Evil paladin [Archive] - Wizards Community

Evil paladin [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
jessewik
04-19-07, 12:21 AM I was wondering if it was possible to make an evil paladin.i know that the dmg has a blackguard prestige class,but i want to be evil from the get-go.i want to start at first level too.i only have the core rulebooks and lack the funds too purchase more books.any helpful responses would be greatly appreciated.thanks.
Vaalingrade Ashland
04-19-07, 12:25 AM UA has the Paladins of Tyranny and Slaughter. You can also find them on d20srd.org under alternative rules.
MikEye
04-19-07, 12:34 AM The only evil paladins I know of would be the ones stated above, I'm not sure if they are official, though.
wizarddog
04-19-07, 12:41 AM You could always start as a fallen Paladin-but having only 1 level in it may be disadvantage.
Vaalingrade Ashland
04-19-07, 12:42 AM http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinVaria ntsFreedomSlaughterAndTyranny

They are certainly official -- they're OGL material appearing in Unearthed Arcana which was published by WotC under the DnD brand.

Alternatively, you could play a regular Paladin, but play him as a mean, petty, psychotic sociopath -- there's a lot of people that endorse that route.
celtredleg
04-19-07, 12:45 AM But those all call themselves good.

Talk to your DM. If he is allowing evil, he should be able to let you start as some form of evil pally.
Perseus_Stoned
04-19-07, 12:49 AM But those all call themselves good.

Thats not true, unless you call Chaotic Evil and Lawful Evil good. The SRD links are the way to go.
AffableDoomwalker
04-19-07, 01:05 AM Blackguards?
metamind
04-19-07, 09:41 AM Blackguards?

Nice, but you can not be a blackgaurd at level one, due to the fact that it is a prestige class.
Castegyre
04-19-07, 10:03 AM Well, it's house rules, but maybe they can help.

Usually when we play, and especially when I run, Paladins must be aligned to a deity and/or an order (so must monks, druids, and clerics). This dictates the characters alignment and code of conduct. Usually Paladins are LG or LN (as most characters are generally good or nuetral).

I do not force a Paladin to be lawful good. I force them to be lawful, pic a deity and/or order to belong to, and adhere strictly to the ethos implied by their deity or order. If they follow Hextor*, for example, they would be LE and have to take on his portfolio of Tyrrany, War, Discord, Massacres, Conflict, and Fitness as an active and constant part of the characters persona and actions.

*I would only allow someone to do this who I was familiar with as a player and convinced of both their abilities as a roleplayer and their motives behind the character.
Pegasos989
04-19-07, 10:36 AM If we are going to talk about houserules (and we could seeing that the OP was answered already), when I DM...

There is no class "paladin". Just Champion (nothing to do with certain webcomic author's Champion class). Champions can be either champions of a god or some universal power, often not even knowing what are they champions of.

So LG paladin might exist if he is a champion of heironeus but NG champion of good is more common.
Taluron
04-19-07, 11:18 AM When 3.5 came out Dragon magazine, issues 310-312 had alternate base classes. This included base paladin-like classes for each alignment.

310 had:

Anarch - CN
Avenger - CG
Enforcer - LN
Incarnate - TN
Sentinel - NG

312 had the bad guys:

Anti-Paladin - CE
Despot - LE
Corrupter - NE

They are all full 20-level base classes and (IMO) closer in construction to a Paladin than the classes in UA.
Dazzer
04-19-07, 11:47 AM The Unearthed Arcana has

Paladin of Tyranny (LE)
Paladin of Slaughter (CE)

Additionally, for a more generic, any-evil-god paladin

Pious Templar (gains blackguard spells, some neat abilities)

Furthermore!

A Cleric who goes Divine Champion (complete divine) could fit this ideal.

For a Base Class on Neutral Evil Paladins (if you want)

Take Paladin of Tyranny, remove chaos/law axis spells.

Add-: Evil aligned Spells of similar power for each chaos/law spell removed.

Paladin of Desecration or Paladin of Hades

Aura-: 10ft Radius, Aura of Desolation; Imposes a -2 penalty on attack and damage rolls within the radius.

