Can I save the PCs from Vampires? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Can I save the PCs from Vampires? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
FriendoftheDork
09-28-04, 08:27 PM If you're in my game: stay out!

background:

I have a problem: I never do clichès! I mean, whenever the PCs encounter a damsel in distress they will think her the villain (evil cleric or vampire). The only time they met a paladin he was killed while fighting orcs. They're getting used to losing, so when they read a letter that sounded like organized crime they thought they were way out of their leauge!

This time around, I've tried to be more normal. PCs are hired by a noble house, where the lord and lady are NOT doppelgangers in disguise. They were approached by a rogue go-between who was NOT up to no good or trying to fool them. Then, the Sembian caravan raiders that the PCs were to thwart were NOT really good or misunderstood, but really greedy merchants who just wanted to up the competition.

But that's were the cookie crumbled. When they got to the village of the evil merchant company, they noticed that it was getting darker and rainier than nature allows. When they enter the council club of the "Company" they found them slaughtered, and a peasent vampire crouching over them. So now they're trying to defeat the vampires (two real ones) and their spawn, with the aid of the former bodyguard of the evil merchant (LE tank) and a Kelemvoran vampire hunter.

They almost made it, and even beheaded one of the vampire spawns (Sean, the local charming lad). But one of the dominated characters managed to awaken the other 3 spawns (but luckily not the real vampires) and now the NPC fighter and the halfing druid/rogue are dominated too. The others survived, but had to flee since they're our of HP and spells.

The problem at hand:
So now there's a problem, two of the survivors are probably going to chicken out and not try to rescue their friends. What am I to do? I'd like them to at least try to help their friends, but if I just happen to give them something to defeat them with (NPCs, magic items etc.) it will look like a poorly veiled attempt to save them. They're already a bit annoyed that the spawns called to them the dominated ones when they were just about to kill off some of the fleeing characters. In fact, the spawns didn't manage to stay awake, and as soon as they were no longer turned, they wanted the dominated ones to guard their coffins while they slept, and didn't know their enemies were as good as dead.

Oh, btw as soon as the night falls, the main vampires (lvl 5 and lvl 10) will wake up and check on their spawn, perhaps try to find the fleeing PCs. The dominated ones will not be turned vampires, but will remain slaves.

All in all, there are 3 remaining vampire spawns, to vampires, 1 dominated halfling lvl 3 druid/lvl 1 rogue w/riding dog companion, 1 dominated lvl 6 fighter, 1 dominated lvl 4 monk (stable but uncouncious, easily healed by vampire cleric). On the other side there are: a half elf cleric1/ranger4, a human rogue1/fighter4, a human cleric3/wizard2 of mystra, and the Kelemvor cleric5.

What should I do?
FriendoftheDork
09-28-04, 09:49 PM bump... I need this resolved before the next session so please reply.
Ironykitten
09-28-04, 10:00 PM Well...
the first thing i would recomend is give yourself a pat on the back for being origanal.
Second I would do something like this:

Using thier newly dominated servents, the master vampires decide to take out the agrivating PC's. However, they concider such a task to be menial and beneath their notice, and therefore send only two spawn out to kill them (their least favorit spawn of course). The spawn, feeling unprotected, decide to take their new slaves along with them, thus giving the PC's another crack at dispelling the gazes (spawns only do Charm Person with their gaze, and that can be broken whenever they make the person do something agains their nature, like ATTACK THEIR FRIENDS). Then, you have all your PC's together again!

Howzat?

No really. Let me know.
On_the_wings_of_TPK
09-28-04, 11:01 PM You know what really sucks for vampires? Turning, straight up and simple. They may have +4 turn resistance, but are still at bay when a holy symbol is strongly presented. When the cleric holds up his holy symbol and begins commanding them to the depths of heck form whence they came, successful or not at turning them, he/she is still strongly presenting that holy symbol. A 1st level cleric can hold off a 20th level vamp so long as his/her arm doesn't get tired. After that it's just a matter of pulling out the bow and plugging some vamps.

Also, has the party attempted an assult at 12 noon? March in and bring the sun. I'd get siege gear together and start kicking in walls. Furthermore Daylight + vampires = bad day for the vamp.

