Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Juca 04-07-04, 07:48 AM	I always saw topics about DMs and players fighting about the most dumb subjects, DMs telling that the players don't take the game too seriously, players arguing that the DM is trying to kill then, everyone whinning about the others using his dice, DMs being worried because he will need to go to the house of one of the players to DM, people whinning about the others don't having all the books... COME ON GUYS! What is wrong in playing this game as a... GAME? When you were young and come to your friends house to play videogame did you needed to bring your own food? You cannot have played if you don't bringed your own joypad? Do really mattered who winned the game that day? D&D is all about fun and friends metting to have fun! I have saw to much topics about people that simply cannot socialize as a normal human can. When I play with my friends we play in everyone house, I'm the DM but I have no complains about DMing in anothers players house, when they come to my house they know that they got all the food that they need and the same is true in everyone's house. Instead of each one having his own set of dice we have a colective set of dices, and minis, that everyone share. The same with the books, instead of having 6 players handbooks (we are 6 nerd...gasp gasp people) and we got 2 players handbook (one in english and one in portuguese) and we prefer to share then and use the money to buy diferent books. Well, this was just a rant, I don't expect to be understood.
Heron_Marked_Blade 04-07-04, 08:46 AM	Originally posted by Juca Well, this was just a rant, I don't expect to be understood. You may be surprised at how many people might understand you. I for one emphasize the fun/game aspect more than any other: if you regularly get angry while playing D&D, you need to step back and re-evaluate your priorities. That being said, there are certain basic considerations that can make the game a lot more fun for everyone. If players come over to your house and leave it trashed, that's not fun. If people come over and eat all your food without contributing anything, that's not fun (me = tight budget). Our rule of thumb (in my gaming group) is that if you want food, bring it. We might all chip in for pizza and drinks, but we don't do that every time. Sometimes we decide who's going to bring snacks, and rotate turns. It really depends on how we feel at the time. Bottom line, though: if you consistently leave your gaming sessions feeling frustrated, you need to figure out why you're getting mad and what you can do about it. If that means quitting for a little while, then that's what you need to do. Usually there are a lot of other things you can do before taking that drastic step.
Thorak 04-07-04, 09:08 AM	I'm probably one of the worst on here for long-lived, rules-lawyering rants about how things work, at least IMHO. I do it here because I don't do it at my own sessions; I gotta play with those guys, and if I'm mouthing off to the DM that he's 'wrong' every 5 minutes, no one's going to have any fun. When I'm playing, I use the rules as a guideline, and pass anything 'odd' past my DM first. And generally try and have fun, rather than pick apart little rule details. I think that's 'fun' too, but the kind of fun I do at home when I'm avoiding writing the papers I should be writing. Like right now. *sigh*
muppet_man 04-07-04, 10:36 AM	I'm the DM in my group (tho i haven't played for a while, too busy with assignments and exams which will be finished in a month) me and my group share the same opinion that it is just a game. the main aim is to have fun and a laugh. i'm pretty flexible with the rules and make some house rules in cooperation with the group to better fit my game world (homebrew nation set in FR).
Crossover-Chronicler 04-07-04, 10:53 AM	I understand. However, I take my entertainment seriously: I've spent a good deal of money on it, and when I step into game I'm investing a good deal of my time. I want to see a payoff in terms of entertainment. I get (understandabley, I hope) annoyed when I don't have fun at a game I've put that much into. Whenever there's some childish flareup of drama, it's hard not to think of that bag of dice as an impromptu weapon. While things like DM/player authority and possessiveness over books and other items may be childish, it's best to plan to get that childishness out of the way before hand. edit: As for possessiveness, I'll side with the "less mature" on that one. Nobody but me handles my books, dice, or minis (if I had any) without my express permission. They dpn't take care of my stuff, and they don't show any consideration about returning it when I need to use it. That being so, I'd rather just keep it to myself and let the other players fend for themselves rather than go through the headache of trying to get players to treat me respectfully.
bahamut_0 04-07-04, 11:23 AM	I understood it too, and I can't see how some of these stupid arguements can come along. Thank god I have a great group....
