1001 Things You Miss About 3.0 [Archive] - Wizards Community

1001 Things You Miss About 3.0 [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Insane Pixie
03-15-05, 09:31 PM 1. Animal Friendship

2. The sample treasure tables in the back of the PHB.

3. The character generator disc in the back of the PHB.
Serious Games Only
03-15-05, 09:37 PM 1. Animal Friendship

2. The sample treasure tables in the back of the PHB.

3. The character generator disc in the back of the PHB.

1. I miss animal freindship too.

2. I hated the random sample treasure in the back of the PHB becuase it would pritty much tell players what to expect and if the dont get what they want becuase its a differnt type of game they whine.

3. I never liked random generators because I use home brew material heavily, I have yet to find an online generator that lets to put in a custem race, if anyone has seen one tell me.
Count Arioch the 28th
03-15-05, 09:37 PM 1. Animal Friendship

Aah yes, the spell that gives EVERYONE an animal companion. (Cast it in a ring of spell storing, and give it to someone else.

I'll add to the list:

4. 3.0 shapechange

5. Better combat feat synergy (Too many feats and abilities don't stakc now, which is a kick in the junk for fighters. A fighter can't get keen and improved critical to stack, but clerics get divine meta-magic? where's the fairness?)

6. Meta-magic rods and natural spell are non-core.

7. there are spells that do more than one thing in 3.0, which is great for sorcerors!
Lord Gwydion
03-15-05, 09:38 PM 8. Centaurs, whose humaniod torso is the exact same proportions as a human, using the same size weapons as a human. [Now, because they have the rump of a horse, they use the weapons of a Hill Giant in human-size hands.]
Kensu
03-15-05, 09:55 PM Nothing, because I still use it! :D
Lord Schpungus
03-15-05, 10:10 PM 8. Giving it the old heave-ho! (because I've already done it..heh...)

9. 3.0 Haste. Because there's nothing like sitting on your fighterly behind watching the rest of the party (who are all spellcasters) quicken grease the mob, then chain lightning the mob, then cone of cold them all for good effect, and then the next spellcaster gets to go.

10. the Beast and Shapechanger types. Because they're so useful.

11. Never making saving throws thanks to impossible spell save DCs.

Okay, okay, these are things I don't miss (except for #8). I really can't think of anything I would bring back from 3.0. Maybe a useful ranger animal companion. As it is now they're the dinner that follows you around, so you can eat it once the monster kills it in one hit. The Lasher, too. Technically still amazingly viable in 3.5, but I wish they'd update it even so. I miss the compatibility of the Epic Level Handbook with actual rules..
Rogpog
03-15-05, 10:21 PM 12. Scrying

13. Intuit Direction

14. When I played 3.0 I didn't use any splat books... it was all so much simpler. No need to ruleslawyer... those were the good times!
Insane Pixie
03-15-05, 10:43 PM Aah yes, the spell that gives EVERYONE an animal companion. (Cast it in a ring of spell storing, and give it to someone else.

...until it runs out. That's why I'm working on a 3.0 race with Animal Friendship as a spell-like ability...
Draco Strang
03-16-05, 05:52 AM Why is this thread here? If you still want to play 3.0 you can, there's no reason to miss it, persay.
rhflyweyr
03-16-05, 05:53 AM 15. The 'Better' NPC tables in the DMG
Count Arioch the 28th
03-16-05, 09:14 AM ...until it runs out. That's why I'm working on a 3.0 race with Animal Friendship as a spell-like ability...

Yeah, I hate it when it runs out. whe's animal friendship run out again? Ahh, that's right.

NEVER!

Geezy pete, if you're going to extole the virtues of 3.0 (Which is not wrong per se), you should at least know the rules beforehand. A race with Animal Friendship as a SLA will have an army of animal friends, animal friendship is instantaneous, which means the effect (the animal being your friend) last forever, cannot be dispelled, or disjoined.
Insane Pixie
03-16-05, 12:38 PM Yeah, I hate it when it runs out. whe's animal friendship run out again? Ahh, that's right.

NEVER!