The party should already have the means to defeat these things, they just have to use them right. I wouldn't "save" them. Encourage them to start taking more ginseng, yes, but save, no.
Darrett
09-28-04, 11:48 PM Vampires aren't always well known for their ability to work and play well together. You could have one of them decide that this is the chance to kill a rival Vampire within their group...
FriendoftheDork
09-29-04, 08:41 PM ok, thanks for the praise kitten :)

But I realize I've made a mistake by not letting them get extra saves against domination. bad me. Any idea how I can handle that? because the save DC is only 14 and they're likely to succeed, at least the druid. Give them another the save as it dawns on them they were trying to kill their friends? That could actually help alot. Thanks for correction!

To you others: my vampires are different... holy symbols won't work,(neither does garlic, running water etc.) only real turning power. On the other hand I removed all level draning ability, and they can't fast heal holy damage (holy water, blessed weapon, etc.) or any fire damage.

And the assault WAS before noon, but as the vampires and their spawns are deep down an old ruin it doesen't help that much - but thet vampires to get very sleepy and the really big ones were asleep the entire combat. it's really only the dominated ones that prevents the others from staking and beheading the vampire spawns. The real Vampires are hidden behind a masonry wall and thus will probably not be encountered at all. They were intented as recurring villains, except perhaps the lvl 5 cleric of Shar, who could be defeated by herself.

Right now, the party has exhausted their powers and all out of ginseng so the only chance is that the dominated ones suceed their saves. TY for help everyone.
Mizik
09-30-04, 03:48 AM well If they have not excaped or have been rescued you could have the vampires "spread out" their meals. (Slowly drinking their blood over a period of time)

But I like the sugested idea of sending them after the pc to give them another save. (Maby use this if the remaining pcs are clearly not trying to rescue them)
amethal
09-30-04, 08:27 AM If this region has a history of vampire activity, maybe they could stumble across the remains of the local anti-vampire squad.

The dead bodies could have a reasonable supply of holy water the PCs can liberate, and maybe some of them are still alive and join the party (only to be cut down in the vampire attack, which will save the PCs necks for a round or so).

They need to have earned the holy water, so have it guarded by something, with maybe a few puzzles that need to be solved to locate it.
MortalPlague
09-30-04, 08:36 AM Or maybe you could have the party encounter some local authorities while slinking away. Something like this:

Captain - "Hey, weren't there seven of you going in?"

Player - "Yeah, they got three of us."

Captain - *Resting hand on hilt of sword* "Well that's a fine mess. Three more vampires. Let's go clean it up before they get turned, shall we?"

Player - "Yeah, sure, go for it."

Captain - "You're coming with us."

Player - *Looks at guard company* "Uh, yes, of course."
ck2001wendt
09-30-04, 09:39 AM ------------------------------------------
Friend of the Dork said:

But I realize I've made a mistake by not letting them get extra saves against domination. bad me. Any idea how I can handle that? because the save DC is only 14 and they're likely to succeed, at least the druid. Give them another the save as it dawns on them they were trying to kill their friends? That could actually help alot. Thanks for correction!
------------------------------------------

I make mistakes like that as a DM all the time, including once in a solo campaign where I had to rewind and erase the PCs death, because a Wall of Sand does NOT drop when you break concentration (not for many rounds, anyway).

So, if you make a mistake, don't be afraid to say "My Bad!" and undo it in a way that is interesting and/or moves the story forward. My advice is to allow the Dominated PCs a new Save at some crucial moment. Chances are they'll break it, and help turn the tide.
FriendoftheDork
09-30-04, 10:12 AM Darret, I've considered the vampires in-fighting, but the cleric is the Childe of the 10th lvl Monk. She loves her. And besides, she wouldn't have a chance. Same goes for the spawns, even if they are not controlled.

Amethal, this sleepy part of Sembia has little or no history of vampires. The Vampires are actually from Vasa - and once part of the Lich King's armies. That's why they have managed to take over the village completely, and know the village's Lady answers to the vampires.

Moralplague, the local authorities are on the vampires' sides for the moment, and the rest of the nation is unaware of their existence. There is already a sole vampire hunter after them, but he needs the help of the PCs.

ck1001, to make that happen the dominated ones would have to attack the PCs, and unless they know where they'll go right away that can be hard. So I'm going to give the dominated ones a save just as we start, and if they suceed they can either kill the sleeping vampires or flee from the ones still dominated to link up with the party. Any way is good.

