Astral Deva corrections. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Astral Deva corrections. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
savagelink1
12-22-03, 02:07 AM Hello everyone. Yes I am new here but I've been playing the D&D 3.0 since it came out and 3.5 as soon as that came out as well. Yes, I play a level 16 astral deva and before you cry out cheese let me summerize our party and what my situation is.

We have a
level 19 cleric
level 19 cleric/fighter
level 18 deepwood sniper/thief
level 18 thief/arcane trickster/sunmage

and myself. Now damage is not an issue here... the problems I need to come up with is survivability. As you can see by the list that I have given we have some decent damage dealers but no really front line fighters, and i thought that being an astral deva with a high AC that i could be a decent frontline fighter... but we seem to be fighting creatures with attack bonuses higher than my AC so i've been lasting about a round before i have to retreat. Also with spells, every spell caster has been able to penetrate my spell resistance with no problems at all so i'm getting hit by every spell and getting hit by every attack. Grappling is just the uber suckiness for deva's as well. I enjoy the game i'm in but what are some ways to survive longer?

Level 16 Astral Deva
HP: 130
AC: 36

Str: 32
Con: 28
Dex: 24
Wis: 22
Int: 19
Cha: 26

Fort/Will/Ref: 20/19/18
wdarkk
12-22-03, 02:34 AM What exactly is a sunmage?

Anyway, I presume you're using the Savage Species monster class.

First off, are you wearing armor? By my calculations your base AC should be 30. If you are wearing armor, get _better_ armor. You're approaching the point where you can afford +5 armor, or +8 bracers of armor.

Also, have you considered a shield? An animated shield would be useful if you rely on using your off-hand. Or even a Brooch of Shielding.

Finally, as for spells, consider a ring of evasion and some save-boosting items/feats.
savagelink1
12-22-03, 02:02 PM Defensive items I have already

+4 bracers of moderate fortification
+5 Cloak of resistance
+2 items to all stats (except int)
+1 ring of protection
Ioun stone (+1 insight bonus)

We are in a primarily undead campaign so a shield is great against night walkers and night crawlers, but I'll probably look into more of a luck or insight bonus to AC. I also think I may get an item that casts divine power 1/day or 2/day to help against grappling.

I am not a DM so I don't know what else there is for protection against undead so anything else would help out.
Dalaeck
12-22-03, 02:15 PM I personally don't know why anyone whould want to play an angel but that's likely because I'm an old fashioned wizard...

A "standard" 19th level fighter has the following:
Dwarven full plate +5 (+16 AC = base 8 + 5 enhancement + 3 dex)
Animated tower shield +5 (+9 AC = base 4 + 5 enhancement)
Ring of protection +5 (+5 deflection)
Amulet of natural armor +5 (+5 natural armor)
Ioun stone (+1 insight bonus)
With additionally,
dodge feat +1 (dodge bonuses stack)
expertise feat +1 to +5

So base AC of 46 and potentially AC 52 all told.

You can dual weild defending weapons for an additional +1-10 AC but usually expertise is more than enough to send most monsters packing.

Incidentally if you are playing broken 3.5 then you should definitely get a ring of freedom of mouvement - it makes you immune to all grappling. :rolleyes:

I don't know? Get better gear or drop the silly angel schtick?
Rudigrrr
12-22-03, 03:21 PM You are a 16th level what??? 16th level fighter astral deva?? by my calculations your character level is actually 36 if I understand you correctly, which should mean you should be able to destroy everything in your path, level adjustment 8 + plus hit dice 12 + 16 levels = 36

so unless i'm not understanding you, you should be more than overpowered.....

and how do you only have 130 hp??? the base for a standard astral deva is 102.... if you have 16 character levels on top of that you should have an insane amount of hp...

not too mention your base ac with nothing on is 32, you are a powerhouse my friend and im not sure why your DM allowed your character at all... but once again, maybe i just dont understand your explanation, because you should be having no problems
wdarkk
12-22-03, 04:34 PM He's using a "monster class". He's a 16th level Astral Deva. He has 10-11 HD or so.

Yeah, despite Dalaeck's problems with certain equipment, he's got the right idea.
Dalaeck
12-22-03, 07:21 PM Also 19th level and 130 HP means you are going to die in the front lines... a lot. A 19th level fighter has base 10 + 18x5.5 = 109 hp on average just from his class. With even a 12 con he'll have as many hp as you. However his con is likely on the order of 22, so 223 hp on average.
wdarkk
12-22-03, 07:35 PM He's sixteenth level.
Dalaeck
12-23-03, 01:48 AM Yeah but his allies are 18-19. I don't care what the "ECL" is on this thing it's normal he's getting his ass handed to him every fight. He can't hope to be anywhere near as effective as a plain fighter as it stands in the front lines. He should ask to roll up a human fighter. With 19 feats and some decent gear you're doing much much better in the desired role.

I mean seriously, if you're a front lines guy and at this level things can hope to hit you on anything but a 20 then you're doing something wrong. A standard fighter of this level should stand in front of a balor and the blows should glance right off.
Dartanel
12-23-03, 06:50 AM Yeah, his main problem is that he's three levels behind the party. But also he's thinking that he's playing a combat character.

