Dm/player conflict [Archive] - Wizards Community

Dm/player conflict [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Sae Cael Oanar
12-18-05, 06:38 PM ok heres the story.

ive been playing with this guy for like four years, like the whole group has been together, different dms, different characters, always mixing it up and stuff.

anyway, the current dm, who basically took over and has held the position like a dictator for the past year and a half or so, is starting to get to me. i like playing the game, and even if i got the rest of the people to quit and like play in a seperate game, it wouldnt be as good, because truth be told, he is a good dm.

by good dm, i mean he knows what hes doing, he also has alot of bad points.

he railroads, he has specific premade adventures and if we dont accept them it pisses him off until we do. i dont dig this, it doesnt really give the characters an identity. basically if we step out of line, we have to un-step out of line, its treated as if we never did. its also getting pretty scrict with the ammount of house rules that limit ooc talking, which in truth i enjoy. really i play dnd to hang out with my friends and have some fun.

the session today, which i guess put it all over the edge, was pretty bad. he made us buy an expensive apartment in the nice part of sharn, and we couldnt even spend that much time figuring out what we wanted it to be like, because he didnt find that important. he also prevented two rogue characters (one of which since character creation wanted to be an assassin) search for an assassins guild, reasoning that they have a job as adventurers and therefore wouldnt do that. he frequently says things like "your character wouldnt do that" which seems like hes kind of stepping out of his dm powers. i understand in certain cases, but without explanation it just seems harsh. also, he prevented the rogues from fighting someone in a casino we were in. i understand that its game disrupting, but people lose their tempers, and its possible for someone to start a fight, not even necessarily kill, and there were gaurds, but the encounter never happened. i think if i want to punch someone in the face in dnd i should be able to.

i dont really know what to do any more as far as this is concerned. i dont really want to quit, but playing is just tedious, as we really just seem to be his puppets in a unconstructed campaign.
20goingon1232
12-18-05, 06:44 PM I'm afraid you only have 1 option open to you, really, IF you want the situation to improve, and you already know what it is, although you don't want to do it.

If I were you, make another campaign and DM it, inviting everyone along. Then apply his rules and his actions (especially the "your character won't do this" nonsense) to him and him only. Let him see how stupid they are from the other side of the screen. Then ask him point blank (after a session or two), in front of everyone, how he liked the game so far.

It should clear a few things up.
CryoSilver
12-18-05, 07:55 PM You could quit.

Or smear his house with offal.

Or stab him.

But quitting is probably best.
ConradBland
12-18-05, 08:21 PM i dont really want to quit, but playing is just tedious, as we really just seem to be his puppets in a unconstructed campaign.

If you aren't having fun, why play?
TLomon
12-18-05, 08:33 PM My wife and I had the same problem with a DM. His world was extremely detailed, but he controlled every bit of interaction we had with it. Even our characters were assigned to us. I sometimes suspected we were reliving his favorite campaign again.

I hate to say it, but I think quiting is the best option.
nastynate
12-18-05, 08:40 PM Try offering him a break. Sometimes DMs need a little time to recharge the batteries. Ask everyone if they'd mind playing a short one-shot DMed by somebody else here and there. It'll give him more time to prepare his next seried of adventures, and expose him as a player to a different kind of game mastering style.

Dm's often work very hard to keep things going in the right direction, and think the players are too easily side tracked by inconsequential events. I know that on numerous occasions while I was DMing, my players have been fascinated by NPCs that I only intended to be background characters.

Maybe he's exerting more control over your PCs because you are deviating from his story line. It's much harder to improvise in a setting that has real goals and objectives, time-lines, and consequences that can't be explained to the players without revealing too much about the over all plot.

Maybe he has his own personal vision of the PCs in his head, based upon what they've done up until now, and he honestly feels you are sometimes acting in a manner inconsistent with your established character.