Not really sure if I should come clean and tell the players that I made a mistake and let them auto-succeed their saves because of it... hmmmm.
Ironykitten
09-30-04, 10:22 AM my advice is not to give an auto save, but allow for creative spellbreaking... such as when one person succeeds, allow them basicly to rough up the remaining enchanted PC's to bring them to their senses ("SNAP OUT OF IT, MAN! *SLAP*!) or something like that
But never just suspend rules because you messed up. always try to come up with an in-game reson why whats happening is happening.
The Idea with letting them escape is good, but it would probably again make more sense if a spawn or two came after the PC's the next night. You could make the slaves carry the cofins!

ANYWAYS...
i dont run your campain, so as always, your finall decision is up to you.
MortalPlague
09-30-04, 10:26 AM I'd recommend strongly against telling them you messed up. Chances are, they'll make the save, no harm done. If it's only DC 14, and you give the others another save if a sane player tries to break them out of it, your party will be fine, and being dominated will only strengthen the antagonism towards your villanous vampires. :)
Didge
09-30-04, 03:26 PM Here is an option,

Have the PC's involved make their saving throw at DC 14. If they make it fine, if they don't, depending on by how much they miss it you might opt for a situational modifier.

If they ask why they get it, explain it like this, "As you're standing there the realization of attacking your comrades fully registers. You realize without the vampire spawn's direct influence now that your actions have caused your friends great harm. Inside your head you wrestle with the knowledge of what you've done and that gives you added fuel to break the enchantment."

Or come up with some equally good reason why they'd be allowed a bonus.

Just some advice, sounds like you've got it taken care of though.
ck2001wendt
09-30-04, 03:41 PM to make that happen the dominated ones would have to attack the PCs, and unless they know where they'll go right away that can be hard. So I'm going to give the dominated ones a save just as we start, and if they suceed they can either kill the sleeping vampires or flee from the ones still dominated to link up with the party. Any way is good.

That's the right way to go. You made a mistake. Hopefully no one died as a result. I agree that maybe you don't want to admit it flat out to your players. Just remember the ruling next time. But don't bury the mistake now by ignoring it. Rectify it at the earliest opportunity (which is at the start of your session) and move on.

Hopefully, when the two groups of PCs meet, the un-dominated ones won't auto-attack their friends.
FriendoftheDork
09-30-04, 08:17 PM ok, I will not admit the error if I don't have to, but rather give them a good chance and an extra save. Giving a bonus since the vampire spawn are sleeping is a good idea, I'll do that.

One of the PCs are unconcious and left behind, but if the other on succeed his save he can bring him along after killing the vampire spawn. I've had too many TPKs lately, even starting the campaign from square one after 3 of 5 PCs died at 7th lvl and the remianing had no reason to adventure together. So I want to prevent that from happening again unless the PCs deserve it.

The spawns, if they survive, will try to get them, but not before healing their damage from holy water that they have suffered.

Now, I'm actually looking forward to the next session. Thanks for advice everyone!
Ironykitten
10-01-04, 03:09 PM So I know you got this pretty much figured out, so this doenst really mean anthing in the way of advice, and is more of a personal querry.

Do undead even heal?

I mean, they are DEAD, and in lieu of things like fast healing, do Undead natually heal? I have always played that they dont, but would apricate advice conferming or denying this.

TY!
diaboli
10-01-04, 06:24 PM The blame isn't all yours. Part of the problem falls on your players. If they (the players) knew they were going after evil foes, they need to share some of the blame. With the tone of your campaign (at least from what I've read), the PCs should be utilizing the Protection from Evil spell regularly, either through potions, scrolls, heck investment in a wand would easily pay for itself.

This would have prevented them from suffering the domination effect of the vamps, plus potentially adding +2 to their AC.

It [p/evil spell] can still be used to suppress the mind control effect in place, at least for the duration of the spell. During that time, should the vamp that is performing the mind control be killed, then no worries once the P/evil spell wears off. This could be an easy way to help explain how the unaffected PCs can rescue their compainions and beat down the spawn. The vampire hunter would definitely know of this spell and should have provided the PCs either a few potions, scrolls, or at least imparted such knowledge before going after the vamps.
FriendoftheDork
10-01-04, 07:55 PM diaboli, prot evil is 1 minute per level... so yes some had been cast prot evil on, but not all. The Kelemvor cleric relied on his protection domain, should he be affected.

Well, I did make quite powerful enemies - but they got pretty tough allies to counter that. It'll work out.

