Applying templates? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Applying templates? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
JarathWulfenstein
01-05-06, 02:37 PM hey, im planning on creating an Aasimar or a Tiefling character that is also a Half-Celestial or a Half-Fiend

problem is...i dont exactly know how to apply the templates.

namely, im not sure exactly how the level progression works. such as, can an Aasimar start as a First Level Half-Celestial with an ECL of 2 and then gain levels as a Half-Celestial just by leveling up, essentially being a 3rd Level Half-Celestial by level 3, counting as ECL of 4? as such he would learn both Cure Serious Wounds and Neutralize poison once he reaches ECL 5, correct? or would he need a character level of 5 and end up being ECL 6? and then theres the matter of, once he reaches a character level of 5, would his CR go up to 2 as the template says and be ECL 7 rather than ECL 6?....or is there a completely different system and im getting this all wrong?

please offer some help, cause the rest makes sense. its just getting through the stages that's confusing.
Tempest Stormwind
01-05-06, 02:58 PM Without using Savage Progressions (an article on the WotC website that turns templates into level-by-level progressions), templates are lump sums. You create your critter, then apply the template, then table them in the game.

An aasimar has a level adjustment of +1. Half-Celestials have a further +4.

You could start as a first-level aasimar half-celestial character (Paladin, say) and he would be an ECL 6 character (1 hit die + 5 level adjustment), meaning he's fit to play in a sixth-level game.

Ditto in reverse for the tiefling/half-fiend.

Note that you're a bit confused on ECL and Character Level.
TheChilliGod
01-05-06, 05:45 PM The thing with the spell-like abilities that you gain as you increase in hit dice, it does not necessarily have to be hit dice in Half-Celestial (And half-celestial hit dice don't exist). It could be hit dice in Rogue, or Fighter, or a monster (Assuming you have the book Savage Species). So, if you have 5 class levels in rogue, you have 5 hit dice, and count as having five hit dice for the purpose of getting spell-like abilities from the half-celestial template.

Same thing for half-fiend tiefling.
JarathWulfenstein
01-05-06, 06:55 PM okay, thanks. makes more sense.

now a question for Tempest Stormwind (or anyone else who knows...): could i get some clarification on ECL, Character Level, and CR? i think i understand mostly, but, apparantly, i am a bit confused (i thought i got it for the most part before...), so might someone lay it out for me right here?
Tempest Stormwind
01-05-06, 07:24 PM okay, thanks. makes more sense.

now a question for Tempest Stormwind (or anyone else who knows...): could i get some clarification on ECL, Character Level, and CR? i think i understand mostly, but, apparantly, i am a bit confused (i thought i got it for the most part before...), so might someone lay it out for me right here?
There's an FAQ question on it, but here's my summary.

ECL = Equivalent Character Level. For most things this is what you'll use. It consists of hit dice (from classes or from a race) and your level adjustment, if any.

Character Level: The sum of all your class levels.

CR = Challenge Rating: A team of four PCs of THIS level should be able to overcome you using approximately 1/5 of their daily resources. (Thus, four encoutnters of a Challenge Rating equal to the party's average level is the standard benchmark for a D&D day).

There's also Class Level (your level in a specific class) and Racial Hit Dice (for instance, the Thri-Kreen starts with 2 "levels" in monstrous humanoid, which is shorthand for 2 racial hit dice), and Level Adjustment (which only raises your ECL).

Hopefully that sums it up, and the FAQ will also clear a few things up. (Note that the FAQ has been HORRIBLY wrong in the past, and still is over templates and polymorph.)
Nom
01-06-06, 01:04 AM Firstly, the concept of a Half-Celestial with traces of celestial blood strikes me as, well, redundant.

Adding to Tempest's post:

Feats, ability score improvements, hit points, and the like are based on your character level or hit dice (they're interchangeable terms). You have 1 hit die for each class level or racial hit die. This is your "real" level.

For the purposes of game balance, some creatures are handicapped with virtual levels. When figuring anything to do with XP or game balance, this value, the Effective Character Level (or ECL) is used instead. The handicap itself is called a Level Adjustment (or LA).

A creature's ECL = HD + LA.