Geezy pete, if you're going to extole the virtues of 3.0 (Which is not wrong per se), you should at least know the rules beforehand. A race with Animal Friendship as a SLA will have an army of animal friends, animal friendship is instantaneous, which means the effect (the animal being your friend) last forever, cannot be dispelled, or disjoined.

Okay captain perky, but I was referring to the number of spells in the ring.

Burning you,

Pixie.
Osiris Memnoch
03-16-05, 04:50 PM 16) Alchemy was still called Alchemy.
17) The same goes for Wilderness Lore and Survival.
18) And Expertise and Combat Expertise.
19) And Sunder and Improved Sunder.
20) Then there was the getting rid of names in front of spells. I miss Evaard, Mortenkeinen, Bigby, and Tensor. Especially Bigby. Those Hand spells just don't sound right without him.

Really these aren't big changes or even bad changes. I just got used to the old names is all.

21) Rangers got d10 HD and Two-Weapon Fighting at level 1.
22) Ambidexterity. Sure it was a useless feat but it left successful two-weapon fighting in the relm of Fighters, darn it!
23) Spell Focus gave +2 to DCs not +1. A peice of my Gnome Illuionist died when I found that one out.
24) Gnome Illusionists.
Thelandrach
03-16-05, 07:13 PM Nothing, really. I'm still using it, too. I paid a bunch of money for these books and I'm going to use them. I haven't upgraded to 3.5 and don't plan to, because I'm done paying $200 to buy another version of the same game.
green_yawgmoth
03-16-05, 11:29 PM Nothing, really. I'm still using it, too. I paid a bunch of money for these books and I'm going to use them. I haven't upgraded to 3.5 and don't plan to, because I'm done paying $200 to buy another version of the same game.
Yep. I play 3.0 with just a little 3.5 mixed in because of the new books that I like that came out (CA, LM, Eberron, PlHB). But if I were to convert all the way (all hell would freeze over)...

I miss class-exclusive skills. There are just some things that certain classes should get to themselves. I always thought Alchemy shoulda been a class-exclusive skill to bards, wizards, and sorcerers, though.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
Solidcobra
03-17-05, 03:58 AM 25: That a horse was 5x10, not 10x10 (i mean...wtf?)
26: 3.0 "animal" buffs (Bulls strength, etc) that didn't suck.
27: The not-too-overpowered animate dead.
Baron Stoonir Fel
03-17-05, 11:28 AM I play 3.25, best of both worlds so i miss nothing!
Endless Dave
03-17-05, 02:21 PM 3.0 permanent-until-dismissed wildshape!
feartheinvinceblehamster
03-17-05, 02:39 PM the treasure and experience table in the same :censored: place

harm, heh, heh, heh, heh
Wizard
03-17-05, 03:03 PM Whoa...horses are 10x10 now?
Greyseed
03-17-05, 03:25 PM 30. Variant slaad tables in the MM.

31. Potions of Glibness ('cause it wasn't a spell.)

32. Emotion . (I wouldn't even mind if they had named good hope Emotion: hope instead.)
Still, I prefer 3.5, a lot.
feartheinvinceblehamster
03-17-05, 03:26 PM Whoa...horses are 10x10 now?

that horse needs to stop eating at mcdonalds
Vaalingrade Ashland
03-17-05, 03:53 PM 1) DR
2) Alchemy that classes that would use it could use.
3) Arcane Magic not sucking
4) Being a halfling with weapons.
5) Feinting that worked.
6) high level crit ranges
7) The belief that 3.5 would be a revision.
Lonestar
03-17-05, 04:56 PM Harm. I miss 3.0 harm with no save. I don't miss my PC getting hit with it, but I most certainly miss casting it.
Lincoln Hills
03-17-05, 06:22 PM (I've counted the actual "things that I miss" and ignored the... miscellaneous asides.)

37. As a 3.0 diehard, what I miss most is being able to buy a module or Dungeon from a store, pull off the shrink-wrap, read it, and play it. (And don't start, Mr. It's-Easy-To-Convert! I know it's easy, I just wish it wasn't necessary!)
Osiris Memnoch
03-17-05, 09:17 PM 38) Weapon Sizes. I likes my i tiny, small, medium, and large weapons. This light, one handed, and two handed business really screws all you other folks that like to play small characters.
Count Arioch the 28th
03-17-05, 09:30 PM 38) Weapon Sizes. I likes my i tiny, small, medium, and large weapons. This light, one handed, and two handed business really screws all you other folks that like to play small characters.

