Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Professor Thac0 02-22-05, 07:34 PM	I am trying to figure out what character to play in a solo campaign. One of my ideas is to be a wizard, I am just wondering if a wizard can make it on his own for the majority of the time at lower levels. I would be starting at 2nd level so that helps a little. I do have very good stats so that helps even more. 15, 16, 15, 17, 9, 15. I was also thinking evocation for my specialty. Any general thoughts would be much appreciated. Ideas for feats, spells, weapons. I just worry that this guy would die before he got really powerful. Wizards depend on protection from the rest of the group at low levels.
eRaz0r 02-22-05, 08:03 PM	Evocation ? No! To rule the world you need to specialize in something .. sneaky. Enchantment/Charms and Compulsions can make your enemies your friends (in and out of combat) Necromancy can turn your fallen foes into smelly allies. Conjuration can bring outsiders from the distant planes to aid you. A Lone Wizard looking to rule the world has to work on a way of getting others to go along with his plans - and to avoid notice as long as possible, because a lone wizard (of any level) is vulnerable to a group of dedicated do-gooders with the will to end his reign of tyranny (often, before it begins). Personally, I'd not bother specializing - no school is worth giving up. If I were to specialize, I'd take Divination and just forgo ... evocation. Conjuration gives you enough damage spells now, and an extra "I want to know what's coming up" divination spell each day can be a real handy thing - far more than an extra fireball. But that's just me.
JohnSnow 02-22-05, 08:08 PM	If it's REALLY a solo campaign, you need to think of a character that can "hold his own" so to speak. A solo wizard is right out. No healing ability, poor BAB, poor hit points, no skills to speak of - all of that HURTS. You're right that being 2nd level helps a little, but I'd say you'd be better off with one of the classes that often gets "downplayed" in multi-player games. Personally, I like Bards, Druids or Rangers, but that's my preference. Barbarians, fighters, wizards and sorcerers are just too much "one-trick ponies." A Paladin or cleric can work (and the solo crusading paladin IS a staple of fiction), but the lack of skills might hurt. Likewise, a rogue is versatile, but the lack of healing would hurt. On the other hand, a good rogue should be able to handle, *ahem* "procuring" healing ability. That said, your stats are good. 17, 16, 15, 15, 15, 9 basically means you have only one sub-average stat. And even that's not TOO bad. Pick your character's desired weak spot, and drop the score there. A solo player MIGHT put it in charisma, to reflect why he's solo, or he might want it someplace else, so that he can deal with people. Self-sufficiency means you want as many OPTIONS as possible. Multiclassing might be something to consider, you'd be better off "focusing" to start off with. Options (Combat, HP, Healing, Skills, Other) Bard 2 (OK, OK, Spells & wands, BETTER, Bardic Song) Druid 2 (OK, GOOD, Spells & wands, GOOD, druid spells and druid abilities) Ranger 2 (BETTER, GOOD, Wands, BETTER, Ranger abilities) Rogue 2 (GOOD, OK, UMD & items, BEST, Evasion) As you progress up, the druid stays VERY competitive as a solo character. Personally, I'd go with one of the above for a solo campaign, but like I said above, that's me. YMMV.