Ironykitten, Undead do not heal at all. But vampires have regenerative abilities (fast heal 2 for spawns) so they get better. My vampires heal fire and holy damage 2/day instead of 2/round! In any case they have a cleric that can spontenously cast inflict spells, which heals undead.

They even cast prot evil on the halfling, but he saved (will save, harmless).

They could afford a wand, if they found one. Not sure if they would unless they spent days traveling to Saerloon. Perhaps not even then!
Lord Stigius
10-04-04, 04:53 PM They even cast prot evil on the halfling, but he saved (will save, harmless).
Well...
Either I don't understand what you wanted to say here, or you don't understand well what 'will save, harmless' means.
It means that since the spell normally is beneficial, no saving throw is rolled.
Unless, of course, the person subject to the spell wants to resist and actualy resists. But did the halfling have any reason to try and resist the spell in the first place?
FriendoftheDork
10-05-04, 09:43 AM yes, said halfling was dominated into killing the person that cast the spell on him. If a hostile recipient is cast a spell on, he will probably always save. Of course, with a spellcraft check he would know what is about to happen and would do the sensible thing: to save against a spell that would prevent him from killing his target. But that didn't happen, he just saved because he was cast a spell on, he didn't know it was beneficial.
Elendur
10-05-04, 11:13 AM If a dominated character is commanded to do something "against his nature" he gets a resave at +2. If he likes his companions, its reasonable to call attacking them directly against his nature.
You might also let slip that protection from evil works to negate(but not dispel) the dominate effect.

The 1st level cleric holding off the 20th level vampire with his holy symbol probably wouldn't work for long. The vamp can't approach him, but nothing prevents him from continually attempting to dominate him with DC 20+ dominate effect...
FriendoftheDork
10-06-04, 05:02 AM elendur, If you've read all my post you would see that my vampires are different.

But yes, they shall get saves with +2, except for the LE fighter as it is not against his nature (yet unmodified save) and the monk who's master is destroyed.

