Post/Author/DateTime	Post
blade18cm 02-14-07, 03:19 PM	Does anyone have input on how to handle the following situation? Your PC is a melee fighter frequently engaging foes face to face while your party wizard stands back and slings fireballs at your back without a care in the world, despite warnings that you will not tolerate this type of reckless spellcasting. Besides attacking your party wizard to teach him a lesson, does anyone have a suggestion on how to curb this type of reckless spellcasting?
Zherog 02-14-07, 03:23 PM	Why doesn't the wizard place the spell in such a way as to hit your enemies but not you? Assuming he wishes to continue to cook you :P , I can think of two things you can do: 1) Delay your initiative so you go after the wizard. 2) Get a ring of evasion and boost your Reflex saves (increase your Dex, cloak of resistance, etc). In the first case, the wizard might just find himself being attacked by an enemy you would've otherwise occupied. When he asks what you were waiting for, simply answer, "Your fireball."
DrakePD 02-14-07, 03:33 PM	Does anyone have input on how to handle the following situation? Your PC is a melee fighter frequently engaging foes face to face while your party wizard stands back and slings fireballs at your back without a care in the world, despite warnings that you will not tolerate this type of reckless spellcasting. Besides attacking your party wizard to teach him a lesson, does anyone have a suggestion on how to curb this type of reckless spellcasting? I would say....Always try and stand behind the wizard. After he goes down, then you will not have to worry about him hitting you with fireballs. The next melee combat situation, make sure you ready or delay your action to go after the wizard and make sure that you make it clear that you are not going to move away from him because you do not want to get hit from a fireball. If he moves, then follow him. At some point he will start to catch on.
kelvinaw273 02-14-07, 03:46 PM	Stand behind the wizard - even when the monsters attack. Meh, you don't want another fireball in your back, do you? Seriously, it sound like an attempt on your life, not reckless casting if he is targeting your back and not the enemy.
philnicau 02-14-07, 03:46 PM	Does anyone have input on how to handle the following situation? Your PC is a melee fighter frequently engaging foes face to face while your party wizard stands back and slings fireballs at your back without a care in the world, despite warnings that you will not tolerate this type of reckless spellcasting. Besides attacking your party wizard to teach him a lesson, does anyone have a suggestion on how to curb this type of reckless spellcasting? As i ban attacking other players in my campaigns, then the wizards either stops lobbing fireballs into melee or his character dies, (and can't be replaced by a spellcaster).
Bruunwald 02-14-07, 03:55 PM	Before you do anything reckless, why not ask him why he can't place the center of the fireball so that you are not in its area? I know it sounds silly, but maybe this guy thinks he has to have a free and open area equal to the radius of the spell in order for it to work. You and I know that's not so, but maybe he's a newb? Also, consider the possibility that you are leaving him no real room to get more than one enemy at a time. Consider planning strategies with him before the next session, like "I'll delay my turn until you cast fireball, then I'll run in and finish them off." Or get a bow and fire a few shots off until he's done, and then get into melee.
Derren S. 02-14-07, 03:58 PM	The next time he does this punch the wizard (the character, not the player) in the face and tell him if he does that again you will <insert creative threat>
Grognor 02-14-07, 04:23 PM	If diplomacy fails, force prevails. Every time he fireballs you, break one of his character's fingers. Either way, out of fear or loss of fingers, it'll but a stop to it very soon.
Dag 02-14-07, 05:48 PM	Be mindful that when you charge into the middle of the enemy ranks you are negating a lot of your wizard's usefulness. Maybe he grew tired of having to hold back his high damage spells because your character was always preventing him from doing damage to the enemy without hurting you. I get easily annoyed with fighter types who feel that their first action of every battle has to be to charge. The last campaign I played a fighter in I finally told the other melee types, a ranger and a paladin, that we're going to take a defensive stance in front of our spell casters and let the enemies come to us (unless we were dealing with spellcasters). So, I suggest you stand 5 to 10 feet in front of your party wizard, protect him without minimizing his effectiveness. Hold for the first enemy to come within range then hack him. If you feel that you must charge or are playing some sort of psycho barbarian type then try to charge an opponent in a way that leaves a good number of opponents open to be fireballed. I think that the tactics might be a problem in your group, fighter charging his way into the most suitable places to drop a fireball, still the wizard should refrain from dropping those fireballs on the fighter. Were it my character I would like a good (a very very good) reason why the wizard decided I needed to be fireballed. I'd try to work out some group tactics that will enable him to use his high damage spells and still allows you to kick some bootie. Were I a third member of this party I'd reccomend that the two both start showing some wisdom and common sense, and I'd tell the wizard to discuss any problems he may with the fighter amongst the group. I'd also tell the wizard that the next time he fireballs a member of the group he'll be asked to leave their company.
