Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MikEye 05-31-07, 09:26 PM	Two PC's in my party have grown to not like me, and want me dead. They haven't really gone through any feat builds to become particularly strong, just more or less things like combat casting and iron will. The druid is 5th level, and the cleric of wee jas is 3rd level. I believe they want to sneak up on me in my sleep and cast either poison, or maybe when the druid reaches 6th level, contagion... That seems like a problem on its own. But in open combat, what can I do? The Con damage seems really crappy from poison, and the cleric who is a spontaneous inflicter and uses things like blade of blood... I don't know what to do. I know that I can try to use the skill Heal on myself to get rid of the poison (+10 to heal) I am a level 5 cleric, domains destruction and strength. Feats are extend spell, persistent spell, divine metamagic. I usualy persist enlarge and use other kinds of self buffs. Any ideas? Much appreciated. Mike
danielinthewolvesden 05-31-07, 10:05 PM	Sit down and talk to them- and the DM- like adults. Discuss the why of the PKing. Ask the DM if he allows this.
celtredleg 05-31-07, 10:06 PM	Stop playing in evil games would work best. Is it the other players, or is this just PC vs PC? If it the other players that want you out, you have bigger problems than what spells to use. If you are all good friends and just like scewing each other over, then game on.
JolanthusTrel 05-31-07, 10:07 PM	And Why are they trying to kill you?
MikEye 05-31-07, 10:14 PM	I am a cleric of st cuthbert and got wind of an assassin who takes ransoms from certain people that he dislikes. I contacted the cleric and the druid because I have been on past endeavors with them. (A problem with everyone in our party is that almost all of us have next to nothing in common) We ended up convincing the head of the assassin's guild that we needed someone of only his expertise to assassinate the murderer of the wee jas cleric's mother... After a 5,000 gold deposit, he left to get the job done. Over night, the druid used contagion on him and by the time he got back, he died of disease. The CN druid seems to influence the cleric's decisions, and she may off me if I made her angry enough. This is the most bitter, selfish druid I have ever met. She cares for no one but herself and has almost no motivation to do anything. One of my least favorite characters. Anyway, that is why they want to kill me, and PKing is perfectly allowed. We are only a party at certain times, due to our diversity, we do not get along most of the time. So that is why they wish to kill me. Now back to the main stake at hand... What's a player to do? ?_?
Salla 05-31-07, 10:19 PM	I am a cleric of st cuthbert and got wind of an assassin who takes ransoms from certain people that he dislikes. I contacted the cleric and the druid because I have been on past endeavors with them. (A problem with everyone in our party is that almost all of us have next to nothing in common) We ended up convincing the head of the assassin's guild that we needed someone of only his expertise to assassinate the murderer of the wee jas cleric's mother... After a 5,000 gold deposit, he left to get the job done. Over night, the druid used contagion on him and by the time he got back, he died of disease. The CN druid seems to influence the cleric's decisions, and she may off me if I made her angry enough. This is the most bitter, selfish druid I have ever met. She cares for no one but herself and has almost no motivation to do anything. One of my least favorite characters. Anyway, that is why they want to kill me, and PKing is perfectly allowed. We are only a party at certain times, due to our diversity, we do not get along most of the time. So that is why they wish to kill me. Now back to the main stake at hand... What's a player to do? ?_? Eeesh. What's the DM's take on all this?
darkneolink 05-31-07, 10:19 PM	well first of all... I'm really REALLY sorry for you you're in a no win situation Are these guys your friends? or just ppl you just happen to know? Can't you join a diferent game? or let them kill you and build a new character that has more in common with them (I'm sorry is not the best advise but... meh!)
MikEye 05-31-07, 10:27 PM	I think I can definitely take one of them in open combat, no problem. But the two together are a terrible combo. If you have any advice, any at all, let me know... Like what you would do as a PC, not as much what I can do as someone playing the PC.
TheAngryFish 05-31-07, 10:31 PM	Once you have the spell divine might kill them.
