An issue on holy ground [Archive] - Wizards Community

An issue on holy ground [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Banning
02-23-05, 10:03 PM In an upcoming adventure of ours theres a problem thats going to occur that my DM hasn't noticed yet. I'm a fighter-esqe character and I'm being teamed up with an arcane caster (not sure who) in order to retrieve an item from a temple of Lolth. Heres the problems first off my character hates the Drow, and every Drow is out for his blood. Secondly due to some restrictions I was given in order to get some reallly nice buffs I cannot willingly or conciously fight on holy ground. Would any of you other players have some advice on accomplishing this mission without fighting? We're level... 25 but witht he templates we have we're effectivly level 30.
Draco Strang
02-24-05, 12:46 AM Seems loopy all around to me, but what about asking the Wizard to cast buffs on you that cause damage if you're touched or attacked?

That, or you could just get buffed into the stratosphere, bring along a load of potions, take total defense, and be a meatwall while your spellcaster does his thing.
Banning
02-24-05, 12:59 AM In theory that works because my AC is in the 50s (loads of dex) However we dont know how big this temple is and the caster im paired with... found out hes a WuJen (OA class). He casts fireball like mad. I won't get buffs. I can go invisible but one true seeing and im kinda dead. I have a rifle with insane range 300 yards. But I doubt I can kill everything as it comes out of the temple easily enough so we dont get attacked.
PhaedrusXY
02-24-05, 01:09 AM Well, a temple of Lolth wouldn't be Holy ground. It would be Unholy ground, if anything. That may sound like splitting hairs, but there is a real difference in D&D. So your restrictions may not apply. Check with your DM. If they do, then how are you going to do anything at all besides stay outside and create a diversion or something?
Bringslite
02-24-05, 01:09 AM Sounds wierd and kinda Uber Munchkin to me but whatever cranks your weekly thrill. I wish you luck. :)
Kulthos
02-24-05, 01:38 AM Holy Ground Highlander! Remember what Ramirez taught you....

BTW, does "Holy ground" count when it is in fact UNholy? Holy and Unholy are not the same in D&D.
Banning
02-24-05, 01:47 AM Holy Ground Highlander! Remember what Ramirez taught you....

BTW, does "Holy ground" count when it is in fact UNholy? Holy and Unholy are not the same in D&D.

BINGO! I am a highlander. We had some things on it tweaked to make it better and lookng up the typed one I have in my DM guide right now "cannot willingly or conciously fight on hallowed or sacred grounds (churches, temples, graveyards, etc.) Churches devoted to evil gods are still considered sacred grounds."

I need a way to get the items without getting into the hallowed grounds so I can fight if it comes near it. I've beenr ecently told that there are ways to obtain them without fighting... but better safe with my two uber rapiers than sorry and running like a ninny in a temple with a hoarde of drow on my tail (literaly I have a tail).

*huge highlander fan* oddly enough until now I didn't realize all the references I've been given from my DM to the Highlaner series. I have seen a Ramirez, and I do believe I have a watcher tailing me.
JadeSpider9643
02-24-05, 02:27 AM your level 25....you probably gots loads of gold....have you concedered....BUYING the item from the temple in exchange for an insanely large donation? (what? they want twice what you have? HORRAY FOR SUBQUESTS!)
Joe Khol
02-24-05, 07:56 AM In an upcoming adventure of ours theres a problem thats going to occur that my DM hasn't noticed yet... due to some restrictions I was given in order to get some reallly nice buffs I cannot willingly or conciously fight on holy ground.

Oh, I bet he has. That'll teach you to go for snaky bonuses in return for what appears to be a minor disadvantage. You've got an Evil DM(tm) and I like him already. :D
BlueFlames
02-24-05, 08:53 AM Have you considered the purchase of siege engines? I'm sure all of the priestesses would be happy to evacuate the temple (right into your rifle's line of fire) if the walls were collapsing around them. Heck, depending on your DM, you might also end up with the "No temple? No problem!" solution to your sacred ground restriction. Of course, I'm not sure how the merchants of the Underdark would react to someone asking for a trebuchet or a couple of ballistas...

