Post/Author/DateTime	Post
mazaudi 04-12-04, 05:06 AM	Two friends and I started to play with these other three guys. Two were friends and the other is the one guys son. We decided to let the one guy(without the son) to DM. From the beginning he had some wacky ideas but for the most part it was ok even though he really didn't know the rules too well and went a little skill crazy, and gave bonus experience for "roleplaying" which has since changed my views on giving RPing xp bonuses. Soon it became obvious that the DM was favoring anyone who worshipped the god Tyr expecially his friend(with the son) who was a priest of Tyr. The priest did all sorts of things taht should have had Tyr scratching his head. Like wanting to kill inoccents, obsene jestures, hording curing spell ect ect. Anytime we joked about the priest being hit by lightning for these acts the Dm (His friend) would just smile and shake his head. Some of the things that this prest recieved for being so pious... 1) equipment from Tyr like a sword that gains abilities as he gains levels. So far it is +4 int lawful and good holy adamite(sp?) longsword. He recieved this at 8th level we are 12th now 2) heavy armors that the DM knows only two worshipers of Tyr can use. Meanwhile the other classes get nothing for their ac's 3) Priest has died 2 times so far and even with the losses of xp from levels he continues to catch up to us in xp's 4) Bonus spell like ablilites granted by Tyr 5) When rewarded he recieves magical items the other players get non-magical items that sometimes you need to waste a feat to use. The only magic item the monk ever got by 12th level was a cursed cloak of poisonous, and a cord that lets you feather fall once. The DM was very angry that the player of the monk was annoyed with such crappy items. Saying that there is more to his monk than magic item. Eventually my friends and I were so annoyed we hatched a plot to let the DM know how serious that we were about the way "Tyr" turns a blind eye to anything bad the priest does. One of the players challenged the Priest saying that if "tyr" would do nothing to warn the priest of his trangressions she (a scorcerer) would have to take matters into her own hands and Odin (her god) will decide if she was right or wrong. The priest accepted the challenge which the DM thought was AWESOME and combat started. It soon was obvious that the Scorcerer was going to defeat the priest (swiftly)which caused the DM to show a lack of interest and pretent to fall asleep. The priest died because he refused to accept defeat. After, the DM decided that it was all a dream and the priest was alive again with the knowledge of what happened. This was at 9th level and since then the priest has taken 3 paladin levels and is still as annoying as ever. It has to be said that the DM finally did do something to punish the priest by taking away his domain spells for a week. But it is kind of too little to late. My questions are... Does anyone have any advise on what can be done (tactfully) with the DM? Even though I would like to salvage the group does anyone think there is a chance? Was it right to attack and kill the priest even though he was asked several times if he would give up? I have played for a long time but have never encountered anything like this. :sad:
The White Knight 04-12-04, 07:10 AM	First kill the favoured guy. Dump him in a lead coffin with 5 feet thick walls and arcane lock it. Then magically trap it with as much stuff as possible and threaten to dump him in the sea unless the DM stops favouring him. Or anyone who doesn't like it leaves and starts a new D&D group
Salla 04-12-04, 10:10 AM	There's no point in killing the favored guy; the DM will just have Tyr resurrect him as a demi-god and he'll come back and mince you all like babies in blenders. Just ... leave. Don't bother saying why, this guy is obviously too thick to care enough to improve his game. Just don't show up next time.
Burner 04-12-04, 01:16 PM	Killing the favored guy won't work, because if he really is that favorable, he ain't gonna die. Instead, do whatever it takes to stop the DM's favorableness. Talk to him, leave the group, do whatever you have to to end this.
mrpink213 04-12-04, 02:25 PM	I too have a similar problem, My friends and i just started a campaign and one player wanted to play a character from another campaign that gotscrewed up. It just so happens that this character had plenty of magical gear in a magic lite capmaign, and the Dm of this new campaing was the one who made him. I started play with a level one hexblade with no money and a -1 sword(backround thing). He started play as a level 2or 3 ranger with two +1/+1 shortswords that dispel magic, lay on hands and deal an additional 1d6 damage to evil creatures, essentially turning the ranger into a multiclass paladin. Now at level 4 i have a +1/+1 longsword, but the dm has added more abilities to the shortswords. Its annoying but i still enjoy my character a lot and because of that am staying in the campaign. Not sure the point of telling you this, just seemed like a good enough thread to vent :) seriously though, start worshiping Tyr, see what happens, not only worshiping him but worshiping him in the appropriate fashion(no killing innocents etc.) make the preist look really bad in the eyes of tyr (hehe eyes of tyr).