In any case, We're playing today! This could be fun ;)
Lord Stigius
10-06-04, 06:33 PM FriendoftheDork
Ok, it was me who took the wrong assumpion here (that the spell had been cast before the halfling was dominated). I wondered why he'd try and resist a spell being cast by his friends. But if he had already been dominated... another matter.
Lord Stigius
10-06-04, 06:33 PM Ooops, double post.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
FriendoftheDork 09-28-04, 08:27 PM	If you're in my game: stay out! background: I have a problem: I never do clichès! I mean, whenever the PCs encounter a damsel in distress they will think her the villain (evil cleric or vampire). The only time they met a paladin he was killed while fighting orcs. They're getting used to losing, so when they read a letter that sounded like organized crime they thought they were way out of their leauge! This time around, I've tried to be more normal. PCs are hired by a noble house, where the lord and lady are NOT doppelgangers in disguise. They were approached by a rogue go-between who was NOT up to no good or trying to fool them. Then, the Sembian caravan raiders that the PCs were to thwart were NOT really good or misunderstood, but really greedy merchants who just wanted to up the competition. But that's were the cookie crumbled. When they got to the village of the evil merchant company, they noticed that it was getting darker and rainier than nature allows. When they enter the council club of the "Company" they found them slaughtered, and a peasent vampire crouching over them. So now they're trying to defeat the vampires (two real ones) and their spawn, with the aid of the former bodyguard of the evil merchant (LE tank) and a Kelemvoran vampire hunter. They almost made it, and even beheaded one of the vampire spawns (Sean, the local charming lad). But one of the dominated characters managed to awaken the other 3 spawns (but luckily not the real vampires) and now the NPC fighter and the halfing druid/rogue are dominated too. The others survived, but had to flee since they're our of HP and spells. The problem at hand: So now there's a problem, two of the survivors are probably going to chicken out and not try to rescue their friends. What am I to do? I'd like them to at least try to help their friends, but if I just happen to give them something to defeat them with (NPCs, magic items etc.) it will look like a poorly veiled attempt to save them. They're already a bit annoyed that the spawns called to them the dominated ones when they were just about to kill off some of the fleeing characters. In fact, the spawns didn't manage to stay awake, and as soon as they were no longer turned, they wanted the dominated ones to guard their coffins while they slept, and didn't know their enemies were as good as dead. Oh, btw as soon as the night falls, the main vampires (lvl 5 and lvl 10) will wake up and check on their spawn, perhaps try to find the fleeing PCs. The dominated ones will not be turned vampires, but will remain slaves. All in all, there are 3 remaining vampire spawns, to vampires, 1 dominated halfling lvl 3 druid/lvl 1 rogue w/riding dog companion, 1 dominated lvl 6 fighter, 1 dominated lvl 4 monk (stable but uncouncious, easily healed by vampire cleric). On the other side there are: a half elf cleric1/ranger4, a human rogue1/fighter4, a human cleric3/wizard2 of mystra, and the Kelemvor cleric5. What should I do?
FriendoftheDork 09-28-04, 09:49 PM	bump... I need this resolved before the next session so please reply.
Ironykitten 09-28-04, 10:00 PM	Well... the first thing i would recomend is give yourself a pat on the back for being origanal. Second I would do something like this: Using thier newly dominated servents, the master vampires decide to take out the agrivating PC's. However, they concider such a task to be menial and beneath their notice, and therefore send only two spawn out to kill them (their least favorit spawn of course). The spawn, feeling unprotected, decide to take their new slaves along with them, thus giving the PC's another crack at dispelling the gazes (spawns only do Charm Person with their gaze, and that can be broken whenever they make the person do something agains their nature, like ATTACK THEIR FRIENDS). Then, you have all your PC's together again! Howzat? No really. Let me know.
On_the_wings_of_TPK 09-28-04, 11:01 PM	You know what really sucks for vampires? Turning, straight up and simple. They may have +4 turn resistance, but are still at bay when a holy symbol is strongly presented. When the cleric holds up his holy symbol and begins commanding them to the depths of heck form whence they came, successful or not at turning them, he/she is still strongly presenting that holy symbol. A 1st level cleric can hold off a 20th level vamp so long as his/her arm doesn't get tired. After that it's just a matter of pulling out the bow and plugging some vamps. Also, has the party attempted an assult at 12 noon? March in and bring the sun. I'd get siege gear together and start kicking in walls. Furthermore Daylight + vampires = bad day for the vamp. The party should already have the means to defeat these things, they just have to use them right. I wouldn't "save" them. Encourage them to start taking more ginseng, yes, but save, no.
Darrett 09-28-04, 11:48 PM	Vampires aren't always well known for their ability to work and play well together. You could have one of them decide that this is the chance to kill a rival Vampire within their group...