Vaelan 02-14-07, 06:42 PM	Adapt your strategies accordingly. Stop rushing into the middle of things. If the Wizard doesn't like it and will not change his strategies so that the party can actually work again, feel free to convince the rest of the party that they would rather have you, the stand-up guy who tries to protect them, around rather than the Wizard, who will attempt to light them on fire on a regular basis. Kind of a no-brainer when you think about it.
Callista 02-14-07, 06:52 PM	I think you ought to mug the wizard and take his spellbook and components. Refuse to give them back until he agrees not to fireball you. If he still fireballs you, rinse and repeat... only this time, hire someone to cast a geas on the wizard--something like 'I will take every precaution not to fireball my party members'.
Magrus 02-14-07, 07:06 PM	I think there are a few things in this situation that need to be adressed. The most obvious ones being, what would work best for the party? Tactically, it may make more sense for you to hold your action, let the wizard blast them, and then defend the wizard. Mowing down injured enemies is easier than healthy ones, saving the party on healing resources, and lowering your risk of death. However, if the wizard has already gotten off an area spell, you have closed and then the wizard decides to blast again anyhow, there IS a problem. He did his initial bomb type work, you are doing yours. He needs to find a way to do precision blasting now. If not, he's open game to reprisals such as leaving him to defend himself when rushed by a mob, or beating him down after the fight you got singed in.
DarkNick 02-14-07, 08:37 PM	Does he do this to any of the other party members? He has been warned - get the other players agreement, then warn him that next time he does it you will boot that character out of the party, refuse to work with him. Talk to him out of character - ask him why he is doing it, tell him it sucks.
Thubby 02-14-07, 09:37 PM	ask him to stop. barring that, next fight, grapple him and DRAG him to the front lines, dump him, and start doing your job. if he tries to run, aoo trip him (his aoo on you should miss or be pathetic, if he takes it). you have to realize that you attacking him ouright is no different than him including you in the area of a fireball (unless he didnt think youd be in the area, accidents do happen)
ashcat_lt 02-14-07, 11:39 PM	Be a man! You're built of hit points. When you get low on either pop a potion or holler for the medic. You could invest in some form of protection or resistance to fire.
Yokomohoyo 02-15-07, 12:15 AM	Get a pair of rings that allow your caster to cast 3 spells per day that would not allow him to harm you with his spells but will allow him to kill the monsters. Or buy a few potions of fire imunnity.
grok_grok 02-15-07, 12:42 AM	Fireball has a huge range on it, next time plan your attack, Spot, Fireball(s), Charge in for the kill. If your indoors, tell him to use something that won't affect an area, there are many spells that effect muilti-targets and not your allies. If that doesn't work, smack him and scream " Steve,Cast another fireball in my direction and ill shove this torch so far up your arse that it will even make Drow twitch in discomfort!" When he asks why your doing this say "it burns like a b**** don't it." Or erase pages of his spellbook, maybe you'll luck out and erase part of his fireball spell and cause it to blow up in his face
Yokomohoyo 02-15-07, 01:07 AM	You have a rouge in the party? If yes steal his spell book wile he sleeps and put it in the rouges back pack... When confronted ask with a big smile on your face: "Who are you going to belive? Me or a thief?
johnkretzer 02-15-07, 04:06 AM	Does anyone have input on how to handle the following situation? Your PC is a melee fighter frequently engaging foes face to face while your party wizard stands back and slings fireballs at your back without a care in the world, despite warnings that you will not tolerate this type of reckless spellcasting. Besides attacking your party wizard to teach him a lesson, does anyone have a suggestion on how to curb this type of reckless spellcasting? Tell him to leave.
