character swallowed whole [Archive] - Wizards Community

character swallowed whole [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Apocolypse_77
07-13-07, 09:46 AM I was DMing a game a while ago and wanted to know if one of the calls i made during an encounter was correct.

So alright here's what happend, the party was around lvl 10 or so, maybe a bit higher and they came into a fight with a purple worm. One of the characters was a elf rogue who used 2 elven light blades (1d6, 18-20/X2 peircing). This elf soon into the battle had the unfortunate luck of grabbing the pruple worms attention and being swallowed whole. When in the stomach she quickly realized that she had no light slashing weapons on her and therefor had no chance of cutting her way out of the stomach. At this point she then asked if she would be able to sneak attack the purple worm from inside its stomach. I thought about it and it seemed obvious that the purple worm would be flat footed to her because how could it possibly dodge any attack she made from inside its stomach. So i let her do a full round attack, with sneak attacks on every hit which proceeded to take down half of the purple worms hitpoints in 1 turn. After having the most severe stomach ache imaginable the purple worm regergitated the rogue on its next turn to prevent further internal damage. So was my call right? can you sneak attack something while you are inside of its stomach?
RobbyPants
07-13-07, 10:26 AM I remember reading a thread on this a long time ago.

I can understand a house-rule allowing a sneak attack (as the rogue is presumably surrounded by vital organs), but I think the RAW says no.

The reasoning would be that the rogue cannot see while inside the creature, making it effectively blind. While blind, the target is treated as invisible (or vice verse), and thus has concealment. A rogue cannot use sneak attack against targets with concealment.

Now, if the rogue had some way to see in the dark, this might start opening up possibilities. I wouldn't call the creature flat-footed (it already acted), but you could argue that it's denied its Dex bonus to AC because it cannot see the rogue.

Anyway, that's my best understanding of it. :)
Saric
07-13-07, 10:28 AM A very good question, First you have to go step by step.

First the purple worm grappled it with improved grab.
second the purple worm swallowed it whole.

Now when someone is swallowed whole a few things are kept in mind.

From the srd :

Swallow Whole
If a creature with this special attack begins its turn with an opponent held in its mouth (see Improved Grab), it can attempt a new grapple check (as though attempting to pin the opponent). If it succeeds, it swallows its prey, and the opponent takes bite damage. Unless otherwise noted, the opponent can be up to one size category smaller than the swallowing creature. Being swallowed has various consequences, depending on the creature doing the swallowing. A swallowed creature is considered to be grappled, while the creature that did the swallowing is not.

Basically, you judged in favor of the player. The rogue was considered grappled but the purple worm should have kept his dex bonus to ac and therefore not suffered sneak attack damage. In addition each attack should have suffered a -4 attack penalty for being in a grapple. As a final note, it states in the purple worm entry that any light slashing or piercing weapon works just fine to get out of its gizzard. (which an elven light blade is)

I hope this helps you bro. Take it easy. It is better that your pc's live through one of your mistakes than they die by one.
Apocolypse_77
07-13-07, 11:09 AM A swallowed creature is considered to be grappled, while the creature that did the swallowing is not. [/I]

Basically, you judged in favor of the player. The rogue was considered grappled but the purple worm should have kept his dex bonus to ac and therefore not suffered sneak attack damage. In addition each attack should have suffered a -4 attack penalty for being in a grapple. As a final note, it states in the purple worm entry that any light slashing or piercing weapon works just fine to get out of its gizzard. (which an elven light blade is)

I hope this helps you bro. Take it easy. It is better that your pc's live through one of your mistakes than they die by one.

well i didn't know about the being considerd grappled part while swallowed so that is good to know. And i don't think the negative 4 would have done that much to stop the attacks maybe one or 2 more might have missed. But the part about the worm not loosing his dex i'll have to disagree with you on, i mean how would it be physically possible for the worm to add his dex bonus to its AC against an attack which is coming from inside its body? I would even be tempted to say it might loose all or at least part of its natural armor bonus as chances are its stomach lining isn't as hard to get through as its hide (mind you this would be a house rule as i am certain this is not detailed anywhere in any books).

I also didn't think you could ever use piercing weapons to escape a creatures stomach? is this just for the purple worm? As i was almost positive only light slashing weapons could be used.

all in all thanks for the info.
Phrennzy
07-13-07, 11:15 AM I would say no.