Remnant 04-12-04, 02:28 PM	Actually, this doesn't seem like too bad a case. 3) Priest has died 2 times so far and even with the losses of xp from levels he continues to catch up to us in xp's Are you aware that, if xp is calculated correctly, this should always be true? XP awards should be calculated individually, where (1/party size)*(experience if defeated encounter alone). This means that lower level characters will earn more experience characters in the same party who are higher level, and participated in the same encounter. Additionally, if the priest has died twice, and must catch up with you, it would not seem to be the case that the DM has made him unstoppable. Also, the DM seems to know his behavior is inappropriate, since he did remove the domain spells. It sounds like the DM just doesn't want to anger his friend. In worse cases, an avatar of Tyr would have come and slain the sorceress for attacking the favored player. You should talk to both the DM and the player, trying not to cause either of them to get defensive. Tell them that you aren't having much fun being treated as second-class PCs. I don't think this group is unsalvagable at all.
wdarkk 04-12-04, 02:33 PM	Even if the XP isn't that bad, the items seem to be, as well as the random "it was a dream" thing. I recommend fire. If you don't mind going to jail, I'd recommend the "Tourist Matches" you can get in Russia. Import some. Those things will set anything on fire, and cannot be put out. They'll melt through glass and ceramic like crazy, to say nothing of weaker materials. Kidding aside, I'd recommend confronting him en-masse about this. If he won't relent, fire him (as in leave, not burn). Get a new DM if he won't stop being a jerk.
Salla 04-12-04, 02:45 PM	Originally posted by wdarkk Kidding aside, I'd recommend confronting him en-masse about this. If he won't relent, fire him (as in leave, not burn). I take the contrary position. I recommend actual fire.:r:
mazaudi 04-12-04, 03:51 PM	Originally posted by The White Knight First kill the favoured guy. Dump him in a lead coffin with 5 feet thick walls and arcane lock it. Then magically trap it with as much stuff as possible and threaten to dump him in the sea unless the DM stops favouring him. Or anyone who doesn't like it leaves and starts a new D&D group Now I only need to find a lead coffin. :devil:
mazaudi 04-12-04, 03:55 PM	Originally posted by mrpink213 seriously though, start worshiping Tyr, see what happens, not only worshiping him but worshiping him in the appropriate fashion(no killing innocents etc.) make the preist look really bad in the eyes of tyr (hehe eyes of tyr). I was thinking of that but personally I feel Tyr god of justice is a little boring and old. I perfer odin and Sif because they represent magic and skill. Did I mention I was the scorceress?? :angel:
Salla 04-12-04, 04:05 PM	mrpink213 just gave me an inspiration. Worship Tyr ... like the other player does, but moreso. Incinerate EVERYTHING in sight, pillage, slaughter, murder, maim, tickle, rip, sue, blast and/or break everything and everybody you can. Then demand equal goodies from Tyr for doing his work.
mazaudi 04-12-04, 04:08 PM	Originally posted by Remnant Actually, this doesn't seem like too bad a case. Are you aware that, if xp is calculated correctly, this should always be true? XP awards should be calculated individually, where (1/party size)*(experience if defeated encounter alone). This means that lower level characters will earn more experience characters in the same party who are higher level, and participated in the same encounter. Additionally, if the priest has died twice, and must catch up with you, it would not seem to be the case that the DM has made him unstoppable. Also, the DM seems to know his behavior is inappropriate, since he did remove the domain spells. It sounds like the DM just doesn't want to anger his friend. In worse cases, an avatar of Tyr would have come and slain the sorceress for attacking the favored player. You should talk to both the DM and the player, trying not to cause either of them to get defensive. Tell them that you aren't having much fun being treated as second-class PCs. I don't think this group is unsalvagable at all. Well the DM doesn't do xp's that way. It is done by average party level and everyone gets an equal share EXCEPT for RP experience. The only thing that keeps the priest close to our xp's is that he does keep dying. As far as the priest dying and not being unstoppable... He actually has died 4 times and one was a dream and one was an illusion... But there always seems to be a resurection handy when he dies though... The DM wouldn't be so obvious as to have the avatar of Tyr appear or my friends and I would have left right there and then. There has been a little talk about not being included in story lines and the DM just says that he is the only one that gave him a background which is absolutely false!! Two of us have had our backgrounds completed. BUT my other friend was converted on the spot to Tyr and got a special sword which has NOT been improving (+1/+3 vs giants int adamantite longsword) kind of pales in comparison to the Priests sword and to this day we have not fought a giant.
