Fencing Dervish? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Fencing Dervish? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Prescient
02-26-06, 05:02 PM Hey ya'll,

Thought I might jump on and get some advice. I am trying to make a new character and I like fencing, tacics and agile fighting. At the same time, I like two-weapon fighting and devishing/berserking. I enjoy scimitars over rapiers, kinda like Drizzt.

Any ideas on what classes and favored attributes a character like that would have?

Thanks
CryoSilver
02-26-06, 05:16 PM Fighter/rogue?

Dervish PrC, maybe.
Xaxor
02-26-06, 05:42 PM You need a good Dex if you want the whole non-Epic Two Weapon Fighting chain. Int could also be useful for Combat Expertise which opens up some interesting feats like Improved Disarm/Trip/Feint.
nastynate
02-26-06, 05:49 PM You'd favor dexterity and intelligence. The character you would want to play would be a rogue (or scout) 3 / swashbuckler 3 / fighter 4 / dervish 10. A very efficient almost standard dervish build that gets bonus damage from either skirmish or sneak attack, insightful strike, and dervish dance. He fights with two scimitars, weapon finesse, and swashbuckling flair, tumbling around, taunting, and dancing while he slashes at his foes. You can tumble during a full attack to set up flanking positions, or move 10'+ per round to get skirmish damage on all your melee attacks. You've also got great bonuses to AC when fighting defensively, and good enough attack bonuses for attack penalties to matter very little, so you'll be parrying and deflecting blows, ducking under the clumsy attacks of your enemies, slashing at their ribs and hamstrings, and fluidly moving through crowded ship decks, tearing appart thier crew. :D

I like to envision these kind of guys, as the skilled sailers, pirates, and deulists of an Arabian type culture, with a scarlet sash, and loose fitting silk clothes, maybe with some piercings and tatoos to boot. Classic Arabian pirate fantasy stuff.
Prescient
02-26-06, 05:54 PM I like to envision these kind of guys, as the skilled sailers, pirates, and deulists of an Arabian type culture, with a scarlet sash, and loose fitting silk clothes, maybe with some piercings and tatoos to boot. Classic Arabian pirate fantasy stuff.

Almost exactly what I was looking for. A Prince of Perisa meets Drizzt Do'urden.
DrMorganes
02-26-06, 08:33 PM Scimitars are Martial weapons and are not able to be used in conjunction with Weapon Finesse.

Does something in the Dervish PrC change this?
Prominence
02-26-06, 08:46 PM Swashbuckler 3 / Fighter 2 / Dervish 10 / X 5 is generally considered one of the most powerful two weapon fighting builds.

Dervish considered scimitars to be light weapons. Four level or so.
Crimson_Concerto
02-26-06, 11:08 PM Scimitars are Martial weapons and are not able to be used in conjunction with Weapon Finesse.

Does something in the Dervish PrC change this?Being a Martial weapon has nothing to do with Weapon Finesse. The qualifications for Weapon Finesse are either a light weapon, or one of the weapons with an exception, such as the rapier. The Dervish PrC allows a character to treat a scimitar as a light weapon and thus use Weapon Finesse for it.
nastynate
02-26-06, 11:13 PM Swashbuckler 3 / Fighter 2 / Dervish 10 / X 5 is generally considered one of the most powerful two weapon fighting builds.Psst :shifty: X 5 is Revenent Blade...not tempest just FYI. But have faith in my build that uses 4 fighter levels, and 3 rogue (or scout) levels. Skirmish and/or sneak attack are perfect for dervishes, and the extra feat helps tremendously. Dervishes are very feat hungry, dodge, mobility, weapon focus, TWF, I-TWF, G-TWF, are all practically madatory, which leaves you very little room to wiggle.

Dervish considered scimitars to be light weapons. Four level or so. Swashy gives you finesse at level 1, and Dervishes treat scimitars as light weapons at level 1. Perfect combo as they say.
Prescient
02-27-06, 01:50 PM Psst :shifty: X 5 is Revenent Blade...not tempest just FYI. But have faith in my build that uses 4 fighter levels, and 3 rogue (or scout) levels. Skirmish and/or sneak attack are perfect for dervishes, and the extra feat helps tremendously. Dervishes are very feat hungry, dodge, mobility, weapon focus, TWF, I-TWF, G-TWF, are all practically madatory, which leaves you very little room to wiggle.

Swashy gives you finesse at level 1, and Dervishes treat scimitars as light weapons at level 1. Perfect combo as they say.

What weapon should I use for Weapon Finesse until I get the level 1 Dervish? In order to take dervish you must have Weapon Focus (Any Slashing Weapon), which means that if I attempt to use a scimitar and gain weapon finess then I am loosing a feat for at least a level. Though this is small in the long run, I don't know how long the campaign will last and I don't want to waste feats if I don't have to.
moriarty13
02-27-06, 04:04 PM Screw scimitars, go with Kukri. The difference between 1d4 and 1d6 damage at any reasonable level is negligible. Especially if you do rogue and get some sneak attack damage in. Plus if you also do Swashbuckler and add your full Int bonus to each weapon.