I think that's neat, if the aura is "too" powerful, make it only damage, or only attack rolls.

Have Fun
Nephlite
04-19-07, 12:15 PM I was wondering if it was possible to make an evil paladin.i know that the dmg has a blackguard prestige class,but i want to be evil from the get-go.i want to start at first level too.i only have the core rulebooks and lack the funds too purchase more books.any helpful responses would be greatly appreciated.thanks.

Be martial Cleric: cast Divine Favor on yourself at low levels. The +1 hit/damage makes up for behind in bab. Don't cure in battles: call yourself a Paladin (if you act appropriately, but evil. No one will know).
Follow the CoC of the Paladin for lawfulness, but not the good side: so no poison as that is not lawful, etc, etc.

Divine Power when you can for battles: use Divine Metamagic Extend to make it last longer.
Prepare detect good (as the Paladin ability but against good as you aren't good).
AffableDoomwalker
04-19-07, 07:15 PM When 3.5 came out Dragon magazine, issues 310-312 had alternate base classes. This included base paladin-like classes for each alignment.

310 had:

Anarch - CN
Avenger - CG
Enforcer - LN
Incarnate - TN
Sentinel - NG

312 had the bad guys:

Anti-Paladin - CE
Despot - LE
Corrupter - NE

They are all full 20-level base classes and (IMO) closer in construction to a Paladin than the classes in UA.

Are those listed anywhere online by chance?
Galahdeon
04-20-07, 03:16 PM well i think you would be able to use the class from the PHB though you would have to alter it a bit, smite good, aura of evil, and i think harming hands instead of the good stuff. though you would still have to be careful on how you acted you would have to act to either serve your self or your god, and remember why you do it the most inportant question you can ask yourself when choosing an action. helping a party member does not mean your being good it means you want your party to help you, bring up the fact you saved the party member later might help sway them to do something for you too.
epifreak
04-20-07, 06:06 PM Green Ronin put out the Unholy Warrior, which is pretty good. I've made up a few, and I like them (and the companion Holy Warrior) better than the blackguard/paladin setup. I don't know if you were shooting for core, but if not, these work pretty well, and you might be able to find them on the cheap.
Evil DM Mk3
04-20-07, 06:10 PM If you want an evil paladin-feeling character you could try Hexblade and roleplay teh rest of teh way.
Galahdeon
04-20-07, 07:16 PM yes i agree on the hexblade and it might be better than the paladin, the curses are nice and realy affect almost all the targest roles. and as they get stronger the aura of unluck can mess things up.
High Octane
04-21-07, 12:24 AM Just reverse the alignment on all the class abilities, change the turn undead to rebuke undead, and switch the aura of courage with the blackguard's aura.
yellowdingo
04-21-07, 12:32 AM Like he said. Just play the Paladin with a lawful Evil alignment. Old D&D which had alignments of Chaotic, Neutral, and Lawful only had lawful Paladins. That allowed a lot more leway in the brutality of your heavily armed and armored thug with warpony...YOu could conduct a crusade to stamp out the heretics and not feel guilty about the brutality of your crime.
High Octane
04-21-07, 12:34 AM Like he said. Just play the Paladin with a lawful Evil alignment. Old D&D which had alignments of Chaotic, Neutral, and Lawful only had lawful Paladins. That allowed a lot more leway in the brutality of your heavily armed and armored thug with warpony...YOu could conduct a crusade to stamp out the heretics and not feel guilty about the brutality of your crime.

Some play paladins like that anyway.
pres_man
04-21-07, 01:24 AM Play a ranger.
Call yourself a paladin.
Done.
UndeadMouse
04-21-07, 06:09 PM turn every 'evil' to 'good' and every 'good' into 'evil'
switch teh spell lists and the auras, and practice your evil laugh.
Taluron
05-09-07, 03:00 PM Are those listed anywhere online by chance?

re:When 3.5 came out Dragon magazine, issues 310-312 had alternate base classes. This included base paladin-like classes for each alignment.

