Fighter Feats/Conversion [Archive] - Wizards Community

Fighter Feats/Conversion [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
loaba
10-03-05, 08:54 PM So I have a 2e Sword & Board fighter that I am converting to 3.5. He’s an 8th level Half-elf, Fighter 6/ Paladin 2 (yes, we broke the rules… big time).

I have some questions regarding his Feat chain. Input is appreciated.

Does this chain look effective? Also, about the conversion, does this seem fair? I only lost 1 level overall, but with multiclassers, conversion is tricky.

Stats
Str: 16 [+3]
Dex: 18 [+4]
Con: 14 [+2]
Int: 13 [+1]
Wis: 12 [+1]
Cha: 14 [+2] (4th & 8th level pump)

Armor: +1 Mithral Breastplate w/ Dragonhide Heavy Shield and +1 Ring of Protection
Total AC: (10+6+4+2) 23

Feats
1st – Weapon Focus: Longsword
1st – Improved Shield Bash
2nd – Two Weapon Fighting
3rd – Combat Reflexes
4th – Weapon Specialization: Longsword
6th – Combat Expertise
6th – Oversized Two Weapon Fighting

Notes
1. – He was a Fighter 6/ Paladin 3 originally. He was very close (within 1000 xp) of 7th level when I multied into Paladin. For that reason we gave him Fighter 7/ Paladin 1.
2. – As much as I would love to change the Longsword, I am stuck with it.

Edit: Changing levels per suggestions - thanks gents.
Nom
10-03-05, 10:27 PM As a caveat, note that it's very difficult to make a correlation between 2e ability scores and 3e ability scores, and almost impossible to do with levels. Often, your best bet is to just decide on the new power level (XP total, ability score generation rules) and convert the character concept.

Thus, I'm going to critique the build as if a Ftr with a few levels of Paladin, rather than worry about how it maps mechanically from the original dual-classed character.

Ability scores: Notably higher than "standard". 46 points is worth roughly +2 LA. Most DMs won't actually apply such a modifier, but your char will be the right power level for encounters approximately 2 EL above normal.

Feat chain: The feat chain is interesting and playable, though I'm surprised to see a dedicated TWF fighter coming from 2nd Ed - I thought TWF was a ranger shtick?

From a pure powergaming perspective, you would be far better to be Ftr6/Pal2, especially since your previous build was increasing the Pal levels. Ftr7 (vs Ftr6) gains you d10 hp and 2 skill points only. Pal2 (vs Pal1) gains you all of the above plus +1 Fort, divine grace and lay on hands. The only value in Ftr7 is a stepping stone to Ftr8.
Chris_The_Guy
10-03-05, 10:37 PM Although you are a fighter and have plenty of feats, I could recomend against taking both Improved Shield Bash and pursuing a two-weapon fighting style, since you are dividing your specialties.

(Unless you can use a shield bash as an off-hand attack. I have never looked into it so I wouldn't know).
SwiftFox
10-04-05, 12:05 AM This char. is obviously set up to attack with a longsword and shield effectively, I dont see how anyone could have missed it...

It looks fine to me, though as mentioned you might want to change it to FTR6/PAL2, then continue on with paladin levels, or pick a prestige class that fits well; you might want to look at the Elven Champion from Races of the Wild though that has some prerequisites that would require you to alter your feat selection slightly.

While your stats are quite high, Ive seen players roll up stats like that before and I do realise how demanding paladin was to get into in 2nd ed. so I wont call you out for that, however dont forget 3rd+ ed. PCs get a stat bonus every 4 levels, so you can add another +2 where you want it, assuming you havent already done so.
loaba
10-04-05, 12:30 AM This char. is obviously set up to attack with a longsword and shield effectively, I dont see how anyone could have missed it...

It looks fine to me, though as mentioned you might want to change it to FTR6/PAL2, then continue on with paladin levels, or pick a prestige class that fits well; you might want to look at the Elven Champion from Races of the Wild though that has some prerequisites that would require you to alter your feat selection slightly.

While your stats are quite high, Ive seen players roll up stats like that before and I do realise how demanding paladin was to get into in 2nd ed. so I wont call you out for that, however dont forget 3rd+ ed. PCs get a stat bonus every 4 levels, so you can add another +2 where you want it, assuming you havent already done so.

Believe it or not, this was honestly rolled, true story. And yeah, both Cha and Wis have the pumps. And yes, Phineas is uber, just how it worked out.

Fighter 6/ Pal 2 - I just thought it made more sense to finish out that Fighter level, but aye, you are correct that Pal 2 would be better than Fighter 7.