No it doesn't, because in 3.5 small characters can use colossal longbows without penalty. that's a boost. ;)

Really, the 3.5 weapon sizes would work just fine if weapons and armor resized like armor used to. the fact that the BBEG is never small and small stuff rarely shows up screws them over.
green_yawgmoth
03-17-05, 11:35 PM Yeah, what the devil were they thinking with magic items not resizing? To me, that just screams "Don't worry DM, you can give that hill giant gloves of +20 str, and the players can't do squadoo with it because who wants gloves that big that won't resize anyways?" That and "body slot affinity". The way I saw it, as long as the article of clothing was worn, it's touching you, and thus the magic is flowing into you. Maybe my character looks better with glasses on, should I get penalized for having glasses of charisma? I blacked out when I heard that rule from :rolleyes:ing too much.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
RblDiver
03-18-05, 06:50 PM 39. Small flying carpet with 210 speed. I mean, come on, max of 40? :yuck:
twad
03-18-05, 08:11 PM the prettry picturess that are no longer in the 3.5 books.
TinManFan
03-18-05, 08:19 PM Useful Persistant Spell. Yeah, 6 f***ing levels. Not happening.

More versions of Polymorph that kept trying to fix the thing.

An Incantrix that required a little bit of sacrifice to go into.

Broken, OH SO BROKEN Psionics
Lord Schpungus
03-18-05, 09:33 PM (Not things I miss).

1. Horses are 10x10 because in combat, everyone's spinning around, watching their own 6.

2. Persistant spell was Borken at 4 levels. (which is more overpowered than Broken).
Ze_Mighty_Vegetable
03-19-05, 12:38 AM It was simply called D&D 3rd edition. 3.5 sounds silly. When will we have D&D 4.56 Beta(2nd edition)?
Vaalingrade Ashland
03-22-05, 09:22 PM - Lidda fails her UMD check.
weasel fierce
03-23-05, 01:34 AM I like the pictures better..
Dunelord
03-23-05, 03:21 AM The 15 minuites between people when stopped *****ing about 2nd going away and WOTC telling us their would be a 3.5.

Search working on the boards.
Abulafia
03-23-05, 10:34 AM The Jump rule that multiplied distance by speed ("How far is it to the other side of the chasm? 1000 feet? OK, my monk takes a running start . . ."). Not a *good* rule, mind you, but an entertaining one.

Improved Crit & Keen stacking (why burn a feat? Have the wizard make a Wand of Keen Edge for the party). I let them stack in my 3.5 campaigns.

Haste. I use three spells in my 3.5 campaigns to replicate 3.0 Haste: A "lesser" version at 3rd level that grants an extra move action, a "regular" version at 6th level that grants an extra standard action, and a "greater" version at 9th level that grants an extra full-round action. I've been using this setup for over a year now, with about 8-9 different players, and have had no problems.

Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus: The Spell Power rules were too lax (an Enchanter 5/Red Wizard 10/Archmage 5 could cast a DC 47 Dominate Monster), but these two feats worked just fine as +2 each.

Weapon Master -- should work in 3.5, but WotC claims the Exotic Weapon Master in Complete Warrior is the updated version. Where have you gone, Kensei?

Gnome Illusionists. I can't even remember the poor little bugger's name. Nebin?

Martial arts feats from Oriental Adventures. The monk got absolutely rogered over the 3.5 updates to Flying Kick and Freezing the Lifeblood (check BAB requirement -- unarmed Fighter gets to this feat before a monk can). Those feats not updated float in limbo.
Santrilla
03-23-05, 10:54 AM The guy in the purple in Chapter 6 of the PH.

Also, dull gray Ioun stones!! Sure, they were pointless, but you could paint them funny colours and scare the bejeysus out of your enemies. :D
lukelightning
03-23-05, 11:41 AM Nah, you cast continual flame on 'em and have a hands-free light source.

The guy in the purple in Chapter 6 of the PH.

