign will start on is enthralled in a years long war between a good kingdom (mostly standard PC races) and an evil one (orc hordes, demons, PC races turned evil, etc). A fairly cliche LoTR kinda bit, really. The good nation is ruled by a young queen who only recently inherited the throne after her father died in the war.

The characters will start out in the tail end of a battle, after the evil army broke through their defenses and things have devolved to a point where the "front" is largely gone and it's just intermitent pockets of combat going on through out the hills.

At that point they will have to rally together (conveniently creating the party) to hold off incoming enemy troops, until they recieve orders from HQ to take out some enemy artillery, then link up with other survivors before falling back to the rest of the regrouping army.

When they arrive a pack of trolls (or somethign like that) has somehow circumvented the camps defenses and attacks the queen (who was there inspecting the troops before all hell broke lose). When the party rescues them she's very grateful and invites them all to a fair/ball/party at a manor in a week or two. The general assigns them to be her guards since most of them were killed, so it all works out nicely.

That will probably be one "adventure", likely taking two to three seessions.

Next, at the party:

I'm thinking it'll be a kind of medieval joust/fair combined with a Pride and Prejudice type garden party/ball. This should be good oportunity to have more roleplay-based session. There will be dancing, feasts, various games and contests, that sort of thing. Of course, the arrival of some scrag commandos will rather kill the celebration.

Then the party will have to escape and escort the queen back to capitol while being chased and hearing news that the kingodm's border defenses have collapsed and it's being over-run.

When they reach the capitol they will be hours ahead of an enemy army and will find the city in the middle of an exodius. As the queen debates the situation with her advisors the enemy forces will attack through secret under-ground passages leading into the city and the party with the help of some guards and the queen's chief paladin will have to get the queen safely to the harbor and on a boat. However, the paladin will lead them into a trap and reveal that he is a traitor and responsible for the enemy's success in overcoming their defenses.

The party will have to fight or think their way out of the trap and get to the harbor to escape. Once on a boat with the queen they'll sail away, the city burning behind them and unforseen future ahead of them. That is, until lighting starts arching down and destroying the evacuation fleet, followed by the arrival of the evil army's general (ridiculously powerful Kensai). He'll dispatch the party with ease (probably doing nonlethal damage) and attempt to kidnap the queen, who will tap into her strongly magical royal blood to call apon arcane powers she didn't know she had, encassing herself in a huge crystal mountain for protection (which of course destroys the boat, scatters the fleet, creates a tidal wave, etc). The party will black out during this and wake up having been washed up on an island where they find one of the queen's mortally wounded loremasters, who tells them that although the crystal mountain is strong enough to resist any force the evil kingdom could bring to bear on it, the young queen has no way to control it and is therefore stuck. He tells them to go to another continent, and find someone or something with the power to free her, and the power to protect her afterwards.

That whole bit will probably be five or more sessions.

When they arrive on the new continent they will basicaly just have to start looking, creating a more free-form adventure with no over-arching story just different people and places to investigate. Along the way they will find other survivors who have started new lives and may or may not want to help.
MinusInnocence
06-17-04, 09:40 PM War can be a powerful storytelling tool but I have to suggest against the plotline you've developed so far. It relies too much on the PCs doing precisely what you expect them to - and we all know that's exactly what the PCs won't do.

It just strikes me as leading them by the nose. If that's what they want, that's fine but then suddenly, when they wake up the island it's not like that anymore and they're cut loose without any guidance whatsoever. If you want despair and a sense of cluelessness to set in, I guess you will have accomplished it but where is the transition? Groups usually come in two types: they like to be told what to do, where to go and who to kill; or they don't. And you offer both scenarios in your game.

Pick one and stick with it, but be sure to ask the PCs if they will enjoy whatever you devise. Good luck!
HamHam
06-17-04, 10:03 PM 1) This will require a certain base assuption in character creation: they are soldiers, and therefore will follow orders, which will be the impetues for the story. Yes, I realize this is railroading.

2) I'm thinking the group will be largely new players, and therefore this way I can provide a variety of play styles and in that way find out which they prefer.

3) Despair and cluelessness are kinda of the desired result, although mainly on the part of the PCs, not the players. From what I do know of the likely playgroup, half of them will respond by becoming drunk bums, too badly affected by their loss to do anything. :D Having them reform should be interesting...

4) These are however good points and ones I'll look at as I develop things more. This is really a rough draft that is primerly in my head at this point, so it's still very fluid.
Autosponge
06-17-04, 10:08 PM Ask yourself this one basic question for each important element, "Does it make sense?"

