A magicless wizard needs help [Archive] - Wizards Community

A magicless wizard needs help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Spankinstein
12-04-04, 11:02 PM In my current campaign, after completing the RttToEE, my party has gotten lost. We appear to be in some strange new land, that's fine, the kicker is that all magic, both arcane and divine, have vanished.

This dose not effect the monk too much, since the DM has ruled that his special powers come from within his spirit, or the fighter and monk/ranger. The druid and cleric are really feeling the sting. But nothing compared to me, a 4 rogue/5 wizard/4 arcane trickster. I've got some skill with the bow and rapier, and some decent sneak attack damage, but my AC and HP are horrible without my magical enhancements.

Our battle strategy usually involved alot of my buffing and combat spells. But am I now regulated to bow use, and hiding and trying to get in position for sneak attacks? I don't know how long this will last without the magic

Any ideas would be appreciated.
JimRuh
12-04-04, 11:12 PM wear armor, carry a crossbow stay out of the fight(hide behind the fighters

Seeing as your more than just a wizard you have a better chance then most.

I'msuprised on the druid, he can argue that his magic comes from nature and nature is still around :)
ThatOneMonk
12-04-04, 11:32 PM I'msuprised on the druid, he can argue that his magic comes from nature and nature is still around

You think so? It's devine so that sounds kinda iffy. Definitly worth the argument though! :D
SD
12-05-04, 03:18 AM No, not really. As I understand it, the world is an antimagic zone or an Outlands-like suppression area. Magic is magic, and the druid's cut off. However, the monks' supernatural abilities, the ranger's spells, and all magic items should be nonfunctional. Otherwise, the issue is not that magic doesn't work (unless your DM is shoddy on the rules for supernatural abilities), but that casting doesn't work.

For the sneak attacks, I suggest waiting until an opponent is flanked or some such before attacking. If that's not working, you can flank an opponent and take the total defense standard action (+4 dodge bonus to AC, +6 if you have 5 ranks in Tumble) to help your allies get that +2. Look into the best suit of armor you can find that doesn't utterly destroy your movement. Try not to make yourself a target, because you'll fall long before anybody else. With lame AC, HP, and BAB, you will not hold up without another party member to stick around with you.
Nom
12-05-04, 06:34 AM First, make sure you DM intends this as a temporary thing. Permanently removing spellcasting from a spellcasting class is a massive nerf. In contrast, playing without magic for a little while might be an entertaining experience.

As to what works, obviously your DM is not treating is as complete magic supression, as otherwise Su abilities (such as the monk's) would also fail. It does strike me as odd that both arcane and divine magics fail, since in theory the power sources are quite different - arcane taps "magic" directly, while divine magic is proxied through the gods or similar. Unless the gods are also deprived of their magic.
Shard of Suzail
12-05-04, 08:58 AM I reckon it is temporary, after all, the poster mentions being lost, so there is a good sense that the party can find their way back again.

They completed the temple of elemental evil, so they`re a tough bunch.

See it as an interesting experience in your adventuring career and an opportunity to pick up some non wizard levels and thus be a more practical animal.
Spankinstein
12-05-04, 09:30 AM Our DM was easy on us on RttToEE, if he played by the books, and had the enemy live up to it's true potential, we would have been toast. We never beat some of the major enemies.

We have had only one gaming session in the null magic zone/continent/world? We discussed it being odd that arcane, divine, and nature magic was deadened. Even our magic items are non-functional. My DM is letting me retain my Impromptu Sneak Attack, but I don't know about my Ranged Legerdomain{SP?}

We have also noticed many symbols of Hextor, on some ogre warriors and a group that appears to be our duplicates, only much darker. We are currently spying on them from afar to try and figure out what is going on.

Keep you posted on what happens, thanks for the responses.
ShadowDragon8685
12-05-04, 09:52 AM Well, your Wizard's up the creek without a paddle.

I SERIOUSLY hope you have major ranks in Knowledge skills, because that may be all that's going to save your butt. Knowledge: Arcana is not just spell theory, it's spell practice - stuff like what stones do what, etcetera. It probably covers enough chemistry that you can (with an alcohol source,) make some impromptu Fireballs, otherwise known as Molotov Cocktails. :)

And the one thing that a Molotov will have a chance to do that a Fireball won't is to cover the target in flaming liquid. Nothing is more fun than watching a brave warrior quit the field screaming so he can stop, drop and roll.

If you get out of this mess, that could even be the basis for a spell for you to research: Magical napalm. Hehehee. Burrrn! BURRRN!

So yeah. If this is a temporary thing, you're good. If this is a permanant thing... Start rolling up a Fighter.
Nom
12-05-04, 05:56 PM We have had only one gaming session in the null magic zone/continent/world? We discussed it being odd that arcane, divine, and nature magic was deadened. Even our magic items are non-functional. My DM is letting me retain my Impromptu Sneak Attack, but I don't know about my Ranged Legerdomain{SP?}If even magic items are deadened, then any Su abilities of the Monk should be too. Su abilities are ki strike, wholeness of body, diamond body, abundant step, quivering palm, and empty body. The other abilities are Ex and are thus not magic-dependent.

Though it seems bizarre to me that diamond body (poison immunity) is Su and diamond soul (spell resistance) is Ex - go figure.