MikEye 05-31-07, 10:32 PM	Divine power you mean? Still don't know if I can take the both of them, and it may be too late.
was_fired 05-31-07, 10:35 PM	Eh, fish assuming they are equally skilled players that won't work in a straight fight. It's a cleric and a druid against just a druid. Two equally built clerics are obviously a fair match but when you add in a druid (which is just about as strong as a cleric) to one side the resulting battle could hardly be termed fair.
darkneolink 05-31-07, 10:39 PM	coup them while they are sleeping cut their heads of while they are sleeping mark of justice get yourself some powerfull allies that can protect you from them (some powerfull pallys maybe some rangers and definitly wiz/sorc)
Salla 05-31-07, 10:39 PM	Since there's no form of DM intervention here that I can see ... this game is doomed to failure. All you can really do is just roll with it. I wouldn't even fight back if they attack, just voluntarily fail your saves and let them Coup De Grace your character to get it over with. If anybody asks why (and they should) tell them that the stupid infighting and lack of cohesion is sucking all the fun out of the game, and hope the DM takes the hint and starts a new game requiring characters to not be jackasses and be able to work in a team environment.
DarkNick 05-31-07, 10:49 PM	...so you don't always play together as a group? Is the conflict between you and the players or just between your characters? Why would you adventure with these characters anyway? Something fishy is going on here......
Krusk 05-31-07, 10:51 PM	Funny idea of vengance/if they kill you take them with you. Im sure they are chaotic right? grab a quiver of axiomatic arrows. Any chaotic enemy who picks up a single one immediatly gains a negative level. imagine this after they kill you. "oh man look, hes got like 40 magic arrows, split em?" "ok cool" "each grab 20 or so and drop dead" very fitting for a cleric of retribution. As for how to deal with them? march off and they will never find you again if you do it right. problem solved. ends the campaign though.
Viseryn 05-31-07, 11:21 PM	I'd say either avoid them like the plague until you get some backup or cast all the buff spells you've got and then take the druid down first while she's alone. :evillaugh The cleric might accuse you, but most likely the player will lose confidence if the druid's been telling him what to do.
Viseryn 05-31-07, 11:42 PM	Oh, or if you want to be really devious about it, pick a completely different guy and beat him into the ground while monologuing about plotting to kill you. Might make them think twice.
Ack 06-01-07, 02:42 AM	Tell the GM that either they shape up or you ship out. Put the ball back in his court. Not playing is better than playing with PK dicks.
Optimized_Commoner 06-01-07, 03:22 AM	Okay, I know this isn't what you want, but I've got to say it... "why the hell are you playing in this game?" Anyway, that now said. Have you considered approaching your church for aid? Surely the church of St Cuthbert would help a loyal cleric in conflict with two evil characters of other faiths.
Matthew77 06-01-07, 12:00 PM	Let the Assassin's guild know that the Druid killed their guildmaster. I'm sure there is some ambitious assassin that would be happy to bring the head of his master's killer to the next assassin's guild meeting.
Phrennzy 06-01-07, 12:20 PM	Tell the DM that your Cleric splits off from the group in the next town, saying he needs to visit his temple and pray. Once there, he goes off, buys a horse, and gallops out of town. Then never team up with these two characters again. This sounds like a horrible game to be in.
wonlee76 06-01-07, 12:46 PM	The motivations seem unclear to me as to why they want to kill you other than "we don't really see eye to eye with each other." If I got your story straight: 1: You get together with Druid and Cleric regarding some situation or other. 2: You go to an assassin guildmaster for whatever reason but apparently the final outcome is you hire him to assassinate the murderer of one of the PC's mother. 3: Druid PC for whatever reason (greed maybe) chooses to kill the assassin you hired via magic instead. 4: The cleric and druid now want to kill you because? They know you will be ****** that one of them killed the assassin guildmaster? There has to be more reasons for this. Ultimately, your PC should retire in somr form or fashion. Whether its by galloping off to the sunset or by some other method. Before you retire, you could choose to set up the druid with the assassin's guild. Personally, there is a reason why mix alignment games do not always work out. This is a good example of how a mix alignmemt game can go wrong. As an aside, you can't persist Enlarge Person since it does not have a "personal" range or a fixed range. Go with Divine Favor instead.