After a while it's really hard to let go of the reigns, or admit things didn't go as planned. What I've found is that it's good to have a back-up DM among your own group to spell the primary DM from time to time. It keeps your primary DM fresh, and exposes him to the role of PC more often. It's much easier to relate to the players when you are one.
Leukrythus
12-18-05, 08:41 PM My wife and I had the same problem with a DM. His world was extremely detailed, but he controlled every bit of interaction we had with it. Even our characters were assigned to us. I sometimes suspected we were reliving his favorite campaign again.

I hate to say it, but I think quiting is the best option.

Been there, done that, threw out the character sheet.
Hatgirl
12-18-05, 09:39 PM There are a lot of threads on these boards about this type of thing. The reality is a lot of DM's do this and don't even know it.

You have to talk to him. Tell him about your issues and what you are thinking. Tell him you aren't having fun. If a DM never gets feedback from his players he will probably assume he is doing a good job and just keep doing the same thing. You can't expect him to change if you don't ever tell him about the things that bug you. (oh, and by the way, this is good advice for any relationship)

If telling him you aren't having fun doesn't get him to ask how he can fix it and try to make things more fun for the players you will probably need to find a new game, but you have to try talking to him first.

People on these boards tend to come up with some very interesting but mean ways of dealing with things and reality is they don't work and you wouldn't like it if someone did it to you. Try DMing some time, it's very hard. I'm sure your DM is trying his best and will welcome the feedback.
Safa Swordjackal
12-18-05, 10:03 PM The DM's job is to run the game and make it fun for everyone, not just himself. If you aren't having fun for a good reason(s), then your DM is a bad DM and he isn't doing his job. If he doesn't know that, HE DOES NOT KNOW D&D.

Tell them that you aren't having fun and are consitering leaving the group. If he tries to sweettalk you, changes the subject quickly, or does anything besides asking you why you're not having fun and how he can fix that, pick up your dice and leave. Recomend the other players do the same. You can also ask him to step down as DM, though it doesn't sound like he would.

If you are forced to leave, stay in contact with the other players. Get back together with them and appoint a new DM.
Feor
12-18-05, 10:14 PM I agree, tell him what he's doing wrong. None of that is appropriate IMHO. The DMs I've had will try and tell us things we shouldn't do, for the sake of the story, but if we really have our hearts set on it, they realize that they can't stop us. (they can damn well make you face teh consequences though, I lose more PCs that way :P)
TLomon
12-18-05, 10:50 PM Been there, done that, threw out the character sheet.

You were allowed to keep the character sheet? LOL.
Millennium
12-19-05, 08:20 AM D&D is, first and foremost, a game. Its primary purpose is to have fun. The only way you can truly "play it wrong" is if you're not having fun. It doesn't sound like people are having fun in this game you describe.

Given that, I'd sincerely suggest starting your own group. DMs like this one come up sometimes, and the only way to deal with them is to leave. It's a shame, but it's unlikely that you'll convince him to change.
taltamir
12-19-05, 11:17 AM welcome to human relationships... there is good, and there is bad in every relationships. Your options are:

1. Put up with it if the good outweighs the bad.
2. Terminate the relationship (and find another one)
3. Try to change the other person.

Good luck.
Phrennzy
12-19-05, 11:56 AM Tell him everything you've told us.

I DM, and if I were doing this kind of thing, I'd want to know about it. I want my players to have fun. And I want to have fun.
giantt
12-19-05, 01:53 PM Personally I say talk to him. But make sure you do it in private not in front of the group. As a DM who is just the opposite (I have my story but I will just do it in whatever direction they go in) I have had people complain that I haven't told them enough. It is also possible that this DM has been in games where he didn't know what to do and didn't have fun so he thinks this is how everyone enjoys the game. I would talk to him outside of the group and let him know. But remember to be open minded as their might be a reason for what he is doing. The game I don't DM in is more this is where you go next type game. I don't enjoy it as much as an "open ended" game but thats me. It takes all kinds. But don't lose a friend or a group just over this would be my advice.
Ozymandias V.
12-19-05, 02:38 PM On a side note, the DM can't tell you what your character would or would not do, since YOU are the one playing the character, and thus anything you want him to do IS something he would do.
Hatgirl
12-19-05, 05:50 PM the DM can't tell you what your character would or would not do, since YOU are the one playing the character, and thus anything you want him to do IS something he would do.
I disagree. The DM has the right to tell you that something you are doing is out of character. He can't force you to change your action though. This happens every once in a while in the group I play with. If a player wants his character to do something that the DM considers evil and the character's alignment is good, then the player should be told, especially if the DM will change the alignment for these types of actions.