Arakano 04-07-04, 12:43 PM	Yes, I play DnD as a game to have fun. But well, I do the same with games like Monopoly, and we discussed itīs rules once or twice. But because DnD has more sophisticated rules, itīs just natural to discuss them more intense. And yes, fun aside, I would like my players to take the game a little more serious. Compare it with another hobby many people share: Playing soccer. Sure, itīs a game, but I tell you most people would not like to play with someone who thinks he can just joke around all the time instead of active playing, or who would grab the ball with itīs hands to carry it across the field.
Glock-9mm 04-07-04, 01:51 PM	Down here in NZ Im lucky as hell, My Group come to me every week and we play at my house. If there are any rules rubbish we handle it after the session, Not during and all my players have respect for each other enough to not start fights for the sake of a fight. Also as we have at 3 Minature painters in our group so everyone tends to take care of the figures we have. And as for books... Books were meant to be used. If I wanted a book not to be damaged through natural wear and tear then I should prolly look at trying to get it in a (Legal) PDF Format. In simple when me and my group get togther we are there for 2 reasons, 1 to catch up on our weekly dramas in real life and 2, to roleplay and have fun with whatever I have prepared. Like most groups we have house rules, And new players (Rare as they may be) have these in a word document that they can read so that they understand that on Sundays we are there to roleplay. Not argue.
BruteForce 04-07-04, 10:49 PM	Speaking mostly as a DM, I can totally see where you're coming from; it's a game and it's meant to be enjoyed. In particular, I honestly don't understand how there can be so many people who are convinced that their DM is out to get them (which is what a good portion of the posts on the "What's a Player to Do" board come down to), nor do I understand how there can be so many DM's out there who aren't able to come up with a simple solution to problems with disruptive players (it seems like every post on the "What's a DM to Do" board can be answered with "talk to the player and let him know he's a problem, if that doesn't work kick him out"). I don't get it; I thought I was like most people in that I play D&D with friends. However... I put a lot of work into playing this "game." I take my gaming seriously. For me, it's not like getting together with whatever friends were around that day and playing a video game -- it's more like (to steal Arakano's example) getting together with the rest of my team and playing an organized sport at a scheduled time and place. Yes, I do it to enjoy myself, but that doesn't mean I want some idiot who just wants to screw around ruining my game. I work hard on my characters when I play, both before and during the game, and I work even harder on my campaigns when I DM. This may be a "hobby," but for me, it isn't something casual.
was_fired 04-07-04, 11:33 PM	I DM for the power trip. My players claim to have fun at times, but hey I can't win them all. In time though I will crush that out of the game and simply have fun with the power trip it brings.
boschdevil 04-08-04, 12:08 AM	I think that the soccer analogy is good, but it really goes both ways. Just as you don't like it if someone just picks up the ball and runs (ir a player deciding to play "monkey" core class - ???), soccer is not fun if it is taken too seriously like if an irate father in the crowd yelling at his kid or a kid yells continuously at the ref about a rule (ie a DM/players complaining and getting hot about the rules in their game). As the original poster noted, in both cases, at the end of the day it is still just a game. Player asclose to the rules as possible, but don't take it too seriously. Life is too short for games to be taken too seriously. Just my opinion.