Oh... That quest item isn't something fragile by any chance, is it? ;)
Callista
02-24-05, 09:03 AM In an upcoming adventure of ours theres a problem thats going to occur that my DM hasn't noticed yet. I'm a fighter-esqe character and I'm being teamed up with an arcane caster (not sure who) in order to retrieve an item from a temple of Lolth. Heres the problems first off my character hates the Drow, and every Drow is out for his blood.And this is a problem why? I mean... you'll probably be killing Drow, right? And the "every Drow is out for your blood" thing (by the way, what exactly are you wanted for?) can be solved by a Disguise spell plus a mundane disguise.

Secondly due to some restrictions I was given in order to get some reallly nice buffs I cannot willingly or conciously fight on holy ground.There's a difference between "holy" and "unholy"--Lloth's temple would generally be the opposite of holy. Run this by your DM: ask what your character would know. Also: If these are buffs, can you simply forego the buffs this time, and use others? Maybe you're not quite as strong, but a fighter's big strength is his feats anyway...

Would any of you other players have some advice on accomplishing this mission without fighting? Teleport as far in as you can. Use Improved Invisibility and a spell that lets you move fast (in case of True Seeing, which you will likely encounter). Get in, get out, then teleport out. Fast, before people catch up with you.

We're level... 25 but witht he templates we have we're effectivly level 30.Try the Epic board, too, since what you've got are obviously epic characters...
CzarGarrett
02-24-05, 10:23 AM Here's an interesting idea.

See if you can't get some way for your caster friend or some other ally to forcefully teleport some of the temple minions out of the temple. That way you can still fight, and you won't be on sacred ground.
Eagle1993
02-24-05, 11:42 AM First off as a DM I would rule "Unholy" is not "Holy" ground. However you have already touch on that.

So my solution would be... You say you 25+ level, a caster that high, can do a few things:
Improved Inviability, and Silence: Walk in take it.
Ethereal Jaunt or Etherealness: Walk in take it. (May have to cast twice)
Shadow Walk: Walk in take it.
Teleport without Error: Err, Teleport in take it?
Mislead:
Polymorph Any Object: Turn into a Drow, however if you hate them, this might not be fun.

There are others.

Edit for spelling.
Banning
02-24-05, 03:40 PM So my solution would be... You say you 25+ level, a caster that high, can do a few things:
Improved Inviability, and Silence: Walk in take it.
Ethereal Jaunt or Etherealness: Walk in take it. (May have to cast twice)
Shadow Walk: Walk in take it.
Teleport without Error: Err, Teleport in take it?
Mislead:
Polymorph Any Object: Turn into a Drow, however if you hate them, this might not be fun.

There are others.

Edit for spelling.

Well we used to have a monk whod go ethereal nearly everytime... so to counter that I showed my DM a lot of ethereal monsters. I don't think it would be that easy to go in... maybe if we went astral it'd work...
Vatras
02-26-05, 11:32 PM There are very often ways besides the brute force approach.

Use bribes or charm to get someone from inside to steal it for you.
Use Magic Jar to possess someone, who gets near the item and do it yourself.
Use Polymorph to assume a harmless form (worshiper, rat, guard) to get in.
Break in like a thief with stealth.
ShadowDragon8685
02-27-05, 12:25 AM You will not willingly fight on holy ground. You're a Fighter. You have a sucktasto Will save. You have an Arcane spellcaster of some sort. PROBLEM SOLVED. Have him Dominate you, and FORCE you to fight on the holy ground. Even making Will Saves every time you hit someone, you're probably not going to beat his DC. Especially if he nails you with something that sends your Wisdom into the gutter.