eRaz0r 02-22-05, 08:13 PM	As a one man party - you're better off being a Cleric than a Wizard. Wizards really suck at healing, and staying alive in general. The pay off is pretty good at the high levels, but getting there is your problem. A Cleric is better for solo work. You can hold your own quite well at the low levels, and you just get nastier as you go up. If you're 'good', you can heal yourself spontaneously. If evil, you can animate a bunch of undead and have them be your minions. With those stats, you could consider the ur-priest/nar demonbinder/True Necromancer/Mystic Theurge builds that are going around. This would give you both classes (cleric and wizard) with 9th level spells in at least one of them (by 20th level). I recommend you look at the Character Optimization Boards, and search for Ur-Priest and/or Mystic Theurge and/or True Necromancer. (If your stats are stuck in that order, then you might want try a GISH build instead, which would give you some decent fighting ability - again, I refer you to the Character Optimization boards - search for GISH (don't ask- I don't know why they call them gish), and read through some of those threads for ideas). Edit : Yeah ,there are other classes that are far better than Wizard for solo. I agree the Bard is nice for a generalist, but his best abilities are designed for supporting other characters. I would probably not play a bard as the single character in a campaign to rule the world. Feed the World, maybe. OTOH, if he took the Leadership feat, it's likely he could have some minions of his own who would be buff-targets for his coolest abilities. The Druid is at least as good as the Cleric as a solo character. The ability to change shape is pretty damn cool, and can get you out of some spots that the Cleric has to smite his way clear from. It also means you can spy on people more easily than the Cleric (nothing to see here but this little bird in the tree!) A Ranger makes a decent solo character, but if your target is ruling the world, he's not got the high level power to pull that off. The Rogue, (or the bard!) especially one with Diplomacy up the yin-yang, can make a decent behind-the-throne manipulator at the high levels. He'll be fairly nasty in combat (Especially against people, but not so much vs undead or constructs), and could, through roleplaying rather than personal power, hold some dirt over the heads of the rulers of the world and manipulate them to do what he wants. It's not the same sort of thing you were looking for, I don't think. A few rogue levels can give you some decent skills to help you with another class (if you're multiclassing). But again, Rogues suffer from the fact that ruling the world directly often requires more personal power than they can bring to bear. Unfortunately, becoming an Arcane Trickster requires you give up too much for both classes to be a viable solo track for this sort of thing. I really think Cleric is the best choice - both for roleplaying and mechanical reasons. The Cleric has the greatest reason to rule the world - forcible conversion to worshipping his deity. Druids just don't care enough about that sort o thing (unless 'ruling the world' == 'cleansing the parasites from it and bringing it back to nature'). Your best bet, no matter what, is to get some sort of cohorts/followers as soon as possible.
Super Guy 02-22-05, 08:15 PM	A Rogue is a slow start (you really need to fight to gain experience, and Rogue isn't too great at that. It doesn't have the attack of the fighter or the magic missile of the wizard, so you're in a hard spot) but you can... hm... Start out with petty theft. You can hire muscle. That way, you can adventure safely. Once you get into the higher levels, UMD is godly. Talk about healing yourself, teleporting from trouble, casting time stop (and then righteous might, divine power, stone skin...), the possibilities are endless (though expensive) As for a wizard, don't specialize in anything. Personally, I find it to be a waste, especially when you're on your own. And especially don't focus on evocation. You need tools, not attacks. Some of the advice already offered is great.
Professor Thac0 02-22-05, 08:19 PM	My other 2 ideas were a Druid, and a Fighter Cleric, mainly a cleric though. They seemed like the best for a solo campaign, I just liked the idea of the wizard so I could really go after the power monger angle since that is hard to do in a group setting. I think that I am leaning toward the fighter cleric character. Lawful Good is sometimes hard in a group dynamic...especially with the guys we normally play with.
eRaz0r 02-22-05, 08:40 PM	Well both of those options are more survivable than the straight wizard. If you're going Cleric, don't drop more than 2 levels into Fighter (for the free feats ). You can't rule the world at 20th level without 9th level spells, and personally, unless you've got a very good reason, don't put any fighter levels in there at all. You really don't need them. The Cleric has great armor, can buff themselves out the hoo-har and get the full BAB of the Fighter with a 4th level spell (compared with Wizards who have to wait till they get 6th level spells, 4 levels later). They have a lot of great spells and can access some of the niftiest Wizard spells with the right domains. I guess it comes down to style. What kind of world domination are you aiming for? You mentioned LG... not the best alignment for bending everyone's knee before you...
Nom 02-22-05, 08:58 PM	This is really a question of campaign style. The "balanced party" - Ftr, Clr, Rog, Wiz - is designed to be able to handle just about any situation. The theory is that whatever the CR appropriate challenge, someone will have the right abilities to deal with it. If you're playing a solo campaign, that assumption goes out the window. No solo character is going to be able to handle every situation, so you really need to assume that the adventures will be tailored to your character. At which point the question "what is the best class to take?" becomes somewhat nonsensical.
Andrew_980 02-22-05, 09:04 PM	a lone wizard? If there is combat and no divine intervention? Nope, not a chance unless it is all 1-on-1 with unarmed kobolds
Razoreface 02-22-05, 09:15 PM	Any, and I mean any class, can survive on his own to get as far as he wants. Provided they are careful. A level 10 Wizard can't go and fight a CR 11 dragon. He'll die. A lone character has less than a quarter of the survivability of a party of four, and he has to pick his encounters accordingly.
