Bard help [Archive] - Wizards Community - Pages Merged by Solauren

Bard help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
NecroticBanana
10-20-06, 09:40 PM I was (for the 1st time) acctually reading the bard entry in the PHB, and for the life of me i can't figure out how else to use the standard class for an interesting character that wasn't a minstrel type character. just the thought of a character singing and playing a lute while everyone else got eatin up by pit traps and wandering monsters seemed silly. Ive been playing (mostly DM'ing) for over 10 years now and have never had anyone play a bard, so i have no examples to draw from, so does anyone else have ideas on "interesting" bard types?
kelvinaw273
10-20-06, 10:24 PM I was working on a Bard with the concept of being an elderly Strolling Player - nay, a true Thespian - whose performance skill was Oratory. To be played much as Tom Baker narrates Little Britain, he would also be an incorrigable womaniser and sneak-thief, but nonetheless occasionaly show a depth of compassion and loyalty seldom matched.
rudie
10-20-06, 10:30 PM I played a bard once, Alzander: bard 9/seeker of the song 1. He became an admiral of his own fleet of (pirated) ships.

They arent great on there own, but they can help the party out a lot. I played Alzander as the arrogant charismatic type that let his looks do the talking, usually standing back and helping the party out with his music, though his great reflexes and skills in ranged combat were useful as well.

Bards arent useless by any means, inspire courage etc. can carry a party in a fight, not to mention the useful spells a bard has at his disposal.
Auburn
10-21-06, 12:43 AM They could juggle and have some sort of throwing weapons or something. Or be an acrobat who fights unarmed like a crappy monk. Yeah they're a wierd class.
CaoSlayer
10-21-06, 05:40 AM Play him as a master manipulator, use lots of enchantment spells and fascination/sugestion, that paired with a good bluff check and glibness spell you can bluff your way out of everything.

Bards arent just bardic music.. actually bardic music isnt this strongest feature, the bard´s strongest feature it is this spellcasting paired with good armor and bab and second to rogue skills.

If you fight against a enemy with weak will saves, you use illusions and enchantments.

If you fight an enemy resistant to magic, use buffing spells and bardic music.

If you fight an enemy weak on melee then you charge it.

If you fight a strong spellcaster BBEG you can really pester him by ready to cast silence spells near him or the always fun to dimension door the party barbarian, yourself and the fighter surrounding him with a single spell.

Whatever player that only sings in a fight have no clue of how play a bard or have levels on a specialist prc.
Kradlo
10-21-06, 10:03 AM There are so many ways to play a given class. With a wide array of feats and skills from which to choose, no two bards need be the same.

I've created a gnome bard for a campaign starting this week. He's taken the feat Trivial Knowledge from Races of Stone, which allows him to roll twice on all Knowledge checks and bardic knowledge checks and take the better of the two rolls. He has ranks in every Knowledge skill (except Architecture and Engineering - so far), so he can help provide useful information to the party about the creatures they encounter, or in any other situation where a Knowledge check could help.

I see him as an entertainer, a talented singer and tumbler. His skills, bardic music, spells, and spell-like abilities give him a wide variety of ways that he can help the party.

That's just one path to take. Even without multiclassing, a bard can take many different roles.
CaoSlayer
10-21-06, 11:05 AM That's just one path to take. Even without multiclassing, a bard can take many different roles.

Actually multiclassing makes the bard able to take less and less roles, each time you gain a level in a another class either this spellcasting starts to drag behind and he dont gain bardic musics also multiclassing cause or well a worse skill selection or a worse bab/hitdice, bards who multiclass actually seeks specialization, by a example a bard with a few rogues level seeks to remplace a full rogue by adquiring search and disable device, a bard who takes a level of cleric or wizards seeks specialization on item creation cause the multiclass greatly broads the options in magical items available and a bard who multiclass as a warrior class seeks more powerful melee or archery weakening everything else.
kelvinaw273
10-21-06, 04:20 PM The thing to remember with Bards is that you have a character who is jack-of-all-trades and master of none. Flexibility in role is your strength, lack of specialisation is your weakness. You have the ultimate team player who is nonetheless the only character who can go it alone and function (after all, you can do everything but Trapfinding).

If you want the ultimate all-rounder, take a level of rogue and you are there.
CaoSlayer
10-21-06, 04:29 PM umm, actually the bards are masters of one thing: mind control...

just one level of rogue dont helps much, seriously.