If the answer is 'no', like "The newly installed young queen surveys the war from the front lines." Then you need to revise the idea. Or "In the middle of a 'devolving' engagement with the army of darkness, the young queen holds a grand gala." These are really bad ideas because they make no sense with the background information you gave us. By themselves they aren't bad, just when put in the context of a fierce war with a vile army.
Gnarl
06-18-04, 12:10 PM Will the pcs get to grab the young queen ?
Joking, sounds like a nice idea. A little cliche but I guess fairytales are always fun (this would be a fairytale if the handsom paly gets to grab da queen).

I do have a couple of comments though.
Unless you are quite generous on xp, you pcs are gona get murdered. A bunch of trolls after only 2 or 3 sessions...

A bit railroaded. You might be surprised how ingenious the pcs can get (all right, it doesn't happen that often). You are talking about the capitol burning or something, but image the pcs find an outstanding idea to prevent this ? (and if they are strong enough to be up trolls after scenario 1, they will be capable of doing so on scenario 3 or 4).

Surprise the players, other than being green and evil, why do these orcs want to beat up the good guys ? For the same reasons the paly is a good guy ? (grab the queen). Why would demons befriend a worthless bunch such as orcs (when they can kill them an turn them into undeads).

To put things in a nutshell, I would say that you described some very interresting encounters I certainly would enjoy playing but the underlying plot is a bit light and you probably would need a couple more of these fun challenges to properly prepare the pcs to the ones you already have designed. Furhtermore, I personnally wouldn't plan that much ahead of time (I'm ready to bet one of my balls your pcs wont make it to that island the way you planned it). Planning the next two or three sessions ahead of time and with a well detailed plot, you got yourself one good campaign.

And please, send us a post when the paly grabs the queen.
Janfar
06-18-04, 01:06 PM If these are all new players, yeah it sounds like a lot of fun. You have some good ideas in there.

I wouldn't suggest trying that with anyone experienced though, it wouldn't be very satisfying then. But I say go for it!

But at a few of the junctions, the PCs will do something you did not expect. That's ok. That will make the game more interesting. That's one of the major cool aspects of being a DM

Hope that helps.
HamHam
06-19-04, 07:00 PM Okay, I've thought it over and considered everyones suggestions and I'll address some of them now:

1) Believability. I've though about this, and have come up with what I believe is a fairly believable way for all this to happen. ?However, being believable to me may not mean it will be believable to my players, so, tell me if you find this believable, or if you don't:

The war has, for the past few decades, been more of a "cold war". In the center of the continent the two kindoms are divided by a lake and river, both of which are extremely difficult to cross in force. In the north, the good kingdom has errected a huge fortification that has so far detered attack. In the south, there is a fork in the river and the land in between the two off-shoots is the only area still actively contested by both sides, but even that has seen a de facto (or is it de jure?) truce as both sides have dug in and stopped launching major offensive operations. In brief, a large scale battle hasn't been fought for many years.

The queen is very spirited and individualistic, and is therefore visiting the front-lines because she wants to personally see what it looks like and provide some personal moral support for the troops (give a speech, hand out some medals, etc). The enemy finds out about this trip (as will later be revealed, from the turn-coat paladin) and that is why they launch an unexpected attack in force. After the battle, the general in command of the army will assure the queen that this was an aberration, and that because the attack was so kamikaze-like in it's goal of getting to her (which failed because of the party) it has harmed the enemy more than helped them, using up the majority of their forces while doing a much smaller amount of damage to the good army.

Therefore the only real threat possed by the attack is that of a security leak, and so the queen sees no need to alter her planned visit to the gala. The reason she is going there is because she is young and many see her as too inexperienced to hold the throne. She plans on using the gala as a way to meet and talk to the local nobles and show them she is fit for the job. Also, it will act as good publicity, fundraising, and a moral boost for the war effort.

2) Power level. I'm thinking of starting it a lv 4, and then having them hit lv 5 after leaving for the new continent or shortly on arriving there. They will, probably, return to rescue the queen around lv 15.

3) Railroading. I'm really thinking of this more of an semi-interactive back-story to the more classic and longer campaing that will take place on the new continent, something to give the whole thing a more over-arching story line and epic feel. And, since their primary duty will be as escorts and guards, assuming no one goes AWOL it should go fine. If not, I should be able to improvise something.