Not that I am aware of. I think Candle Keep's class ability compilation list includes them. Back issues should be available from Paizo.
LCD2YOU
05-09-07, 03:52 PM Some play paladins like that anyway.Only felt that is the case by those who feel that this:

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=808103

is the only proper way to play a Paladin.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
jessewik 04-19-07, 12:21 AM	I was wondering if it was possible to make an evil paladin.i know that the dmg has a blackguard prestige class,but i want to be evil from the get-go.i want to start at first level too.i only have the core rulebooks and lack the funds too purchase more books.any helpful responses would be greatly appreciated.thanks.
Vaalingrade Ashland 04-19-07, 12:25 AM	UA has the Paladins of Tyranny and Slaughter. You can also find them on d20srd.org under alternative rules.
MikEye 04-19-07, 12:34 AM	The only evil paladins I know of would be the ones stated above, I'm not sure if they are official, though.
wizarddog 04-19-07, 12:41 AM	You could always start as a fallen Paladin-but having only 1 level in it may be disadvantage.
Vaalingrade Ashland 04-19-07, 12:42 AM	http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#paladinVaria ntsFreedomSlaughterAndTyranny They are certainly official -- they're OGL material appearing in Unearthed Arcana which was published by WotC under the DnD brand. Alternatively, you could play a regular Paladin, but play him as a mean, petty, psychotic sociopath -- there's a lot of people that endorse that route.
celtredleg 04-19-07, 12:45 AM	But those all call themselves good. Talk to your DM. If he is allowing evil, he should be able to let you start as some form of evil pally.
Perseus_Stoned 04-19-07, 12:49 AM	But those all call themselves good. Thats not true, unless you call Chaotic Evil and Lawful Evil good. The SRD links are the way to go.
AffableDoomwalker 04-19-07, 01:05 AM	Blackguards?
metamind 04-19-07, 09:41 AM	Blackguards? Nice, but you can not be a blackgaurd at level one, due to the fact that it is a prestige class.
Castegyre 04-19-07, 10:03 AM	Well, it's house rules, but maybe they can help. Usually when we play, and especially when I run, Paladins must be aligned to a deity and/or an order (so must monks, druids, and clerics). This dictates the characters alignment and code of conduct. Usually Paladins are LG or LN (as most characters are generally good or nuetral). I do not force a Paladin to be lawful good. I force them to be lawful, pic a deity and/or order to belong to, and adhere strictly to the ethos implied by their deity or order. If they follow Hextor, for example, they would be LE and have to take on his portfolio of Tyrrany, War, Discord, Massacres, Conflict, and Fitness as an active and constant part of the characters persona and actions. I would only allow someone to do this who I was familiar with as a player and convinced of both their abilities as a roleplayer and their motives behind the character.
Pegasos989 04-19-07, 10:36 AM	If we are going to talk about houserules (and we could seeing that the OP was answered already), when I DM... There is no class "paladin". Just Champion (nothing to do with certain webcomic author's Champion class). Champions can be either champions of a god or some universal power, often not even knowing what are they champions of. So LG paladin might exist if he is a champion of heironeus but NG champion of good is more common.
Taluron 04-19-07, 11:18 AM	When 3.5 came out Dragon magazine, issues 310-312 had alternate base classes. This included base paladin-like classes for each alignment. 310 had: Anarch - CN Avenger - CG Enforcer - LN Incarnate - TN Sentinel - NG 312 had the bad guys: Anti-Paladin - CE Despot - LE Corrupter - NE They are all full 20-level base classes and (IMO) closer in construction to a Paladin than the classes in UA.
Dazzer 04-19-07, 11:47 AM	The Unearthed Arcana has Paladin of Tyranny (LE) Paladin of Slaughter (CE) Additionally, for a more generic, any-evil-god paladin Pious Templar (gains blackguard spells, some neat abilities) Furthermore! A Cleric who goes Divine Champion (complete divine) could fit this ideal. For a Base Class on Neutral Evil Paladins (if you want) Take Paladin of Tyranny, remove chaos/law axis spells. Add-: Evil aligned Spells of similar power for each chaos/law spell removed. Paladin of Desecration or Paladin of Hades Aura-: 10ft Radius, Aura of Desolation; Imposes a -2 penalty on attack and damage rolls within the radius. I think that's neat, if the aura is "too" powerful, make it only damage, or only attack rolls. Have Fun