But, since he seems to be an uber-sorcerer, well... You may be in trouble. Hire someone to steal it for you.
cymbolik
02-27-05, 03:43 AM Have him Dominate you, and FORCE you to fight on the holy ground.

inspired!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Banning 02-23-05, 10:03 PM	In an upcoming adventure of ours theres a problem thats going to occur that my DM hasn't noticed yet. I'm a fighter-esqe character and I'm being teamed up with an arcane caster (not sure who) in order to retrieve an item from a temple of Lolth. Heres the problems first off my character hates the Drow, and every Drow is out for his blood. Secondly due to some restrictions I was given in order to get some reallly nice buffs I cannot willingly or conciously fight on holy ground. Would any of you other players have some advice on accomplishing this mission without fighting? We're level... 25 but witht he templates we have we're effectivly level 30.
Draco Strang 02-24-05, 12:46 AM	Seems loopy all around to me, but what about asking the Wizard to cast buffs on you that cause damage if you're touched or attacked? That, or you could just get buffed into the stratosphere, bring along a load of potions, take total defense, and be a meatwall while your spellcaster does his thing.
Banning 02-24-05, 12:59 AM	In theory that works because my AC is in the 50s (loads of dex) However we dont know how big this temple is and the caster im paired with... found out hes a WuJen (OA class). He casts fireball like mad. I won't get buffs. I can go invisible but one true seeing and im kinda dead. I have a rifle with insane range 300 yards. But I doubt I can kill everything as it comes out of the temple easily enough so we dont get attacked.
PhaedrusXY 02-24-05, 01:09 AM	Well, a temple of Lolth wouldn't be Holy ground. It would be Unholy ground, if anything. That may sound like splitting hairs, but there is a real difference in D&D. So your restrictions may not apply. Check with your DM. If they do, then how are you going to do anything at all besides stay outside and create a diversion or something?
Bringslite 02-24-05, 01:09 AM	Sounds wierd and kinda Uber Munchkin to me but whatever cranks your weekly thrill. I wish you luck. :)
Kulthos 02-24-05, 01:38 AM	Holy Ground Highlander! Remember what Ramirez taught you.... BTW, does "Holy ground" count when it is in fact UNholy? Holy and Unholy are not the same in D&D.
Banning 02-24-05, 01:47 AM	Holy Ground Highlander! Remember what Ramirez taught you.... BTW, does "Holy ground" count when it is in fact UNholy? Holy and Unholy are not the same in D&D. BINGO! I am a highlander. We had some things on it tweaked to make it better and lookng up the typed one I have in my DM guide right now "cannot willingly or conciously fight on hallowed or sacred grounds (churches, temples, graveyards, etc.) Churches devoted to evil gods are still considered sacred grounds." I need a way to get the items without getting into the hallowed grounds so I can fight if it comes near it. I've beenr ecently told that there are ways to obtain them without fighting... but better safe with my two uber rapiers than sorry and running like a ninny in a temple with a hoarde of drow on my tail (literaly I have a tail). huge highlander fan oddly enough until now I didn't realize all the references I've been given from my DM to the Highlaner series. I have seen a Ramirez, and I do believe I have a watcher tailing me.
JadeSpider9643 02-24-05, 02:27 AM	your level 25....you probably gots loads of gold....have you concedered....BUYING the item from the temple in exchange for an insanely large donation? (what? they want twice what you have? HORRAY FOR SUBQUESTS!)
Joe Khol 02-24-05, 07:56 AM	In an upcoming adventure of ours theres a problem thats going to occur that my DM hasn't noticed yet... due to some restrictions I was given in order to get some reallly nice buffs I cannot willingly or conciously fight on holy ground. Oh, I bet he has. That'll teach you to go for snaky bonuses in return for what appears to be a minor disadvantage. You've got an Evil DM(tm) and I like him already. :D