Sneak attack requires precision. The elf is being squished and burnt inside the stomach, and cannot see where to stab.

If you could sneak attack while being swallowed, rogues everywhere would be jumping into creatures' mouths.
Ace_of_Night
07-13-07, 11:27 AM Agreed with Phrennzy on this one, mainly because you can't do sneak attacks while in a grapple, and as said above, the swallowed creature is considered to be grappled.
Added to that: a sneak attack is about hitting the creature's vital organs, and I doubt that you come across those before you've been digested for at least some part (You think the purple worm's intestines aren't prepared for swallowing something against its will, which then tries to get out?)
Forgarn
07-13-07, 11:42 AM But the part about the worm not loosing his dex i'll have to disagree with you on, i mean how would it be physically possible for the worm to add his dex bonus to its AC against an attack which is coming from inside its body? I would even be tempted to say it might loose all or at least part of its natural armor bonus as chances are its stomach lining isn't as hard to get through as its hide (mind you this would be a house rule as i am certain this is not detailed anywhere in any books).

Here's the problem with that. If the purple worm swallowed the character whole and then completely stopped moving I would agree about loosing the dex. The thing is that the dex bonus is not all about dodge (otherwise there would be no dodge feat). The worm is still moving around and thus, while still inside the worm, the character has less chance of hitting because of being tossed around (and digested by the stomach acids, etc). They are also in a tight, confined area (hence the being grappled and the -4 to attack)

Now as for the natural armor thing, you would be ruling that you are a purple worm expert by saying that the stomach lining is not a hard as the outer skin. There are creatures that have, listed in the description and write-up, different AC scores for attacks from the inside (I cannot put my finger on one right now) but I would say that if it does not distinguish, then the AC is the same inside and out.
Phrennzy
07-13-07, 11:48 AM Now as for the natural armor thing, you would be ruling that you are a purple worm expert by saying that the stomach lining is not a hard as the outer skin. There are creatures that have, listed in the description and write-up, different AC scores for attacks from the inside (I cannot put my finger on one right now) but I would say that if it does not distinguish, then the AC is the same inside and out.

Amen
RobbyPants
07-13-07, 12:21 PM Here's the problem with that. If the purple worm swallowed the character whole and then completely stopped moving I would agree about loosing the dex. The thing is that the dex bonus is not all about dodge (otherwise there would be no dodge feat). The worm is still moving around and thus, while still inside the worm, the character has less chance of hitting because of being tossed around (and digested by the stomach acids, etc). They are also in a tight, confined area (hence the being grappled and the -4 to attack)
Also note that the swallowing creature cannot see the rogue, and thus, the rogue is treated as invisible. This would cause it to lose it's Dex bonus to AC (against the rogue). The rogue still needs to overcome the darkness (to remove the concealment the swallowing creature has) and the grapple (perhaps with Freedom of Movement). At that point, I think a sneak attack would be legal.
Saric
07-13-07, 06:16 PM Also note that the swallowing creature cannot see the rogue, and thus, the rogue is treated as invisible. This would cause it to lose it's Dex bonus to AC (against the rogue). The rogue still needs to overcome the darkness (to remove the concealment the swallowing creature has) and the grapple (perhaps with Freedom of Movement). At that point, I think a sneak attack would be legal.

Originally Posted by Apocolypse_77
But the part about the worm not loosing his dex i'll have to disagree with you on, i mean how would it be physically possible for the worm to add his dex bonus to its AC against an attack which is coming from inside its body? I would even be tempted to say it might loose all or at least part of its natural armor bonus as chances are its stomach lining isn't as hard to get through as its hide (mind you this would be a house rule as i am certain this is not detailed anywhere in any books).

Freedom of movement doesn't ever state that you can attack normally while inside a grapple, it just says you can escape from a grapple or pin and resist the attempt to be grappled automatically.(which means you go out the creature's mouth if you were swallowed somehow or allowed yourself to be swallowed.)