You're not anymore. In the first couple levels, and Astral Deva makes a competent archer, but once the lack of HD starts to kick in along with the spell-like abilities, your character transforms into a wizard, and should be approached as such.

Stand out of range and use your spell-like abilities to their fullest.
savagelink1
12-26-03, 12:45 AM I think i'm gonna go with perhaps a couple items that give luck and insight bonus to AC as well as a +5 animated mithril shield. Also the same for resistances, get some luck and insight bonuses to resistances too as well as a ring of evasion. What do you guys think about an item that gives Righteous Might 1/day. I have combat reflexes but that would help the 5 foot gap in making grapple checks because of the increase size.
wdarkk
12-26-03, 01:18 AM Well, since you should be Large by now, you could take Improved Trip and/or Large and In Charge.

Do you have an item that grants a +6 Enhancement bonus to Con yet? You should be able to afford one.

Do you have an item that grants a +6 Enhancement bonus to Str yet? You should be able to afford one.

Oh, and consider a good Composite Longbow.
savagelink1
12-26-03, 08:00 PM no, i'm not large yet... i won't hit large size until 19 HD, or level 27
GoodTeletubby
12-26-03, 09:59 PM while you're at it, make use of holy aura

+4 to AC is nothing to scoff at, and +4 to saves is really good too
Tejina Kiko
12-26-03, 10:45 PM Good items, yes. But also, fragility is a price of the character. as an astral deva you have 12d8 by level 20, a fighter has 20d10. Clearly, you are not a combat character. You may hit something with a sword occasionally, darting into and out of combat. I hope you took flyby attack. That, a high fly speed, and spell-likes and weapons should let you attack and stay alive.

Also, why are you three levels lower? 1-2 is easy to cope with, but more is very tricky. And as such a fragile character already, you need the levels. IIRC, a level 16 deva has 10HD? that puts you 9 behind the other players, and that is really bad.

Suggest that your DM use the EXP award method from FRCS. That will let you catch up.
Deep Blue 9000
12-26-03, 10:46 PM I think the most important thing for you to do is to increase your AC. Monster Characters don't have the hp of normal races but their high natural armor bonus can make up for it, keeping them in the fight.

You might want to pick up light armor proficiency so you can wear some real armor. Also, an amulet of natural would probably be better than a + Con amulet because you have so few hit die.