FriendoftheDork 09-29-04, 08:41 PM	ok, thanks for the praise kitten :) But I realize I've made a mistake by not letting them get extra saves against domination. bad me. Any idea how I can handle that? because the save DC is only 14 and they're likely to succeed, at least the druid. Give them another the save as it dawns on them they were trying to kill their friends? That could actually help alot. Thanks for correction! To you others: my vampires are different... holy symbols won't work,(neither does garlic, running water etc.) only real turning power. On the other hand I removed all level draning ability, and they can't fast heal holy damage (holy water, blessed weapon, etc.) or any fire damage. And the assault WAS before noon, but as the vampires and their spawns are deep down an old ruin it doesen't help that much - but thet vampires to get very sleepy and the really big ones were asleep the entire combat. it's really only the dominated ones that prevents the others from staking and beheading the vampire spawns. The real Vampires are hidden behind a masonry wall and thus will probably not be encountered at all. They were intented as recurring villains, except perhaps the lvl 5 cleric of Shar, who could be defeated by herself. Right now, the party has exhausted their powers and all out of ginseng so the only chance is that the dominated ones suceed their saves. TY for help everyone.
Mizik 09-30-04, 03:48 AM	well If they have not excaped or have been rescued you could have the vampires "spread out" their meals. (Slowly drinking their blood over a period of time) But I like the sugested idea of sending them after the pc to give them another save. (Maby use this if the remaining pcs are clearly not trying to rescue them)
amethal 09-30-04, 08:27 AM	If this region has a history of vampire activity, maybe they could stumble across the remains of the local anti-vampire squad. The dead bodies could have a reasonable supply of holy water the PCs can liberate, and maybe some of them are still alive and join the party (only to be cut down in the vampire attack, which will save the PCs necks for a round or so). They need to have earned the holy water, so have it guarded by something, with maybe a few puzzles that need to be solved to locate it.
MortalPlague 09-30-04, 08:36 AM	Or maybe you could have the party encounter some local authorities while slinking away. Something like this: Captain - "Hey, weren't there seven of you going in?" Player - "Yeah, they got three of us." Captain - Resting hand on hilt of sword "Well that's a fine mess. Three more vampires. Let's go clean it up before they get turned, shall we?" Player - "Yeah, sure, go for it." Captain - "You're coming with us." Player - Looks at guard company "Uh, yes, of course."
ck2001wendt 09-30-04, 09:39 AM	------------------------------------------ Friend of the Dork said: But I realize I've made a mistake by not letting them get extra saves against domination. bad me. Any idea how I can handle that? because the save DC is only 14 and they're likely to succeed, at least the druid. Give them another the save as it dawns on them they were trying to kill their friends? That could actually help alot. Thanks for correction! ------------------------------------------ I make mistakes like that as a DM all the time, including once in a solo campaign where I had to rewind and erase the PCs death, because a Wall of Sand does NOT drop when you break concentration (not for many rounds, anyway). So, if you make a mistake, don't be afraid to say "My Bad!" and undo it in a way that is interesting and/or moves the story forward. My advice is to allow the Dominated PCs a new Save at some crucial moment. Chances are they'll break it, and help turn the tide.
FriendoftheDork 09-30-04, 10:12 AM	Darret, I've considered the vampires in-fighting, but the cleric is the Childe of the 10th lvl Monk. She loves her. And besides, she wouldn't have a chance. Same goes for the spawns, even if they are not controlled. Amethal, this sleepy part of Sembia has little or no history of vampires. The Vampires are actually from Vasa - and once part of the Lich King's armies. That's why they have managed to take over the village completely, and know the village's Lady answers to the vampires. Moralplague, the local authorities are on the vampires' sides for the moment, and the rest of the nation is unaware of their existence. There is already a sole vampire hunter after them, but he needs the help of the PCs. ck1001, to make that happen the dominated ones would have to attack the PCs, and unless they know where they'll go right away that can be hard. So I'm going to give the dominated ones a save just as we start, and if they suceed they can either kill the sleeping vampires or flee from the ones still dominated to link up with the party. Any way is good. Not really sure if I should come clean and tell the players that I made a mistake and let them auto-succeed their saves because of it... hmmmm.
Ironykitten 09-30-04, 10:22 AM	my advice is not to give an auto save, but allow for creative spellbreaking... such as when one person succeeds, allow them basicly to rough up the remaining enchanted PC's to bring them to their senses ("SNAP OUT OF IT, MAN! SLAP!) or something like that But never just suspend rules because you messed up. always try to come up with an in-game reson why whats happening is happening. The Idea with letting them escape is good, but it would probably again make more sense if a spawn or two came after the PC's the next night. You could make the slaves carry the cofins! ANYWAYS... i dont run your campain, so as always, your finall decision is up to you.
MortalPlague 09-30-04, 10:26 AM	I'd recommend strongly against telling them you messed up. Chances are, they'll make the save, no harm done. If it's only DC 14, and you give the others another save if a sane player tries to break them out of it, your party will be fine, and being dominated will only strengthen the antagonism towards your villanous vampires. :)
Didge 09-30-04, 03:26 PM	Here is an option, Have the PC's involved make their saving throw at DC 14. If they make it fine, if they don't, depending on by how much they miss it you might opt for a situational modifier. If they ask why they get it, explain it like this, "As you're standing there the realization of attacking your comrades fully registers. You realize without the vampire spawn's direct influence now that your actions have caused your friends great harm. Inside your head you wrestle with the knowledge of what you've done and that gives you added fuel to break the enchantment." Or come up with some equally good reason why they'd be allowed a bonus. Just some advice, sounds like you've got it taken care of though.