2nd of all the creature doesn't get its entire natural armor bonus from inside its lining (see below)
From the srd "swallow whole section":

A swallowed creature can try to cut its way free with any light slashing or piercing weapon (the amount of cutting damage required to get free is noted in the creature description),or it can just try to escape the grapple. The Armor Class of the interior of a creature that swallows whole is normally 10 + ½ its natural armor bonus, with no modifiers for size or Dexterity. If the swallowed creature escapes the grapple, success puts it back in the attacker’s mouth, where it may be bitten or swallowed again.
zorgling25
07-13-07, 06:20 PM Whether the rogue is grappled or not is irrelevant. As already stated, when the rogue is inside the purple worm, he is effectively blind, meaning all enemies have total concealment from him. Rogues cannot sneak attack concealed creatures. Period.
doomblade403x
07-13-07, 07:04 PM Also a sword is effectively a slashing weapon. Go into the hallway of your house or appartment and take a cane with you. Close your eyes and Swing it. Your going to hit a wall, the ceiling or something before the intended target is struck.

The reason the LIGHT weapon was pointed out is because that would be all the rogue would be able to use.
Zarron
07-13-07, 08:18 PM It seems to me that it is rather silly for an ability (swallow whole) to effectively put the creature in even greater danger than if it did not use it (by enabling rogue sneak attacks).

On top of the fact the Rogue is grappled, it just seems weird.
Ungelosh
07-13-07, 08:45 PM A swallowed creature can try to cut its way free with any light slashing or piercing weapon (the amount of cutting damage required to get free is noted in the creature description),or it can just try to escape the grapple. The Armor Class of the interior of a creature that swallows whole is normally 10 + ½ its natural armor bonus, with no modifiers for size or Dexterity. If the swallowed creature escapes the grapple, success puts it back in the attacker’s mouth, where it may be bitten or swallowed again.

Well it looks like apocolypse was right about the dex and natural armor thing.

No for the concealemtn arguement i really don't see how you could believe that concealment in this particular case could logically apply. Yes the rogue cannot see but it seems to me like the 50% miss chance cannot apply and should be ignored due to the fact that his target is literally enveloping him. as was posted earlier try to step into a closet with a steak knife and see if you can hit one of the wall with your eyes closed. If you fail at hitting one of the walls either your closet is freakishly big or there is something seriously wrong with you. The fact that you can't see really isn't hindering your ability to hit the wall as it is enveloping you. Really the only thing stopping you from doing dmg to the wall is wheather you are strong enough to get through it (ie natural armor/dmg reduction). Knowhere in the grappling text does it say that you cannot sneak attack while grappled, and we all know that you can still attack if using light weapons. Therefor i see no reason whatsoever of why sneak attack would not work while you are inside a creatures stomach.

from the PHB "Sneak attack : If a rogue can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectivly from her attack, she can strike a VITAL SPOT for extra damage.

Also I highly consider the stomach of a creature as a VITAL SPOT Normally if you can get through its armor and Hide and hit its stomach, that would count as a vital spot for a sneak attack.
shadzar
07-13-07, 11:29 PM The reasoning would be that the rogue cannot see while inside the creature, making it effectively blind. While blind, the target is treated as invisible (or vice verse), and thus has concealment. A rogue cannot use sneak attack against targets with concealment.

i would disagree. inside ths tomach means even the ground is the worm. so how can someone miss hitting the ground?

it would seem more like the worm is prone to attacks. and helpless to defend itself from the attacks. i wouldn't give a full CDG but pretty close.

i woudl say the way you ruled it was pretty good.

i mean, being able to see or not, what else could you hit other than the worm from inside it?

i am just wondering what effects the digestive acids would have had on the attack, the PC, the weapon, and on the worm itself after the attack....

seems liek a very bad place to be, but this is how i as a DM lost a terresque one time...

party member swallowed. luckily grabds the uvula of the terresque and has a pixie sleep arrow used on said uvula. terresque falls asleep and the rest of the party proceed to free the captured party member. they didn't bother with killing the beast, but wished it to another plane of existance.

i was very upset, but laughed the whole way through the episode and awarded full XP for defeating the creature. and bonus XP to the player "eaten" and he earned the title of "uvula slayer".
RobbyPants
07-14-07, 11:06 AM Also a sword is effectively a slashing weapon. Go into the hallway of your house or appartment and take a cane with you. Close your eyes and Swing it. Your going to hit a wall, the ceiling or something before the intended target is struck.