edgelett 04-08-04, 12:49 AM	Yes I play as a game above all else...if i'm not having fun, I'll say something to the people involved & if that doesn't help I'll leave. The people I play with are my friends and my boyfriend, and if someone starts on one of those "why can't I leap over the dragon's head, back stab him, run up his neck & tug his ears then get away without being hurt? You're just being a stupid DM" rants then no doubt someone in the group will say "for crying out loud, it's just a game get over it"
Iron Chef Vastrox 04-08-04, 01:19 AM	Well, Juca, we're Americans, and that means that we place a ridiculous amount of value on personal belongings and the declaration of one's ownership. That's why you see everybody get so uptight about whose dice, whose rules, whose house; Dungeons and Dragons wasn't originally intended to be a social event where equals could come together and intermingle, it was created so that we Americans could show how much stuff we had! Question: Why do you think that WotC keeps churning out a new gaming system, miniatures set, or supplementary rulebook every month? Answer: Stuff! It's so that people with more stuff can flaunt it over the people with less stuff. Because by the accumulation of stuff, you automatically become Right. How do you know whose interpretation of a rule is correct? The person with more stuff is correct. He can reference his shiny new books and access knowledge far beyond the kenning of the peon who challenged his authority. So you see, it is the healthy competitive drive of establishing Who Is Better that fuels the gaming industry. That is why we all get so mad when Skip Williams comes out with a new rules clarification; we cannot determine how much stuff he has to back it up. Furthermore, by his simple existence, he creates more stuff but in a venue which is easily accessible by even said lowly peon. This frustrates the ultrahardcoreplayforkeepscanwinatD&D Stuff Accumulators because Sage advice is not an elitist posession and the infinite vastness of the Internet allows again said lowly peon to believe that his opinion can somehow matter if he simply cites these intangible astral sources. That's the reason that the next logical step is then dice and miniature-throwing. It reestablishes the power balance. Obviously the weaker challenger with less stuff will run out of ammunition first, allowing the victor to fully assert his dominance by beating the peon into submission with his newly-acquired Earth Elemental Miniature. I hope this helps, Juca. Happy Gaming.
Yeltnarg 04-08-04, 06:36 AM	[QUOTE]Originally posted by Iron Chef Vastrox [B]Well, Juca, we're Americans, and that means that we place a ridiculous amount of value on personal belongings and the declaration of one's ownership. That's why you see everybody get so uptight about whose dice, whose rules, whose house; Dungeons and Dragons wasn't originally intended to be a social event where equals could come together and intermingle, it was created so that we Americans could show how much stuff we had! ________________________________________ _____ Glad im not american. My group has 1 set of 3.5 & 3.0 rulebooks between the lot of us, so we share them and have FUN. Taking the GAME too seriously wrecks it. Or maybe its just because we are all relatively newbs.
ryan_stone 04-08-04, 01:38 PM	Thank you Iron Chef Vastrox. Best explanation EVER!
SureFoot 04-08-04, 01:59 PM	There's another consideration on why D&D is taken, in general, "more seriously" than many other games/hobbies. Everyone--players and DMs alike--have more personally invested in any given D&D session than, say, spending an afternoon with your pals shooting hoops or on the PlayStation. The players create a character--a personality they're going to act out. If you do it "right" (and this is the blatantly elitist role player in me) you get to know your charater as a person. You also might set, and eventually achieve, long-term goals for your character (and I don't mean just "level up and get more stuff"--that much is a given!). The DM must invest boatloads of time adn effort into creating a game that's level-appropriate and fun. it's a thankless, mentally and emotionally tiring job. This personal investment lends itself to taking the game rather seriously, for better or for worse.
Simpi 04-08-04, 05:44 PM	Originally posted by Iron Chef Vastrox Well, Juca, we're Americans, and that means that we place a ridiculous amount of value on personal belongings and the declaration of one's ownership. Amen to that. If someone in our gaming group would actually say 'I know you forgot your own book but you cannot check my books cause they are mine.', he would be laughed at, booted from the game and asked to come back after he has grown up. Investing money to my entertainment, expecting some 'standard entertainment level' from DM. Sheesh, what are CC:s D&D sessions? Board meetings?