For example, my group uses The Book of Exalted Deeds and one of the charaters is an exalted Paladin. The player suggested doing something that is evil and the DM informed him that this would be out of character and have consequences with his God. This is appropriate. But, the DM can't force the player to alter his plan and do something different.
Alterran
12-19-05, 06:31 PM This is what i would do in your place:

1: Talk to ur DM especially if the entire group feels the same way.

2: If he still acts like a dictator boycott the group for a week or two to see if he gets the message

3: Start a new game and not allowed a DM of such tyranny to DM again (of course this is only till he understands the true meaning of what it means to be a DM)
Good Agnostic
12-19-05, 06:50 PM It doesn't seem like this guy has bad motivations. If he were really just running you through an ego trip, he would probably also be running a super DMPC along with the group.

It sounds like he just wants to run a "good" campaign. But, for him, "good" seems to be limited by being linear and goal oriented. He has probably never imagined that a more free form session could be good. Free form can be scary. You need to think on the fly.

He is probably just in a comfort zone right now. Ask him if it would be OK to run a "day in the life" session. That is, a session where the PC's just live in teh world, and are not moving any specific plot forward. See how he likes it.

Good luck!
Milandros
12-19-05, 07:36 PM As some of the wiser people on these forums have already said, the only possible solution - other than the obvious "don't play" one - is to talk to him.

90% of problems are solved this way.

As is usually wise, don't confront him or humiliate him in front of the others. Tell him your feelings honestly and respectfully. Tell him what you like about his games as well. Tell him you want to turn his games from fun but frustrating into pure fun. Tell him that some of the other players feel the same, but you enjoy his games enough to really want this improvement.

If he gets mad at you, throws you out or simply refuses to listen, then maybe you do have to look elsewhere, but if you assume initially that everyone there has goodwill and wants everyone to have fun, you'll usually do a lot better than making your first step reaching for the hammer gun.
Gailbraithe
12-19-05, 08:13 PM Tell him how you feel. Confer with other players, and discuss it as a group. Don't be any more accusatory than you have to be, and most imporantly also discuss the things you like. If this guy is a good Dm, then say that. Make sure he understands that you want to discuss this so he can be a better DM, not because he is a bad DM.

Keep your points brief:
1. You feel that you lack control over your character's choices in actions, and would like more freedom to explore your own agendas.
2. You feel you lack the freedom to role-play your character as you imagine them. Tell the DM that it is fine for him to comment when the DM feels a character is acting out of alignment, but it is not okay for the DM to decide what the character does. The DM's responsibility is to asses consequences of PC actions, not to assign PC actions.

Warning: rant imminent!

:rant:

Keep in mind that if you ask for these freedoms, you are accepting certain responsibilities:
1. DMs railroad to keep the party together. If the players can't keep themselves together, then a DM must either railroad or run several different tracks of action at the same time. Both are frustrating and tedious for a DM, so be aware of it. Most Dm's will blow off the player who wants to go shopping and interact with shopkeepers while the rest of the party goes and fights a monster (running combat at the same time iis the worst chore). Be kind to your DM, and keep the party spliting to a minimum.
2. Many DMs, whether they'll admit it or not, are uncomfortable with helping player act out their worst tendancies. I think I know why your DM is nerfing the would-be assassins - he doesn't want to DM the adventures of a bunch of murdering thugs. Discuss this with your Dm. Find out what his comfort zone is. I don't let my players play NE or CE characters, because I'm not comfortable with PCs that are as bad as the worst villains I come up with. And I don't like creating good guys for them to kill. It's not my idea of a good time. Make sure the DM is cool with evil characters before you make him DM one.
3. Don't be a twit. Seriously. If you or another player takes advantage of the freedom to do what you want to spit in the eyes of the cool NPC that the DM created as a potential party ally for **** & giggles, then guess what the Dm is going to do? He's going to say "No, your character wouldn't do that."