Alathriel 02-22-05, 11:20 PM	I didn't do it from Level 1 on... but around Level 9 my character went solo and left the group because he became evil, and he didn't fit with the other characters. This was 2nd ed, but the same principle will apply. He went from 9 to level 12, and during that time fought solo often and did very well at it. But before that, he often did things on his own and gained power on his own through one thing... leeching. Yes, you've heard it right. Leeching. My most favorite character leeched his way to the top alot, and I'm not afraid to admit it. He joined a group of mostly good adventurers with strong fighter support, and he went on adventures with them and shared in the spoils and exp even though for some fights he got knocked out. Just because your character is solo doesn't mean he does everything alone. I'm sure your DM will not throw the same type of stuff at you that he would a whole party of adventurers. What your wizard can do is find a group of adventurers (NPCs) to adventure with, and then gain his experience and treasure through teamwork and.. in effect, leeching :) A wizard is a very rewarding class to play because in effect, he can achieve great ends and seek godhood and all that craziness in a way that a Cleric or Druid cannot. A cleric still has to be a slave to his deity and the deity could take his powers away like that, and a druid must still rely on the power of nature for his spells and frankly there are just some times that nature just doesn't cut it like raw arcane magic does. This is coming from a neutral evil standpoint, mind you, but you said you want to go for power. Wizard=power. Believe me. My wizard achieved magical items that border on artifact power, has his own mansion with servants and mercenary guards, his own laboratory, and has over 43 million gold pieces, all won through adventures and assassinations. But also, I have a ton of enemies.. ranging from the Red Wizards of Thay to the Priesthood of Chauntea and alot of Illithids. Let's say the ride was very tough, and even at the point where I last played the character he was betrayed by a friend. So, in summary.. power corrupts, it is fun, and can be done with a wizard. But always look over your shoulder. Always. I had other character ideas at the time but I'm glad I went with wizard. Fits my personality and worked perfectly for great roleplay and powerful growth. Just play what you think would satisfy you the most!
Dauntless 02-22-05, 11:49 PM	I am trying to figure out what character to play in a solo campaign. One of my ideas is to be a wizard, I am just wondering if a wizard can make it on his own for the majority of the time at lower levels. I would be starting at 2nd level so that helps a little. I do have very good stats so that helps even more. 15, 16, 15, 17, 9, 15. I was also thinking evocation for my specialty. Any general thoughts would be much appreciated. Ideas for feats, spells, weapons. I just worry that this guy would die before he got really powerful. Wizards depend on protection from the rest of the group at low levels. eRazOr had the best suggestions so far. Ignore everyone talking about survivability and whatnot. When you're working alone, the main way you survive is by picking and choosing your fights. You don't go dungeon delving alone, period. I don't care what class you are. Depending on your objective, your build can go a number of ways. Evocation is probably the worst one. Enchantment is probably your best bet, because frankly you don't want to be going into combat if you don't have to. Personally I'd specialize in Enchantment and drop necromancy and evocation. Damage can be replicated via conjuration, and necromancy, while it has some nice spells, isn't necessary. That extra spell per day will be more useful. Grab spell focus: enchantment, and slap the 17 into int. Charm Person will become your favorite spell. If you have to roll initiative, you've already lost. If you absolutely MUST kill someone, think like a professional hitman. You don't live very long in that business by busting down doors with fireballs. You have to use careful planning if you want to survive.
ServantOfTheLordYawgmoth 02-23-05, 10:06 AM	I'd agree that Wizard is a perfectly suitable choice. In fact,a wizard is probably one of the best choices for this sort of campaign. You'll have the intelligence to lead a group well and plan your assaults. And as has been said before, don't think for an instant that you won't have a group with you. Mercenaries are cheap and expendable(especially if you move around a lot and plan on dominating the world). It's a lot easier to higher a couple of thugs as meatshields than it is to higher an arcane caster as backup. Not only are they more numerous in most settings, but they're also less intelligent, and thus easier to manipulate into doing your bidding even when it might prove fatal. Just don't let word get out that you're hiring expendable mercenaries. It tends to be bad for business. Just remember that playing alone does not means that your character will adventure alone and you'll be fine.
mcnoo 02-23-05, 10:33 AM	I'd say sorcerer rather than wizard, because you have to do everything yourself you will need to be very flexible.