bob_the_great 02-15-07, 07:59 AM	um, ignore the people telling you to do something stupid which will cause conflict. so far, in 4 combats, i have been fireballed twice by our wizard. the first time he got 6 of them and 1 of me (his other option would have been to get maybe 2 or 3 of them) and the second time he was desperate and didn't know what to do, so he tossed a fireball. after the first instance i told him out-of-character that I agreed it was the right thing to do and that I didn't mind. My character was a little annoyed, but one advantage to being a meatshield with 14 int is that he could understand too. after the second instance i mentioned to the player that I don't want this to become a regular thing, and that my character is smart enough to learn and will adapt his stategy (i.e. grab a bow and shoot arrows from a safe spot, like next to the wizard). My character was angry but would never attack an ally, as that's a little too evil for his tastes. He might not mind watching something chomp on the wizard because he's firing a bow rather than tanking though.
Zankue 02-15-07, 08:26 AM	The people that say "tell him to leave" are wrong thats an idiotic thing to do, yeah we've been having a good time playing D&D but you did hurt my character a few times so I'm not letting you play with us anymore. You should discuss tactics with the wizard and not just rush into battle. obviously the wizard must have some precision spells or even a spell that can hit multiple enemies without a chance to hit you. Or you could ask him to become an Arch Mage (DMG) and have him get the high arcana that lets him make holes in area effects for allies to stand in. I'm not sure if I'm right though... is that a high arcana or is it something else that has to do with manipulating the area of your spells... I'm not sure... tell me if I'm right about that one.
blade18cm 02-15-07, 11:42 AM	The wizard is new to our party. We have been playing for a year and a half together and this player just joined last session. Our party rescued his PC from captivity, and he shows his thanks by throwing around area of affect spells in a cramped dungeon when it was not necessary. My PC is a hobgoblin ftr1/brd4/dragon disciple 7. The wizard is a dwarven wizard 12, which might explain why he didn't care about fireballing the heck out of the area containing a hobgoblin, even if it was the hobgoblin that just rescued him. In the last session, there was one slaad that was being easisy cut down by my PC's greataxe, therefore the fireball spell was wasteful and unneccesary. I'll give him the fact that he could not center it far enough away from my PC to not cause damage, but then why shoot it at all? My PC was about to chop down the Slaad. One of my PC's feats is powerful charge, and so this is why he tends to charge in and face down enemies. Sitting back and waiting for NMEs is not the way to use the powerful charge feat. Thanks for all the input from everyone. I think next time I will delay, cast enlarge person on myself, or play some bardic music and allow him to shoot a fireball in first, before charging in while shouting a warning to the wizard that if I get burnt this time he will pay for it.
Salla 02-15-07, 01:03 PM	Does anyone have input on how to handle the following situation? Your PC is a melee fighter frequently engaging foes face to face while your party wizard stands back and slings fireballs at your back without a care in the world, despite warnings that you will not tolerate this type of reckless spellcasting. Besides attacking your party wizard to teach him a lesson, does anyone have a suggestion on how to curb this type of reckless spellcasting? Inform the wizard, in-character, that he is a liability and take a party vote, in-character, to remove him from the party. Then, OOC, ask your friend to make a character who isn't such a douchebag.
Zherog 02-15-07, 01:23 PM	The wizard is new to our party. We have been playing for a year and a half together and this player just joined last session. So here's a follow-up question. Does he understand the game? Does he know how spells work, about different options, and all that stuff?
Dunsel 02-15-07, 01:58 PM	I played a Wizard for 11 levels and NEVER caught a party member in a area effect spell. If they would be affected, I didn't cast it! If this guy has been warned and he understands the definitions of radius and diameter, call him "Steve" and go chop him down.
Salla 02-15-07, 02:02 PM	I played a Wizard for 11 levels and NEVER caught a party member in a area effect spell. If they would be affected, I didn't cast it! If this guy has been warned and he understands the definitions of radius and diameter, call him "Steve" and go chop him down. Same here. Hell, if nothing else, get him to think in three dimensions. Throw a Fireball high and you effectively shrink the radius for the ground fight.
blade18cm 02-15-07, 04:01 PM	In response to your follow up questions... What makes it even more frustrating, is that the guy playing the dwarven wizard is not new to the game, has been playing for years, knew that he was going to do a lot of damage to my PC and did it anyway. This was after I warned him not to both IC and OOC, and after the DM and the other players confirmed that it would be damaging his own party member. I handled like any ****** off hobgoblin being fireballed from behind by a dwarf would...I turned charged at him and hit him once with my greataxe to teach him a lesson. That is essentially where the session left off and I am curious to see what will happen next. I don't plan to attack him again unless he attacks me first again with another fireball or any other spell...hobgoblin justice!