And if you're playing the sort of PC who would spit in the eyes of a NPC "because he's Chaotic Neutral" (i.e. just to annoy the DM) then, you know, knock if off.

:rant:

If you receieved this rant in error and feel it does not pertain to you because you <3 your DM and treat him/her nice, then kindly ignore.
20goingon1232
12-19-05, 10:04 PM On a side note, the DM can't tell you what your character would or would not do, since YOU are the one playing the character, and thus anything you want him to do IS something he would do.
Actually, judging from the number of posts in these forums to that effect, and from personal experience, there is a LOT of DMs that do that. A lot of PLAYERS too. "Your character won't do that" is a phrase that will make me a very very rich man if I get but a penny everytime some idiot says it in a DnD game. Just DnD, no other RPGs.
DragonKing72
12-20-05, 04:30 PM the DM is more or less like a guide......a ref, if you will......yes the DM has the right to enforce certain rules of game play, but the most important thing to remember is......"FUN". if your not having fun, what's the point in playing with him. just because he knows the game/rules, does not make him a good DM.
tsuyoshikentsu
12-21-05, 05:02 AM Quit.

Now.

I have been with DMs like this. It was the least fun I have ever had while doing something that I consider entertaining.

Look at it this way: the line "Your character wouldn't do that" appears in a DR. DEMENTO PARODY of D&D.
Arkangel
12-21-05, 07:13 AM Yes exactly he sounds to be taking the fun out of your game,

simply confront him and tell to quit dictating every single part of he game. It should at least make him think about his status and job as DM.

