Animal Companion Level-up questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Animal Companion Level-up questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Da'Newf
04-21-05, 10:13 PM Hoping someone can shed some light on level advancement for animal companions. My ranger just got level 6, so I need to update the animal companion - in this case, a riding dog. When I originally created the animal companion sheet, I just used the base stats from the monster manual, with the minor modifications according to the PHB.

I still haven't quite figured out how the saves work. The PHB appears to contradict itself - that or I'm just not understanding it. It says the animal companion is superior to normal animals. And then it says to treat the companion as a character of the same level. Hence the confusion. Do I add the level 3 saves (and of which class) to the monster manual stats? That would agree with the "superior" statement. Or do I use only the saves of a 3rd level character, which would contradict that statement.

Also, with regards to the feats - can I pick something from the PHB (within reason of course) or do I go with the options in the MM (chapter 6)?

Any advice/tips/tricks would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Nom
04-21-05, 11:18 PM Summary of how to do it for a druid. For ranger, do it the same way but treat "class level" as half that of a druid. From PH pg 36...

Class level 1-2:

Take stock animal from MM. Animal gains 1 bonus trick, and the link and share spells special abilities.

Class level 3-5:

Animal gains 2 HD (d8s), +2 improvement to natural armour, +1 to Str and Dex, another bonus trick, and evasion.

I assume that what you are really asking is "what is the effect of adding those HD?".

Although it may appear confusing, it's not really. Although the animal is treated as a "magical beast" for effects based on type, it still uses the animal progression. Animals have d8 HD, good Fort and Ref saves, and a 3/4 BAB progression ("same as that of a druid"). When gaining animal companion HD, the animal gains hit points, BAB + saves, feats, and skills normally. Other effects (such as size increases or ability score increases) do not apply.

Consider a wolf. Its two levels of 'animal' provide the following: HD 2d8, BAB +1, base saves F+3/R+3/W+1, 5 skill points (low Int), 1 feat. The skill points are spent on Listen (2), Move Silently (1), and Spot (2), while the feat provides Weapon Focus (bite).

The wolf also has wolf ability scores, racial abilities (eg Track, Trip special attack, low-light vision, +2 natural armour) and the extra trick, link and share spells abilities from being an animal companion.

Now, our wolf companion improves, gaining +2 (animal companion) HD to reach 4d8. BAB improves to +3 (same as a 4th level druid, or see PH pg 22) and base saves improve to F+4/R+4/W+1 (see PH pg 22). The wolf gains 2 skill points to distribute (1 each for 3 and 4 HD), and gains a feat (for 3 HD).

A normal character would also gain an ability score increase from HD, but the wolf does not, instead gaining +1 Dex and +1 Str. It also gains +2 (more) natural armour (total +4), Evasion, and a bonus trick.

Does that make more sense?
Da'Newf
04-24-05, 12:24 AM Makes some sense, but still a bit confused on the saves. The book says the animal companion has good fort and ref saves, with no mention of specific character class to use. This kind of conflicts with using a druid for the saves, since the druid's ref saves are considerably lower with the will saves being the higher. Guess that's the part that has me confused the most on that, and from some of the other posts I found on this and other forums, that seems to be the issue for the most part.

As far as HD go, its just the d8 + con bonus? Or is it d8+2 (half of the 2d8+4 listed in monster manual) + con bonus?

Skill points, bab, feats, etc - if I'm understanding correctly, the animal companion is supposed to get starting skill points, etc, the same as a normal character? And the same applies when advancing levels?

Been playing 3.5 rules since October... still trying to adjust to them. Last time playing before then was AD&D.

Thanks for the help.
Borris
04-24-05, 12:31 AM Use the ranger's table. It has good fortitude and reflex saves, and a poor will save, just like an animal.

Dire animals, however, are an exception as they have three good saves. Use the monk's table for them.
Nom
04-24-05, 02:11 AM Makes some sense, but still a bit confused on the saves. The book says the animal companion has good fort and ref saves, with no mention of specific character class to use.You don't need a specific class - just cross reference level (or HD) on the table on pg 22. Use the "Good" column for Fort and Ref and the "Poor" column for Will.
As far as HD go, its just the d8 + con bonus? Or is it d8+2 (half of the 2d8+4 listed in monster manual) + con bonus?d8 + con bonus. The +2 in the MM is from the wolf's Con 15.
Skill points, bab, feats, etc - if I'm understanding correctly, the animal companion is supposed to get starting skill points, etc, the same as a normal character? And the same applies when advancing levels?Skills, BAB, feats, saves - yes. These are already included on the animal's starting profile (as I showed above), and increase just as for a character. What animal companions don't get is the ability score increase - they get the listed Str & Dex bonuses instead.
Da'Newf
04-24-05, 02:56 PM Nom - thanks for the info. You've clarified my questions regarding the saves - the part about switching the "poor" columns makes the whole thing make sense now.

That's what I figured with respects to the hit points. Just wanted to make sure. The ability score increases make sense as well. An animal, even modern animals, get stronger, but not more intelligent or wise.