Ayra 06-01-07, 03:49 PM	First a few assumptions on my side: You actually want to fight them and win. Everyone else seems to assume you don't, so I will look at it from a different angle. Your character is aware of the threat Your character is aware of what both the druid and cleric are capable of Well it's quite easy to realize that if you face both of them head on you are very likely to lose. Facing them head on is therefor not a valid option. As said before you could try to eliminate the druid while the cleric is not around and then patiently set up a trap for the cleric. It might also be doable to somehow raise the importance of your character. Communicate with your God (or go to a big temple). As a level 5 or 6 character you could actually strike a deal with them for support or to send you on a divine mission. Those who interfere with that mission, mess with the church of St. Cuthbert and will face certain retaliation. If you have some money on you, you could offer a large donation so they would help you get resurrected afterwards and you have all the time to plot for revenge. If you talk to your DM about this, you could actually turn your character into a recurring opponent who tries to eliminate the cleric and the druid. If you want to win and keep your character, then you must make sure that every condition is favorable to you. This means that you come prepared while they are not. Splitting them up is a definite must. You could try to make them distrust each other ingame, which may be a very hard task to do. Otherwise money would help. Rent a tough mercenary. Buy magical objects (or even better, attempt to steal theirs. This'll be very hard as you're not exactly a rogue) and scrolls/wands (if you have UMD) to gain the advantage. It's very hard and I don't think I particularly helped much with this, but this situation is not an easy one to resolve. Last but not least.. if you really want to try and win, you could ask at the character optimization boards.
Max Octavious Xavier 06-01-07, 10:21 PM	The motivations seem unclear to me as to why they want to kill you other than "we don't really see eye to eye with each other."Good, I thought it was just me. I too am unclear on why they want to kill your character. Two PC's in my party have grown to not like me, and want me dead. They haven't really gone through any feat builds to become particularly strong, just more or less things like combat casting and iron will. The druid is 5th level, and the cleric of wee jas is 3rd level. ... I am a level 5 cleric, domains destruction and strength. Feats are extend spell, persistent spell, divine metamagic. I usualy persist enlarge and use other kinds of self buffs. I don't see the problem ;) . Your class is (arguably) 1 of the best in the game with the (arguably) most potent combo in the game (persistent spell & divine metamagic) and 2 combat domains. The druid only wildshapes 1/day and can't use Natural Spell. It won't be easy, but with planning and a little luck you should have the edge. But before you escalate to fighting, talk to the dm and the players. But before you escalate to fighting, talk to the dm and the players. I felt this needed to be said twice.
Kouk 06-01-07, 11:06 PM	I like the ideas of informing the assassins that the druid killed their best man (leader?), asking your own church for aid against these crazy people who clearly don't understand justice, and/or coup'ing them in their sleep. Assassin guild without a leader probably wouldn't care about revenge though. Then again why would a leader of a guild do anything himself? Maybe it was just their best man. Always coup de grace with a x3 (or better) weapon, maximize the lethality. You could buy a scythe, then if they ask why, just say "I am thinking about retiring and starting a farm" or something.... You could work out some kind of Commune or something and ask "Is this druid a threat to my and others?" or, "has this druid been responsible for unjust acts that could deserve retribution?" the answer will probably be yes, so that might be an all-clear for a cleric of just retribution to remove the druid threat in the simplest way possible no?
Kouk 06-01-07, 11:15 PM	Oops, double.
Kouk 06-01-07, 11:18 PM	Or, if they are asleep you could cast Hold Person on them. They should auto-fail the save because being unconscious is always willing. Then, after you paralyze them both, just keep coup'ing until they are dead. If they are awake while you do it, just say "Don't **** with Cuthbert, biatch".
The Cursed Ronin 06-01-07, 11:29 PM	We had a similar problem in our group awhile back, with a cleric of Heironeous. A bit backwards from your situation, but it'll do. Anyway, he hated my bard because I didn't follow his god. And he didn't like our paladin of Pelor, for the same reason. So we solved this problem in a simple, indirectly violent manner. I antagonized him into fighting me, and then tricked him into fighting a death knight instead. Clerics = stupid. Remember this. My suggestion, wait for a big boss fight that they need you to win, and then in the thick of battle advance in the opposite direction as fast as you can, preferably locking doors and collapsing tunnels if able. No blood directly on your hands, and gets them out of the way. And don't worry about alignment, they plotted against your life first.
