Post/Author/DateTime	Post
tsuyoshikentsu 01-12-06, 12:10 PM	This quiz uses a little bit less offensive questions then Board Rider's, while still being rather true to his original. Also, it cuts the poor roleplayers who'd rather use Martial weapons over Simple ones some slack. 1. Are you a powergamer? A) I've been called that, sure. B) No, but I sometimes let my self-admitted powergamer friend go over my character sheet. C) Never been called that/Never heard of it. 2. Do you min/max at all when it isn't required? A) Yes. While it may not always be nessecarry, playing ineffective heroes is frustrating. B) A little. You won't see me with five prestige classes, but you won't see me as a Half-Orc Sorcerer either. C) Not really. Generally it just goes as far as picking equipment or spells. 3. When choosing FEATS…. A) If I have the space after prestige class prerequisites and feats that help my build, I'll throw in something oddball. B) Generally effective stuff, but there are definitely more than a few oddballs in there. C) Whatever I feel like having. 4. When choosing skills… A) Prestige class requirements first. Unless my build is focused on a particular skill; then that first. B) I usually max out a few useful skills, but I don't plan from level to level so much. C) Whatever I feel like putting them in. Usually I have a skill maxed, but everything else suits my background or my whimsey. 5. When you place stats... A) I look at the requirements of my prestige classes and feats, ability-dependant abilities, etc. that I have planned, then place accordingly. B) I tend to place them where I think they'll be effective, sometimes putting a good stat somewhere unusual. C) I put them where my background dictates. If my character was sickly child, that 6 goes straight into CON -- even if I'm a Barbarian. 6. The DM says that you can use the 28 point buy system for character creation. You…. A) Say, "Point buy? Woohoo! Now I can DEFINITELY get that 13 in DEX!" B) Shrug your shoulders and give yourself a mostly even spread. C) Think for a moment, then spend points as your background dictates. 7. You're playing a Barbarian, and there are three weapons on the ground. You take the... A) Greatsword. B) Greataxe. C) Greatclub. 8. The Character Optimization Board….. A) Is a great tool, and an effective one as well. B) Is useful, but only if you're really stuck for ideas. C) Is a den of sin, and should be avoided at all costs. 9. Do you multiclass? A) Unless I'm playing an Artificer. B) I tend to pick a class and stick with it. Maybe a prestige class too. C) If it suits my character concept, definitely. ---------- Mostly As: You're an optimizer. You combine prestige classes, feats, and skills to give ou the most effective character for your concept. Your backstory may suffer a bit, but you can usually make that up in-game. Mostly Bs: You tend to sit on the middle of the fence between "roleplay" and "rollplay." While your characters may not be Pun-Pun, they're not entirely RP-based either. Mostly Cs: Your characters always are based on their back story which you may write even before placing stats. Effectiveness be d*mned -- if it doesn't match the character, it's out the window. The upside of this is that your characters tend to be a little easier to roleplay.
Kalai_Eljahn 01-12-06, 01:31 PM	1: I haven't played long enough to be called a powergamer, so C, or maybe B. 2-7: A. Guess I'm an optimizer. 8: Not Applicable 9: What does A mean? (not exceptionally familiar with artificers) As long as I don't get an experience penalty, if it'd be cool roleplaying and abilities, I'd choose to multiclass. I love PrCs. Well, I got a totally different answer than the first quiz (like 1 A). Don't think I don't care for roleplaying, though; like it says, I try and optimize my character concept. I'm really a powergamer of roleplaying...