4) Motivation for the war. Does LoTR really have any motivation for Sauron beyond an evil god wanting to destroy the world? Power is usually a goal in itself.
Autosponge
06-20-04, 01:17 AM Since #1 was my biggest concern I'll answer to that one. I really like the adjustments you made. Make the father (king) die of old age rather than "in the war". That just sounds too dramatic for this sleepy seige. The point missing from your description is motivation for the pally. I'm sure you can (if you haven't already) make that good as well. Since all of the events hinge on his actions, this has to be a very well constructed motive to work. Good luck.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
HamHam 06-17-04, 09:34 PM	I'm planning out a campaign to run sometime, and I was hoping to expound it here and get some critques, suggestions, ideas, etc. Or give other people ideas. Or just entertian those of us with overactive imaginations. So, here goes: The contenent the campaign will start on is enthralled in a years long war between a good kingdom (mostly standard PC races) and an evil one (orc hordes, demons, PC races turned evil, etc). A fairly cliche LoTR kinda bit, really. The good nation is ruled by a young queen who only recently inherited the throne after her father died in the war. The characters will start out in the tail end of a battle, after the evil army broke through their defenses and things have devolved to a point where the "front" is largely gone and it's just intermitent pockets of combat going on through out the hills. At that point they will have to rally together (conveniently creating the party) to hold off incoming enemy troops, until they recieve orders from HQ to take out some enemy artillery, then link up with other survivors before falling back to the rest of the regrouping army. When they arrive a pack of trolls (or somethign like that) has somehow circumvented the camps defenses and attacks the queen (who was there inspecting the troops before all hell broke lose). When the party rescues them she's very grateful and invites them all to a fair/ball/party at a manor in a week or two. The general assigns them to be her guards since most of them were killed, so it all works out nicely. That will probably be one "adventure", likely taking two to three seessions. Next, at the party: I'm thinking it'll be a kind of medieval joust/fair combined with a Pride and Prejudice type garden party/ball. This should be good oportunity to have more roleplay-based session. There will be dancing, feasts, various games and contests, that sort of thing. Of course, the arrival of some scrag commandos will rather kill the celebration. Then the party will have to escape and escort the queen back to capitol while being chased and hearing news that the kingodm's border defenses have collapsed and it's being over-run. When they reach the capitol they will be hours ahead of an enemy army and will find the city in the middle of an exodius. As the queen debates the situation with her advisors the enemy forces will attack through secret under-ground passages leading into the city and the party with the help of some guards and the queen's chief paladin will have to get the queen safely to the harbor and on a boat. However, the paladin will lead them into a trap and reveal that he is a traitor and responsible for the enemy's success in overcoming their defenses. The party will have to fight or think their way out of the trap and get to the harbor to escape. Once on a boat with the queen they'll sail away, the city burning behind them and unforseen future ahead of them. That is, until lighting starts arching down and destroying the evacuation fleet, followed by the arrival of the evil army's general (ridiculously powerful Kensai). He'll dispatch the party with ease (probably doing nonlethal damage) and attempt to kidnap the queen, who will tap into her strongly magical royal blood to call apon arcane powers she didn't know she had, encassing herself in a huge crystal mountain for protection (which of course destroys the boat, scatters the fleet, creates a tidal wave, etc). The party will black out during this and wake up having been washed up on an island where they find one of the queen's mortally wounded loremasters, who tells them that although the crystal mountain is strong enough to resist any force the evil kingdom could bring to bear on it, the young queen has no way to control it and is therefore stuck. He tells them to go to another continent, and find someone or something with the power to free her, and the power to protect her afterwards. That whole bit will probably be five or more sessions. When they arrive on the new continent they will basicaly just have to start looking, creating a more free-form adventure with no over-arching story just different people and places to investigate. Along the way they will find other survivors who have started new lives and may or may not want to help.
MinusInnocence 06-17-04, 09:40 PM	War can be a powerful storytelling tool but I have to suggest against the plotline you've developed so far. It relies too much on the PCs doing precisely what you expect them to - and we all know that's exactly what the PCs won't do. It just strikes me as leading them by the nose. If that's what they want, that's fine but then suddenly, when they wake up the island it's not like that anymore and they're cut loose without any guidance whatsoever. If you want despair and a sense of cluelessness to set in, I guess you will have accomplished it but where is the transition? Groups usually come in two types: they like to be told what to do, where to go and who to kill; or they don't. And you offer both scenarios in your game. Pick one and stick with it, but be sure to ask the PCs if they will enjoy whatever you devise. Good luck!
HamHam 06-17-04, 10:03 PM	1) This will require a certain base assuption in character creation: they are soldiers, and therefore will follow orders, which will be the impetues for the story. Yes, I realize this is railroading. 2) I'm thinking the group will be largely new players, and therefore this way I can provide a variety of play styles and in that way find out which they prefer. 3) Despair and cluelessness are kinda of the desired result, although mainly on the part of the PCs, not the players. From what I do know of the likely playgroup, half of them will respond by becoming drunk bums, too badly affected by their loss to do anything. :D Having them reform should be interesting... 4) These are however good points and ones I'll look at as I develop things more. This is really a rough draft that is primerly in my head at this point, so it's still very fluid.