Cyricist 04-08-04, 07:13 PM	Fascinating thread. I DM quite a lot (well over seven years now) and in my experience it's best to make gaming sessions as serious as a group wants and can handle. Serious roleplaying is fun, but a bit of laugh and giggles can be just as entertaining. D&D is a social game however, and as many people out there I haven't got the cash to feed 6 to 7 guests every weekend (since I nearly play every other week, often entire weekends) so I do ask a small contribution of everyone, if they can spare it. Most can, thankfully. As others said here: clear houserules help. If you have them and a handfull of social players (friends) you usually get along fine. If not, open yer yap and talk about it. Talking fixes so much more than open violence, mr Bush. Oops, did I just say Bush.. I'm sorry.. :angel: But seriously. A game is a social activity. If you "just play the game" you're actually interacting socially. And sometimes being social means solving social problems before moving on being social. And sometimes it is a good thing to ask for help when you really don't know anymore, before moving on being social. Ok that's a lot of "being social". I'll stop now.. right.. there.. I stopped.. end of post.. I think.. :rolleyes:
jafyfe 04-08-04, 08:21 PM	actually, i don't play D&D i live it :D and President Bush lives D&D too :fight!: + :fight!: Vs :devil: President Bush + Me Vs Saddam
Geethree 04-08-04, 09:19 PM	D&D is a different kind of game, though. Everybody puts a lot of time and effort into it, especially the DMs. Some people go as far as to write multiple page (or more) backgrounds for their characters, DMs create entire worlds. Too much time goes into the game for the DM to just arbitrarily kill the characters off. The game is also stressful because it can sometimes be a chore. Most games revolve around several characters and a story. If you're not there to play your character, the rest of the players suffer. If the DM doesn't feel like running the game, everybody suffers. It's a game of tremendous cooperation. The pressure falls squarely on the DM to keep the game fresh and exciting. If poorly coordinated, the game will result in a lot of tension and arguments. This happens to all DMs at least once. Tempers flare, people are in a bad mood, you can fill in the blanks. But, this happens elsewhere. This can happen playing baseball, or poker, or videogames, or Candy Land, or anything. I can understand why people get angry over the game. People need to remember that anytime a recreational activity isn't fun, you need to step back and take a few deep breathes, maybe even take a break.
Crossover-Chronicler 04-08-04, 10:07 PM	Originally posted by Simpi Amen to that. If someone in our gaming group would actually say 'I know you forgot your own book but you cannot check my books cause they are mine.', he would be laughed at, booted from the game and asked to come back after he has grown up. Investing money to my entertainment, expecting some 'standard entertainment level' from DM. Sheesh, what are CC:s D&D sessions? Board meetings? As I appear to be the only person on this thread with the initials "CC" I'll assume that last comment was directed at me, and respond accordingly: Originally posted by me edit: As for possessiveness, I'll side with the "less mature" on that one. Nobody but me handles my books, dice, or minis (if I had any) without my express permission. They dpn't take care of my stuff, and they don't show any consideration about returning it when I need to use it. That being so, I'd rather just keep it to myself and let the other players fend for themselves rather than go through the headache of trying to get players to treat me respectfully.Note the mention of permission there. There is a difference between "You can't check my books," and "ask before you manhandle my stuff." There is also a difference between "You can't touch my books because they are mine," and "You aren't getting your greasy, clumsy, Cheetos-stained fingers on my books because I value the condition of my property, you inconsiderate simian." There's also the consideration that I as DM need the rulebooks handy to, y'know, make ruling. It's very frustrating when a player won't hand back my own :censored: rulebook because he isn't done looking some rule for himself. As for investment/return, that's my rhetoric on these boards. If you want less "corporate" terms, try: "I expect to get as much fun out of it as I put time,money, and effort into it. Otherwise I could save myself a headache and buy a new computer game." Better?
Frodo Lives 04-08-04, 10:23 PM	D & D is just a game, but one that the individuals need to take seriously (at least somewhat) because unlike bowling what you do and how you behave directly effects the other people at the table. If you and 4 friends decide to go bowling (or play pool, or go to a bar, or .....) and one of you doesn't show consistantly that has very little effect on how the rest of your night will go. In D & D if one player doesn't show or decides to act like an idiot and constantly disrupts the game, it does affect the rest of the group. If you join a group you must be aware of how your actions will affect the entire group, it's not just you as an individual that is effected, it's everyone. That is why I take D & D seriously, because my actions and behaviour have consequenses for other people. People who have spent considerable time and money on this hobby. That being said you can't be so uptight that you don't have fun, it is only a hobby.