JungeonJeff 01-13-06, 04:37 AM	1) A Many, many times... (But thats just because Im better at it than the rest of the group ;) ) 2) A You acctually described it perfectly in your answer, I just dont like playing a useless character (or a character that is only good for ONE thing... which I see as falling into the "useless" catagory) 3) A If I have a PrC in mind that I want my char to work towards, sure, Ill choose the feats that will acctually get him there. Even though Weapon Focus might be usefull, it wont get me closser to becomming a Highland Stalker... Plus the fact that most of my groups stories starts us at 2nd-3rd- lvl, and we useally dont get higher than 15 or so, so if you want the whole PrC experience, you cant really wait for another feat to come your way... 4) A -Do I see a pattern here? Same as above, but any excess skill pts will go into skills that compliment the rest of the party... 5) A/B I'm stranded between A and B, as I, as above, WILL meet the Atribute requirements for a given PrC that I want, but I might very well, after those are meet, place an unusual stat (Right now I have a Barbarian with average Wis, good Int, and good Cha, to make an example) 6) B Never did like pts buy, it leaves almost nothing to chance, and I like char's with "build-in" weaknesses. If I roll a 7, it will become a direct roleplaying aspect of my character. 7) B Come on... its a Barbarian, Greataxe all the way! :rolleyes: (Mine uses a Halberd) 8) B "Those people are crazy, you know!" I do like to pop my head in there once a week, but Ive never acctually used anything from it. I have nothing against people in there, bless them, the know how to work game mechanics, but the only way I use it as a tool, is so if one of my players comes to a session with his new "origional build", I'll know what hes up to. "Ladies and gentlemen, we have a tie!" 9) A Gah... yes, Im a power gamer :P I multiclass to get the most out of my characters, and I do feel good when I can stand up to the monsters that the GM throws at me, but I also feel good when I can go through a game session or two without even touching the game mechanics, but intead just talking and eexploring the imaginary world around me :)
Yak of Darkness 01-13-06, 05:06 PM	I can shorten questions 2-5 for you: X. Do you plan on taking a prestige class? A) Yes. Maybe more than one. B) Maybe, if I see something I like. C) Not planning on it, but if it logically flows from my character, I will. Over-simplification? Yeah. But there is kind-of an overemphasis on PrCs here, when they are not even close to the be-all and end-all of "powergaming" or optimization. Some PrCs are stronger than average, some are weaker, and some are in the middle, just like base classes. Not to mention that for some ideas to even be remotely effective in-game, the "multiclassing patch" style of PrC is necessary. Plus, taking a PrC, even if you're just doing it for a nifty (or nifty-sounding) ability isn't anything like optimization, this rule being applicable to any kind of class, feat, spell, or ability. The soulknife's the best example of this I can think of. Awesome-sounding abilities and imagery, but definitely on the low end of the power curve. Plus, if PrCs, then, are not necessarily functions of powergaming, then specifically choosing abilities to meet PrC requirements aren't, either. And since, y'know, prerequisites are . . . well, required prior to entry into a PrC, choosing your abilities, skills, and feats based on what you actually need to get into a desired (for whatever reason) PrC isn't so much powergaming as it is . . . thinking. Plus, a core cleric will give your "powergamers" a run for their money. ;) Not sure what you're trying to say/do with this quiz, but I don't think it's that accurate. (Use of the terms "roleplaying" versus "rollplaying" is also asinine, IMO. But that's really more of a personal peeve of mine. ^_~)
tsuyoshikentsu 01-13-06, 09:48 PM	Hey, no one is disputing the power of a CoD -- least of all me. It's just that generally speaking, prestiege classes are common in optimized builds. Any quiz has to make generalizations. As to what I'm trying to do with this quiz, look at the one Board Rider posted a while ago. While mine may be far from perfect (and I welcome further advice, as long as it's well-thought out and polite) his contains such lovely answers for optimizers as 5. When you roll stats… A) I NEED at least two 18’s. If I don’t I will jot them down anyway. 6. The DM says that you can use the 28 point buy system for character creation. You…. A) “28 point buy system!!! I can’t…” as you continue to gather your stuff and leave.I'm simply trying to create a less blatantly biased quiz. As for role vs. roll, they're generally recognized, if not accepted, terms for the two sides here, and I couldn't think of a better name for RPers that wouldn't automatically imply that optimizers don't. By the way, I fall squarely in the optimization camp. I hold a record on the Char Op boards. :D
Always-Late 01-13-06, 11:34 PM	6 A's, 3 B's. Optimization forever! I'm thinking about a reversely biased quiz. You're a TWF melee-oriented class. Which path would you most likely take? A. A tricked out fighter/dervish who can knock the stuffing out of his ranger counterpart in every way. B. A ranger with the appropriate rangerly feats. C. A commoner who takes feats like "Skill Focus: Basketweaving," but has a wonderful backstory to justify why he uses two weapons. Note: I'm not trying to be serious. Don't take it seriously.