Kyuketsukiouji 04-12-04, 04:14 PM	There are two approaches you can take to a situation like this, and the one you choose shows how mature you are and how interested in being a good player. The mature approach is to tell the DM your problem, ask him to do something about it, and leave if he doesn't. The other approach has already been exhaustively commented on by others.
mazaudi 04-12-04, 04:36 PM	Originally posted by wdarkk Even if the XP isn't that bad, the items seem to be, as well as the random "it was a dream" thing. I recommend fire. Kidding aside, I'd recommend confronting him en-masse about this. If he won't relent, fire him (as in leave, not burn). Get a new DM if he won't stop being a jerk. We went out and bought lighters!!! :mage: Well confronting him is a possibility but the last time the DM felt critisized he packed up his toys and went home. But not before he insulted my friends and I. All that was said was sometimes it seems like you are out to kill off our characters. :sad: And yes I know... if he wanted to kill us he is the DM and could. What was ment by the comment was that he needs to brush up on his CR's. Routinely fighting creatures who are 2-6 cr's higher than the average group level and most of the group not having magic items equal to our own cr's is really tough. It took 2 months to get back together but all we did was finish the combat we were in before the DM stomped off. It just hasn't been the same. :sad:
feng the barbarian 04-12-04, 05:53 PM	i don't think the group will work.
Kronk LaSworda 04-12-04, 05:53 PM	Well confronting him is a possibility but the last time the DM felt critisized he packed up his toys and went home. OK. So far, he is a crybaby, plays favorites, and doesn't enforce a deities tennants. My question to you is: "are you having fun? Are the other guys (non-favorites) having fun?" You have already brought this to the GMs attention and he didn't do anything. That was good on your part, bad on his. Always be honest with bad GMs or Players first. THat was step 1. Step 2: Start a new group with the other players. Take over GMing responsibilities for the new group. You can do it. Round up one or two more players. If you aren't having fun, why are you playing a game? Personally, I have so little gaming time that I can't afford to play with people I don't like or games I don't fit (and vice-versa). Good luck.
mazaudi 04-12-04, 06:42 PM	Originally posted by Kronk LaSworda OK. So far, he is a crybaby, plays favorites, and doesn't enforce a deities tennants. My question to you is: "are you having fun? Are the other guys (non-favorites) having fun?" You have already brought this to the GMs attention and he didn't do anything. That was good on your part, bad on his. Always be honest with bad GMs or Players first. THat was step 1. Step 2: Start a new group with the other players. Take over GMing responsibilities for the new group. You can do it. Round up one or two more players. If you aren't having fun, why are you playing a game? Personally, I have so little gaming time that I can't afford to play with people I don't like or games I don't fit (and vice-versa). Good luck. The only reason why I think that we are playing still is because 40% of the time it is ok and personally I have DMed for a long long time and want to take a break. Which origionally that was the deal... We would play for 4-5 sessions as him as DM and then I would take over. obviously that hasn't happened. The few times I did DM when they other guy wasn't available his friend who plays the priest starts to do other things like look things up on the computer, play video games while everyone else is having a great time he says he is listening but as a DM how would you react?? So now I refuse to DM him or Atilla the DM. Personally I think it is payback for p!ssing off his friend... Thanks for all the feedback you guys are giving it is starting to be clear what I have to do.... Offer to DM the third player in their group... put the priests player in a 5'thick arcane locked coffin and bury him then set the DM on fire. :D what do you think?? :schemes:
