Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MoltenDm 12-02-07, 09:22 PM	Im playing on Shattered gates of Slaughtergarde and this Cr 8 monster is a challenge to be avoided i think..although the creature is CE and i should be scared of him i cant feel but stupid if i fight against him, i know IT being evil doesnt mean that i should try to kill him in melee but in this case im good AND a follower of Heironeous and my character has like 7 int So.. what should i do? I shouldnt just attack him the way i shouldnt just attack a Red Wyrm dragon right?
Salla 12-02-07, 09:25 PM	I don't think INT 7 is dumb enough to attack something that has you that badly outclassed, no, at least not without a plan or some forethought (buffing, weakening the troll, etc.).
ravenshrike 12-02-07, 09:30 PM	You might actually be able to take it as a Crusader, although it would be close. As long as it doesn't grapple. Except as long as you're not pinned you can move a little bit, so maneuvers and stances still apply. Hmm, I'd go for it, but then I am one for the spectacularly suicidal.
navar100 12-02-07, 09:37 PM	Do you must, must, must fight him? Single-handedly? Let's assume you have to fight him, alone. I don't know the monster statistics. Presuming he doesn't have pounce, never let him get a full attack on you. Let him approach you. If he charges, that's fine. He's -2 AC and easier to hit. After you attack, move away. Take the AoO. You are better off with his two attacks total (his standard attack plus the AoO) against your one maneuver attack than his full attack routine. Your Steely Resolve/Furious Counterstrike will be relatively continually fueled because of this. You want this. Please, please, please tell me you have the Stone Power feat. It's really a must have feat for Crusaders. Furious Counterstrike mitigates the penalty. The troll's -2 to AC because he charged helps even more. Do you have Vital Recovery for a "free potion of Cure Light Wounds"? I hope you have Crusader's Strike. Martial Spirit Stance will help too but not absolutely necessary. The troll's regeneration will be a big pain in the rear. Expect a very long battle; I mean 10-15 or more rounds. You can win; you just have to out last it with Stone Power and Crusader's Strike. Once he's unconscious, burn the body or drown it in acid with whatever fire/acid source you have. If you only need to get it unconcious and then move away very quickly, that's fine. If you have a potion of Enlarge or get the spell cast upon you it would really help.
MoltenDm 12-02-07, 09:48 PM	ok People chances are that you are going to go with its Suicide a mountain troll has like 200 hp, like three attacks like 20 and taks out like 1d8 + 12, now he is blind wich i guess is great Now guys what im really asking is not if i can kill it thats a NO.. what im asking is if i should try it being a Crusader and all, not being aware of its power and if i do how do i kill it (we are like 4 guys a wizard a fighter tripper and a Ranger)
navar100 12-03-07, 12:44 AM	You can do it as a crusader with a party, but your job is not to kill it. Your job is be the meat shield and get everyone else to kill it. Iron Guard Glare stance means the troll has -4 to hit anyone but you when you theraten it. Leading The Attack or Vanguard Strike allow allies to get +4 to hit it, perfect for someone who has Power Attack. Shield Block grants an ally your shield +4 AC. Douse The Flames prevents it from taking AoO for a round so party members can move through its threatened area, cast spells in its threatened area, etc. At 5th level you have access to White Raven Tactics. Use it! Allow the wizard to cast two spells in a round. Allow a dedicated warrior to attack twice in a round. Ranger can go two-weapon machete or tripper fighter can get multiple tries to trip it and attack it while it is prone. You're still attacking the troll. You are still damaging it. You are contributing a great deal. You want the troll to attack you to fuel Furious Counterstrike for the extra plus to hit and damage. The troll ignoring the rest of the party makes their job easier. Use Crusader's Strike and Stone Power feat to keep yourself alive. Vital Recovery feat is helpful but not absolutely necessary. Take Foe Hammer or Mountain Hammer if you want a little more offensive power oomph. I'd go with Mountain Hammer since you can use Stone Power with it.
Guardian1 12-03-07, 01:06 AM	Let's not forget Revitalizing Strike, Defensive Rebuke, and Thicket of Blades. Revitalizing Strike-Succesfull attack heals you for 3d6/+1 for every level of crusader you have. Thicke of Blades-If opponents move away from you, you get attacks of opportunity on them. Defensive Rebuke-If opponents don't attack you, you get an attack of opportunity on them. Once you hit them, they know what will happen if they attack something else, in turn forcing them to focus on you. In WoW terms, this maneuver will allow you to draw aggro. With these maneuvers, as well as the ones mentioned in the previous post, you should stand a chance.
navar100 12-03-07, 08:39 PM	As a 5th level Crusader he won't be able to have all those maneuvers. They're all 3rd level. I chose White Raven Tactics as his 3rd level maneuver because in my opinion it is that good. It's giving another party member 3.0 Haste for one round. A Crusader with that maneuver likes to delay his action. :D
Guardian1 12-03-07, 09:56 PM	Oh yeah, good point. Looks like I need to read that book more myself. If only I had a chance to use it.
MoltenDm 12-03-07, 11:12 PM	Hmm well im already lvl 5 and i cant change stuff because its more useful..i do have Revitilizing Strike and Hammer, crusader's strike and a few others..im though for a 5th lvl character (54Hp by dice rolling) and can usually stand my ground and more..but fellows this is just too much and I think i'll die a horrible death while our wizard flees with Fly and Inv. Im assuming you guys have never fought this Troll and uhm well still the question was if it was ethical to negotiate with the beast or bypass it and later on kill it even thou im a Crusader of Heironeous ..
navar100 12-03-07, 11:57 PM	I was just going by if you had to fight the troll. If you can avoid the combat, all the better. That goes for about almost any encounter. Being a crusader does not mean you must fight every monster you come across, Heironeous or not. Revitalizing Strike will work fine instead of White Raven Tactics. Since trolls do pack a wallop, the greater healing it provides over Crusader's Strike will be quite helpful. Mountain Hammer gets the damage in, especially since you can only make one attack per round anyway at level 5. It's a nice maneuver all its own. Of course, this also assumes the party is fighting along with you. I still think you could win on your own, but it's no guarantee and requires very specific tactics. If the party fights along with you then decides to retreat, you better go with them. By then it would be too late for a one-on-one fight.
MoltenDm 12-04-07, 01:31 AM	Thanks and wish me luck then i'll post the result
MoltenDm 12-11-07, 11:07 PM	Update on the fight Didnt happen i was killed by a random encounter with a Specter and rised as one. I was the only one with a Magic weapon and our wizard suffered 2 lvl losses before he could use a puny spell (2 lvl by then), the specter flew and 80ft and we couldnt run so I stayed and faced him while my friends runned. And so that was it.