If he continues controlling every aspect of your characters, quit and start a new game with someone else as DM.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sae Cael Oanar 12-18-05, 06:38 PM	ok heres the story. ive been playing with this guy for like four years, like the whole group has been together, different dms, different characters, always mixing it up and stuff. anyway, the current dm, who basically took over and has held the position like a dictator for the past year and a half or so, is starting to get to me. i like playing the game, and even if i got the rest of the people to quit and like play in a seperate game, it wouldnt be as good, because truth be told, he is a good dm. by good dm, i mean he knows what hes doing, he also has alot of bad points. he railroads, he has specific premade adventures and if we dont accept them it pisses him off until we do. i dont dig this, it doesnt really give the characters an identity. basically if we step out of line, we have to un-step out of line, its treated as if we never did. its also getting pretty scrict with the ammount of house rules that limit ooc talking, which in truth i enjoy. really i play dnd to hang out with my friends and have some fun. the session today, which i guess put it all over the edge, was pretty bad. he made us buy an expensive apartment in the nice part of sharn, and we couldnt even spend that much time figuring out what we wanted it to be like, because he didnt find that important. he also prevented two rogue characters (one of which since character creation wanted to be an assassin) search for an assassins guild, reasoning that they have a job as adventurers and therefore wouldnt do that. he frequently says things like "your character wouldnt do that" which seems like hes kind of stepping out of his dm powers. i understand in certain cases, but without explanation it just seems harsh. also, he prevented the rogues from fighting someone in a casino we were in. i understand that its game disrupting, but people lose their tempers, and its possible for someone to start a fight, not even necessarily kill, and there were gaurds, but the encounter never happened. i think if i want to punch someone in the face in dnd i should be able to. i dont really know what to do any more as far as this is concerned. i dont really want to quit, but playing is just tedious, as we really just seem to be his puppets in a unconstructed campaign.
20goingon1232 12-18-05, 06:44 PM	I'm afraid you only have 1 option open to you, really, IF you want the situation to improve, and you already know what it is, although you don't want to do it. If I were you, make another campaign and DM it, inviting everyone along. Then apply his rules and his actions (especially the "your character won't do this" nonsense) to him and him only. Let him see how stupid they are from the other side of the screen. Then ask him point blank (after a session or two), in front of everyone, how he liked the game so far. It should clear a few things up.
CryoSilver 12-18-05, 07:55 PM	You could quit. Or smear his house with offal. Or stab him. But quitting is probably best.
ConradBland 12-18-05, 08:21 PM	i dont really want to quit, but playing is just tedious, as we really just seem to be his puppets in a unconstructed campaign. If you aren't having fun, why play?
TLomon 12-18-05, 08:33 PM	My wife and I had the same problem with a DM. His world was extremely detailed, but he controlled every bit of interaction we had with it. Even our characters were assigned to us. I sometimes suspected we were reliving his favorite campaign again. I hate to say it, but I think quiting is the best option.
nastynate 12-18-05, 08:40 PM	Try offering him a break. Sometimes DMs need a little time to recharge the batteries. Ask everyone if they'd mind playing a short one-shot DMed by somebody else here and there. It'll give him more time to prepare his next seried of adventures, and expose him as a player to a different kind of game mastering style. Dm's often work very hard to keep things going in the right direction, and think the players are too easily side tracked by inconsequential events. I know that on numerous occasions while I was DMing, my players have been fascinated by NPCs that I only intended to be background characters. Maybe he's exerting more control over your PCs because you are deviating from his story line. It's much harder to improvise in a setting that has real goals and objectives, time-lines, and consequences that can't be explained to the players without revealing too much about the over all plot. Maybe he has his own personal vision of the PCs in his head, based upon what they've done up until now, and he honestly feels you are sometimes acting in a manner inconsistent with your established character. After a while it's really hard to let go of the reigns, or admit things didn't go as planned. What I've found is that it's good to have a back-up DM among your own group to spell the primary DM from time to time. It keeps your primary DM fresh, and exposes him to the role of PC more often. It's much easier to relate to the players when you are one.
Leukrythus 12-18-05, 08:41 PM	My wife and I had the same problem with a DM. His world was extremely detailed, but he controlled every bit of interaction we had with it. Even our characters were assigned to us. I sometimes suspected we were reliving his favorite campaign again. I hate to say it, but I think quiting is the best option. Been there, done that, threw out the character sheet.