The reason the LIGHT weapon was pointed out is because that would be all the rogue would be able to use.
The OP said the rogue had elven light blades (light, piercing weapons).
Myzery78
07-14-07, 12:24 PM If the rogue could see then the SA would be justified due to the creature being denied its dex bonus, however the concealment is still a factor. A purple wurm, and for that matter anything with swallow whole feeds by swallowing creatures live, and the creature is adapted for that. While you may not be able to swing your weapon without hitting something, you will very often be landing insignificant hits. Also while its reasonable for the wurm to spit up the offending bit of food, it would most likely only move it back to its mouth where it would bite it for a while before reswallowing. So for a brief recap:

Attack: With a light weapon at a -4
Concealment: 50%(unless you can see in the dark)
Sneak Attack: No(unless concealment is negated)
RobbyPants
07-14-07, 09:44 PM Freedom of movement doesn't ever state that you can attack normally while inside a grapple, it just says you can escape from a grapple or pin and resist the attempt to be grappled automatically.(which means you go out the creature's mouth if you were swallowed somehow or allowed yourself to be swallowed.)
Actually, the very first line of the spell states exactly that.

Per the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org) (emphasis mine).

Freedom of Movement
Abjuration
Level: Brd 4, Clr 4, Drd 4, Luck 4, Rgr 4
Components: V, S, M, DF
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Personal or touch
Target: You or creature touched
Duration: 10 min./level
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)

This spell enables you or a creature you touch to move and attack normally for the duration of the spell, even under the influence of magic that usually impedes movement, such as paralysis, solid fog, slow, and web. The subject automatically succeeds on any grapple check made to resist a grapple attempt, as well as on grapple checks or Escape Artist checks made to escape a grapple or a pin.

The spell also allows the subject to move and attack normally while underwater, even with slashing weapons such as axes and swords or with bludgeoning weapons such as flails, hammers, and maces, provided that the weapon is wielded in the hand rather than hurled. The freedom of movement spell does not, however, allow water breathing.