The White Knight 04-12-04, 11:05 PM	nice work, always use an exalted characters ideas. They get to cotmeplate them but can't go through with them, so just give them to someone else to do. The exalted character has all that time to contemplate. personally i think the coffin idea is good, but i could do better. think about it. Find a dragon or summon one thats devoted to tyr cast invisibilty on it and show the priests little flaws. Don't kill the guy, the DM can resurrect him, tyr can always get though lead. When i said "put him in a lead coffin and arcane lock it i was refering to the idea of no mortal could possibly open it unless sacrificing his life. What you can do, and without the DM resurecting him is when in a dungeon have a charcter knock him out place him in a room and arcane lock it. Then cast a summoning spell for a succubus and you'll never see him again. :D Also consider that if this happens the DM may allow the player to start another character. Just sell the charcters he makes as slaves to various creatures. When at a hobgoblin strong-hold shackle him up and leave him with a note (A slave for you, love Maglubiyet (for any person out there not knowing who this is its the goblin god). Life without smart ways for getting rid of unwated characters would be boring, thats why in every movie silent choirs start to sing when a charcter is near to death and is dying or dead. My advice; work with what the DM gives you, and make it unprevenatble!!!!!:mad:
Zendu 04-13-04, 06:53 AM	Ask the dm what you have to do to get your hands on the rp xp. Surly theres nothing wrong with a player who wants to rp more. As a dm i understand the dream thing, you have to try to keep everyone happy, but i whould point out that you did say you wanted to kill him, and you did intend to ressuerect him /to little to late Do something in game! Ask the tyr church what they consider reasonable behavior, maybe this will jog the dms memory. Go on strike! If the cleric wont cast healing spells, maybe you wont cast fireballs all the time, or even better, next time theres a huge cliff, only cast fly on your friends, let him climb it. If hes not using his abilitys to the max of the group, either should you. Offer to DM yourself!!!!!! DMs like to play, its much less work, and maybe he can see something in your style.
Sir Todd 04-13-04, 07:57 AM	It sounds like you know what you need to do. Take over GMing again and politely ask the two trouble makers not to return. If its possible for the third player to continue attending then thats good. It seems like no one has any problems with him. You have already tried both approaches: Talking to the DM did nothing, And killing the offending character only got the 'it was just a dream' excuse. The only recourse left is to remove the bad people. On a side note: Playing favorites is wrong. There is nothing wrong with focusing on one character as long as that focus passes to different characters regularly such that no one character is constantly favored any more than any other. My advice: Put up an advertisement in a hobby shop or gaming store for new people. Clearly you need new blood at the table.
Edymnion 04-13-04, 12:24 PM	Hey, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em! Retire your sorcerer and make up a Paladin of Tyr, which means you will become God. Actually, I prefer the "Get up and walk out" approach. Warn the DM that if it doesn't stop, and if he doesn't treat everyone equally, you will simply stop playing with him. If he doe sit again, just stand up in the middle of the game, pack your stuff up, and leave. If the entire table does that, it'll just leave the DM and the guy playing the favored character. Hope they enjoy their one on one campaign (heck, they might prefer it that way!). Start a new group yourself, find another group to join up with, or even try playing online. There is a link to a simply fabulous online roleplaying site in my sig.
Moonstonedragon 04-13-04, 12:58 PM	Agree, either walk out or talk to him. Dont really start yelling or anything, just take the dm aside and say that it has to stop or he'll lose players, most dms i know dont like losing players at all, me being one of them. If he doesnt shape up then you have no choice but to bare with it or leave =(
Nick Soapdish 04-13-04, 10:17 PM	Quit and organize your own group, maybe with just your two friends. It is possible to play with only 3 people, or even only two. The DM (and players) just need to be more careful. But playing in the current group doesn't sound worth it if 40% of it is "ok" and the rest is the junk that you just mentioned. I empathize with wanting to take a break from DMing. I'd love to myself. I have a player that's been working on a campaign for about 3 years now, but he just hasn't had enough time to put it together and isn't experienced enough to be willing to freelance it.
Edymnion 04-14-04, 10:18 AM	Originally posted by Nick Soapdish Quit and organize your own group, maybe with just your two friends. It is possible to play with only 3 people, or even only two. The DM (and players) just need to be more careful. Actually, that would be a great oppertunity to try out some Gestalt characters :D