Elven Doritos 01-14-06, 12:00 AM	Somehow, I ended up with Leeroy Jenkins as my answer :confused: Kidding. Landed where I thought I would: Without a single scratch of power-gaming. Just not my thing- I've got nothing against a well-intentioned powergamer.
Gailbraithe 01-14-06, 03:54 AM	1. Are you a powergamer? A) I've been called that, sure. 2. Do you min/max at all when it isn't required? Min/maxing when it isn't required just makes characters look unnatural and ugly. 3. When choosing FEATS…. I always try to throw in some "flavor" feats that help the character stand out and be recognizable, but my first priority is making an effective build that can survive long enough to develop a real character out of. 4. When choosing skills… I usually start with a broad array representing background, and then focus on the skills I find myself using the most often. It really depends on the concept though. 5. When you place stats...[quote] Depends on the concept. [quote]6. The DM says that you can use the 28 point buy system for character creation. You…. D) Find a different game where the DM doesn't use a 28 point buy. 7. You're playing a Barbarian, and there are three weapons on the ground. You take the... D) Closest one. 8. The Character Optimization Board….. ...home to some of the dumbest concepts I've ever seen. 9. Do you multiclass? C) If it suits my character concept, definitely. Very few of my concepts require multiclassing, and I rarely/never use prestige classes except for NPCs. I find the idea of taking multiple PrC utterly stupid. Mostly As: You're an optimizer. You combine prestiege classes, feats, and skills to give ou the most effective character for your concept. Your backstory may suffer a bit, but you can usually make that up in-game. Mostly Bs: You tend to sit on the middle of the fence between "roleplay" and "rollplay." While your characters may not be Pun-Pun, they're not entirely RP-based either. Mostly Cs: Your characters always are based on their back story which you may write even before placing stats. Effectiveness be d*mned -- if it doesn't match the character, it's out the window. The upside of this is that your characters tend to be a little easier to roleplay. I'd say none of these describe me. I design my character via route C - start with concept and backstory, roll up character, then build to match concept. But my starting concepts lead to optimal characters, because when I think "What will I play next?" it's never "Some dweeb who will get eaten alive by the first monster he meets."
tsuyoshikentsu 01-14-06, 03:54 AM	You're a TWF melee-oriented class. Which path would you most likely take? A. A tricked out fighter/dervish who can knock the stuffing out of his ranger counterpart in every way. B. A ranger with the appropriate rangerly feats. C. A commoner who takes feats like "Skill Focus: Basketweaving," but has a wonderful backstory to justify why he uses two weapons. Duh! Basketweaving is the path to ULTIMATE power!
RendakorRahn 05-25-06, 02:59 AM	1.) A, and my DM hates me for it. 2.) A. What do you mean when its not required? I...I do not understand. 3.) A, although I honestly can't remember the last time I've taken a feat that wasn't a PreReq or essential to a build. 4.) B. I generally max out tumble and UMD with every character I run, and throw enough ranks in heal to be able to stabilize on a natural 10. 5.) A. Put all the crap that needs to be 13 for feats at 13, then get primary stats as high as possible. 8 charisma is typical for me. 6.) A. I swear by point buy, but only because I'm godawful at rolling stats. 7.) B. I like critting hard, rather than often (With the exception being a falchion wielding Disciple of Dispater w/Imp. Crit) 8.) A. Home sweet home... 9.) A, unless I'm playing a druid. Good quiz, I liked it.
Shaggy_Shaggs 05-25-06, 03:40 AM	1. A - Maybe not a CO fiend, but I do tend to run circles around the other folks I play with if I set my mind to it. 2. B - Power isn't everything, but I prefer to die in a huge blastmark or crater, and I like to give my enemies the same opportunity. 3. A - Feats are too rare to screw around with for anything but their useful properties. What's unique or flavourful about a mouldering corpse with a halfdozen cute but useless feats? 4. B - I like to be good at what I need, but I'm not playing an inflexible unadaptive robot (unless of course I am, but I haven't yet taken a LN warforged for a spin). 5. B - I've got a goblin scout-archer (ranger/rogue actually, but he identifies himself as a scout and his role in combat is most definitely archer) with Str 11, Dex 20, Con 15, Int 12, Wis 14, Cha 15 in play currently. :smirk: 6. C - I don't much like point buy, but it does at least grant the opportunity to fine-tune character abilities a bit more closely to what I originally envisioned than dice generation does. 7. C - :headexplo "HULK SMASH!!" 8. B - CO's a great place to take problems with a concept that won't quite fit together mechanically, but I could live without it. 9. C - I don't like the idea that each class represents some noble path or ideal that must be followed, and reject any claim that multiclassing is a bad thing or strictly the territory of powergaming. (Most) classes are merely collections of abilities, parts kits I can use to assemble a mechanical package to reflect my character ideas, and keep them alive and free long enough to tell their stories. Mostly Bs: You tend to sit on the middle of the fence between "roleplay" and "rollplay." While your characters may not be Pun-Pun, they're not entirely RP-based either. - Suits me just fine.