And yes - This is a shield fighter, very much so.
Nom
10-04-05, 01:52 AM Believe it or not, this was honestly rolled, true story. And yeah, both Cha and Wis have the pumps. And yes, Phineas is uber, just how it worked out.I'm not accusing you of cheating, merely pointing out the (significant) game balance implications of that ability array. If your DM is already on the ball with it, there will be no problem. If not, there's a reason we continually see "I gave my PCs the equivalent of two free levels and now all the CRs don't work! I don't understand!" threads.
And yes - This is a shield fighter, very much so.Ah, that makes sense, yes.
loaba
10-04-05, 02:28 AM With the feat selections that I have made, I basically have tried to make a warrior who can sling a heavy shield around with relative ease and A. still retain shield AC benefit and B. only take a -2 penalty on attacking. I like that. I guess I kind of think of it as responsible TWF. :D

Phineas Phinbarson, Male Half-Elf Ftr6/Pal2: CR 8; Medium Humanoid (Elf); HD 6d10+12(Fighter) , 2d10+4(Paladin) ; hp 75; Init +4; Spd 30; AC:25 (Flatfooted:21 Touch:16); Atk +11/6 base melee, +12/7 base ranged; +13/8 (1d8+6+1d6, +1 Intelligent Adamantine Longsword); SQ: Immunity: Sleep Effects (Ex), Low-light Vision (Ex), +2 Saves vs. Spells and Spell-like Effects; RF: Elven Blood; AL LG; SV Fort +13, Ref +9, Will +6; STR 16, DEX 18, CON 14, INT 13, WIS 12, CHA 14.
Skills: Diplomacy +4, Gather Information +4, Handle Animal +6, Knowledge (Religion) +4, Listen +4, Ride +9, Search +4, Sense Motive +4, Spot +4.