Hatgirl 12-18-05, 09:39 PM	There are a lot of threads on these boards about this type of thing. The reality is a lot of DM's do this and don't even know it. You have to talk to him. Tell him about your issues and what you are thinking. Tell him you aren't having fun. If a DM never gets feedback from his players he will probably assume he is doing a good job and just keep doing the same thing. You can't expect him to change if you don't ever tell him about the things that bug you. (oh, and by the way, this is good advice for any relationship) If telling him you aren't having fun doesn't get him to ask how he can fix it and try to make things more fun for the players you will probably need to find a new game, but you have to try talking to him first. People on these boards tend to come up with some very interesting but mean ways of dealing with things and reality is they don't work and you wouldn't like it if someone did it to you. Try DMing some time, it's very hard. I'm sure your DM is trying his best and will welcome the feedback.
Safa Swordjackal 12-18-05, 10:03 PM	The DM's job is to run the game and make it fun for everyone, not just himself. If you aren't having fun for a good reason(s), then your DM is a bad DM and he isn't doing his job. If he doesn't know that, HE DOES NOT KNOW D&D. Tell them that you aren't having fun and are consitering leaving the group. If he tries to sweettalk you, changes the subject quickly, or does anything besides asking you why you're not having fun and how he can fix that, pick up your dice and leave. Recomend the other players do the same. You can also ask him to step down as DM, though it doesn't sound like he would. If you are forced to leave, stay in contact with the other players. Get back together with them and appoint a new DM.
Feor 12-18-05, 10:14 PM	I agree, tell him what he's doing wrong. None of that is appropriate IMHO. The DMs I've had will try and tell us things we shouldn't do, for the sake of the story, but if we really have our hearts set on it, they realize that they can't stop us. (they can damn well make you face teh consequences though, I lose more PCs that way :P)
TLomon 12-18-05, 10:50 PM	Been there, done that, threw out the character sheet. You were allowed to keep the character sheet? LOL.
Millennium 12-19-05, 08:20 AM	D&D is, first and foremost, a game. Its primary purpose is to have fun. The only way you can truly "play it wrong" is if you're not having fun. It doesn't sound like people are having fun in this game you describe. Given that, I'd sincerely suggest starting your own group. DMs like this one come up sometimes, and the only way to deal with them is to leave. It's a shame, but it's unlikely that you'll convince him to change.
taltamir 12-19-05, 11:17 AM	welcome to human relationships... there is good, and there is bad in every relationships. Your options are: 1. Put up with it if the good outweighs the bad. 2. Terminate the relationship (and find another one) 3. Try to change the other person. Good luck.
Phrennzy 12-19-05, 11:56 AM	Tell him everything you've told us. I DM, and if I were doing this kind of thing, I'd want to know about it. I want my players to have fun. And I want to have fun.
giantt 12-19-05, 01:53 PM	Personally I say talk to him. But make sure you do it in private not in front of the group. As a DM who is just the opposite (I have my story but I will just do it in whatever direction they go in) I have had people complain that I haven't told them enough. It is also possible that this DM has been in games where he didn't know what to do and didn't have fun so he thinks this is how everyone enjoys the game. I would talk to him outside of the group and let him know. But remember to be open minded as their might be a reason for what he is doing. The game I don't DM in is more this is where you go next type game. I don't enjoy it as much as an "open ended" game but thats me. It takes all kinds. But don't lose a friend or a group just over this would be my advice.
Ozymandias V. 12-19-05, 02:38 PM	On a side note, the DM can't tell you what your character would or would not do, since YOU are the one playing the character, and thus anything you want him to do IS something he would do.
Hatgirl 12-19-05, 05:50 PM	the DM can't tell you what your character would or would not do, since YOU are the one playing the character, and thus anything you want him to do IS something he would do. I disagree. The DM has the right to tell you that something you are doing is out of character. He can't force you to change your action though. This happens every once in a while in the group I play with. If a player wants his character to do something that the DM considers evil and the character's alignment is good, then the player should be told, especially if the DM will change the alignment for these types of actions. For example, my group uses The Book of Exalted Deeds and one of the charaters is an exalted Paladin. The player suggested doing something that is evil and the DM informed him that this would be out of character and have consequences with his God. This is appropriate. But, the DM can't force the player to alter his plan and do something different.
Alterran 12-19-05, 06:31 PM	This is what i would do in your place: 1: Talk to ur DM especially if the entire group feels the same way. 2: If he still acts like a dictator boycott the group for a week or two to see if he gets the message 3: Start a new game and not allowed a DM of such tyranny to DM again (of course this is only till he understands the true meaning of what it means to be a DM)