Thanks again for clearing all this up.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Da'Newf 04-21-05, 10:13 PM	Hoping someone can shed some light on level advancement for animal companions. My ranger just got level 6, so I need to update the animal companion - in this case, a riding dog. When I originally created the animal companion sheet, I just used the base stats from the monster manual, with the minor modifications according to the PHB. I still haven't quite figured out how the saves work. The PHB appears to contradict itself - that or I'm just not understanding it. It says the animal companion is superior to normal animals. And then it says to treat the companion as a character of the same level. Hence the confusion. Do I add the level 3 saves (and of which class) to the monster manual stats? That would agree with the "superior" statement. Or do I use only the saves of a 3rd level character, which would contradict that statement. Also, with regards to the feats - can I pick something from the PHB (within reason of course) or do I go with the options in the MM (chapter 6)? Any advice/tips/tricks would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Nom 04-21-05, 11:18 PM	Summary of how to do it for a druid. For ranger, do it the same way but treat "class level" as half that of a druid. From PH pg 36... Class level 1-2: Take stock animal from MM. Animal gains 1 bonus trick, and the link and share spells special abilities. Class level 3-5: Animal gains 2 HD (d8s), +2 improvement to natural armour, +1 to Str and Dex, another bonus trick, and evasion. I assume that what you are really asking is "what is the effect of adding those HD?". Although it may appear confusing, it's not really. Although the animal is treated as a "magical beast" for effects based on type, it still uses the animal progression. Animals have d8 HD, good Fort and Ref saves, and a 3/4 BAB progression ("same as that of a druid"). When gaining animal companion HD, the animal gains hit points, BAB + saves, feats, and skills normally. Other effects (such as size increases or ability score increases) do not apply. Consider a wolf. Its two levels of 'animal' provide the following: HD 2d8, BAB +1, base saves F+3/R+3/W+1, 5 skill points (low Int), 1 feat. The skill points are spent on Listen (2), Move Silently (1), and Spot (2), while the feat provides Weapon Focus (bite). The wolf also has wolf ability scores, racial abilities (eg Track, Trip special attack, low-light vision, +2 natural armour) and the extra trick, link and share spells abilities from being an animal companion. Now, our wolf companion improves, gaining +2 (animal companion) HD to reach 4d8. BAB improves to +3 (same as a 4th level druid, or see PH pg 22) and base saves improve to F+4/R+4/W+1 (see PH pg 22). The wolf gains 2 skill points to distribute (1 each for 3 and 4 HD), and gains a feat (for 3 HD). A normal character would also gain an ability score increase from HD, but the wolf does not, instead gaining +1 Dex and +1 Str. It also gains +2 (more) natural armour (total +4), Evasion, and a bonus trick. Does that make more sense?
Da'Newf 04-24-05, 12:24 AM	Makes some sense, but still a bit confused on the saves. The book says the animal companion has good fort and ref saves, with no mention of specific character class to use. This kind of conflicts with using a druid for the saves, since the druid's ref saves are considerably lower with the will saves being the higher. Guess that's the part that has me confused the most on that, and from some of the other posts I found on this and other forums, that seems to be the issue for the most part. As far as HD go, its just the d8 + con bonus? Or is it d8+2 (half of the 2d8+4 listed in monster manual) + con bonus? Skill points, bab, feats, etc - if I'm understanding correctly, the animal companion is supposed to get starting skill points, etc, the same as a normal character? And the same applies when advancing levels? Been playing 3.5 rules since October... still trying to adjust to them. Last time playing before then was AD&D. Thanks for the help.
Borris 04-24-05, 12:31 AM	Use the ranger's table. It has good fortitude and reflex saves, and a poor will save, just like an animal. Dire animals, however, are an exception as they have three good saves. Use the monk's table for them.
Nom 04-24-05, 02:11 AM	Makes some sense, but still a bit confused on the saves. The book says the animal companion has good fort and ref saves, with no mention of specific character class to use.You don't need a specific class - just cross reference level (or HD) on the table on pg 22. Use the "Good" column for Fort and Ref and the "Poor" column for Will. As far as HD go, its just the d8 + con bonus? Or is it d8+2 (half of the 2d8+4 listed in monster manual) + con bonus?d8 + con bonus. The +2 in the MM is from the wolf's Con 15. Skill points, bab, feats, etc - if I'm understanding correctly, the animal companion is supposed to get starting skill points, etc, the same as a normal character? And the same applies when advancing levels?Skills, BAB, feats, saves - yes. These are already included on the animal's starting profile (as I showed above), and increase just as for a character. What animal companions don't get is the ability score increase - they get the listed Str & Dex bonuses instead.
Da'Newf 04-24-05, 02:56 PM	Nom - thanks for the info. You've clarified my questions regarding the saves - the part about switching the "poor" columns makes the whole thing make sense now. That's what I figured with respects to the hit points. Just wanted to make sure. The ability score increases make sense as well. An animal, even modern animals, get stronger, but not more intelligent or wise. Thanks again for clearing all this up.