Unfortunately, the prestige class write-up in the DMG for the arcane trickster was not correctly updated, and thus the abilities are not marked Ex/Su/Sp. Sneak attack is obviously Ex (see Rogue). Ranged Legerdomain is Su or Sp, considering the mage hand class requirement. As a DM, I'd treat it as Sp, counterspellable with mage hand, but that's interpretation on my part. Impromptu sneak attack could be Ex or Su; I'd recommend Su, though if your DM has ruled it Ex I wouldn't complain. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Spankinstein 12-04-04, 11:02 PM	In my current campaign, after completing the RttToEE, my party has gotten lost. We appear to be in some strange new land, that's fine, the kicker is that all magic, both arcane and divine, have vanished. This dose not effect the monk too much, since the DM has ruled that his special powers come from within his spirit, or the fighter and monk/ranger. The druid and cleric are really feeling the sting. But nothing compared to me, a 4 rogue/5 wizard/4 arcane trickster. I've got some skill with the bow and rapier, and some decent sneak attack damage, but my AC and HP are horrible without my magical enhancements. Our battle strategy usually involved alot of my buffing and combat spells. But am I now regulated to bow use, and hiding and trying to get in position for sneak attacks? I don't know how long this will last without the magic Any ideas would be appreciated.
JimRuh 12-04-04, 11:12 PM	wear armor, carry a crossbow stay out of the fight(hide behind the fighters Seeing as your more than just a wizard you have a better chance then most. I'msuprised on the druid, he can argue that his magic comes from nature and nature is still around :)
ThatOneMonk 12-04-04, 11:32 PM	I'msuprised on the druid, he can argue that his magic comes from nature and nature is still around You think so? It's devine so that sounds kinda iffy. Definitly worth the argument though! :D
SD 12-05-04, 03:18 AM	No, not really. As I understand it, the world is an antimagic zone or an Outlands-like suppression area. Magic is magic, and the druid's cut off. However, the monks' supernatural abilities, the ranger's spells, and all magic items should be nonfunctional. Otherwise, the issue is not that magic doesn't work (unless your DM is shoddy on the rules for supernatural abilities), but that casting doesn't work. For the sneak attacks, I suggest waiting until an opponent is flanked or some such before attacking. If that's not working, you can flank an opponent and take the total defense standard action (+4 dodge bonus to AC, +6 if you have 5 ranks in Tumble) to help your allies get that +2. Look into the best suit of armor you can find that doesn't utterly destroy your movement. Try not to make yourself a target, because you'll fall long before anybody else. With lame AC, HP, and BAB, you will not hold up without another party member to stick around with you.
Nom 12-05-04, 06:34 AM	First, make sure you DM intends this as a temporary thing. Permanently removing spellcasting from a spellcasting class is a massive nerf. In contrast, playing without magic for a little while might be an entertaining experience. As to what works, obviously your DM is not treating is as complete magic supression, as otherwise Su abilities (such as the monk's) would also fail. It does strike me as odd that both arcane and divine magics fail, since in theory the power sources are quite different - arcane taps "magic" directly, while divine magic is proxied through the gods or similar. Unless the gods are also deprived of their magic.
Shard of Suzail 12-05-04, 08:58 AM	I reckon it is temporary, after all, the poster mentions being lost, so there is a good sense that the party can find their way back again. They completed the temple of elemental evil, so they`re a tough bunch. See it as an interesting experience in your adventuring career and an opportunity to pick up some non wizard levels and thus be a more practical animal.
Spankinstein 12-05-04, 09:30 AM	Our DM was easy on us on RttToEE, if he played by the books, and had the enemy live up to it's true potential, we would have been toast. We never beat some of the major enemies. We have had only one gaming session in the null magic zone/continent/world? We discussed it being odd that arcane, divine, and nature magic was deadened. Even our magic items are non-functional. My DM is letting me retain my Impromptu Sneak Attack, but I don't know about my Ranged Legerdomain{SP?} We have also noticed many symbols of Hextor, on some ogre warriors and a group that appears to be our duplicates, only much darker. We are currently spying on them from afar to try and figure out what is going on. Keep you posted on what happens, thanks for the responses.
ShadowDragon8685 12-05-04, 09:52 AM	Well, your Wizard's up the creek without a paddle. I SERIOUSLY hope you have major ranks in Knowledge skills, because that may be all that's going to save your butt. Knowledge: Arcana is not just spell theory, it's spell practice - stuff like what stones do what, etcetera. It probably covers enough chemistry that you can (with an alcohol source,) make some impromptu Fireballs, otherwise known as Molotov Cocktails. :) And the one thing that a Molotov will have a chance to do that a Fireball won't is to cover the target in flaming liquid. Nothing is more fun than watching a brave warrior quit the field screaming so he can stop, drop and roll. If you get out of this mess, that could even be the basis for a spell for you to research: Magical napalm. Hehehee. Burrrn! BURRRN! So yeah. If this is a temporary thing, you're good. If this is a permanant thing... Start rolling up a Fighter.
Nom 12-05-04, 05:56 PM	We have had only one gaming session in the null magic zone/continent/world? We discussed it being odd that arcane, divine, and nature magic was deadened. Even our magic items are non-functional. My DM is letting me retain my Impromptu Sneak Attack, but I don't know about my Ranged Legerdomain{SP?}If even magic items are deadened, then any Su abilities of the Monk should be too. Su abilities are ki strike, wholeness of body, diamond body, abundant step, quivering palm, and empty body. The other abilities are Ex and are thus not magic-dependent. Though it seems bizarre to me that diamond body (poison immunity) is Su and diamond soul (spell resistance) is Ex - go figure. Unfortunately, the prestige class write-up in the DMG for the arcane trickster was not correctly updated, and thus the abilities are not marked Ex/Su/Sp. Sneak attack is obviously Ex (see Rogue). Ranged Legerdomain is Su or Sp, considering the mage hand class requirement. As a DM, I'd treat it as Sp, counterspellable with mage hand, but that's interpretation on my part. Impromptu sneak attack could be Ex or Su; I'd recommend Su, though if your DM has ruled it Ex I wouldn't complain. :)