Also, dull gray Ioun stones!! Sure, they were pointless, but you could paint them funny colours and scare the bejeysus out of your enemies. :D

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Insane Pixie 03-15-05, 09:31 PM	1. Animal Friendship 2. The sample treasure tables in the back of the PHB. 3. The character generator disc in the back of the PHB.
Serious Games Only 03-15-05, 09:37 PM	1. Animal Friendship 2. The sample treasure tables in the back of the PHB. 3. The character generator disc in the back of the PHB. 1. I miss animal freindship too. 2. I hated the random sample treasure in the back of the PHB becuase it would pritty much tell players what to expect and if the dont get what they want becuase its a differnt type of game they whine. 3. I never liked random generators because I use home brew material heavily, I have yet to find an online generator that lets to put in a custem race, if anyone has seen one tell me.
Count Arioch the 28th 03-15-05, 09:37 PM	1. Animal Friendship Aah yes, the spell that gives EVERYONE an animal companion. (Cast it in a ring of spell storing, and give it to someone else. I'll add to the list: 4. 3.0 shapechange 5. Better combat feat synergy (Too many feats and abilities don't stakc now, which is a kick in the junk for fighters. A fighter can't get keen and improved critical to stack, but clerics get divine meta-magic? where's the fairness?) 6. Meta-magic rods and natural spell are non-core. 7. there are spells that do more than one thing in 3.0, which is great for sorcerors!
Lord Gwydion 03-15-05, 09:38 PM	8. Centaurs, whose humaniod torso is the exact same proportions as a human, using the same size weapons as a human. [Now, because they have the rump of a horse, they use the weapons of a Hill Giant in human-size hands.]
Kensu 03-15-05, 09:55 PM	Nothing, because I still use it! :D
Lord Schpungus 03-15-05, 10:10 PM	8. Giving it the old heave-ho! (because I've already done it..heh...) 9. 3.0 Haste. Because there's nothing like sitting on your fighterly behind watching the rest of the party (who are all spellcasters) quicken grease the mob, then chain lightning the mob, then cone of cold them all for good effect, and then the next spellcaster gets to go. 10. the Beast and Shapechanger types. Because they're so useful. 11. Never making saving throws thanks to impossible spell save DCs. Okay, okay, these are things I don't miss (except for #8). I really can't think of anything I would bring back from 3.0. Maybe a useful ranger animal companion. As it is now they're the dinner that follows you around, so you can eat it once the monster kills it in one hit. The Lasher, too. Technically still amazingly viable in 3.5, but I wish they'd update it even so. I miss the compatibility of the Epic Level Handbook with actual rules..
Rogpog 03-15-05, 10:21 PM	12. Scrying 13. Intuit Direction 14. When I played 3.0 I didn't use any splat books... it was all so much simpler. No need to ruleslawyer... those were the good times!
Insane Pixie 03-15-05, 10:43 PM	Aah yes, the spell that gives EVERYONE an animal companion. (Cast it in a ring of spell storing, and give it to someone else. ...until it runs out. That's why I'm working on a 3.0 race with Animal Friendship as a spell-like ability...
Draco Strang 03-16-05, 05:52 AM	Why is this thread here? If you still want to play 3.0 you can, there's no reason to miss it, persay.
rhflyweyr 03-16-05, 05:53 AM	15. The 'Better' NPC tables in the DMG
Count Arioch the 28th 03-16-05, 09:14 AM	...until it runs out. That's why I'm working on a 3.0 race with Animal Friendship as a spell-like ability... Yeah, I hate it when it runs out. whe's animal friendship run out again? Ahh, that's right. NEVER! Geezy pete, if you're going to extole the virtues of 3.0 (Which is not wrong per se), you should at least know the rules beforehand. A race with Animal Friendship as a SLA will have an army of animal friends, animal friendship is instantaneous, which means the effect (the animal being your friend) last forever, cannot be dispelled, or disjoined.