CuttinCurt 02-23-05, 11:29 AM	I agree with the cleric advice, although, being a solo campaign, you might want more from your character. An Idea to help you might be going cleric/wizard, with cleric going up first to get you hp, bab, and healing. Then go back to wizard. Perhaps the Thuramagist sp? prestige class that lets you go up as a wizard and cleric at the same time for spell casting level could be good, but you give up bab, but your spell selection would be nice. With Quickened spell, this could be a great class at higher levels while giving you the ability to survive at low levels. CC
Thoronmir 02-23-05, 11:44 AM	There’s been some good suggestions made so far, but you also need to have this discussion with your DM. Find out how he plans to approach the solo campaign. Some DMs refuse to take into account the party’s make up when planning adventures (even if it’s a one-man party) … “No Rogue in the group? Too bad, here’s a dungeon laden with traps, good luck.” When I’ve DMed solo (or duo) campaigns, I’ve encouraged players to select PCs they want to play without regard for what type of character is most likely to survive a fight. I’m willing to make accommodations to ensure that everyone enjoys the campaign. All it takes is devising different types of challenges for the PC to overcome. So, sounding out your DM on his style may provide some guidance. The campaign’s setting may also affect your decision. Personally, I’ve never enjoyed playing Clerics and would choose just about anything else to play, especially if magic is sufficiently prevalent in the campaign world for me to stockpile healing potions. So, again, it comes down to talking to your DM.
Super Guy 02-23-05, 12:06 PM	Now that I've had more time to think of it, the question which will make it and RULE the world? Definitely either Rogue or Bard. Slight chance for Sorceror and slighter Wizard. It's not about power. It's about escape from trouble, and the charisma and diplomacy to get people on your side. And it doesn't hurt to rule the mafia (aka thieves' guild) What's going to get you there? A fighter? No, he's the guy that GUARDS the guy that rules the world. A cleric? Not flexible enough, and no arcane power, that especially rogues have (UMD is godly, trust me). A wizard? Probably doesn't have the right charm, and even if he can dominate, when his minions aren't near him they may be disenchanted. The Rogue and Bard are both the best candidates for 'ruling the world'. However, for the Bard, his face will be lost to everyone because he changes so much, but he's quite famous. For the Rogue, no one will know he even exists, only rumors.
Bonzai 02-23-05, 08:18 PM	I have played Solo with a wizard (Actually Necromancer/palemaster) from time to time when groups couldn't come together and to catch up from item creation, and have done ok. The key is to be a coward at the low lvls, preparation, and circumventing weaknesses. Early on, my keys to survival were relying on my familiar and utilizing it to it's best potential (scouting, delivering touch attacks, etc...), picking spells that give the maximum impact (Burning hands for example, early AoE that scales niceley for a while), and after having a few lvls under your belt summons are a huge help (Summon undead line in this case). Healing wasn't a factor as I took tomb tainted soul, and latter on I turned a rogue into a ghoul under my control (through the ghoul gauntlet spell) and so I have a trapfinder/lockpicker. Latter on, I got a mummy/cleric cohort, so I almost have a party through my minions. Any class can work solo, you just have to work around your limitations. If your a warrior, spend points in healing and or buy potions and equipement. If your a rogue, you may want to hire muscle. You get the idea..
Razoreface 02-23-05, 09:28 PM	Slight chance for Sorceror...... ......It's not about power. It's about escape from trouble, and the charisma and diplomacy to get people on your side. I'd just like to point out that I find this a really ironic statement. Even without them as class skills, a Sorc starting at 18 can get up to 32 with non-epics. A +11 to his social skills. Thems be some charisma. Wiz can go the other way. CC away his intelligence bonus skills into the social skills. Unless his charisma is abyssal, he can pretty much match the Sorc in those skills.
