Bad DM, need help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bad DM, need help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Blindman6642
09-01-06, 07:08 PM For reference sake (although this may be confusing) there is me, my brother, my brother's friends, friend A (known only as A), friend B, friend G, and my friend C/DM.

I started playing DND about a year ago because B's father had played in college and was gonna DM. It has been a total blast, we have had a ton of fun (A, B, G, C, and my brother) and did all kinds of great stuff. However me and C felt that we didnt get to play as much as we wanted and that some of the rules were sacrificed to be silly. So during the summer I ordered some stuff online for the eberron campaign setting. Sometime in mid summer we started our first adventure(s).

We ran into problems with C being our DM, he is a bit commanding and was unquestionably DM (no-one except me fully understood the rules, and I was the expert still {rules are my thing} but felt like I wouldnt be anything like him so didnt even mention DMing). We ran into problems before we even started. C is known to be really lazy and not do work he doesnt want to do, we figured this would change for DND. It didnt. He had told me that because we had 6 players we would have to alter the campaign, but when I asked him if he would change anything he said "Im not going to, im too lazy." Which struck me as bad DNDing in general but I let it slide. When we began to play it turned out he was really not interested in the game and took a large break after 8pm (we began playing at 3-5, when characters were finished). This may be different for some people but considering this was a major sleepover we were expecting much more, instead we did nothing at all till we went to bed at 11. All he said was that he was tired of reading the books (which to me sounded like "im tired of DMing).

In the end we had the following issues=
-He read right out of the book and made no effort to add some suspense or wonder, it was as bland as the writing
-He would not repeat himself when we were taking inventory of items
-He handed out XP deductions for saying real names, talking out of character, rolling to early, talking at all, and talking back
-He did not try to help when our CLEARLY new party broke into fighting, instead he sat back and provoked us to attack eachother/laughed.
-While playing he would walk off and do other things
-He would not allow any character customization, everything was rolled
-He did not listen when I corrected him on the rules
-He left us with no options for separate adventures, roll-playing or character background. Our backgrounds were read right out of the adventure book and everything the NPCs said was too.
-He was overall mean, un-enthusiastic, un-caring, and generally everything I thought a DM shouldnt be

Regardless of how each person here runs their games all of these things were things we DID NOT want (ie we all wanted character customization). Because he was my good friend I decided to give him one last chance, and after many delays and 0/8 returned phone calls we finally agreed to play tomorrow saturday september 2nd.

I have talked to B, A, G and my brother about this and they all agree, new DM. This would be fairly easy for me to take over, ive DMed the free download adventures before (which I loved doing) and happen to enjoy reading the rules. However we have a number of problems.

I have given him saturday to prove he is a good DM or he is out (which already seems unlikely since he cut our expected play time in half). However what do I do? When/(maybe if) it becomes clear he is a bad DM at the end of our session do I announce it too him? How should we handle a new campaign? We have adventures but he may have read through them (unlikely considering how lazy he is) and dont have time to order new ones. How should I handle telling him I am going to be DM? What options can/should I give him? Basically what should we do?

What we want is a new DM, eberron campaign, and the most happy players we can have, if anyone has an idea on how to solve this please help. I will be on all of tonight and tomorrow morning and will answer questions ASAP.

Thank you very much,
Chris
Drodain
09-01-06, 07:15 PM Sounds just like a bad player in general. Some friends just shouldn't play DnD together. Thats the way it works. I would just say 'Hey, here are the problems I'm having with your DMing. B, G, and my brother agree. If you could work on this we all could enjoy it more.' If after the next session it doesn't improve. You could try DMing. A passive DM is not a bad thing as long as he's not to passive. If he raises problems as a player tell him what hes doing and if it doesn't improve kick him.
Blindman6642
09-01-06, 07:22 PM tommorow is what we alotted as his last chance (though he doesnt know yet that we want him all the way out), at that point we will ask if he wants to stay yes/no and then continue, but we were trying to find out what to do about campaign material. We are using all the eberron books and arent sure if we should start over and alter what we already did or what (were at level 2, we just completed teh part in the eberron campaing setting). I have the heroes of battle book and everyone in our group would LOVE a battle like that, but I have no experience in designing my own adventure and might over/under power it
tuffn00gies
09-01-06, 07:34 PM No one has experience their first time. Don't worry about it. Even if you did have experience you still might get it over/under powered. My suggestion is just to tell the guy he doesn't seem to be too interested in DMing and if he doesn't mind you'll take over. At least you have the passion to try and get it right. Trust me - that's more than half of what makes a good DM. If he does mind you taking over, start your own group and forget to invite him. I'm betting he won't mind.