Material Component
A leather thong, bound around the arm or a similar appendage.
Based on that, I'd say that would negate the grappling portion of the swallow attack. So, if the rogue gets a way to see in the dark too, then I'd say the sneak attacks would work.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Apocolypse_77 07-13-07, 09:46 AM	I was DMing a game a while ago and wanted to know if one of the calls i made during an encounter was correct. So alright here's what happend, the party was around lvl 10 or so, maybe a bit higher and they came into a fight with a purple worm. One of the characters was a elf rogue who used 2 elven light blades (1d6, 18-20/X2 peircing). This elf soon into the battle had the unfortunate luck of grabbing the pruple worms attention and being swallowed whole. When in the stomach she quickly realized that she had no light slashing weapons on her and therefor had no chance of cutting her way out of the stomach. At this point she then asked if she would be able to sneak attack the purple worm from inside its stomach. I thought about it and it seemed obvious that the purple worm would be flat footed to her because how could it possibly dodge any attack she made from inside its stomach. So i let her do a full round attack, with sneak attacks on every hit which proceeded to take down half of the purple worms hitpoints in 1 turn. After having the most severe stomach ache imaginable the purple worm regergitated the rogue on its next turn to prevent further internal damage. So was my call right? can you sneak attack something while you are inside of its stomach?
RobbyPants 07-13-07, 10:26 AM	I remember reading a thread on this a long time ago. I can understand a house-rule allowing a sneak attack (as the rogue is presumably surrounded by vital organs), but I think the RAW says no. The reasoning would be that the rogue cannot see while inside the creature, making it effectively blind. While blind, the target is treated as invisible (or vice verse), and thus has concealment. A rogue cannot use sneak attack against targets with concealment. Now, if the rogue had some way to see in the dark, this might start opening up possibilities. I wouldn't call the creature flat-footed (it already acted), but you could argue that it's denied its Dex bonus to AC because it cannot see the rogue. Anyway, that's my best understanding of it. :)
Saric 07-13-07, 10:28 AM	A very good question, First you have to go step by step. First the purple worm grappled it with improved grab. second the purple worm swallowed it whole. Now when someone is swallowed whole a few things are kept in mind. From the srd : Swallow Whole If a creature with this special attack begins its turn with an opponent held in its mouth (see Improved Grab), it can attempt a new grapple check (as though attempting to pin the opponent). If it succeeds, it swallows its prey, and the opponent takes bite damage. Unless otherwise noted, the opponent can be up to one size category smaller than the swallowing creature. Being swallowed has various consequences, depending on the creature doing the swallowing. A swallowed creature is considered to be grappled, while the creature that did the swallowing is not. Basically, you judged in favor of the player. The rogue was considered grappled but the purple worm should have kept his dex bonus to ac and therefore not suffered sneak attack damage. In addition each attack should have suffered a -4 attack penalty for being in a grapple. As a final note, it states in the purple worm entry that any light slashing or piercing weapon works just fine to get out of its gizzard. (which an elven light blade is) I hope this helps you bro. Take it easy. It is better that your pc's live through one of your mistakes than they die by one.
Apocolypse_77 07-13-07, 11:09 AM	A swallowed creature is considered to be grappled, while the creature that did the swallowing is not. [/I] Basically, you judged in favor of the player. The rogue was considered grappled but the purple worm should have kept his dex bonus to ac and therefore not suffered sneak attack damage. In addition each attack should have suffered a -4 attack penalty for being in a grapple. As a final note, it states in the purple worm entry that any light slashing or piercing weapon works just fine to get out of its gizzard. (which an elven light blade is) I hope this helps you bro. Take it easy. It is better that your pc's live through one of your mistakes than they die by one. well i didn't know about the being considerd grappled part while swallowed so that is good to know. And i don't think the negative 4 would have done that much to stop the attacks maybe one or 2 more might have missed. But the part about the worm not loosing his dex i'll have to disagree with you on, i mean how would it be physically possible for the worm to add his dex bonus to its AC against an attack which is coming from inside its body? I would even be tempted to say it might loose all or at least part of its natural armor bonus as chances are its stomach lining isn't as hard to get through as its hide (mind you this would be a house rule as i am certain this is not detailed anywhere in any books). I also didn't think you could ever use piercing weapons to escape a creatures stomach? is this just for the purple worm? As i was almost positive only light slashing weapons could be used. all in all thanks for the info.
Phrennzy 07-13-07, 11:15 AM	I would say no. Sneak attack requires precision. The elf is being squished and burnt inside the stomach, and cannot see where to stab. If you could sneak attack while being swallowed, rogues everywhere would be jumping into creatures' mouths.
Ace_of_Night 07-13-07, 11:27 AM	Agreed with Phrennzy on this one, mainly because you can't do sneak attacks while in a grapple, and as said above, the swallowed creature is considered to be grappled. Added to that: a sneak attack is about hitting the creature's vital organs, and I doubt that you come across those before you've been digested for at least some part (You think the purple worm's intestines aren't prepared for swallowing something against its will, which then tries to get out?)