Good Agnostic 12-19-05, 06:50 PM	It doesn't seem like this guy has bad motivations. If he were really just running you through an ego trip, he would probably also be running a super DMPC along with the group. It sounds like he just wants to run a "good" campaign. But, for him, "good" seems to be limited by being linear and goal oriented. He has probably never imagined that a more free form session could be good. Free form can be scary. You need to think on the fly. He is probably just in a comfort zone right now. Ask him if it would be OK to run a "day in the life" session. That is, a session where the PC's just live in teh world, and are not moving any specific plot forward. See how he likes it. Good luck!
Milandros 12-19-05, 07:36 PM	As some of the wiser people on these forums have already said, the only possible solution - other than the obvious "don't play" one - is to talk to him. 90% of problems are solved this way. As is usually wise, don't confront him or humiliate him in front of the others. Tell him your feelings honestly and respectfully. Tell him what you like about his games as well. Tell him you want to turn his games from fun but frustrating into pure fun. Tell him that some of the other players feel the same, but you enjoy his games enough to really want this improvement. If he gets mad at you, throws you out or simply refuses to listen, then maybe you do have to look elsewhere, but if you assume initially that everyone there has goodwill and wants everyone to have fun, you'll usually do a lot better than making your first step reaching for the hammer gun.
Gailbraithe 12-19-05, 08:13 PM	Tell him how you feel. Confer with other players, and discuss it as a group. Don't be any more accusatory than you have to be, and most imporantly also discuss the things you like. If this guy is a good Dm, then say that. Make sure he understands that you want to discuss this so he can be a better DM, not because he is a bad DM. Keep your points brief: 1. You feel that you lack control over your character's choices in actions, and would like more freedom to explore your own agendas. 2. You feel you lack the freedom to role-play your character as you imagine them. Tell the DM that it is fine for him to comment when the DM feels a character is acting out of alignment, but it is not okay for the DM to decide what the character does. The DM's responsibility is to asses consequences of PC actions, not to assign PC actions. Warning: rant imminent! :rant: Keep in mind that if you ask for these freedoms, you are accepting certain responsibilities: 1. DMs railroad to keep the party together. If the players can't keep themselves together, then a DM must either railroad or run several different tracks of action at the same time. Both are frustrating and tedious for a DM, so be aware of it. Most Dm's will blow off the player who wants to go shopping and interact with shopkeepers while the rest of the party goes and fights a monster (running combat at the same time iis the worst chore). Be kind to your DM, and keep the party spliting to a minimum. 2. Many DMs, whether they'll admit it or not, are uncomfortable with helping player act out their worst tendancies. I think I know why your DM is nerfing the would-be assassins - he doesn't want to DM the adventures of a bunch of murdering thugs. Discuss this with your Dm. Find out what his comfort zone is. I don't let my players play NE or CE characters, because I'm not comfortable with PCs that are as bad as the worst villains I come up with. And I don't like creating good guys for them to kill. It's not my idea of a good time. Make sure the DM is cool with evil characters before you make him DM one. 3. Don't be a twit. Seriously. If you or another player takes advantage of the freedom to do what you want to spit in the eyes of the cool NPC that the DM created as a potential party ally for **** & giggles, then guess what the Dm is going to do? He's going to say "No, your character wouldn't do that." And if you're playing the sort of PC who would spit in the eyes of a NPC "because he's Chaotic Neutral" (i.e. just to annoy the DM) then, you know, knock if off. :rant: If you receieved this rant in error and feel it does not pertain to you because you <3 your DM and treat him/her nice, then kindly ignore.
20goingon1232 12-19-05, 10:04 PM	On a side note, the DM can't tell you what your character would or would not do, since YOU are the one playing the character, and thus anything you want him to do IS something he would do. Actually, judging from the number of posts in these forums to that effect, and from personal experience, there is a LOT of DMs that do that. A lot of PLAYERS too. "Your character won't do that" is a phrase that will make me a very very rich man if I get but a penny everytime some idiot says it in a DnD game. Just DnD, no other RPGs.
DragonKing72 12-20-05, 04:30 PM	the DM is more or less like a guide......a ref, if you will......yes the DM has the right to enforce certain rules of game play, but the most important thing to remember is......"FUN". if your not having fun, what's the point in playing with him. just because he knows the game/rules, does not make him a good DM.
tsuyoshikentsu 12-21-05, 05:02 AM	Quit. Now. I have been with DMs like this. It was the least fun I have ever had while doing something that I consider entertaining. Look at it this way: the line "Your character wouldn't do that" appears in a DR. DEMENTO PARODY of D&D.
Arkangel 12-21-05, 07:13 AM	Yes exactly he sounds to be taking the fun out of your game, simply confront him and tell to quit dictating every single part of he game. It should at least make him think about his status and job as DM. If he continues controlling every aspect of your characters, quit and start a new game with someone else as DM.