Trap sense only it is useful if you can max search and bards lack search on their skill lists... so just one level of rogue only it is good if you take one of those feats that allows you to turn any skill into a class skill like Able learner or Metropolitian.

for being good at searching traps you need to take a level of rogue and about every four levels take one level of rogue or another class or prestige that grants search (disable device it is optional since there are spells able to disable devices pretty good) so you can keep your check almost as good as a pure rogue and with the help of spells like heroism and improvisation you can improve your check and become a better trap disabler than a pure rogue.
Twinkle
10-23-06, 01:48 PM I've been playing a bard for almost a year. You don't have to play a lute when the others are slaying a dragon! If you arm yourself with damage spells and use other spells in imaginative ways, you can first make sure the party (and you) gets lots of bonuses to attack, damage, saves (if you take the focused performance feat, you can actually play two songs at the same time - at 14th level I got all my allies +3 to attack and damage and will saves against fear/charm and simultaneously two of them - the ones in the frontline got an additional +2 to attack, 2d10hp and +1 fortitude saves!) but you can also make yourself stronger and more agile and actually fight! I can't think of a better class to play; you can also team it up with a wizard!
trapspringer
10-23-06, 02:09 PM I played a tiefling bard up through level ten. Hell of a character. He was quiet and reserved but was a masterful orrator when he chose to speak. He also had the arcane disciple feat and access to the fire domian, so he could really put out some damage if he wanted to.
EscherEnigma
10-23-06, 08:05 PM So far I've played a bard from 1 to 4 and had a blast with it all the way. Sadly, the campaign kinda fizzled due to fall schedules (damn college classes getting in the way of my gaming!)

But before then... I was actually probalby the most effective character. Admitteldy, I didn't swing the sword that slew the foe, but everytime the fighter DID swing his sword he swung it better because of me. with minor healing spells (and tumble) I made a better combat healer then the cleric, and gave varoius other bonuses to the group with illusion spells and the like.

And, when all was said and done, I was STILL almost as good at sword swining and archery as the fighter. I just did alot of other things as well.