Eldren 04-08-04, 10:40 PM	I'm fortunate to be in a group that handles the use of books, distribution of food, etc., pretty simply and even-handedly. We're fortunate in that everyone but, I think, one person in our group has at least the three main Core Rulebooks, although at least one person has the 3.0 books (and we're playing a primarily 3.5 campaign), and requires us to reference the 3.5 books for him to see if something has changed (which, more often than not, it has). If someone needs a book they don't have, they simply look to someone who they know has it on them and they ask if they can look at it. There seem to be no problems. As of yet, no one has asked to borrow anyone's books, so it isn't an issue. As well, none of us tend to have food stains on our hands, or any other substances, that are going to result in a book handled by someone else being returned in less than optimal condition. We're all adults, we all manage to stay clean. If we eat pizza or some other messy food, we use these new-fangled inventions called "paper towels". :D As far as food itself goes, more often than not we take a break during the game session to acquire vittles. We usually either walk to a local restaurant and get our food, or we order in pizza or Chinese food. Sometimes we'll just walk to a local grocery store and each of us who has cash will purchase something that we personally want, and call it good. On more than one occasion, someone (usually me) doesn't have cash on hand at the moment, so that person either goes without that night, or they borrow something from someone else and pay it back within the next couple of weeks. All in all, food and the purchase/distribution of it has been less than a non-issue with us. People ought to be playing Dungeons & Dragons for fun, but there's something that those who aren't regularly involved in role playing games don't understand, and that's that RPGs are significantly more immersive than a sports game or a boardgame like Monopoly. There, you have little to lose if your team loses or if you have to pay someone rent for landing on their space. You run around the field/court, or you move your piece around the board, and that's generally about it. With role playing games, you're taking on a personality, and you're seeing this personality grow from a newb who can barely manage to survive one fight without the request of some sort of enchanted healing, to someone who walks the planes of reality and leaves dimension-wide destruction in their wake. These are important distinctions. The rules are in place to avoid the old childhood discussions/arguments from "Cops 'n Robbers" of "I shot you!" "No you didn't!". People take the rules very seriously because those rules let them know what they can and can't do as they attempt to advance the cause of their character. Dungeons & Dragons is interactive, immersive and time-involving, and all of these things add up to people involved in taking their "fun" seriously.
Dragon Snack 04-09-04, 01:23 AM	I can agree with you in spirit, but sometimes things do happen. You have to understand that. Playing with friends: I do, I've done things outside of D&D with every player in my main groups (2+ years of gaming together) and even some of the people in my non-main groups. However I also know that not everybody does game with friends, sometimes you game with someone just because they happen to game also. It's not ideal, but if you want to game you have to sometimes. I've made friends from doing this, but I've also run into some people I would rather avoid... Someones house: 3 of my 4 groups game at someones house (4th is a LGS). It's usually a set house, as not everyone has the room or ability to host a game (and face it, some peoples houses are nicer than others - note none of my groups meets at my house). To make the person ALSO pay for food is a little much. Borrowing books: You've never had someone WEAR YOUR BOOK AS A HAT, have you? I have (a new player who didn't last very long). I've also had people write so hard on their character sheet that they left indentations on the pages (and the covers) of my books as well. They may be meant to be used, but not abused. If you've been eating, forget using a paper towel - WASH YOUR HANDS. It should be simple respect, but apparently some people do need to learn it... Dice and minis: I actually only have a few d6, d10, and d20s of my own. I use another guys dice. My minis get used by almost everyone. I don't think everyone has as bad a time as may seem like it from these boards. Even I have DMs that seem out to kill the PCs (5th lv party vs. CR12 Roper, Hold Person teamed with Death Blow from S&F) that make me roll my eyes, some people are probably just venting. You also have to remember that not everyone is as old as you may be (assuming that when you say everyone gets food at your house, it's your food and not your parents). Some posters here may be younger and not be as experienced with interacting with others as well. Others may not have a wide range of people available to play with. So, while it may seem like everyone isn't having fun playing, most people probably are...