About the material - if he has read it, don't be afraid to change things on him.
Psychoticpsymon
09-01-06, 07:41 PM Many have said it before and many will say it hence;

Before doing anything rash that might offend, try to talk to him about the situation first. If he refuses to listen, bring in everyone else to back yourself up. If he flips, he ain't worth fighting with and possibly losing a friend, so get everyone together to discuss a new DM.
pres_man
09-01-06, 07:49 PM Ok, I didn't read this super careful so if I mix some stuff up, I'm sorry. It sounds like he is going to get another chance at DMing, but you expect this to be at least as bad as the first time, and that he is going to end early. Ok, then if you intend to take over, as soon as he ends early, say, "Hey, don't worry about it, I've got an idea of something to run for the rest of the time." Then take over his campaign or start a new one, if you plan are starting new, you might want to have some pre-generated characters ready for everybody, made by you or them. When the next time to game comes and if he thinks he is going to DM, everybody should just say, "Nah thanks, I think we want to play Blindman6642's campaign instead." No reason to be mean or anything. Just make it clear if he isn't interested in DMing there are those that are.
King Bulba
09-01-06, 09:41 PM you might want to have some pre-generated characters ready for everybody, made by you or them.
Ummmm made by them. If a player can't choose his character then that is a REALLY bad start. Spend the rest of the sesson making up the groups chars. If everyone finishes in time then start up the opening scene. Need that to be really flexable since you know very little when designing it.