ck2001wendt 09-30-04, 03:41 PM	to make that happen the dominated ones would have to attack the PCs, and unless they know where they'll go right away that can be hard. So I'm going to give the dominated ones a save just as we start, and if they suceed they can either kill the sleeping vampires or flee from the ones still dominated to link up with the party. Any way is good. That's the right way to go. You made a mistake. Hopefully no one died as a result. I agree that maybe you don't want to admit it flat out to your players. Just remember the ruling next time. But don't bury the mistake now by ignoring it. Rectify it at the earliest opportunity (which is at the start of your session) and move on. Hopefully, when the two groups of PCs meet, the un-dominated ones won't auto-attack their friends.
FriendoftheDork 09-30-04, 08:17 PM	ok, I will not admit the error if I don't have to, but rather give them a good chance and an extra save. Giving a bonus since the vampire spawn are sleeping is a good idea, I'll do that. One of the PCs are unconcious and left behind, but if the other on succeed his save he can bring him along after killing the vampire spawn. I've had too many TPKs lately, even starting the campaign from square one after 3 of 5 PCs died at 7th lvl and the remianing had no reason to adventure together. So I want to prevent that from happening again unless the PCs deserve it. The spawns, if they survive, will try to get them, but not before healing their damage from holy water that they have suffered. Now, I'm actually looking forward to the next session. Thanks for advice everyone!
Ironykitten 10-01-04, 03:09 PM	So I know you got this pretty much figured out, so this doenst really mean anthing in the way of advice, and is more of a personal querry. Do undead even heal? I mean, they are DEAD, and in lieu of things like fast healing, do Undead natually heal? I have always played that they dont, but would apricate advice conferming or denying this. TY!
diaboli 10-01-04, 06:24 PM	The blame isn't all yours. Part of the problem falls on your players. If they (the players) knew they were going after evil foes, they need to share some of the blame. With the tone of your campaign (at least from what I've read), the PCs should be utilizing the Protection from Evil spell regularly, either through potions, scrolls, heck investment in a wand would easily pay for itself. This would have prevented them from suffering the domination effect of the vamps, plus potentially adding +2 to their AC. It [p/evil spell] can still be used to suppress the mind control effect in place, at least for the duration of the spell. During that time, should the vamp that is performing the mind control be killed, then no worries once the P/evil spell wears off. This could be an easy way to help explain how the unaffected PCs can rescue their compainions and beat down the spawn. The vampire hunter would definitely know of this spell and should have provided the PCs either a few potions, scrolls, or at least imparted such knowledge before going after the vamps.
FriendoftheDork 10-01-04, 07:55 PM	diaboli, prot evil is 1 minute per level... so yes some had been cast prot evil on, but not all. The Kelemvor cleric relied on his protection domain, should he be affected. Well, I did make quite powerful enemies - but they got pretty tough allies to counter that. It'll work out. Ironykitten, Undead do not heal at all. But vampires have regenerative abilities (fast heal 2 for spawns) so they get better. My vampires heal fire and holy damage 2/day instead of 2/round! In any case they have a cleric that can spontenously cast inflict spells, which heals undead. They even cast prot evil on the halfling, but he saved (will save, harmless). They could afford a wand, if they found one. Not sure if they would unless they spent days traveling to Saerloon. Perhaps not even then!
Lord Stigius 10-04-04, 04:53 PM	They even cast prot evil on the halfling, but he saved (will save, harmless). Well... Either I don't understand what you wanted to say here, or you don't understand well what 'will save, harmless' means. It means that since the spell normally is beneficial, no saving throw is rolled. Unless, of course, the person subject to the spell wants to resist and actualy resists. But did the halfling have any reason to try and resist the spell in the first place?
FriendoftheDork 10-05-04, 09:43 AM	yes, said halfling was dominated into killing the person that cast the spell on him. If a hostile recipient is cast a spell on, he will probably always save. Of course, with a spellcraft check he would know what is about to happen and would do the sensible thing: to save against a spell that would prevent him from killing his target. But that didn't happen, he just saved because he was cast a spell on, he didn't know it was beneficial.
Elendur 10-05-04, 11:13 AM	If a dominated character is commanded to do something "against his nature" he gets a resave at +2. If he likes his companions, its reasonable to call attacking them directly against his nature. You might also let slip that protection from evil works to negate(but not dispel) the dominate effect. The 1st level cleric holding off the 20th level vampire with his holy symbol probably wouldn't work for long. The vamp can't approach him, but nothing prevents him from continually attempting to dominate him with DC 20+ dominate effect...
FriendoftheDork 10-06-04, 05:02 AM	elendur, If you've read all my post you would see that my vampires are different. But yes, they shall get saves with +2, except for the LE fighter as it is not against his nature (yet unmodified save) and the monk who's master is destroyed. In any case, We're playing today! This could be fun ;)
Lord Stigius 10-06-04, 06:33 PM	FriendoftheDork Ok, it was me who took the wrong assumpion here (that the spell had been cast before the halfling was dominated). I wondered why he'd try and resist a spell being cast by his friends. But if he had already been dominated... another matter.
Lord Stigius 10-06-04, 06:33 PM	Ooops, double post.