Insane Pixie 03-16-05, 12:38 PM	Yeah, I hate it when it runs out. whe's animal friendship run out again? Ahh, that's right. NEVER! Geezy pete, if you're going to extole the virtues of 3.0 (Which is not wrong per se), you should at least know the rules beforehand. A race with Animal Friendship as a SLA will have an army of animal friends, animal friendship is instantaneous, which means the effect (the animal being your friend) last forever, cannot be dispelled, or disjoined. Okay captain perky, but I was referring to the number of spells in the ring. Burning you, Pixie.
Osiris Memnoch 03-16-05, 04:50 PM	16) Alchemy was still called Alchemy. 17) The same goes for Wilderness Lore and Survival. 18) And Expertise and Combat Expertise. 19) And Sunder and Improved Sunder. 20) Then there was the getting rid of names in front of spells. I miss Evaard, Mortenkeinen, Bigby, and Tensor. Especially Bigby. Those Hand spells just don't sound right without him. Really these aren't big changes or even bad changes. I just got used to the old names is all. 21) Rangers got d10 HD and Two-Weapon Fighting at level 1. 22) Ambidexterity. Sure it was a useless feat but it left successful two-weapon fighting in the relm of Fighters, darn it! 23) Spell Focus gave +2 to DCs not +1. A peice of my Gnome Illuionist died when I found that one out. 24) Gnome Illusionists.
Thelandrach 03-16-05, 07:13 PM	Nothing, really. I'm still using it, too. I paid a bunch of money for these books and I'm going to use them. I haven't upgraded to 3.5 and don't plan to, because I'm done paying $200 to buy another version of the same game.
green_yawgmoth 03-16-05, 11:29 PM	Nothing, really. I'm still using it, too. I paid a bunch of money for these books and I'm going to use them. I haven't upgraded to 3.5 and don't plan to, because I'm done paying $200 to buy another version of the same game. Yep. I play 3.0 with just a little 3.5 mixed in because of the new books that I like that came out (CA, LM, Eberron, PlHB). But if I were to convert all the way (all hell would freeze over)... I miss class-exclusive skills. There are just some things that certain classes should get to themselves. I always thought Alchemy shoulda been a class-exclusive skill to bards, wizards, and sorcerers, though. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
Solidcobra 03-17-05, 03:58 AM	25: That a horse was 5x10, not 10x10 (i mean...wtf?) 26: 3.0 "animal" buffs (Bulls strength, etc) that didn't suck. 27: The not-too-overpowered animate dead.
Baron Stoonir Fel 03-17-05, 11:28 AM	I play 3.25, best of both worlds so i miss nothing!
Endless Dave 03-17-05, 02:21 PM	3.0 permanent-until-dismissed wildshape!
feartheinvinceblehamster 03-17-05, 02:39 PM	the treasure and experience table in the same :censored: place harm, heh, heh, heh, heh
Wizard 03-17-05, 03:03 PM	Whoa...horses are 10x10 now?
Greyseed 03-17-05, 03:25 PM	30. Variant slaad tables in the MM. 31. Potions of Glibness ('cause it wasn't a spell.) 32. Emotion . (I wouldn't even mind if they had named good hope Emotion: hope instead.) Still, I prefer 3.5, a lot.
feartheinvinceblehamster 03-17-05, 03:26 PM	Whoa...horses are 10x10 now? that horse needs to stop eating at mcdonalds
Vaalingrade Ashland 03-17-05, 03:53 PM	1) DR 2) Alchemy that classes that would use it could use. 3) Arcane Magic not sucking 4) Being a halfling with weapons. 5) Feinting that worked. 6) high level crit ranges 7) The belief that 3.5 would be a revision.
Lonestar 03-17-05, 04:56 PM	Harm. I miss 3.0 harm with no save. I don't miss my PC getting hit with it, but I most certainly miss casting it.
Lincoln Hills 03-17-05, 06:22 PM	(I've counted the actual "things that I miss" and ignored the... miscellaneous asides.) 37. As a 3.0 diehard, what I miss most is being able to buy a module or Dungeon from a store, pull off the shrink-wrap, read it, and play it. (And don't start, Mr. It's-Easy-To-Convert! I know it's easy, I just wish it wasn't necessary!)
Osiris Memnoch 03-17-05, 09:17 PM	38) Weapon Sizes. I likes my i tiny, small, medium, and large weapons. This light, one handed, and two handed business really screws all you other folks that like to play small characters.
