Post/Author/DateTime	Post
shogunboy 06-05-07, 11:26 PM	How can you take monster classes, and still come out decent, and maybe even more powerful than your friend's characters?
Thubby 06-05-07, 11:31 PM	ask the char op boards? seriously, +1 or +2 ecl is usualy no big, stick to low ecl and play to the races strength. (1/2 giants with spiked chains ftw)
shogunboy 06-05-07, 11:34 PM	Well, this isn't about oping the character, but more for why do some people take monster classes? My friend told me that a few of his friends can make powerful characters out of monster class levels like hound Archon for example.
Thubby 06-05-07, 11:43 PM	Well, this isn't about oping the character, but more for why do some people take monster classes? My friend told me that a few of his friends can make powerful characters out of monster class levels like hound Archon for example. why? because they like the idea of playing that race, even if it isnt the most powerful. fun> everything else, in dnd. as to hound archon of doom. he iether hasnt seen a truely powerful character, is lying (friend of a friend?), or they know how to optimise, and apply those techniques to monster characters. it might not be more powerful than super druid, but its more powerful than everyone around.
shogunboy 06-05-07, 11:49 PM	Well, my friend has made quite a few powerful characters, but he hasn't ever made a powerful character with only monster class levels.
Drag0nUL 06-06-07, 02:54 AM	Regardless of what character you pick, an LA grater than +2 will bring you down compared to the other non-LA PC's, because of the lack of HD. The not so high LA but high racial HD monsters fare a little better, but not much. They have solved the HP problem a bit, but racial HD still come out worse than class levels(with the exception of outsider HD, which are pretty decent). I have seen/played very powerful monster characters (minotaur barbarian, centaur cavalier, githyanki gish etc.) but they never reached the level of power a comparable character of a standard race could achieve.
danielinthewolvesden 06-06-07, 03:04 AM	Warriors and skill monkeys can afford to take a couple of LA. Here is where spellcasters get hurt- they really can not afford to take any LA at all. But more than LA+2 and you get into the problem of poor HP and worse- low HD vs spells that attack based on HD- Blasphemy for example. No doubt, weird races are fun. For "just" and LA+1 try to max out your primary stat: get a very high plus in str for warriors. For an LA+2, make sure you get an invulnerability or two. I had a ball playing a half-zombie (Dragon mag) fighter in one game.
northern_bear 06-06-07, 07:23 AM	Well, this isn't about oping the character, but more for why do some people take monster classes? My friend told me that a few of his friends can make powerful characters out of monster class levels like hound Archon for example. Define "powerful". A hound archon wizard is going to suck. But hound archons have some extremely useful abilities that are going to make them extremely useful to a party. They probably can't go toe to toe with a fighter of their same level, but they have enough abilities that they are probably a lot more useful to have around than the fighter is. Teleport at will is a huge benefit. Damage reduction 10/evil basically means they are immune to weapon damage from low level enemies. For sheer destructive power, there's nothing better than a full progression spell caster. But depending on the role you want the character to fill in the party, there are many monsters that can fill that role extremely well. You want a sneaky scout? Forget the halfling rogue. Play a pixie. Permanent invisibility. Flight at speed 60 with good maneuverability. +8 Dex bonus. The world sneakiest halfling couldn't out sneak a pixie on the sneakiest day of his life if he had an electrified +5 sneaking machine. Want a pure damage dealing melee combatant? A minotaur can be just as good as a human fighter, maybe better. Need somebody who can stand in the front lines and absorb damage? Pick a monster class with high natural AC and lots of hit points. If you can add in fast healing, great. Regeneration is even better. Why should the wizard bother wasting a fireball, or why should your Barbarian risk taking hit points damage, when the troll in the party can single handedly slay those 30 orcs, and be completely uninjured at the end of the fight. There is no such thing as an all powerful character. There are only characters that are really good in certain situations. Figure out what situation you want the character to be good at. Then find a monster who would be effective in that situation.
smorgasbord_of_pie 06-06-07, 09:26 AM	How can you take monster classes, and still come out decent, and maybe even more powerful than your friend's characters? I think you've got the wrong idea if you are trying to outmatch your friends characters. It looks very obnoxious. (Trust me, there is a person in my group who is like this.)