feartheinvinceblehamster 02-23-05, 09:34 PM	hey, wiz isn't to bad, my sorcereor has survived to be 4th lvl so far, but that might have something to do with his pistol and whip of rust monster tendrils
PhaedrusXY 02-23-05, 09:44 PM	Yes, a wizard can survive in a solo campaign. Make liberal use of Charm Person (for bodyguards/cannon fodder) and running away at the lower levels. Obscuring Mist combined with Rope Trick is a great getaway trick. At the upper levels, this becomes Contingency: If I lose Initiative, I teleport away to safety (or however you want to phrase that). Also, later on make good use of Magic Jar. Why risk your own body, when you can use someone else's? :P When Magic Jarred, change your Contingency to: If someone casts Greater Dispel Magic at me, I Dimension Door 1000 feet straight up. (Or something like that). And keep a Clone hidden away somewhere, just in case. Have a spellstitched mindless undead with Gentle Repose as a spell-like ability entombed with it to keep it fresh. Becoming a lich at the upper levels might be a good idea, also. I'd still use Magic Jar frequently, though. A well-built druid or cleric might be a bit more powerful at the higher levels overall, and definitely is easier to survive with throughout all levels. But I still prefer playing a wizard, especially if you're going to be a megalomaniac trying to take over the world.
Gralock 02-23-05, 10:42 PM	i would take leadership as my 6th level feat and select a cleric as my co-hort and a base of followers that were mainly miltia men, build a stronghold as a base to the story as well as to increase your leaderscrip value, have a good charisma, and a good spell selection (enlarge person, bulls str, and hastes will make your army much more vicious than it is and you'll never fret over missing a mellee touch attack, ranged touch attack or save as all these spells are buffs) . at that point i think you would have enough arsenal to hold your own. maybe, if you go human take human paragon to buff up you int and give you a means to a martial weapon prof
Wizard 02-24-05, 12:41 AM	You know, for what would be probably be the most fun flavor-wise...specialize in Necromancy. Kill 'em and raise 'em. Watch as your enemies flee their former friends. And then make darn sure you've got ray attacks to kill any nasty high AC clerics that come knocking. :)
Agifem 02-24-05, 06:57 AM	Wizard is an excellent choice to either survive, or simply rule, the world. Depending on your DM, the right use of the right spell at the right time can save your butt countless times, when swinging a sword or singing a song is not enough. Divination spells give you incredibly useful insights. Enchantement spells can make up for the lack of social skills that, in fact, you don't lack (thank you, high intelligence). Transmutation has some nice opportunities to shine. It's true you have neither good BAB nor HP, but a wizard who gets hit is a poor wizard, and a wizard who goes in melee is an even poorer one. The main thing you might lack is healing spells, but going Mystic Theurge can help here.
sooperspook 02-24-05, 07:58 AM	Formula: take one human. Add Able Learner (Races of Destiny) and Collegiate Wizard (Cmplete Arcane).At low levels use divination, abjuration and enchantment or illusion magics. Dont go head to head. Use divinations to find out weaknesses or ways around problems. Flying familliars make good scouts. Ravens can even talk to you at 1st level. Hire a body guard soon as you can afford it. You get Scribe Scroll for free. USE IT. Buff your body guard if you get into combat. DONT stay in a fight if you have a less than 60% chance of winning. Once you hit 3rd level start to use invocation or conjuration. if you often go one on one, necromancy is your best bet. Take UMD from early on. With Able Learner you can afford it. get up to about 5 ranks. eagles splendor and a good Cha base score means you have a good chance of activating wands of cure light. a good Cha also means you can win over others trust and loyalty. you need this if you want to rule without too many assassins coming after you. Take Ride. Purchase a steed as soon as you can. Save you having to run AND carry your heavy spell book. Proffesion(apothecary) is good for a few extra gp when you need it. Dont forget Craft (alchemy) and Heal. always useful. my stat sugestion: Str 9 not all that important to a wizard. Dex 15 AC , Reflex Ranged attacks also Ride skill. Con 16 needed for extra hp , Fort saves and the concentration skill. Int 17 Pretty obvious , spells, save DC , spell level, skill points, Proffesion and Knowledge skills. Wis 15 Spot, Listen, Sense motive . all useful to and adventuring wizard. the last especially in social situations. will save are already good. Cha 15 UMD, and all social encounters. from your ability increases i'd put them in this order. Dex, Int, Str(carry capacity becomes more important later on) Int, Cha For budding rulers, Leadership is a MUST.