Count Arioch the 28th 03-17-05, 09:30 PM	38) Weapon Sizes. I likes my i tiny, small, medium, and large weapons. This light, one handed, and two handed business really screws all you other folks that like to play small characters. No it doesn't, because in 3.5 small characters can use colossal longbows without penalty. that's a boost. ;) Really, the 3.5 weapon sizes would work just fine if weapons and armor resized like armor used to. the fact that the BBEG is never small and small stuff rarely shows up screws them over.
green_yawgmoth 03-17-05, 11:35 PM	Yeah, what the devil were they thinking with magic items not resizing? To me, that just screams "Don't worry DM, you can give that hill giant gloves of +20 str, and the players can't do squadoo with it because who wants gloves that big that won't resize anyways?" That and "body slot affinity". The way I saw it, as long as the article of clothing was worn, it's touching you, and thus the magic is flowing into you. Maybe my character looks better with glasses on, should I get penalized for having glasses of charisma? I blacked out when I heard that rule from :rolleyes:ing too much. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
RblDiver 03-18-05, 06:50 PM	39. Small flying carpet with 210 speed. I mean, come on, max of 40? :yuck:
twad 03-18-05, 08:11 PM	the prettry picturess that are no longer in the 3.5 books.
TinManFan 03-18-05, 08:19 PM	Useful Persistant Spell. Yeah, 6 f***ing levels. Not happening. More versions of Polymorph that kept trying to fix the thing. An Incantrix that required a little bit of sacrifice to go into. Broken, OH SO BROKEN Psionics
Lord Schpungus 03-18-05, 09:33 PM	(Not things I miss). 1. Horses are 10x10 because in combat, everyone's spinning around, watching their own 6. 2. Persistant spell was Borken at 4 levels. (which is more overpowered than Broken).
Ze_Mighty_Vegetable 03-19-05, 12:38 AM	It was simply called D&D 3rd edition. 3.5 sounds silly. When will we have D&D 4.56 Beta(2nd edition)?
Vaalingrade Ashland 03-22-05, 09:22 PM	- Lidda fails her UMD check.
weasel fierce 03-23-05, 01:34 AM	I like the pictures better..
Dunelord 03-23-05, 03:21 AM	The 15 minuites between people when stopped *****ing about 2nd going away and WOTC telling us their would be a 3.5. Search working on the boards.
Abulafia 03-23-05, 10:34 AM	The Jump rule that multiplied distance by speed ("How far is it to the other side of the chasm? 1000 feet? OK, my monk takes a running start . . ."). Not a good rule, mind you, but an entertaining one. Improved Crit & Keen stacking (why burn a feat? Have the wizard make a Wand of Keen Edge for the party). I let them stack in my 3.5 campaigns. Haste. I use three spells in my 3.5 campaigns to replicate 3.0 Haste: A "lesser" version at 3rd level that grants an extra move action, a "regular" version at 6th level that grants an extra standard action, and a "greater" version at 9th level that grants an extra full-round action. I've been using this setup for over a year now, with about 8-9 different players, and have had no problems. Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus: The Spell Power rules were too lax (an Enchanter 5/Red Wizard 10/Archmage 5 could cast a DC 47 Dominate Monster), but these two feats worked just fine as +2 each. Weapon Master -- should work in 3.5, but WotC claims the Exotic Weapon Master in Complete Warrior is the updated version. Where have you gone, Kensei? Gnome Illusionists. I can't even remember the poor little bugger's name. Nebin? Martial arts feats from Oriental Adventures. The monk got absolutely rogered over the 3.5 updates to Flying Kick and Freezing the Lifeblood (check BAB requirement -- unarmed Fighter gets to this feat before a monk can). Those feats not updated float in limbo.
Santrilla 03-23-05, 10:54 AM	The guy in the purple in Chapter 6 of the PH. Also, dull gray Ioun stones!! Sure, they were pointless, but you could paint them funny colours and scare the bejeysus out of your enemies. :D
lukelightning 03-23-05, 11:41 AM	Nah, you cast continual flame on 'em and have a hands-free light source. The guy in the purple in Chapter 6 of the PH. Also, dull gray Ioun stones!! Sure, they were pointless, but you could paint them funny colours and scare the bejeysus out of your enemies. :D