Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Ranger44 05-26-06, 02:35 PM	All right here is question for all of you. I didn't know whether to post this in the players forum or the dm's forum so I'll start here and if it doesn't garner a response then I shall try the dm corner. I have played mainly melee characters and my favorite are the rangers. I love the adaptability they have. Lately I have been wanting to try one that is more like a scout character as well, so I ask you this, is trading the spell casting ability of the ranger for the skirmish ability of the scout a fair trade? I have seen the variant ranger and the substitutions in the PHBII, but neither of them suit my fancy. I would like the best of the scout and ranger in one, and still be able to keep my animal companion I seem to have an uncanny knack to develop a good companion even if it is not as good as a druid's. Any input or suggestions would be much appreciated.
Rickiel 05-26-06, 02:39 PM	Hmmm..... Well I think it might be a fair trade. Say gain Skirmish at 4th level, and it increases every three levels. I think that would be fair without overshadowing an actual Scout.
Hochiu 05-26-06, 03:08 PM	Bonus feats at every level they would have gained a new spell level. That's what I do when I want my "magic-less" ranger to run around. Or, they have variant ones in the Complete Warrior book, where they gain some spell like abilities instead of spellcasting -- gives you that kind of "Aragorn" feel of a ranger, without the whole overt magic. Check that one out, if you'd like. Edit: I just really read the whole of the first post, and realized you were speaking of the fairness of adding a skirmish ability. Sorry. I really can't add too much about the original question, as I'm largely unfamiliar with the Scout, even though I have the book it is printed in. My first inclination is that it could be a little much..especially when you combine the favored enemy. I'll have to look at it a bit later.
kelvinaw273 05-26-06, 04:05 PM	Scout and Ranger overlap a lot as it is ... take a look at the ranger varient in Unearthed Arcana for getting rid of magic. I would say it only balances if you take away favoured enemies as well. That or just take a Scout.
Neochronic 05-26-06, 06:15 PM	There's a decent non-casting ranger variant in CW.
Ranger44 05-29-06, 12:26 PM	All right this what the dm came back with... I won't give you skirmish or sneak attack(which is ok), but instead I'll give you uncanny dodge, and later you get improved uncanny dodge. I ask him if it is as the barbarian progression coming in at 4th and improving to IUD at 7th, and he says for now you have Uncanny dodge and that's it I'll tell you when you get IUD (forot to mention I came in the campaign as a 9th level ranger). Am I wrong in believing that this guy is ripping me off? I stated earlier that I wanted to try something other than the variant ranger listed in the CW, and I was trying to make my ranger more scoutlike and keep the animal companion. So, I really think that I am getting screwed on this deal, anyone think otherwise?
FeceMan 05-29-06, 02:24 PM	All right this what the dm came back with... I won't give you skirmish or sneak attack(which is ok), but instead I'll give you uncanny dodge, and later you get improved uncanny dodge. I ask him if it is as the barbarian progression coming in at 4th and improving to IUD at 7th, and he says for now you have Uncanny dodge and that's it I'll tell you when you get IUD (forot to mention I came in the campaign as a 9th level ranger). Am I wrong in believing that this guy is ripping me off? I stated earlier that I wanted to try something other than the variant ranger listed in the CW, and I was trying to make my ranger more scoutlike and keep the animal companion. So, I really think that I am getting screwed on this deal, anyone think otherwise? You probably are, yes. Rangers + swift spells = nice. Personally, I'd just go for the variant rangers suggested in CW--it's pretty good sans spellcasting, and you get something similar albeit better than the barbarian's rage ability.
kelvinaw273 05-29-06, 02:44 PM	Giving this due consideration, why not just multi class the firts few levels as ranger and the rest as scout?
Dragon Snack 05-29-06, 03:58 PM	How about just playing a Scout and adding the "Ranger" elements with feats. You can call yourself a "ranger" even if you're not... Take Wild Cohort (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031118a) for your animal companion. Skirmish should even out for your lack of favored enemy, since the extra damage is not as specialized. Track can be taken as a Scout Bonus Feat. Although the Scout Bonus Feats won't replace the Ranger Combat Style, they do give you some more "adaptability". Sure, losing the +1 BAB/level hurts, but Rangers aren't the toe to toe type anyway. Since you are starting at 9th level, your best bet (as Kelvinaw said) is probably to take a "dip" in Ranger for a few levels (maybe even Fighter to snag some Feats), depending on what you want to do. As long as you're a human or Half Elf that is.
Morrowner 05-29-06, 05:43 PM	There are so many good ranger spells that you'd be foolish to give it up. If you don't like the flavor most of the spells can be explained away as expertise. Hmm, Uncanny Dodge instead of Hunter's Mercy and Animal Growth? Methinks not!
Archangel62 05-30-06, 05:07 AM	He's actually a player in my games, the DM he's mentioning though is different. My guess is that the DM doesn't have the library that I do and as a result his spell availability sorta plummets, well that and the fact that I can't be there with my library for him to use.
tsuyoshikentsu 05-30-06, 11:30 AM	Look, if I'm reading his second post right, his DM wants to trade spellcasting for [b]uncanny dodge[/i]. Yes, you ARE getting screwed. I'd say Skirmish for casting is more than fair.