Crossover-Chronicler 04-09-04, 03:04 AM	Well, since I've already made a jerk of myself, I've decided to play devil's advocate and respond to this in greater detail:Originally posted by Juca I always saw topics about DMs and players fighting about the most dumb subjects, DMs telling that the players don't take the game too seriously,If it's a damper in my enjoyment, I reserve the right to complain. But usually my problem is that some player takes the game too seriously (generally leading to raised voices and/sulking).players arguing that the DM is trying to kill then,I'm guessing you've never been on the receiving end of a DMwho had it in for you, or you'd know the kind of bad taste a game like that can leave in your mouth. And sometimes it even comesfrom peopleyou call friends.everyone whinning about the others using his dice,You wanna count how many ofmy dice have been lost by other players? Their combined worth could probably buy me the Expanded Psionics Handbook and Unearthed Aracna.DMs being worried because he will need to go to the house of one of the players to DM,Again, I'm betting you've never had a payer try to "pull rank" because you're DMing in his house. It can be a really tense situation.people whinning about the others don't having all the books...Because then they try to borrow mine (see above). They have computers, and it's not that hard to locate and download the SRD...COME ON GUYS! What is wrong in playing this game as a... GAME?Nothing at all. But some people are more "into" their games than others. Look at diehard sportsfans, SCA members, or ...well, roleplayers. The level of involvement varies.When you were young and come to your friends house to play videogame did you needed to bring your own food?Yeah, sometimes I did. Because some of my friends were, y'know, broke. What's that to do with anything?You cannot have played if you don't bringed your own joypad?Well, on some of the later systems I need to bring my own joypad if I plan to participate often, as the multiplayer games they run can go kinda long, so I'll need to be in on the first one to be assured participation at all.Do really mattered who winned the game that day?Define "matter."D&D is all about fun and friends metting to have fun! I have saw to much topics about people that simply cannot socialize as a normal human can.D&D isn;t necessarily designed to attract people with sterling social skills. And lack of social skill is an issue separate from the game itself.When I play with my friends we play in everyone house, I'm the DM but I have no complains about DMing in anothers players house, when they come to my house they know that they got all the food that they need and the same is true in everyone's house. Instead of each one having his own set of dice we have a colective set of dices, and minis, that everyone share. The same with the books, instead of having 6 players handbooks (we are 6 nerd...gasp gasp people) and we got 2 players handbook (one in english and one in portuguese) and we prefer to share then and use the money to buy diferent books. Congratulations! :tiphat: :D It may work for you,but that doesn't mean it works for everyone. You seem awfully condescending to anyone who doens't share your vision, or who can't realize it for practical reasons. :(
Ilonwe 04-09-04, 08:16 PM	yea, it's weird. I play at school w/ a bunch of friends and a teacher and it seems like they are completely different people! I mean, the teacher is, like, the coolest one in the whole school and so even tempered until we start playing the game. He is cool to us, but if some evil dude in the game (can't find the censored smiley) him off, he can get pretty nasty. Like when we found out that the mayor in the town was a follower of the Drow and was trying to poison the town, he was telling the DM (acting as the mayor) that if he didn't talk, we would slit his throat ear to ear. It was a pretty drastic change on his part, but when we got out of the mayor's house, he turned back into his goofy self! We ended up cutting the mayor's hands and tongue out, which was alot of fun. Didn't kill him, though :mad: :b:
Meloncov 04-09-04, 09:15 PM	One thing everyone so far has missed is that DnD is more then a game, its a form of performing art. If someone goofs around during a play, you have the right to be upset. Ditto for DnD.
Brillock of Ithicus 04-10-04, 02:13 AM	Originally posted by Simpi Amen to that. If someone in our gaming group would actually say 'I know you forgot your own book but you cannot check my books cause they are mine.', he would be laughed at, booted from the game and asked to come back after he has grown up. Investing money to my entertainment, expecting some 'standard entertainment level' from DM. Sheesh, what are CC:s D&D sessions? Board meetings? kinda funny if he was the only one who brought his books that day! haha! suckas, now yah can't play and if you do, you don't have the stuff to back it up. Iron chef has it down. Piles of books, bags of dice, and sharp pewter minitures are the way to go! just remember you take a -4 to using improvised weapons unless you've taken the improved improvised weapon feat. in which case I'd like to know how exactly you gained a level since god only knows ive been trying forever, to get to 2nd level so i can get my bonus feat!