BlueFlames 02-24-05, 08:53 AM	Have you considered the purchase of siege engines? I'm sure all of the priestesses would be happy to evacuate the temple (right into your rifle's line of fire) if the walls were collapsing around them. Heck, depending on your DM, you might also end up with the "No temple? No problem!" solution to your sacred ground restriction. Of course, I'm not sure how the merchants of the Underdark would react to someone asking for a trebuchet or a couple of ballistas... Oh... That quest item isn't something fragile by any chance, is it? ;)
Callista 02-24-05, 09:03 AM	In an upcoming adventure of ours theres a problem thats going to occur that my DM hasn't noticed yet. I'm a fighter-esqe character and I'm being teamed up with an arcane caster (not sure who) in order to retrieve an item from a temple of Lolth. Heres the problems first off my character hates the Drow, and every Drow is out for his blood.And this is a problem why? I mean... you'll probably be killing Drow, right? And the "every Drow is out for your blood" thing (by the way, what exactly are you wanted for?) can be solved by a Disguise spell plus a mundane disguise. Secondly due to some restrictions I was given in order to get some reallly nice buffs I cannot willingly or conciously fight on holy ground.There's a difference between "holy" and "unholy"--Lloth's temple would generally be the opposite of holy. Run this by your DM: ask what your character would know. Also: If these are buffs, can you simply forego the buffs this time, and use others? Maybe you're not quite as strong, but a fighter's big strength is his feats anyway... Would any of you other players have some advice on accomplishing this mission without fighting? Teleport as far in as you can. Use Improved Invisibility and a spell that lets you move fast (in case of True Seeing, which you will likely encounter). Get in, get out, then teleport out. Fast, before people catch up with you. We're level... 25 but witht he templates we have we're effectivly level 30.Try the Epic board, too, since what you've got are obviously epic characters...
CzarGarrett 02-24-05, 10:23 AM	Here's an interesting idea. See if you can't get some way for your caster friend or some other ally to forcefully teleport some of the temple minions out of the temple. That way you can still fight, and you won't be on sacred ground.
Eagle1993 02-24-05, 11:42 AM	First off as a DM I would rule "Unholy" is not "Holy" ground. However you have already touch on that. So my solution would be... You say you 25+ level, a caster that high, can do a few things: Improved Inviability, and Silence: Walk in take it. Ethereal Jaunt or Etherealness: Walk in take it. (May have to cast twice) Shadow Walk: Walk in take it. Teleport without Error: Err, Teleport in take it? Mislead: Polymorph Any Object: Turn into a Drow, however if you hate them, this might not be fun. There are others. Edit for spelling.
Banning 02-24-05, 03:40 PM	So my solution would be... You say you 25+ level, a caster that high, can do a few things: Improved Inviability, and Silence: Walk in take it. Ethereal Jaunt or Etherealness: Walk in take it. (May have to cast twice) Shadow Walk: Walk in take it. Teleport without Error: Err, Teleport in take it? Mislead: Polymorph Any Object: Turn into a Drow, however if you hate them, this might not be fun. There are others. Edit for spelling. Well we used to have a monk whod go ethereal nearly everytime... so to counter that I showed my DM a lot of ethereal monsters. I don't think it would be that easy to go in... maybe if we went astral it'd work...
Vatras 02-26-05, 11:32 PM	There are very often ways besides the brute force approach. Use bribes or charm to get someone from inside to steal it for you. Use Magic Jar to possess someone, who gets near the item and do it yourself. Use Polymorph to assume a harmless form (worshiper, rat, guard) to get in. Break in like a thief with stealth.
ShadowDragon8685 02-27-05, 12:25 AM	You will not willingly fight on holy ground. You're a Fighter. You have a sucktasto Will save. You have an Arcane spellcaster of some sort. PROBLEM SOLVED. Have him Dominate you, and FORCE you to fight on the holy ground. Even making Will Saves every time you hit someone, you're probably not going to beat his DC. Especially if he nails you with something that sends your Wisdom into the gutter. But, since he seems to be an uber-sorcerer, well... You may be in trouble. Hire someone to steal it for you.
cymbolik 02-27-05, 03:43 AM	Have him Dominate you, and FORCE you to fight on the holy ground. inspired!