DrakePD 02-15-07, 04:29 PM	In response to your follow up questions... What makes it even more frustrating, is that the guy playing the dwarven wizard is not new to the game, has been playing for years, knew that he was going to do a lot of damage to my PC and did it anyway. This was after I warned him not to both IC and OOC, and after the DM and the other players confirmed that it would be damaging his own party member. I handled like any ****** off hobgoblin being fireballed from behind by a dwarf would...I turned charged at him and hit him once with my greataxe to teach him a lesson. That is essentially where the session left off and I am curious to see what will happen next. I don't plan to attack him again unless he attacks me first again with another fireball or any other spell...hobgoblin justice! What damage would you do if you hit with a dwarven mage of flaming? I think you might have to have monkey grip??;)
snakeman830 02-15-07, 04:50 PM	I would say talk over a new strategy with the wizard. Adjust your tactics so that you hang back until he's thrown a fireball into the enemies (if you have the quick-draw feat, support him with a composite longbow then switch to your primary melee weapon when distance closes) then charge in. He can then use certian spells that do decent amounts of damage (Melf's Acid arrow and Searing Rays are good ones for this) and that are extremely accurate. Remember, touch attacks are a wizards best friend. Plus, they can threaten criticals on a natural 20. He can also cover a large area empty of allies with a cone attack (Burning Hands, Cone of Cold) instead of a burst (fireball). Also, don't let him forget Magic Missle. This is the most accurate spell in the game as it can hit anything, requires no attack roll, and allows no save. Sure, it seems to do very little damage, but when he shoots five at the same target, that's 10-25 virtually gaurnteed damage with no risk to allies.
Zankue 02-15-07, 06:04 PM	Also, don't let him forget Magic Missle. This is the most accurate spell in the game as it can hit anything, requires no attack roll, and allows no save. Sure, it seems to do very little damage, but when he shoots five at the same target, that's 10-25 virtually gaurnteed damage with no risk to allies. Also don't forget about Chain Missle this is just as accurate as magic missle but it hits multiple enemies, theirs also chain lightning, fireball isn't your only choice at multiple target attacks.
MDFFourOfFive 02-15-07, 06:39 PM	I doubt that's how it happened, however. This was probably the FIRST fireball that the character had EVER fired. Second, he probably had NEVER been warned in character. Anyway, my suggestion would be to TALK, especialy for a Militaristic race. (i.e. Hobgoblin, or Drow). I've seen too many people get worked up durring the first time a character gets fireballed by a fireball(or shadow evocation fireball as the case may be) spell cast by a party member.
MDFFourOfFive 02-15-07, 06:43 PM	One more thing, he DID place it as far away from as many party members as he could, you don't have much room to work in a 20 ft. by 30 ft. room. He wasn't TRYING to hit your character, but he couldn't avoid hitting everyone, and you happened to be the unlucky closest one. And, one more thing. I don't like PvP in Pen and Paper RPGs, it always gets TOO PERSONAL.
Vaelan 02-16-07, 12:24 AM	I doubt that's how it happened, however. This was probably the FIRST fireball that the character had EVER fired. Read all of the posts before replying. Second, he probably had NEVER been warned in character. Read all of the posts before replying. Anyway, my suggestion would be to TALK, especialy for a Militaristic race. (i.e. Hobgoblin, or Drow). Read all of the posts before replying.
johnkretzer 02-16-07, 12:40 AM	Why is this the fighter fault? I mean people are saying"Hey stop rushing into the middle of the mosters damit. You are a fighter your job is to hold the wizard's cloak while he deals with it." The wizard shouldn't not be casting area effect spells. If this happened to you in real life would you just calmly go over and discuss it with @#$% for brains? I would treat it as a attempt on my life. The wizard would have died the first time if he didn't immediatly aplogize for it. The second time if I am restrained from killing him on the account that he must be retared he would be out of the party at the very least. I am sorry but the fighter is fully justified in this act of PvP.