Feats: Armor Proficiency: heavy, Armor Proficiency: light, Armor Proficiency: medium, Combat Expertise, Combat Reflexes, Improved Shield Bash, Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Tower Shield Proficiency, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus: Longsword, Weapon Specialization: Longsword.
Possessions:
Weapons: +1 Intelligent Adamantine Longsword: Flaming (11,315 gp).
Armor: +1 Mithral Breastplate (5,350 gp).
Shields: +1 Dragonhide Shield, heavy steel (1,340 gp).
Goods: Coin: gp (74) (74 gp); Traveler`s outfit (1 gp); Pouch, belt (1 gp); Backpack (2 gp); Bedroll (1 sp); Candle (1 cp); Coin: cp (107) (107 cp); Flint and steel (1 gp); Mess Kit (6 sp); Mirror, small steel (10 gp); Sewing needle (5 sp); Waterskin (full) (1 gp); Whetstone (2 cp); Rations, trail (per day) (4) (20 sp); Coin: sp (7) (7 sp).
Magic: Ring: Protection +2 (8,000 gp); Wondrous: Cloak of Resistance +1 (1,000 gp).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
loaba 10-03-05, 08:54 PM	So I have a 2e Sword & Board fighter that I am converting to 3.5. He’s an 8th level Half-elf, Fighter 6/ Paladin 2 (yes, we broke the rules… big time). I have some questions regarding his Feat chain. Input is appreciated. Does this chain look effective? Also, about the conversion, does this seem fair? I only lost 1 level overall, but with multiclassers, conversion is tricky. Stats Str: 16 [+3] Dex: 18 [+4] Con: 14 [+2] Int: 13 [+1] Wis: 12 [+1] Cha: 14 [+2] (4th & 8th level pump) Armor: +1 Mithral Breastplate w/ Dragonhide Heavy Shield and +1 Ring of Protection Total AC: (10+6+4+2) 23 Feats 1st – Weapon Focus: Longsword 1st – Improved Shield Bash 2nd – Two Weapon Fighting 3rd – Combat Reflexes 4th – Weapon Specialization: Longsword 6th – Combat Expertise 6th – Oversized Two Weapon Fighting Notes 1. – He was a Fighter 6/ Paladin 3 originally. He was very close (within 1000 xp) of 7th level when I multied into Paladin. For that reason we gave him Fighter 7/ Paladin 1. 2. – As much as I would love to change the Longsword, I am stuck with it. Edit: Changing levels per suggestions - thanks gents.
Nom 10-03-05, 10:27 PM	As a caveat, note that it's very difficult to make a correlation between 2e ability scores and 3e ability scores, and almost impossible to do with levels. Often, your best bet is to just decide on the new power level (XP total, ability score generation rules) and convert the character concept. Thus, I'm going to critique the build as if a Ftr with a few levels of Paladin, rather than worry about how it maps mechanically from the original dual-classed character. Ability scores: Notably higher than "standard". 46 points is worth roughly +2 LA. Most DMs won't actually apply such a modifier, but your char will be the right power level for encounters approximately 2 EL above normal. Feat chain: The feat chain is interesting and playable, though I'm surprised to see a dedicated TWF fighter coming from 2nd Ed - I thought TWF was a ranger shtick? From a pure powergaming perspective, you would be far better to be Ftr6/Pal2, especially since your previous build was increasing the Pal levels. Ftr7 (vs Ftr6) gains you d10 hp and 2 skill points only. Pal2 (vs Pal1) gains you all of the above plus +1 Fort, divine grace and lay on hands. The only value in Ftr7 is a stepping stone to Ftr8.
Chris_The_Guy 10-03-05, 10:37 PM	Although you are a fighter and have plenty of feats, I could recomend against taking both Improved Shield Bash and pursuing a two-weapon fighting style, since you are dividing your specialties. (Unless you can use a shield bash as an off-hand attack. I have never looked into it so I wouldn't know).
SwiftFox 10-04-05, 12:05 AM	This char. is obviously set up to attack with a longsword and shield effectively, I dont see how anyone could have missed it... It looks fine to me, though as mentioned you might want to change it to FTR6/PAL2, then continue on with paladin levels, or pick a prestige class that fits well; you might want to look at the Elven Champion from Races of the Wild though that has some prerequisites that would require you to alter your feat selection slightly. While your stats are quite high, Ive seen players roll up stats like that before and I do realise how demanding paladin was to get into in 2nd ed. so I wont call you out for that, however dont forget 3rd+ ed. PCs get a stat bonus every 4 levels, so you can add another +2 where you want it, assuming you havent already done so.
loaba 10-04-05, 12:30 AM	This char. is obviously set up to attack with a longsword and shield effectively, I dont see how anyone could have missed it... It looks fine to me, though as mentioned you might want to change it to FTR6/PAL2, then continue on with paladin levels, or pick a prestige class that fits well; you might want to look at the Elven Champion from Races of the Wild though that has some prerequisites that would require you to alter your feat selection slightly. While your stats are quite high, Ive seen players roll up stats like that before and I do realise how demanding paladin was to get into in 2nd ed. so I wont call you out for that, however dont forget 3rd+ ed. PCs get a stat bonus every 4 levels, so you can add another +2 where you want it, assuming you havent already done so. Believe it or not, this was honestly rolled, true story. And yeah, both Cha and Wis have the pumps. And yes, Phineas is uber, just how it worked out. Fighter 6/ Pal 2 - I just thought it made more sense to finish out that Fighter level, but aye, you are correct that Pal 2 would be better than Fighter 7. And yes - This is a shield fighter, very much so.
Nom 10-04-05, 01:52 AM	Believe it or not, this was honestly rolled, true story. And yeah, both Cha and Wis have the pumps. And yes, Phineas is uber, just how it worked out.I'm not accusing you of cheating, merely pointing out the (significant) game balance implications of that ability array. If your DM is already on the ball with it, there will be no problem. If not, there's a reason we continually see "I gave my PCs the equivalent of two free levels and now all the CRs don't work! I don't understand!" threads. And yes - This is a shield fighter, very much so.Ah, that makes sense, yes.
loaba 10-04-05, 02:28 AM	With the feat selections that I have made, I basically have tried to make a warrior who can sling a heavy shield around with relative ease and A. still retain shield AC benefit and B. only take a -2 penalty on attacking. I like that. I guess I kind of think of it as responsible TWF. :D Phineas Phinbarson, Male Half-Elf Ftr6/Pal2: CR 8; Medium Humanoid (Elf); HD 6d10+12(Fighter) , 2d10+4(Paladin) ; hp 75; Init +4; Spd 30; AC:25 (Flatfooted:21 Touch:16); Atk +11/6 base melee, +12/7 base ranged; +13/8 (1d8+6+1d6, +1 Intelligent Adamantine Longsword); SQ: Immunity: Sleep Effects (Ex), Low-light Vision (Ex), +2 Saves vs. Spells and Spell-like Effects; RF: Elven Blood; AL LG; SV Fort +13, Ref +9, Will +6; STR 16, DEX 18, CON 14, INT 13, WIS 12, CHA 14. Skills: Diplomacy +4, Gather Information +4, Handle Animal +6, Knowledge (Religion) +4, Listen +4, Ride +9, Search +4, Sense Motive +4, Spot +4. Feats: Armor Proficiency: heavy, Armor Proficiency: light, Armor Proficiency: medium, Combat Expertise, Combat Reflexes, Improved Shield Bash, Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Tower Shield Proficiency, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus: Longsword, Weapon Specialization: Longsword. Possessions: Weapons: +1 Intelligent Adamantine Longsword: Flaming (11,315 gp). Armor: +1 Mithral Breastplate (5,350 gp). Shields: +1 Dragonhide Shield, heavy steel (1,340 gp). Goods: Coin: gp (74) (74 gp); Traveler`s outfit (1 gp); Pouch, belt (1 gp); Backpack (2 gp); Bedroll (1 sp); Candle (1 cp); Coin: cp (107) (107 cp); Flint and steel (1 gp); Mess Kit (6 sp); Mirror, small steel (10 gp); Sewing needle (5 sp); Waterskin (full) (1 gp); Whetstone (2 cp); Rations, trail (per day) (4) (20 sp); Coin: sp (7) (7 sp). Magic: Ring: Protection +2 (8,000 gp); Wondrous: Cloak of Resistance +1 (1,000 gp).