hmmmm 05-25-06, 03:14 PM	I got mostly the same answers, first half Cs and second half Bs and number 9 as C.
Board_Rider 05-25-06, 04:28 PM	1. A - I optimize by guaging what the other players do and what is allowed. 2. C - If I have a concept that a DM approves with backstory I will use feats, skills and spells to further enhance my PCs backstory. For example I will have a Dwarven Wizard with Endurance because his backstory notes that while he was always studying he always tried to prove himself to the rest of his warrior based clan. 3. A - Thats if I am going for a prestige class. 4. B - I max out the skills that the PC would most normally use. If, during the campaign, the PC is climbing or swimming alot I will put ranks in that...even if the skill is cross classed. 5. B - I usually try to play a more balanced PC. I would rather have a 16STR/12CHA fighter than a 18STR/8CHA fighter. 6. B - With a 28PB I will go no higher than a 16 with a primary attribute. If the PC is a MAD character I will spread evenly. 7. I do not see where this correlates into anything. If I were a human Barbarian, greatsword. If a half-orc barbarian, greatclub. 8. A - Those guys are extreme and can usually help a player with whatever help they need when dealing with mechanics. I will note however that your option C is no more "fair" an assumption that someone would make than you accuse my quiz as having. 9. C - I will multiclass to get my concept more mechanically sound. I do not get your option A and how it makes you more of an optimizer. The Spellcarved Warforged PrC needs levels in either Artificer/Wizard/Sorcerer to get into that PrC. ------------- A - 3 B - 3 C - 2 N/A - 7 All in all not bad. As noted in the other thread I do not think that my quiz is any more biased than your run of the mill Cosmopolitan quiz that they offer each month. Everybody takes from it what they will but if you take a quiz in fun then that is all it is, fun. There is nothing "unfair" or biased about it. Unless the quiz is part of some sort of data collecting medium or experiment then the results are arbitrary and don't mean anything. Neither do the questions.
tsuyoshikentsu 05-25-06, 10:59 PM	The Explanation of the Barbarian Weapon Question The relevance of this question is that from A to C, the weapons get less optimized. Greatsword does 2-12 and doubles its damage ten percent of the time -- magic number 20. Greataxe does less on average than the greatsword at 1-12, and its magic number is only 15. (5% x 3.) Greatclub, with 1d10 damage and a magic number of 10 (5% x 2 -- the lowest possible in the game) is the worst of the three "Great" weapons -- but it's the most iconic of a barbarian, I've found.
Planar Wanderer 05-26-06, 02:59 AM	I'm not much of a one for the D&D quiz questions that float around every so often, there is one thing I take issue with though: the greatclub being most iconic of a barbarian, remember the class includes several archetypes including but not limited to other concepts such as the Norse berserker in addition to any other type, besides if anything I've always felt that a greataxe or even a longsword (which isn't two handed I know) can be as iconic , in short I really don't think this question really tells much, since the greatclub being most iconic of the barbarian is arguably a flawed premise (I haven't explained this well I know, it makes more sense in my head than it does written down so please do ask me to explain if anythings unclear) remember Krusk the iconic barbarian doesn't carry a greatclub.