Count Arioch the 28th 04-10-04, 03:02 AM	I tried playing D&D as a game. didn't work out. Now, I mostly use D&D as a sock sorting device.
Steelwill 04-10-04, 11:24 AM	I tie down my players and tattoo the Core rules from the PHB on their chests backwards so that whenever they look into the mirror, they know I am their D&D god!!! Just kidding, me personally I love D&D, and enjoy playing it no matter what set of house rules are in effect. I am just picky about those rules being consistant so that the shared sensory illusions of the game world are consistant. As far as goofin off during gaming...like anything else in life, it has its place, and is best sampled in moderation. Don't let it kill all progress of the gaming session, and its pretty much ok. About the only time I get upset is when someone is delibrately being a distraction, or trying to cause tension unnessesarily because they have the maturity of a 2 year old. Be young, have fun, and play some D&D, that is my 2 cents.
Wolfhart 04-10-04, 01:30 PM	In all the groups I am on (Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, Sunday) we all share books. There isnt a point in havint a dozen copies of a phb or the tomb and blood book, for examples. The monday group everyone just leaves the books at the DM's house so he or anyone else can look through them.. Hes got a bunch of shelves in the basement/gaming room everyone gets a shelf to store stuff on. Dont need to ask permission to barrow a book, long its there by the following monday or if not you sent an email to the person lettimg them know that ya barrowed it. Tuseday group its a custom world.. dm's got everything we need in a yahoo group where we can DL/ print out anything we need. Thrusday group. just started 3.5 i dont own either phb or dmg so just basically use one of their books for info or ask as i dun know that system. Friday is Heros unlimited. DM has books and a photo copier at his place prints out what we need to know. And if we want to look though info then will let anyone come over when we want and hes free. Sunday.. still up for vote if were gonna be 3.0/5 or custom world.. I'm hoping for custom world ad i dont really like the 3.0 or the 3.5 systems.. I'd stick with 2nd ed or 1st ed or go to a custom world before the 3ed/3.5ed world. As for Dice. Monday group everyone has their own colored dice, but if need an extra die can barrow from anyone for the adventure. Tuesday (4 of the people from monday in a different dms world) color coded dice. Thuesday - all have own dice and dunday were not starting for another month still but all have own dice. Minatures - monday we use a dry erase board. Tuesday random roll for matching order (dont really like that but dms house rule) Thrusday - march as we feel. Sunday -no clue and Friday - mach as we feel This is a game, thats the first rule. Personially I could care less if one of my charcters dies. For all the NPC's and monsters that we will kill in the course of the campaine, it only makes sense that we will loose characters over time.. or someone will just get boored with the character and kill them off to roll something new. I mean the good guys cant ALLWAYS win.. cant they? I love the near death experances. two weeks back, my character was almost killed in a backstab by a Thief, healed back up by party member, then almost cleaved in half by a higher leveled warrior. Ive had to run from fights before. Ive also died in fights. if the character would stay and defend the others.. Reason for so many gaming groups.. I would be a professional gamer if I find a way to make it pay the bills.. My free tme is spent either beta testing MMORPG's or playing Table-Top games. The great thing, my better half does the same.. we meet durring Shadowbane Beta last year. Its all fun and games. RPG's are supposed to be fun, before anything else. If I am not having fun with a campaigne I'll talk to the DM and see if we can figure out why its not fun for me, I can only assume that the other gamers do the same thing, I know my better half does when shes not having fun. The day that I want to attack one of my GM's for killing off one of my charcters or modifing him without tellin me bout ti first, is the day I stop gaming.