When considering XP awards, XP totals or levelling, it's often convenient to think of LA as multiclass levels that don't actually do anything. A 4th level fighter human has from 6000 to 9999 XP, and will gain 5th level when his XP total reaches 10,000 XP. A 3rd level fighter Aasimar has a LA +1 so is actually ECL 4 (Ftr3/LA 1). He has from 6000 to 9999 XP, and will gain ECL 5 when his XP total reaches 10,000 XP. In each case, the character adds a level / hit die when its ECL increases from 4 to 5 (eg Human Ftr4/Rog1 or Aasimar Ftr3/Pal1/LA 1).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
JarathWulfenstein 01-05-06, 02:37 PM	hey, im planning on creating an Aasimar or a Tiefling character that is also a Half-Celestial or a Half-Fiend problem is...i dont exactly know how to apply the templates. namely, im not sure exactly how the level progression works. such as, can an Aasimar start as a First Level Half-Celestial with an ECL of 2 and then gain levels as a Half-Celestial just by leveling up, essentially being a 3rd Level Half-Celestial by level 3, counting as ECL of 4? as such he would learn both Cure Serious Wounds and Neutralize poison once he reaches ECL 5, correct? or would he need a character level of 5 and end up being ECL 6? and then theres the matter of, once he reaches a character level of 5, would his CR go up to 2 as the template says and be ECL 7 rather than ECL 6?....or is there a completely different system and im getting this all wrong? please offer some help, cause the rest makes sense. its just getting through the stages that's confusing.
Tempest Stormwind 01-05-06, 02:58 PM	Without using Savage Progressions (an article on the WotC website that turns templates into level-by-level progressions), templates are lump sums. You create your critter, then apply the template, then table them in the game. An aasimar has a level adjustment of +1. Half-Celestials have a further +4. You could start as a first-level aasimar half-celestial character (Paladin, say) and he would be an ECL 6 character (1 hit die + 5 level adjustment), meaning he's fit to play in a sixth-level game. Ditto in reverse for the tiefling/half-fiend. Note that you're a bit confused on ECL and Character Level.
TheChilliGod 01-05-06, 05:45 PM	The thing with the spell-like abilities that you gain as you increase in hit dice, it does not necessarily have to be hit dice in Half-Celestial (And half-celestial hit dice don't exist). It could be hit dice in Rogue, or Fighter, or a monster (Assuming you have the book Savage Species). So, if you have 5 class levels in rogue, you have 5 hit dice, and count as having five hit dice for the purpose of getting spell-like abilities from the half-celestial template. Same thing for half-fiend tiefling.
JarathWulfenstein 01-05-06, 06:55 PM	okay, thanks. makes more sense. now a question for Tempest Stormwind (or anyone else who knows...): could i get some clarification on ECL, Character Level, and CR? i think i understand mostly, but, apparantly, i am a bit confused (i thought i got it for the most part before...), so might someone lay it out for me right here?
Tempest Stormwind 01-05-06, 07:24 PM	okay, thanks. makes more sense. now a question for Tempest Stormwind (or anyone else who knows...): could i get some clarification on ECL, Character Level, and CR? i think i understand mostly, but, apparantly, i am a bit confused (i thought i got it for the most part before...), so might someone lay it out for me right here? There's an FAQ question on it, but here's my summary. ECL = Equivalent Character Level. For most things this is what you'll use. It consists of hit dice (from classes or from a race) and your level adjustment, if any. Character Level: The sum of all your class levels. CR = Challenge Rating: A team of four PCs of THIS level should be able to overcome you using approximately 1/5 of their daily resources. (Thus, four encoutnters of a Challenge Rating equal to the party's average level is the standard benchmark for a D&D day). There's also Class Level (your level in a specific class) and Racial Hit Dice (for instance, the Thri-Kreen starts with 2 "levels" in monstrous humanoid, which is shorthand for 2 racial hit dice), and Level Adjustment (which only raises your ECL). Hopefully that sums it up, and the FAQ will also clear a few things up. (Note that the FAQ has been HORRIBLY wrong in the past, and still is over templates and polymorph.)
Nom 01-06-06, 01:04 AM	Firstly, the concept of a Half-Celestial with traces of celestial blood strikes me as, well, redundant. Adding to Tempest's post: Feats, ability score improvements, hit points, and the like are based on your character level or hit dice (they're interchangeable terms). You have 1 hit die for each class level or racial hit die. This is your "real" level. For the purposes of game balance, some creatures are handicapped with virtual levels. When figuring anything to do with XP or game balance, this value, the Effective Character Level (or ECL) is used instead. The handicap itself is called a Level Adjustment (or LA). A creature's ECL = HD + LA. When considering XP awards, XP totals or levelling, it's often convenient to think of LA as multiclass levels that don't actually do anything. A 4th level fighter human has from 6000 to 9999 XP, and will gain 5th level when his XP total reaches 10,000 XP. A 3rd level fighter Aasimar has a LA +1 so is actually ECL 4 (Ftr3/LA 1). He has from 6000 to 9999 XP, and will gain ECL 5 when his XP total reaches 10,000 XP. In each case, the character adds a level / hit die when its ECL increases from 4 to 5 (eg Human Ftr4/Rog1 or Aasimar Ftr3/Pal1/LA 1).