Nephlite 04-19-07, 12:15 PM	I was wondering if it was possible to make an evil paladin.i know that the dmg has a blackguard prestige class,but i want to be evil from the get-go.i want to start at first level too.i only have the core rulebooks and lack the funds too purchase more books.any helpful responses would be greatly appreciated.thanks. Be martial Cleric: cast Divine Favor on yourself at low levels. The +1 hit/damage makes up for behind in bab. Don't cure in battles: call yourself a Paladin (if you act appropriately, but evil. No one will know). Follow the CoC of the Paladin for lawfulness, but not the good side: so no poison as that is not lawful, etc, etc. Divine Power when you can for battles: use Divine Metamagic Extend to make it last longer. Prepare detect good (as the Paladin ability but against good as you aren't good).
AffableDoomwalker 04-19-07, 07:15 PM	When 3.5 came out Dragon magazine, issues 310-312 had alternate base classes. This included base paladin-like classes for each alignment. 310 had: Anarch - CN Avenger - CG Enforcer - LN Incarnate - TN Sentinel - NG 312 had the bad guys: Anti-Paladin - CE Despot - LE Corrupter - NE They are all full 20-level base classes and (IMO) closer in construction to a Paladin than the classes in UA. Are those listed anywhere online by chance?
Galahdeon 04-20-07, 03:16 PM	well i think you would be able to use the class from the PHB though you would have to alter it a bit, smite good, aura of evil, and i think harming hands instead of the good stuff. though you would still have to be careful on how you acted you would have to act to either serve your self or your god, and remember why you do it the most inportant question you can ask yourself when choosing an action. helping a party member does not mean your being good it means you want your party to help you, bring up the fact you saved the party member later might help sway them to do something for you too.
epifreak 04-20-07, 06:06 PM	Green Ronin put out the Unholy Warrior, which is pretty good. I've made up a few, and I like them (and the companion Holy Warrior) better than the blackguard/paladin setup. I don't know if you were shooting for core, but if not, these work pretty well, and you might be able to find them on the cheap.
Evil DM Mk3 04-20-07, 06:10 PM	If you want an evil paladin-feeling character you could try Hexblade and roleplay teh rest of teh way.
Galahdeon 04-20-07, 07:16 PM	yes i agree on the hexblade and it might be better than the paladin, the curses are nice and realy affect almost all the targest roles. and as they get stronger the aura of unluck can mess things up.
High Octane 04-21-07, 12:24 AM	Just reverse the alignment on all the class abilities, change the turn undead to rebuke undead, and switch the aura of courage with the blackguard's aura.
yellowdingo 04-21-07, 12:32 AM	Like he said. Just play the Paladin with a lawful Evil alignment. Old D&D which had alignments of Chaotic, Neutral, and Lawful only had lawful Paladins. That allowed a lot more leway in the brutality of your heavily armed and armored thug with warpony...YOu could conduct a crusade to stamp out the heretics and not feel guilty about the brutality of your crime.
High Octane 04-21-07, 12:34 AM	Like he said. Just play the Paladin with a lawful Evil alignment. Old D&D which had alignments of Chaotic, Neutral, and Lawful only had lawful Paladins. That allowed a lot more leway in the brutality of your heavily armed and armored thug with warpony...YOu could conduct a crusade to stamp out the heretics and not feel guilty about the brutality of your crime. Some play paladins like that anyway.
pres_man 04-21-07, 01:24 AM	Play a ranger. Call yourself a paladin. Done.
UndeadMouse 04-21-07, 06:09 PM	turn every 'evil' to 'good' and every 'good' into 'evil' switch teh spell lists and the auras, and practice your evil laugh.
Taluron 05-09-07, 03:00 PM	Are those listed anywhere online by chance? re:When 3.5 came out Dragon magazine, issues 310-312 had alternate base classes. This included base paladin-like classes for each alignment. Not that I am aware of. I think Candle Keep's class ability compilation list includes them. Back issues should be available from Paizo.
LCD2YOU 05-09-07, 03:52 PM	Some play paladins like that anyway.Only felt that is the case by those who feel that this: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=808103 is the only proper way to play a Paladin.