Your saves are good and SR 26 is better than no SR so you should be ok versus spells. If some undead tries to grapple you, just hit him with heal, that should make short work of him. Or polymorph self into something big and strong.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
savagelink1 12-22-03, 02:07 AM	Hello everyone. Yes I am new here but I've been playing the D&D 3.0 since it came out and 3.5 as soon as that came out as well. Yes, I play a level 16 astral deva and before you cry out cheese let me summerize our party and what my situation is. We have a level 19 cleric level 19 cleric/fighter level 18 deepwood sniper/thief level 18 thief/arcane trickster/sunmage and myself. Now damage is not an issue here... the problems I need to come up with is survivability. As you can see by the list that I have given we have some decent damage dealers but no really front line fighters, and i thought that being an astral deva with a high AC that i could be a decent frontline fighter... but we seem to be fighting creatures with attack bonuses higher than my AC so i've been lasting about a round before i have to retreat. Also with spells, every spell caster has been able to penetrate my spell resistance with no problems at all so i'm getting hit by every spell and getting hit by every attack. Grappling is just the uber suckiness for deva's as well. I enjoy the game i'm in but what are some ways to survive longer? Level 16 Astral Deva HP: 130 AC: 36 Str: 32 Con: 28 Dex: 24 Wis: 22 Int: 19 Cha: 26 Fort/Will/Ref: 20/19/18
wdarkk 12-22-03, 02:34 AM	What exactly is a sunmage? Anyway, I presume you're using the Savage Species monster class. First off, are you wearing armor? By my calculations your base AC should be 30. If you are wearing armor, get _better_ armor. You're approaching the point where you can afford +5 armor, or +8 bracers of armor. Also, have you considered a shield? An animated shield would be useful if you rely on using your off-hand. Or even a Brooch of Shielding. Finally, as for spells, consider a ring of evasion and some save-boosting items/feats.
savagelink1 12-22-03, 02:02 PM	Defensive items I have already +4 bracers of moderate fortification +5 Cloak of resistance +2 items to all stats (except int) +1 ring of protection Ioun stone (+1 insight bonus) We are in a primarily undead campaign so a shield is great against night walkers and night crawlers, but I'll probably look into more of a luck or insight bonus to AC. I also think I may get an item that casts divine power 1/day or 2/day to help against grappling. I am not a DM so I don't know what else there is for protection against undead so anything else would help out.
Dalaeck 12-22-03, 02:15 PM	I personally don't know why anyone whould want to play an angel but that's likely because I'm an old fashioned wizard... A "standard" 19th level fighter has the following: Dwarven full plate +5 (+16 AC = base 8 + 5 enhancement + 3 dex) Animated tower shield +5 (+9 AC = base 4 + 5 enhancement) Ring of protection +5 (+5 deflection) Amulet of natural armor +5 (+5 natural armor) Ioun stone (+1 insight bonus) With additionally, dodge feat +1 (dodge bonuses stack) expertise feat +1 to +5 So base AC of 46 and potentially AC 52 all told. You can dual weild defending weapons for an additional +1-10 AC but usually expertise is more than enough to send most monsters packing. Incidentally if you are playing broken 3.5 then you should definitely get a ring of freedom of mouvement - it makes you immune to all grappling. :rolleyes: I don't know? Get better gear or drop the silly angel schtick?
Rudigrrr 12-22-03, 03:21 PM	You are a 16th level what??? 16th level fighter astral deva?? by my calculations your character level is actually 36 if I understand you correctly, which should mean you should be able to destroy everything in your path, level adjustment 8 + plus hit dice 12 + 16 levels = 36 so unless i'm not understanding you, you should be more than overpowered..... and how do you only have 130 hp??? the base for a standard astral deva is 102.... if you have 16 character levels on top of that you should have an insane amount of hp... not too mention your base ac with nothing on is 32, you are a powerhouse my friend and im not sure why your DM allowed your character at all... but once again, maybe i just dont understand your explanation, because you should be having no problems
wdarkk 12-22-03, 04:34 PM	He's using a "monster class". He's a 16th level Astral Deva. He has 10-11 HD or so. Yeah, despite Dalaeck's problems with certain equipment, he's got the right idea.
Dalaeck 12-22-03, 07:21 PM	Also 19th level and 130 HP means you are going to die in the front lines... a lot. A 19th level fighter has base 10 + 18x5.5 = 109 hp on average just from his class. With even a 12 con he'll have as many hp as you. However his con is likely on the order of 22, so 223 hp on average.
wdarkk 12-22-03, 07:35 PM	He's sixteenth level.
Dalaeck 12-23-03, 01:48 AM	Yeah but his allies are 18-19. I don't care what the "ECL" is on this thing it's normal he's getting his ass handed to him every fight. He can't hope to be anywhere near as effective as a plain fighter as it stands in the front lines. He should ask to roll up a human fighter. With 19 feats and some decent gear you're doing much much better in the desired role. I mean seriously, if you're a front lines guy and at this level things can hope to hit you on anything but a 20 then you're doing something wrong. A standard fighter of this level should stand in front of a balor and the blows should glance right off.
Dartanel 12-23-03, 06:50 AM	Yeah, his main problem is that he's three levels behind the party. But also he's thinking that he's playing a combat character. You're not anymore. In the first couple levels, and Astral Deva makes a competent archer, but once the lack of HD starts to kick in along with the spell-like abilities, your character transforms into a wizard, and should be approached as such. Stand out of range and use your spell-like abilities to their fullest.
savagelink1 12-26-03, 12:45 AM	I think i'm gonna go with perhaps a couple items that give luck and insight bonus to AC as well as a +5 animated mithril shield. Also the same for resistances, get some luck and insight bonuses to resistances too as well as a ring of evasion. What do you guys think about an item that gives Righteous Might 1/day. I have combat reflexes but that would help the 5 foot gap in making grapple checks because of the increase size.
wdarkk 12-26-03, 01:18 AM	Well, since you should be Large by now, you could take Improved Trip and/or Large and In Charge. Do you have an item that grants a +6 Enhancement bonus to Con yet? You should be able to afford one. Do you have an item that grants a +6 Enhancement bonus to Str yet? You should be able to afford one. Oh, and consider a good Composite Longbow.
savagelink1 12-26-03, 08:00 PM	no, i'm not large yet... i won't hit large size until 19 HD, or level 27
GoodTeletubby 12-26-03, 09:59 PM	while you're at it, make use of holy aura +4 to AC is nothing to scoff at, and +4 to saves is really good too
Tejina Kiko 12-26-03, 10:45 PM	Good items, yes. But also, fragility is a price of the character. as an astral deva you have 12d8 by level 20, a fighter has 20d10. Clearly, you are not a combat character. You may hit something with a sword occasionally, darting into and out of combat. I hope you took flyby attack. That, a high fly speed, and spell-likes and weapons should let you attack and stay alive. Also, why are you three levels lower? 1-2 is easy to cope with, but more is very tricky. And as such a fragile character already, you need the levels. IIRC, a level 16 deva has 10HD? that puts you 9 behind the other players, and that is really bad. Suggest that your DM use the EXP award method from FRCS. That will let you catch up.
Deep Blue 9000 12-26-03, 10:46 PM	I think the most important thing for you to do is to increase your AC. Monster Characters don't have the hp of normal races but their high natural armor bonus can make up for it, keeping them in the fight. You might want to pick up light armor proficiency so you can wear some real armor. Also, an amulet of natural would probably be better than a + Con amulet because you have so few hit die. Your saves are good and SR 26 is better than no SR so you should be ok versus spells. If some undead tries to grapple you, just hit him with heal, that should make short work of him. Or polymorph self into something big and strong.