Have an invastion of level 1 warforged or mindless undead attack the village thats next to the mournlands. They join up in self defense. Make it at a railway station which explains why some people are there who arent native to that land. A little stareotypical but works. Then create a reason to keep them together.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Blindman6642 09-01-06, 07:08 PM	For reference sake (although this may be confusing) there is me, my brother, my brother's friends, friend A (known only as A), friend B, friend G, and my friend C/DM. I started playing DND about a year ago because B's father had played in college and was gonna DM. It has been a total blast, we have had a ton of fun (A, B, G, C, and my brother) and did all kinds of great stuff. However me and C felt that we didnt get to play as much as we wanted and that some of the rules were sacrificed to be silly. So during the summer I ordered some stuff online for the eberron campaign setting. Sometime in mid summer we started our first adventure(s). We ran into problems with C being our DM, he is a bit commanding and was unquestionably DM (no-one except me fully understood the rules, and I was the expert still {rules are my thing} but felt like I wouldnt be anything like him so didnt even mention DMing). We ran into problems before we even started. C is known to be really lazy and not do work he doesnt want to do, we figured this would change for DND. It didnt. He had told me that because we had 6 players we would have to alter the campaign, but when I asked him if he would change anything he said "Im not going to, im too lazy." Which struck me as bad DNDing in general but I let it slide. When we began to play it turned out he was really not interested in the game and took a large break after 8pm (we began playing at 3-5, when characters were finished). This may be different for some people but considering this was a major sleepover we were expecting much more, instead we did nothing at all till we went to bed at 11. All he said was that he was tired of reading the books (which to me sounded like "im tired of DMing). In the end we had the following issues= -He read right out of the book and made no effort to add some suspense or wonder, it was as bland as the writing -He would not repeat himself when we were taking inventory of items -He handed out XP deductions for saying real names, talking out of character, rolling to early, talking at all, and talking back -He did not try to help when our CLEARLY new party broke into fighting, instead he sat back and provoked us to attack eachother/laughed. -While playing he would walk off and do other things -He would not allow any character customization, everything was rolled -He did not listen when I corrected him on the rules -He left us with no options for separate adventures, roll-playing or character background. Our backgrounds were read right out of the adventure book and everything the NPCs said was too. -He was overall mean, un-enthusiastic, un-caring, and generally everything I thought a DM shouldnt be Regardless of how each person here runs their games all of these things were things we DID NOT want (ie we all wanted character customization). Because he was my good friend I decided to give him one last chance, and after many delays and 0/8 returned phone calls we finally agreed to play tomorrow saturday september 2nd. I have talked to B, A, G and my brother about this and they all agree, new DM. This would be fairly easy for me to take over, ive DMed the free download adventures before (which I loved doing) and happen to enjoy reading the rules. However we have a number of problems. I have given him saturday to prove he is a good DM or he is out (which already seems unlikely since he cut our expected play time in half). However what do I do? When/(maybe if) it becomes clear he is a bad DM at the end of our session do I announce it too him? How should we handle a new campaign? We have adventures but he may have read through them (unlikely considering how lazy he is) and dont have time to order new ones. How should I handle telling him I am going to be DM? What options can/should I give him? Basically what should we do? What we want is a new DM, eberron campaign, and the most happy players we can have, if anyone has an idea on how to solve this please help. I will be on all of tonight and tomorrow morning and will answer questions ASAP. Thank you very much, Chris
Drodain 09-01-06, 07:15 PM	Sounds just like a bad player in general. Some friends just shouldn't play DnD together. Thats the way it works. I would just say 'Hey, here are the problems I'm having with your DMing. B, G, and my brother agree. If you could work on this we all could enjoy it more.' If after the next session it doesn't improve. You could try DMing. A passive DM is not a bad thing as long as he's not to passive. If he raises problems as a player tell him what hes doing and if it doesn't improve kick him.
Blindman6642 09-01-06, 07:22 PM	tommorow is what we alotted as his last chance (though he doesnt know yet that we want him all the way out), at that point we will ask if he wants to stay yes/no and then continue, but we were trying to find out what to do about campaign material. We are using all the eberron books and arent sure if we should start over and alter what we already did or what (were at level 2, we just completed teh part in the eberron campaing setting). I have the heroes of battle book and everyone in our group would LOVE a battle like that, but I have no experience in designing my own adventure and might over/under power it
tuffn00gies 09-01-06, 07:34 PM	No one has experience their first time. Don't worry about it. Even if you did have experience you still might get it over/under powered. My suggestion is just to tell the guy he doesn't seem to be too interested in DMing and if he doesn't mind you'll take over. At least you have the passion to try and get it right. Trust me - that's more than half of what makes a good DM. If he does mind you taking over, start your own group and forget to invite him. I'm betting he won't mind. About the material - if he has read it, don't be afraid to change things on him.
Psychoticpsymon 09-01-06, 07:41 PM	Many have said it before and many will say it hence; Before doing anything rash that might offend, try to talk to him about the situation first. If he refuses to listen, bring in everyone else to back yourself up. If he flips, he ain't worth fighting with and possibly losing a friend, so get everyone together to discuss a new DM.
pres_man 09-01-06, 07:49 PM	Ok, I didn't read this super careful so if I mix some stuff up, I'm sorry. It sounds like he is going to get another chance at DMing, but you expect this to be at least as bad as the first time, and that he is going to end early. Ok, then if you intend to take over, as soon as he ends early, say, "Hey, don't worry about it, I've got an idea of something to run for the rest of the time." Then take over his campaign or start a new one, if you plan are starting new, you might want to have some pre-generated characters ready for everybody, made by you or them. When the next time to game comes and if he thinks he is going to DM, everybody should just say, "Nah thanks, I think we want to play Blindman6642's campaign instead." No reason to be mean or anything. Just make it clear if he isn't interested in DMing there are those that are.
King Bulba 09-01-06, 09:41 PM	you might want to have some pre-generated characters ready for everybody, made by you or them. Ummmm made by them. If a player can't choose his character then that is a REALLY bad start. Spend the rest of the sesson making up the groups chars. If everyone finishes in time then start up the opening scene. Need that to be really flexable since you know very little when designing it. Have an invastion of level 1 warforged or mindless undead attack the village thats next to the mournlands. They join up in self defense. Make it at a railway station which explains why some people are there who arent native to that land. A little stareotypical but works. Then create a reason to keep them together.