Autosponge 06-17-04, 10:08 PM	Ask yourself this one basic question for each important element, "Does it make sense?" If the answer is 'no', like "The newly installed young queen surveys the war from the front lines." Then you need to revise the idea. Or "In the middle of a 'devolving' engagement with the army of darkness, the young queen holds a grand gala." These are really bad ideas because they make no sense with the background information you gave us. By themselves they aren't bad, just when put in the context of a fierce war with a vile army.
Gnarl 06-18-04, 12:10 PM	Will the pcs get to grab the young queen ? Joking, sounds like a nice idea. A little cliche but I guess fairytales are always fun (this would be a fairytale if the handsom paly gets to grab da queen). I do have a couple of comments though. Unless you are quite generous on xp, you pcs are gona get murdered. A bunch of trolls after only 2 or 3 sessions... A bit railroaded. You might be surprised how ingenious the pcs can get (all right, it doesn't happen that often). You are talking about the capitol burning or something, but image the pcs find an outstanding idea to prevent this ? (and if they are strong enough to be up trolls after scenario 1, they will be capable of doing so on scenario 3 or 4). Surprise the players, other than being green and evil, why do these orcs want to beat up the good guys ? For the same reasons the paly is a good guy ? (grab the queen). Why would demons befriend a worthless bunch such as orcs (when they can kill them an turn them into undeads). To put things in a nutshell, I would say that you described some very interresting encounters I certainly would enjoy playing but the underlying plot is a bit light and you probably would need a couple more of these fun challenges to properly prepare the pcs to the ones you already have designed. Furhtermore, I personnally wouldn't plan that much ahead of time (I'm ready to bet one of my balls your pcs wont make it to that island the way you planned it). Planning the next two or three sessions ahead of time and with a well detailed plot, you got yourself one good campaign. And please, send us a post when the paly grabs the queen.
Janfar 06-18-04, 01:06 PM	If these are all new players, yeah it sounds like a lot of fun. You have some good ideas in there. I wouldn't suggest trying that with anyone experienced though, it wouldn't be very satisfying then. But I say go for it! But at a few of the junctions, the PCs will do something you did not expect. That's ok. That will make the game more interesting. That's one of the major cool aspects of being a DM Hope that helps.
HamHam 06-19-04, 07:00 PM	Okay, I've thought it over and considered everyones suggestions and I'll address some of them now: 1) Believability. I've though about this, and have come up with what I believe is a fairly believable way for all this to happen. ?However, being believable to me may not mean it will be believable to my players, so, tell me if you find this believable, or if you don't: The war has, for the past few decades, been more of a "cold war". In the center of the continent the two kindoms are divided by a lake and river, both of which are extremely difficult to cross in force. In the north, the good kingdom has errected a huge fortification that has so far detered attack. In the south, there is a fork in the river and the land in between the two off-shoots is the only area still actively contested by both sides, but even that has seen a de facto (or is it de jure?) truce as both sides have dug in and stopped launching major offensive operations. In brief, a large scale battle hasn't been fought for many years. The queen is very spirited and individualistic, and is therefore visiting the front-lines because she wants to personally see what it looks like and provide some personal moral support for the troops (give a speech, hand out some medals, etc). The enemy finds out about this trip (as will later be revealed, from the turn-coat paladin) and that is why they launch an unexpected attack in force. After the battle, the general in command of the army will assure the queen that this was an aberration, and that because the attack was so kamikaze-like in it's goal of getting to her (which failed because of the party) it has harmed the enemy more than helped them, using up the majority of their forces while doing a much smaller amount of damage to the good army. Therefore the only real threat possed by the attack is that of a security leak, and so the queen sees no need to alter her planned visit to the gala. The reason she is going there is because she is young and many see her as too inexperienced to hold the throne. She plans on using the gala as a way to meet and talk to the local nobles and show them she is fit for the job. Also, it will act as good publicity, fundraising, and a moral boost for the war effort. 2) Power level. I'm thinking of starting it a lv 4, and then having them hit lv 5 after leaving for the new continent or shortly on arriving there. They will, probably, return to rescue the queen around lv 15. 3) Railroading. I'm really thinking of this more of an semi-interactive back-story to the more classic and longer campaing that will take place on the new continent, something to give the whole thing a more over-arching story line and epic feel. And, since their primary duty will be as escorts and guards, assuming no one goes AWOL it should go fine. If not, I should be able to improvise something. 4) Motivation for the war. Does LoTR really have any motivation for Sauron beyond an evil god wanting to destroy the world? Power is usually a goal in itself.
Autosponge 06-20-04, 01:17 AM	Since #1 was my biggest concern I'll answer to that one. I really like the adjustments you made. Make the father (king) die of old age rather than "in the war". That just sounds too dramatic for this sleepy seige. The point missing from your description is motivation for the pally. I'm sure you can (if you haven't already) make that good as well. Since all of the events hinge on his actions, this has to be a very well constructed motive to work. Good luck.