Gerrad_Vandar 06-02-07, 04:40 AM	Any ideas? Much appreciated. Yes. Play a good aligned character in a campaign where a DM DOES NOT LET STRONGLY EVIL, NEUTRAL, OR CHAOTIC ALIGNED PC'S JOIN! Otherwise, well, let's just say you asked for it as soon as you joined up dude. Evil is evil and backstabbing my friend is definately a part of it. Try out good for a change. Oh, and make sure the DM gives fair but warrented Experience Penalties for those who don't stay true to their alignment. Edit: Then again, every action no matter how good could be interrpeted as a somewhat selfish act (in terms of trying to satisfy one's need to help others or another more central way of interrpeting it). Thus I shall simply say if my Paladin dies and somehow ends up in Baator you may have his heavy warhorse (of course, my PC will demand compensation when you come to Baator yourself but why worry bout tomarrow when you can ride a strudy large sized poop factory capable of traveling 38 miles an hour)?
Matthew77 06-02-07, 12:12 PM	Or, if they are asleep you could cast Hold Person on them. They should auto-fail the save because being unconscious is always willing. Check with your DM before trying this. Willing vs Unwilling is only for the purposes of targetting a spell, such as Dimension Door. Being willing because of unconsciousness is not the same thing as voluntarially failing your saving throw.
MikEye 06-03-07, 05:26 PM	Thanks for the advice guys :)
Zandolit 06-04-07, 12:03 AM	I really, really feel your pain on this. I had this problem with an assassin and a cleric of Lolth when I was Lawful Good. (And before you say I shouldn't have joined this party, my character was there first. The Lolth cleric was a replacement character and the assassin started out as a Neutral Rogue.) My character survived, and I would make the following suggestions: Out of character, make it clear to the players that you like your character (if you do) and want to continue playing him/her as long as you can. In my situation, the PKers were getting bored of their own characters, and assumed I was too. Once they realized that wasn't the case, they backed off a bit. In character, a show of power will help. Next time you face an enemy, go all out and be impressive. This makes you appear both useful to the team (more useful alive than dead) and not someone they want to take on. Without overt threats, make it clear that anyone trying to take you down will get hurt in the process. If you have area of effect spells (which could be used on multiple targets at the same time,) prepare them and demonstrate you can and will use them. Make yourself seem as lethal as possible. If there are any other party members, get them to watch your back. Otherwise, make NPC friends. Better yet, do both. Never underestimate the power of even low level friends in large groups if they like you better than your killer party-mates. Last thing... is the game really worth playing? Is it worth the annoyance and frustration? I decided that it was because I really liked the game otherwise, but I certainly wouldn't fault you if you decided to move on to other things and better gaming situations.
Vaelan 06-04-07, 03:33 AM	Funny idea of vengance/if they kill you take them with you. Im sure they are chaotic right? grab a quiver of axiomatic arrows. Any chaotic enemy who picks up a single one immediatly gains a negative level. imagine this after they kill you. Nice, but rather vulnerable to DM fiat. Just grab a handful of them and ask one of the problem players to hold them for you. They take 5+ negative levels and die.
Naderion 06-04-07, 06:51 AM	I would say, if you know other will try to kill you, you have only two good options. 1. Run and never be seen again. 2. Kill them first.
northern_bear 06-04-07, 08:20 AM	I think I can definitely take one of them in open combat, no problem. But the two together are a terrible combo. If you have any advice, any at all, let me know... Like what you would do as a PC, not as much what I can do as someone playing the PC. Kill them in their sleep before they can do it to you? If forced into direct combat, then kill the cleric first. Focus your attacks on him. Once he is dead, run away. Heal. Then come back to fight the druid. The advantage of this is that as a cleric you have plenty of healing available. Chances are good that the Druid doesn't memorize much in the way of healing. The other cleric is low level, low hit points. You can take him out pretty easily, and once you do, they have no healing options left. You, on the other hand, have plenty of healing available. Use persistant spell with the "lesser vigour" spell from complete divine, if it is allowed. You now have fast healing which will last all day. Spend a round attacking them, then run away. Wait till you heal, then come back and attack some more. Repeat. They will eventually run out of healing, but you never will.