Vaelan 05-26-06, 03:21 AM	Greatsword does 2-16 and doubles its damage ten percent of the time -- magic number 20. Greataxe does less on average than the greatsword at 1-12, and its magic number is only 15. (5% x 3.) First of all, I think you meant 2-12 on the Greatsword. Second, you're figuring the "magic number" incorrectly. You're comparing the result of a 19 plus the result of a 20 with a greatsword to the result of a 20 with a greataxe. You should be comparing it to the result of a 19 and a 20 with a greataxe.
tsuyoshikentsu 05-26-06, 03:45 AM	First of all, I think you meant 2-12 on the Greatsword. Second, you're figuring the "magic number" incorrectly. You're comparing the result of a 19 plus the result of a 20 with a greatsword to the result of a 20 with a greataxe. You should be comparing it to the result of a 19 and a 20 with a greataxe.First is fixed; thanks. Second, I think you're right -- but that doesn't change the fact that the greatsword is statistically superior. Even assuming its magic number is the same as the greataxe's (which it'd be by the way you're mentioning) the average damage is better, and it has twice the chance to automatically hit. As for the iconic weapon question, I'm well aware of Nordic barbarians and all. The premise behind this was a new player with no prior knowledge except the stats of the weapons and the idea that barbarians like to bash things. I'll admit, though, that question reflects my personal opinion (ie, what's iconic for a barbarian) the most. The point of that question, though, was to determine whether you'd choose weapons based on stats or RP, without outright asking that, which'd taint the answer. As it is, people sem to be leaning mostly towards B on that answer, which is of course the neutral one.
Yak of Darkness 05-26-06, 03:59 AM	and it has twice the chance to automatically hit.A threat is not an automatic hit. Only a natural 20 is. As for the iconic weapon question, I'm well aware of Nordic barbarians and all. The premise behind this was a new player with no prior knowledge except the stats of the weapons and the idea that barbarians like to bash things. I'll admit, though, that question reflects my personal opinion (ie, what's iconic for a barbarian) the most. The point of that question, though, was to determine whether you'd choose weapons based on stats or RP, without outright asking that, which'd taint the answer. As it is, people sem to be leaning mostly towards B on that answer, which is of course the neutral one.But there's no reason to think (beyond your own assumption) that the greatclub is considered the "iconic" weapon for Hypothetical New Gamer . . . or anyone, really. If I had to come up with an "iconic" barbarian weapon, i'd say a battleaxe or greataxe. My brother thinks it's the greatsword. My girlfriend thinks it should be some kind of greathammer. A friend of mine, when making her first character (not a member of the barbarian class, but certainly one at heart), said to me, without even looking at the book/stats, "Just give me the biggest sword they have." The idea of picking an "iconic" weapon for most classes is entirely a matter of opinion (hell, all three of us see bow use as an iconic image for druids, who don't even get friggin' bow proficiency). The whole idea is based on a flawed premise, even before you take into consideration that there's no way to be sure that someone picking the greatsword over greatclub is picking mechanics over roleplaying. The idea that there's a "better roleplaying" weapon is ridiculous. One is certainly more powerful than the other, but there's absolutely no connection (and certainly not an adversarial one) between mechanical optimization and roleplaying, which makes the whole quiz's premise shaky, at best. Great roleplayers can have greatswords, multiple PrCs*, a min/maxxed stat block, and even levels of cleric. None of it will make them any worse at roleplaying. Crappy roleplayers can pick greatclubs, take nothing but level one in low-BAB classes and try to fight in melee, get Weapon Specialization (net) and Skill Focus (Craft [macaroni and cheese]), and none of it will make them better roleplayers, even if they have a backstory that fits it all in. The two are separate issues. * EDIT: This is based off the sometimes-seen-on-these-boards stereotypical idea that having multiple prestige classes (or any kind of multiclassing, or any prestige class at all) is inherently a powergaming, or even overpowering munchkin move. Its inclusion on the above list is not meant to imply I share that view. ;)
Vaelan 05-26-06, 11:32 PM	Even assuming its magic number is the same as the greataxe's (which it'd be by the way you're mentioning) the average damage is better, and it has twice the chance to automatically hit. The average damage is indeed better. However, a 19 is not an automatic hit even if it is a threat so it only retains the .5 damage advantage.
Pajaul 05-27-06, 05:51 AM	Answers: A, C, C, C, B, B, A, B, C. Sum: As= 2 Bs= 3 Cs= 4 Huh... Well… That is certainly weird. Guess that makes me role..roll.. optimize? I havent even played D&D yet! But I got three characters! (all 1st level) *thumbs up*