Forgarn 07-13-07, 11:42 AM	But the part about the worm not loosing his dex i'll have to disagree with you on, i mean how would it be physically possible for the worm to add his dex bonus to its AC against an attack which is coming from inside its body? I would even be tempted to say it might loose all or at least part of its natural armor bonus as chances are its stomach lining isn't as hard to get through as its hide (mind you this would be a house rule as i am certain this is not detailed anywhere in any books). Here's the problem with that. If the purple worm swallowed the character whole and then completely stopped moving I would agree about loosing the dex. The thing is that the dex bonus is not all about dodge (otherwise there would be no dodge feat). The worm is still moving around and thus, while still inside the worm, the character has less chance of hitting because of being tossed around (and digested by the stomach acids, etc). They are also in a tight, confined area (hence the being grappled and the -4 to attack) Now as for the natural armor thing, you would be ruling that you are a purple worm expert by saying that the stomach lining is not a hard as the outer skin. There are creatures that have, listed in the description and write-up, different AC scores for attacks from the inside (I cannot put my finger on one right now) but I would say that if it does not distinguish, then the AC is the same inside and out.
Phrennzy 07-13-07, 11:48 AM	Now as for the natural armor thing, you would be ruling that you are a purple worm expert by saying that the stomach lining is not a hard as the outer skin. There are creatures that have, listed in the description and write-up, different AC scores for attacks from the inside (I cannot put my finger on one right now) but I would say that if it does not distinguish, then the AC is the same inside and out. Amen
RobbyPants 07-13-07, 12:21 PM	Here's the problem with that. If the purple worm swallowed the character whole and then completely stopped moving I would agree about loosing the dex. The thing is that the dex bonus is not all about dodge (otherwise there would be no dodge feat). The worm is still moving around and thus, while still inside the worm, the character has less chance of hitting because of being tossed around (and digested by the stomach acids, etc). They are also in a tight, confined area (hence the being grappled and the -4 to attack) Also note that the swallowing creature cannot see the rogue, and thus, the rogue is treated as invisible. This would cause it to lose it's Dex bonus to AC (against the rogue). The rogue still needs to overcome the darkness (to remove the concealment the swallowing creature has) and the grapple (perhaps with Freedom of Movement). At that point, I think a sneak attack would be legal.
Saric 07-13-07, 06:16 PM	Also note that the swallowing creature cannot see the rogue, and thus, the rogue is treated as invisible. This would cause it to lose it's Dex bonus to AC (against the rogue). The rogue still needs to overcome the darkness (to remove the concealment the swallowing creature has) and the grapple (perhaps with Freedom of Movement). At that point, I think a sneak attack would be legal. Originally Posted by Apocolypse_77 But the part about the worm not loosing his dex i'll have to disagree with you on, i mean how would it be physically possible for the worm to add his dex bonus to its AC against an attack which is coming from inside its body? I would even be tempted to say it might loose all or at least part of its natural armor bonus as chances are its stomach lining isn't as hard to get through as its hide (mind you this would be a house rule as i am certain this is not detailed anywhere in any books). Freedom of movement doesn't ever state that you can attack normally while inside a grapple, it just says you can escape from a grapple or pin and resist the attempt to be grappled automatically.(which means you go out the creature's mouth if you were swallowed somehow or allowed yourself to be swallowed.) 2nd of all the creature doesn't get its entire natural armor bonus from inside its lining (see below) From the srd "swallow whole section": A swallowed creature can try to cut its way free with any light slashing or piercing weapon (the amount of cutting damage required to get free is noted in the creature description),or it can just try to escape the grapple. The Armor Class of the interior of a creature that swallows whole is normally 10 + ½ its natural armor bonus, with no modifiers for size or Dexterity. If the swallowed creature escapes the grapple, success puts it back in the attacker’s mouth, where it may be bitten or swallowed again.
zorgling25 07-13-07, 06:20 PM	Whether the rogue is grappled or not is irrelevant. As already stated, when the rogue is inside the purple worm, he is effectively blind, meaning all enemies have total concealment from him. Rogues cannot sneak attack concealed creatures. Period.
doomblade403x 07-13-07, 07:04 PM	Also a sword is effectively a slashing weapon. Go into the hallway of your house or appartment and take a cane with you. Close your eyes and Swing it. Your going to hit a wall, the ceiling or something before the intended target is struck. The reason the LIGHT weapon was pointed out is because that would be all the rogue would be able to use.
Zarron 07-13-07, 08:18 PM	It seems to me that it is rather silly for an ability (swallow whole) to effectively put the creature in even greater danger than if it did not use it (by enabling rogue sneak attacks). On top of the fact the Rogue is grappled, it just seems weird.