MikEye 06-06-07, 03:09 PM	If the druid attempts to entangle or poison, what is the best course of action?
Matthew77 06-06-07, 04:46 PM	Cast silence on him.
Krusk 06-07-07, 04:26 AM	If he casts entangle the best course of action is not to be near plants or in an open field. Now he will be unable to cast it. if he casts poison cant you just cast remove poison? or not fail the save?
MikEye 06-08-07, 02:59 PM	Maybe. Lol. We'll see when I need to roll the save.
Ilaro 06-08-07, 10:06 PM	Easy, just hit them with spells in which their saves are poor at. Cast protection from energy. And use the Bane spell.
Krusk 06-09-07, 04:26 AM	i guess dont fail the save should be more specific... but thats essentially what you ought to do. Buy vest of resistance +5 MIC for 25k, cast spell to up con by a ton, and spell to add bonus to saves using divine metamagic so they last all days. now you wont fail.
Magrus 06-09-07, 11:27 PM	I don't grasp why your DM isn't doing something about this. When I run games, if one of the players runs a character that goes after the other player's chars, I speak to the player. I let them know they are causing a problem, and if it continues, I will either let the other char's tear his into itty bitty pieces or I shall have fun doing something similar myself. Short of all of that, you never really gave a reason why they are wanting to kill you. You gave info that makes them look like idiots playing psychotic evil PC's, but nothing on why they would want to kill you. However, this isn't the first time you've had problems with this group. I would say pack your stuff and don't go back, personally. Telling the DM he can't run a game worth his life might be a good way to start your trip towards the door too.
Krusk 06-10-07, 02:54 PM	it sounds to me like they are playing an evil game in which this sort of thing is going to come up. Evil people to not solve problems in the nicest way every time. Sometimes a problem is solved by murder. Just cause they allow Player V player combat does not mean they have a bad DM, just a DM who runs a game diffrently than you would like.
Skrimshaw 06-11-07, 04:38 PM	I am a level 5 cleric, domains destruction and strength. Feats are extend spell, persistent spell, divine metamagic. I usualy persist enlarge and use other kinds of self buffs. Mike Persistent spell is cast as +6 levels, a cleric cannot persist a first level spell until level 13 For this reason, I don't take this feat until level 12 or so. Do you think your DM would let you trade it in for another? My advice would be to just scape the character and make another.. Or maybe ou could start to "see things their way" and join the Dark side. Go gawdless.
Far_Traveler 06-11-07, 04:55 PM	Persistent spell is cast as +6 levels, a cleric cannot persist a first level spell until level 13 For this reason, I don't take this feat until level 12 or so. Do you think your DM would let you trade it in for another? My advice would be to just scape the character and make another.. Or maybe ou could start to "see things their way" and join the Dark side. Go gawdless. Not with divine metamagic. Then it's only 7 turning attempts instead.
NightBreeze 06-11-07, 09:35 PM	By the way, the first thing that I thought seeing "Cleric and Druid want to kill me" , was: <Man, you are sooo screwed>
pmurray@bigpond.com 06-12-07, 12:01 AM	Your class is (arguably) 1 of the best in the game with the (arguably) most potent combo in the game (persistent spell & divine metamagic) and 2 combat domains. The druid only wildshapes 1/day and can't use Natural Spell. So one tactic is to engage and then run for it until their buffs expire. When you come back, your persistent enlarge, magic fang, and barkskin will still be in effect, and they will have nothing.
Skrimshaw 06-12-07, 08:23 PM	Not with divine metamagic. Then it's only 7 turning attempts instead. Ah so!
esteigs 06-21-07, 10:55 PM	take the leadership as soon as you can (if you live that long) get your own party of support characters XP bard, cleric,wizard,etc.