striderII 04-11-04, 03:13 PM	This may be a bit off topic, but I felt the need to respond to this: For all the NPC's and monsters that we will kill in the course of the campaine, it only makes sense that we will loose characters over time.. or someone will just get boored with the character and kill them off to roll something new. I haven't understood this way of thinking yet, although I've seen mention of it quite a bit on these boards. Why would you kill off a character when you're bored with them? It doesn't make sense to me - why would the character suddenly develop a suicidal tendency, and kill themselves? If you're really bored with the character, perhaps you could do something different. For instance, adventuring is a harrowing and danger-filled experience. It would not be unlikely that an adventurer would, sooner or later, tire of risking his or her life for uncertain gain. Why don't you just retire the character instead? Work it into the story, have the character start to feel as if this adventuring gig isn't working out. Work with your DM - perhaps a few scenes where things don't go your character's way (pre-scripted, perhaps), that start to make them think that they should retire from adventuring and use their gains to this point to open a business, or whatever it is that they would like to do. The other PC's can be aware of this, and attempt to talk your character into staying - citing examples of when the character was instrumental in the party's success, playing on friendships, etc. If they fail in convincing your character, the character may bow out in a believable fashion that fits within the framework of the story, and the party can begin searching for someone else to fill that hole in the party (enter your next character). On the other hand, it's entirely possible that the arguments of the other PC's gives your character a newfound zeal for adventuring (meaning, OOG, you the player have found something to interest you in the character again). I find that this makes for a much better way to have a character bow out of an adventuring party, all the while allowing the other players to contribute, rather than short-changing them by your character simply committing suicide. strider
Wolfhart 04-11-04, 03:53 PM	Perhaps I used the wrong term there.. To me killing off a character means simply that I will no longer be using that character durring the course of the campaigne. Character sheet +notes are handed to the dm to use as a NPC if he wishes or the character retires to the forge or something on those lines. If I am playing a character that does not hold my interest any longer I will reroll and make a new character or just wait until the end of the campaigne. I cant see wasting my time with a character that has grown borring to roleplay. I could never intentionally sucide one of my beloved characters, especially if i had spent months or even years working on his concept and truly becoming him duirring the adventure.
Sphyre 04-12-04, 04:51 AM	Hehe you describe some of my friends pefectly. It's like they play the game to get in arguments. I have this one friend who argues about the rationality of every situation - esspecially when it's in his favor. I had another friend who basically knows every possible way to abuse the game then compalins when there's an uber pc that he can't kill.... because HE has to be the most powerful character. Then we have lets see... the DM who loves to roll dice! he railroads the party - and if you do something unexpected... oh you can't do that. You are level 13 going up against a balor.... then... oh... and you don't get ANY treasure from any encounter - basically forcing people to play spell casters or some form of min-maxed character. Then in addition to that... if you died your wealth would actually INCREASE because your starting gold is greater than what you got at level 1. If you kill the enemy for some reason you dont kill it and the dm decides to kill you for some reason. Seriously his campaign is about rolling dice. Then the one to trump it all, and oh am i glad i never met him. The friend of the guy i mentioned who had to be the most powerful character in my world insisted that he should get outrageous abilities for free. Like be a Lycanthrope without a level adjustment. Be an undead without a level adjustment. take away the weakness of a class or add special abilities to his character because he "knows how to cast prestidigitation. THEN when people give into him he would say "well if you're going to give me that then it's only logical that you give me this because it goes along with it" It's like people play the game.. well not really play it start a campaign... to create this huge argument. I'm currently finding a group that will want to play a campaign that focuses more on role playing and playing the character you are than adventuring and getting in combat. I want to get the feel of the game... and actually role play someone instead of rolling dice... in combat. eh... can't be perfect, huh?
striderII 04-12-04, 09:15 PM	Then the one to trump it all, and oh am i glad i never met him. The friend of the guy i mentioned who had to be the most powerful character in my world insisted that he should get outrageous abilities for free. Like be a Lycanthrope without a level adjustment. Be an undead without a level adjustment. take away the weakness of a class or add special abilities to his character because he "knows how to cast prestidigitation. THEN when people give into him he would say "well if you're going to give me that then it's only logical that you give me this because it goes along with it" I would *love* to have this guy in my gaming group, although I seriously doubt the reverse would be true. Also, he wouldn't last very long. There's really only one way to deal with this particular breed of player. Sticks. Large ones. Especially when used in violent fashion. strider