Down with scimitars! Down with drow dervishes! :)
Father Dale
02-27-06, 11:47 PM I think the Scout/Dervish is better than the Fighter/Dervish. Your BAB won't be as good but you get some real nice abilities (Evasion, Uncanny Dodge, etc..) and much better skills. And the skirmish damage can be a killer in a dervish dance.
nastynate
02-28-06, 10:08 AM What weapon should I use for Weapon Finesse until I get the level 1 Dervish? In order to take dervish you must have Weapon Focus (Any Slashing Weapon), which means that if I attempt to use a scimitar and gain weapon finess then I am loosing a feat for at least a level. Though this is small in the long run, I don't know how long the campaign will last and I don't want to waste feats if I don't have to.

Use a rapier until you can finesse a scimitar. Even after you take weapon focus in scimitar (at level 9 BTW so you'll only waste it for 1 level), you'll probably continue to use a rapier, because you'll most likely get bigger bonuses from finesse, than you would from focus and strength bonus combined (if you built him right and made dexterity & intelligence your two most important scores).

I think the Scout/Dervish is better than the Fighter/Dervish. Your BAB won't be as good but you get some real nice abilities (Evasion, Uncanny Dodge, etc..) and much better skills. And the skirmish damage can be a killer in a dervish dance.

My build: scout 3 / swashbuckler 3 / fighter 4 / dervish 10. (use both)
Kragar's Shadow
03-01-06, 12:23 PM The only problem I see is that the Dervish only lets you treat Scimitars as a light weapon for Weapon Finesse purposes, not for TWF. This means you either take big penalties for using two scimitars to take advantage of WF and Weapons Specialization (the reason for 4 levels of Fighter?) or you use another offhand weapon and lose out on WFocus.
Father Dale
03-01-06, 01:07 PM A first level Dervish can treat the Scimitar as a, quote, "light weapon (rather than a one-handed weapon) for all purposes, including fighting with two weapons." Complete Warrior P. 26
Rivelstraz
03-01-06, 01:17 PM If you're building a dervish from lower levels, you can still take the scimitar feats and use them as light weapons.
Just take the smaller version. They are like kukris now, but still scimitar, so weapon specialization, focus, etc. will work fine.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Prescient 02-26-06, 05:02 PM	Hey ya'll, Thought I might jump on and get some advice. I am trying to make a new character and I like fencing, tacics and agile fighting. At the same time, I like two-weapon fighting and devishing/berserking. I enjoy scimitars over rapiers, kinda like Drizzt. Any ideas on what classes and favored attributes a character like that would have? Thanks
CryoSilver 02-26-06, 05:16 PM	Fighter/rogue? Dervish PrC, maybe.
Xaxor 02-26-06, 05:42 PM	You need a good Dex if you want the whole non-Epic Two Weapon Fighting chain. Int could also be useful for Combat Expertise which opens up some interesting feats like Improved Disarm/Trip/Feint.
nastynate 02-26-06, 05:49 PM	You'd favor dexterity and intelligence. The character you would want to play would be a rogue (or scout) 3 / swashbuckler 3 / fighter 4 / dervish 10. A very efficient almost standard dervish build that gets bonus damage from either skirmish or sneak attack, insightful strike, and dervish dance. He fights with two scimitars, weapon finesse, and swashbuckling flair, tumbling around, taunting, and dancing while he slashes at his foes. You can tumble during a full attack to set up flanking positions, or move 10'+ per round to get skirmish damage on all your melee attacks. You've also got great bonuses to AC when fighting defensively, and good enough attack bonuses for attack penalties to matter very little, so you'll be parrying and deflecting blows, ducking under the clumsy attacks of your enemies, slashing at their ribs and hamstrings, and fluidly moving through crowded ship decks, tearing appart thier crew. :D I like to envision these kind of guys, as the skilled sailers, pirates, and deulists of an Arabian type culture, with a scarlet sash, and loose fitting silk clothes, maybe with some piercings and tatoos to boot. Classic Arabian pirate fantasy stuff.
Prescient 02-26-06, 05:54 PM	I like to envision these kind of guys, as the skilled sailers, pirates, and deulists of an Arabian type culture, with a scarlet sash, and loose fitting silk clothes, maybe with some piercings and tatoos to boot. Classic Arabian pirate fantasy stuff. Almost exactly what I was looking for. A Prince of Perisa meets Drizzt Do'urden.
DrMorganes 02-26-06, 08:33 PM	Scimitars are Martial weapons and are not able to be used in conjunction with Weapon Finesse. Does something in the Dervish PrC change this?