Bards aren't experts at anything (except suggestion that is...) but if you have a group of at least 5 players they're a great addition. Sure, you won't shine on your own as often, but you're definitely adding to the group as a whole.
EberronMoses
10-23-06, 09:53 PM I'm making my first bard for LIVING GREYHAWK. I plan to make him a gentleman warrior, poet, historian, and storyteller. I"ll play him as smooth and cavalier cuz I'm in the Yeomanry and from what I see the Yeomanry is like the ideal confederate south. Unfortunately, there seemed to be a lot of adventures geared towards redneck ideals. particularly rednecks named turnip seed that had small but important roles in deliverance.
Ignitus
10-23-06, 10:35 PM Well, I personaly love bards. Actualy, I'm playing as a Bard/swashbuckler right now.
The truth is, bards can do anything that they want, except damage.
So if you don't mind not dealing Uber damage just by slashing, and finding other ways to deal with your enemies, Bards rock.
Plus they're fun to RP
Twinkle
10-24-06, 12:16 PM Bards rock.
I couldn't agree more! And they're also a bit of a challenge and unpredictable.;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
NecroticBanana 10-20-06, 09:40 PM	I was (for the 1st time) acctually reading the bard entry in the PHB, and for the life of me i can't figure out how else to use the standard class for an interesting character that wasn't a minstrel type character. just the thought of a character singing and playing a lute while everyone else got eatin up by pit traps and wandering monsters seemed silly. Ive been playing (mostly DM'ing) for over 10 years now and have never had anyone play a bard, so i have no examples to draw from, so does anyone else have ideas on "interesting" bard types?
kelvinaw273 10-20-06, 10:24 PM	I was working on a Bard with the concept of being an elderly Strolling Player - nay, a true Thespian - whose performance skill was Oratory. To be played much as Tom Baker narrates Little Britain, he would also be an incorrigable womaniser and sneak-thief, but nonetheless occasionaly show a depth of compassion and loyalty seldom matched.
rudie 10-20-06, 10:30 PM	I played a bard once, Alzander: bard 9/seeker of the song 1. He became an admiral of his own fleet of (pirated) ships. They arent great on there own, but they can help the party out a lot. I played Alzander as the arrogant charismatic type that let his looks do the talking, usually standing back and helping the party out with his music, though his great reflexes and skills in ranged combat were useful as well. Bards arent useless by any means, inspire courage etc. can carry a party in a fight, not to mention the useful spells a bard has at his disposal.
Auburn 10-21-06, 12:43 AM	They could juggle and have some sort of throwing weapons or something. Or be an acrobat who fights unarmed like a crappy monk. Yeah they're a wierd class.
CaoSlayer 10-21-06, 05:40 AM	Play him as a master manipulator, use lots of enchantment spells and fascination/sugestion, that paired with a good bluff check and glibness spell you can bluff your way out of everything. Bards arent just bardic music.. actually bardic music isnt this strongest feature, the bard´s strongest feature it is this spellcasting paired with good armor and bab and second to rogue skills. If you fight against a enemy with weak will saves, you use illusions and enchantments. If you fight an enemy resistant to magic, use buffing spells and bardic music. If you fight an enemy weak on melee then you charge it. If you fight a strong spellcaster BBEG you can really pester him by ready to cast silence spells near him or the always fun to dimension door the party barbarian, yourself and the fighter surrounding him with a single spell. Whatever player that only sings in a fight have no clue of how play a bard or have levels on a specialist prc.
Kradlo 10-21-06, 10:03 AM	There are so many ways to play a given class. With a wide array of feats and skills from which to choose, no two bards need be the same. I've created a gnome bard for a campaign starting this week. He's taken the feat Trivial Knowledge from Races of Stone, which allows him to roll twice on all Knowledge checks and bardic knowledge checks and take the better of the two rolls. He has ranks in every Knowledge skill (except Architecture and Engineering - so far), so he can help provide useful information to the party about the creatures they encounter, or in any other situation where a Knowledge check could help. I see him as an entertainer, a talented singer and tumbler. His skills, bardic music, spells, and spell-like abilities give him a wide variety of ways that he can help the party. That's just one path to take. Even without multiclassing, a bard can take many different roles.
CaoSlayer 10-21-06, 11:05 AM	That's just one path to take. Even without multiclassing, a bard can take many different roles. Actually multiclassing makes the bard able to take less and less roles, each time you gain a level in a another class either this spellcasting starts to drag behind and he dont gain bardic musics also multiclassing cause or well a worse skill selection or a worse bab/hitdice, bards who multiclass actually seeks specialization, by a example a bard with a few rogues level seeks to remplace a full rogue by adquiring search and disable device, a bard who takes a level of cleric or wizards seeks specialization on item creation cause the multiclass greatly broads the options in magical items available and a bard who multiclass as a warrior class seeks more powerful melee or archery weakening everything else.
kelvinaw273 10-21-06, 04:20 PM	The thing to remember with Bards is that you have a character who is jack-of-all-trades and master of none. Flexibility in role is your strength, lack of specialisation is your weakness. You have the ultimate team player who is nonetheless the only character who can go it alone and function (after all, you can do everything but Trapfinding). If you want the ultimate all-rounder, take a level of rogue and you are there.
CaoSlayer 10-21-06, 04:29 PM	umm, actually the bards are masters of one thing: mind control... just one level of rogue dont helps much, seriously. Trap sense only it is useful if you can max search and bards lack search on their skill lists... so just one level of rogue only it is good if you take one of those feats that allows you to turn any skill into a class skill like Able learner or Metropolitian. for being good at searching traps you need to take a level of rogue and about every four levels take one level of rogue or another class or prestige that grants search (disable device it is optional since there are spells able to disable devices pretty good) so you can keep your check almost as good as a pure rogue and with the help of spells like heroism and improvisation you can improve your check and become a better trap disabler than a pure rogue.
Twinkle 10-23-06, 01:48 PM	I've been playing a bard for almost a year. You don't have to play a lute when the others are slaying a dragon! If you arm yourself with damage spells and use other spells in imaginative ways, you can first make sure the party (and you) gets lots of bonuses to attack, damage, saves (if you take the focused performance feat, you can actually play two songs at the same time - at 14th level I got all my allies +3 to attack and damage and will saves against fear/charm and simultaneously two of them - the ones in the frontline got an additional +2 to attack, 2d10hp and +1 fortitude saves!) but you can also make yourself stronger and more agile and actually fight! I can't think of a better class to play; you can also team it up with a wizard!
trapspringer 10-23-06, 02:09 PM	I played a tiefling bard up through level ten. Hell of a character. He was quiet and reserved but was a masterful orrator when he chose to speak. He also had the arcane disciple feat and access to the fire domian, so he could really put out some damage if he wanted to.
EscherEnigma 10-23-06, 08:05 PM	So far I've played a bard from 1 to 4 and had a blast with it all the way. Sadly, the campaign kinda fizzled due to fall schedules (damn college classes getting in the way of my gaming!) But before then... I was actually probalby the most effective character. Admitteldy, I didn't swing the sword that slew the foe, but everytime the fighter DID swing his sword he swung it better because of me. with minor healing spells (and tumble) I made a better combat healer then the cleric, and gave varoius other bonuses to the group with illusion spells and the like. And, when all was said and done, I was STILL almost as good at sword swining and archery as the fighter. I just did alot of other things as well. Bards aren't experts at anything (except suggestion that is...) but if you have a group of at least 5 players they're a great addition. Sure, you won't shine on your own as often, but you're definitely adding to the group as a whole.
EberronMoses 10-23-06, 09:53 PM	I'm making my first bard for LIVING GREYHAWK. I plan to make him a gentleman warrior, poet, historian, and storyteller. I"ll play him as smooth and cavalier cuz I'm in the Yeomanry and from what I see the Yeomanry is like the ideal confederate south. Unfortunately, there seemed to be a lot of adventures geared towards redneck ideals. particularly rednecks named turnip seed that had small but important roles in deliverance.
Ignitus 10-23-06, 10:35 PM	Well, I personaly love bards. Actualy, I'm playing as a Bard/swashbuckler right now. The truth is, bards can do anything that they want, except damage. So if you don't mind not dealing Uber damage just by slashing, and finding other ways to deal with your enemies, Bards rock. Plus they're fun to RP
Twinkle 10-24-06, 12:16 PM	Bards rock. I couldn't agree more! And they're also a bit of a challenge and unpredictable.;)