danielinthewolvesden 02-16-07, 03:15 AM	If he does not want to include your PC in the area then he simply aims the template so it misses you. Unless you are playing some sort of odd houserules? Or he is doing that on purpose. In which case, it is not an IC problem, it is a OOC problem, the player is being disruptive. Sit down with him, the DM and the other players and explain that PvP is something that reduces the game fun for you and you would like to not have any more of it, please. If it is an OOC problem, then it can not be solved IC. Killing the Wizard will simply result in that player bring in an assassin that kills your PC in his sleep.Then you bring in a new PC which kills him, and so on.
TheOinodaemon 02-16-07, 03:57 AM	The guy clearly doesn't care that he's causing you a great deal of pain, and frankly singed metal (the armor and the axe) is a pain to clean. Your character just met this guy, I think the attack was justified. In the future delay until the wizard goes. Also, have your character talk to him about battle strategies. Both dwarves and hobgoblins lean toward law, so if you come to an agreement, he might follow it. If he breaks his half, gut him like a fish and wear his skull as a hat.
Elsydeon 02-16-07, 04:36 AM	Very likely it's what I call video game mentality. He's less focused on the character during combat, and more on the victory. Why can't he make you (he's probably got SOME item creation) some resist fire stuff? Or just buy it for you? I'd have a conversation OOC. Tell him that there are ways around having the party member in range, like resist items/potions. That you don't want to cramp his style, but it's not believable that anyone would nuke their ally unless they were NE/CE, were in very dire straits and panicked, or had given their friend resistance. That if he continues to act that way he'll be booted, but you can come up with a pretty entertaining combat style if that's how he wants to play. Then have an in character conversation about the fireball in the back. Tell him that he better look after his friends or they won't be friends anymore. And say that if you are hit with another spell 'coincidentally' before he's found some solution to you getting SET ON FIRE you'll rip his head off and make it your puppet. Honestly, he probably doesn't realize that some people expect you to play your character in combat, or he thinks it's some funny gimmick where the Dwarf is a complete jerk to you. That stuff isn't funny when it escalates to this level, though.
blade18cm 02-16-07, 07:39 AM	One more thing, he DID place it as far away from as many party members as he could, you don't have much room to work in a 20 ft. by 30 ft. room. He wasn't TRYING to hit your character, but he couldn't avoid hitting everyone, and you happened to be the unlucky closest one. And, one more thing. I don't like PvP in Pen and Paper RPGs, it always gets TOO PERSONAL. If he couldn't cast the spell without hitting his own party member then why did he feel he had to cast it??? It was a waste of a powerful spell and not necessary against a weak foe. He was warned several times and acted like he did not care at all that he would be damaging my PC. He didn't believe there would be any consequences for his actions and learned the hard way that there are always consequences... You're right PvP in any RPG gets way too personal and he shouldn't have started it. Being fireballed from a ranged distance is no different than being attacked in melee, only more cowardly. I am ready to accept his aplogy OOC or IC and will return the favor in turn. Otherwise we can continue to play it how he likes.
Dunsel 02-16-07, 03:19 PM	The player is experienced so he is doing this on purpose. A druid in my campaign was warned by the players IC and OOC for the same thing. During the very next battle he centered a spell on the gladiator and rogue. I warned him but he did it anyway. The spell went off and the rogue rolled a '1'; the gladiator rolled a 2 and both failed and took some serious damage from a 14th level druid. They lost some items in the fireball and promptly attacked the druid who tried to leave battle after some heavy damage. They pursued and eventually killed him. His next character was another druid! And yes, he still is lax with his spell aiming and it is only a matter of time before they kill him again. His reasons for the location of the spell, "They were likely to make their saves" and "They were collateral damage. I killed the bad guys didn't I?" We use miniatures for battle so there was no excuse.
danielinthewolvesden 02-16-07, 08:46 PM	His next character was another druid! And yes, he still is lax with his spell aiming and it is only a matter of time before they kill him again. We use miniatures for battle so there was no excuse. Sure there is. You are still playing with this immature :censored: You must sit down with him and the DM and explain that if he does this eve again, you will no longer play with him. If you get the backing of the rest of the players, it will be better.