Ungelosh 07-13-07, 08:45 PM	A swallowed creature can try to cut its way free with any light slashing or piercing weapon (the amount of cutting damage required to get free is noted in the creature description),or it can just try to escape the grapple. The Armor Class of the interior of a creature that swallows whole is normally 10 + ½ its natural armor bonus, with no modifiers for size or Dexterity. If the swallowed creature escapes the grapple, success puts it back in the attacker’s mouth, where it may be bitten or swallowed again. Well it looks like apocolypse was right about the dex and natural armor thing. No for the concealemtn arguement i really don't see how you could believe that concealment in this particular case could logically apply. Yes the rogue cannot see but it seems to me like the 50% miss chance cannot apply and should be ignored due to the fact that his target is literally enveloping him. as was posted earlier try to step into a closet with a steak knife and see if you can hit one of the wall with your eyes closed. If you fail at hitting one of the walls either your closet is freakishly big or there is something seriously wrong with you. The fact that you can't see really isn't hindering your ability to hit the wall as it is enveloping you. Really the only thing stopping you from doing dmg to the wall is wheather you are strong enough to get through it (ie natural armor/dmg reduction). Knowhere in the grappling text does it say that you cannot sneak attack while grappled, and we all know that you can still attack if using light weapons. Therefor i see no reason whatsoever of why sneak attack would not work while you are inside a creatures stomach. from the PHB "Sneak attack : If a rogue can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectivly from her attack, she can strike a VITAL SPOT for extra damage. Also I highly consider the stomach of a creature as a VITAL SPOT Normally if you can get through its armor and Hide and hit its stomach, that would count as a vital spot for a sneak attack.
shadzar 07-13-07, 11:29 PM	The reasoning would be that the rogue cannot see while inside the creature, making it effectively blind. While blind, the target is treated as invisible (or vice verse), and thus has concealment. A rogue cannot use sneak attack against targets with concealment. i would disagree. inside ths tomach means even the ground is the worm. so how can someone miss hitting the ground? it would seem more like the worm is prone to attacks. and helpless to defend itself from the attacks. i wouldn't give a full CDG but pretty close. i woudl say the way you ruled it was pretty good. i mean, being able to see or not, what else could you hit other than the worm from inside it? i am just wondering what effects the digestive acids would have had on the attack, the PC, the weapon, and on the worm itself after the attack.... seems liek a very bad place to be, but this is how i as a DM lost a terresque one time... party member swallowed. luckily grabds the uvula of the terresque and has a pixie sleep arrow used on said uvula. terresque falls asleep and the rest of the party proceed to free the captured party member. they didn't bother with killing the beast, but wished it to another plane of existance. i was very upset, but laughed the whole way through the episode and awarded full XP for defeating the creature. and bonus XP to the player "eaten" and he earned the title of "uvula slayer".
RobbyPants 07-14-07, 11:06 AM	Also a sword is effectively a slashing weapon. Go into the hallway of your house or appartment and take a cane with you. Close your eyes and Swing it. Your going to hit a wall, the ceiling or something before the intended target is struck. The reason the LIGHT weapon was pointed out is because that would be all the rogue would be able to use. The OP said the rogue had elven light blades (light, piercing weapons).
Myzery78 07-14-07, 12:24 PM	If the rogue could see then the SA would be justified due to the creature being denied its dex bonus, however the concealment is still a factor. A purple wurm, and for that matter anything with swallow whole feeds by swallowing creatures live, and the creature is adapted for that. While you may not be able to swing your weapon without hitting something, you will very often be landing insignificant hits. Also while its reasonable for the wurm to spit up the offending bit of food, it would most likely only move it back to its mouth where it would bite it for a while before reswallowing. So for a brief recap: Attack: With a light weapon at a -4 Concealment: 50%(unless you can see in the dark) Sneak Attack: No(unless concealment is negated)
RobbyPants 07-14-07, 09:44 PM	Freedom of movement doesn't ever state that you can attack normally while inside a grapple, it just says you can escape from a grapple or pin and resist the attempt to be grappled automatically.(which means you go out the creature's mouth if you were swallowed somehow or allowed yourself to be swallowed.) Actually, the very first line of the spell states exactly that. Per the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org) (emphasis mine). Freedom of Movement Abjuration Level: Brd 4, Clr 4, Drd 4, Luck 4, Rgr 4 Components: V, S, M, DF Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Personal or touch Target: You or creature touched Duration: 10 min./level Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless) Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless) This spell enables you or a creature you touch to move and attack normally for the duration of the spell, even under the influence of magic that usually impedes movement, such as paralysis, solid fog, slow, and web. The subject automatically succeeds on any grapple check made to resist a grapple attempt, as well as on grapple checks or Escape Artist checks made to escape a grapple or a pin. The spell also allows the subject to move and attack normally while underwater, even with slashing weapons such as axes and swords or with bludgeoning weapons such as flails, hammers, and maces, provided that the weapon is wielded in the hand rather than hurled. The freedom of movement spell does not, however, allow water breathing. Material Component A leather thong, bound around the arm or a similar appendage. Based on that, I'd say that would negate the grappling portion of the swallow attack. So, if the rogue gets a way to see in the dark too, then I'd say the sneak attacks would work.