Prominence 02-26-06, 08:46 PM	Swashbuckler 3 / Fighter 2 / Dervish 10 / X 5 is generally considered one of the most powerful two weapon fighting builds. Dervish considered scimitars to be light weapons. Four level or so.
Crimson_Concerto 02-26-06, 11:08 PM	Scimitars are Martial weapons and are not able to be used in conjunction with Weapon Finesse. Does something in the Dervish PrC change this?Being a Martial weapon has nothing to do with Weapon Finesse. The qualifications for Weapon Finesse are either a light weapon, or one of the weapons with an exception, such as the rapier. The Dervish PrC allows a character to treat a scimitar as a light weapon and thus use Weapon Finesse for it.
nastynate 02-26-06, 11:13 PM	Swashbuckler 3 / Fighter 2 / Dervish 10 / X 5 is generally considered one of the most powerful two weapon fighting builds.Psst :shifty: X 5 is Revenent Blade...not tempest just FYI. But have faith in my build that uses 4 fighter levels, and 3 rogue (or scout) levels. Skirmish and/or sneak attack are perfect for dervishes, and the extra feat helps tremendously. Dervishes are very feat hungry, dodge, mobility, weapon focus, TWF, I-TWF, G-TWF, are all practically madatory, which leaves you very little room to wiggle. Dervish considered scimitars to be light weapons. Four level or so. Swashy gives you finesse at level 1, and Dervishes treat scimitars as light weapons at level 1. Perfect combo as they say.
Prescient 02-27-06, 01:50 PM	Psst :shifty: X 5 is Revenent Blade...not tempest just FYI. But have faith in my build that uses 4 fighter levels, and 3 rogue (or scout) levels. Skirmish and/or sneak attack are perfect for dervishes, and the extra feat helps tremendously. Dervishes are very feat hungry, dodge, mobility, weapon focus, TWF, I-TWF, G-TWF, are all practically madatory, which leaves you very little room to wiggle. Swashy gives you finesse at level 1, and Dervishes treat scimitars as light weapons at level 1. Perfect combo as they say. What weapon should I use for Weapon Finesse until I get the level 1 Dervish? In order to take dervish you must have Weapon Focus (Any Slashing Weapon), which means that if I attempt to use a scimitar and gain weapon finess then I am loosing a feat for at least a level. Though this is small in the long run, I don't know how long the campaign will last and I don't want to waste feats if I don't have to.
moriarty13 02-27-06, 04:04 PM	Screw scimitars, go with Kukri. The difference between 1d4 and 1d6 damage at any reasonable level is negligible. Especially if you do rogue and get some sneak attack damage in. Plus if you also do Swashbuckler and add your full Int bonus to each weapon. Down with scimitars! Down with drow dervishes! :)
Father Dale 02-27-06, 11:47 PM	I think the Scout/Dervish is better than the Fighter/Dervish. Your BAB won't be as good but you get some real nice abilities (Evasion, Uncanny Dodge, etc..) and much better skills. And the skirmish damage can be a killer in a dervish dance.
nastynate 02-28-06, 10:08 AM	What weapon should I use for Weapon Finesse until I get the level 1 Dervish? In order to take dervish you must have Weapon Focus (Any Slashing Weapon), which means that if I attempt to use a scimitar and gain weapon finess then I am loosing a feat for at least a level. Though this is small in the long run, I don't know how long the campaign will last and I don't want to waste feats if I don't have to. Use a rapier until you can finesse a scimitar. Even after you take weapon focus in scimitar (at level 9 BTW so you'll only waste it for 1 level), you'll probably continue to use a rapier, because you'll most likely get bigger bonuses from finesse, than you would from focus and strength bonus combined (if you built him right and made dexterity & intelligence your two most important scores). I think the Scout/Dervish is better than the Fighter/Dervish. Your BAB won't be as good but you get some real nice abilities (Evasion, Uncanny Dodge, etc..) and much better skills. And the skirmish damage can be a killer in a dervish dance. My build: scout 3 / swashbuckler 3 / fighter 4 / dervish 10. (use both)
Kragar's Shadow 03-01-06, 12:23 PM	The only problem I see is that the Dervish only lets you treat Scimitars as a light weapon for Weapon Finesse purposes, not for TWF. This means you either take big penalties for using two scimitars to take advantage of WF and Weapons Specialization (the reason for 4 levels of Fighter?) or you use another offhand weapon and lose out on WFocus.
Father Dale 03-01-06, 01:07 PM	A first level Dervish can treat the Scimitar as a, quote, "light weapon (rather than a one-handed weapon) for all purposes, including fighting with two weapons." Complete Warrior P. 26
Rivelstraz 03-01-06, 01:17 PM	If you're building a dervish from lower levels, you can still take the scimitar feats and use them as light weapons. Just take the smaller version. They are like kukris now, but still scimitar, so weapon specialization, focus, etc. will work fine.