Vharuck 02-24-05, 11:14 AM	You won't be the traditional dungeon crawler. You'll need to craft brilliant plans to seize power and magic. Wow. Sounds like my BBEGs. :D
MrMorden 02-24-05, 10:30 PM	Don't listen to all these "a wizard can't survive on his own" doomsayers. It all really depends on your DM. A good DM will craft challenges that match your skillset. He won't throw hordes of physical challenges at you as a wizard, nor would he throw lots of magical challenges at you as a fighter! If you trust your DM to be appropriate to what you play, you should be able to survive equally well with any class. Take a high CON score and maybe the toughness feat to give you a few extra HP, and I think you'll be okay.
Mandarbgrim 02-24-05, 10:44 PM	Why doesn't anyone mention Monk? I agree with the earlier statements..play what you want to play. Play the character concept that you like that most, and see as the most feasible to plot to rule the world.
Scarlet Knight 02-24-05, 11:08 PM	Be a Mystic Theurge! Start off as a cleric 1/wizard 1, Str 9, Dex 15, Con 15, Int 17, Wis 16, Cha 15. If you specialize as a wizard, drop Necromancy, since clerics are better at raising and controlling undead. Carry a crossbow.
Loren Pechtel 02-24-05, 11:36 PM	from your ability increases i'd put them in this order. Dex, Int, Str(carry capacity becomes more important later on) Int, Cha For budding rulers, Leadership is a MUST. I don't understand. I'd put all the stat boosts in Int. It's simply not that expensive to raise a stat by 2 with an item.
sooperspook 02-25-05, 03:52 AM	Items can be dispelled. and if youre loaded down stuff (like magic items) and your strength boosting magic is nullified somehow you could be in trouble. You dont really need an Int score of more than 19 pre-Epic. 19 already gives you access to 9th level spells and DC boosting items arent that difficult to make. if youre smart (as a wizard should be) you'll know which spells work best on different foes no matter what the save DC is. The bonus spell slots become less important as you get higher becase you should have numerous scroll/wands/potions by then. As a uman you get an extra skill point per level anyway so the skill boost isnt that big of a problem. Dex increases your Ref which is a poor save for a wizard. You could replace it with con to boost your Fort and hp, I just thought that by that point you won't be getting into many combats yourself. you should have minions doing the actual fighting while you supply artillery and buff support. Cha because it increases the number of followers and the level of your cohort. it also improves your social skills which are definately nessicary (sp?) for someone who wants to rule the world.
PhaedrusXY 02-25-05, 04:13 AM	Items can be dispelled. and if youre loaded down stuff (like magic items) and your strength boosting magic is nullified somehow you could be in trouble. You dont really need an Int score of more than 19 pre-Epic. 19 already gives you access to 9th level spells and DC boosting items arent that difficult to make. if youre smart (as a wizard should be) you'll know which spells work best on different foes no matter what the save DC is. The bonus spell slots become less important as you get higher becase you should have numerous scroll/wands/potions by then. As a uman you get an extra skill point per level anyway so the skill boost isnt that big of a problem. I couldn't disagree much more. Boost your Int as much as possible. ALL of your class abilities are reliant on it. If you're using a low point buy, don't totally dump Con and Dex, but I certainly don't agree that 19 is "good enough" pre-epic. There is no such thing as having too high of an Int as a wizard.
was_fired 02-25-05, 07:20 AM	19 is good enough without magic. Depending on your point buy (which they guy didn't use) other stats can become really important. The most obvious being dex and con.
steenan 02-25-05, 08:50 PM	With your stats (15, 16, 15, 17, 9, 15) I would dump strength, put 17 in Int, 16 in Con and 15 in the rest. I think it's better to add points from levels to all odd scores than to rise only Int. Leadership is a must. Get a cleric as a cohort - he'll be both your meatshield and your healer. Get Craft Wondrous Item and later Craft Staff. Make all the items you will need. Don't specialize. One more spell of every level isn't worth giving up two schools (even if you rarely use some spells, they may be useful for crafting items with them). Last but not least - clever use of enchantments can give you a small army even on low levels. At least until someone dispells magic...