Gaming Problems (Feedback wanted) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Gaming Problems (Feedback wanted) [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Maryk_Keiros
12-29-05, 03:47 AM Me and the rest of the people in my game have a problem. Two of the players are extremely unreliable. 1 is unreliable through association though. The one bad one has a car, a cell phone and a job. He is notorious for not caring. For example, we were supposed to be gaming at nine o'clock. Today. It is now 12:49 am and no show or word. The problem is that he is dating the other player, so she is always with him and thus if he's not there neither is she. The job has nothing to do with him though, as we work around it.

What should we do? I think booting them is too big because the group only has 5 people and we need the others. Im confused. I would love some help.
Shaggy_Shaggs
12-29-05, 03:57 AM Ugh, I've seen this before. If it continues long-term it'll build up resentment with the players and DM until things get very ugly.

Establish a specific time for sessions (weekly, monthly, whatever you can do) if you don't already have one, decide among the entire group how much tardiness should count for an absence, and give each player a limited amount (I suggest 3) of allowable unexpected absences they can use up, with the understanding that if they are absent more than that many times they will be booted out of the group.

Offer them the option to temporarily leave the group (have their characters take a vacation or whatever) to get their personal issues sorted out, if necessary.

Ask them if they're even still interested in playing, and make it clear that there are no dire consequences if they are not. It's possible that one or both no longer wants to play but doesn't feel comfortable saying so for fear of retribution.

No matter what, don't just leave the situation as it is. If they've got to go, make it a clean cut rather than dragging it out torturously until they don't want to come back and you don't want them back, if they get the chance to later.

It's understandable not wanting to lose them from the group, but you've got to ask yourself when having them becomes more of a detriment (to them and to the group) than not having them.
Rumple_Cragstan
12-29-05, 04:56 AM Ok, I am the DM of the group in question. Maryk did a decent job, but didn't quite drill home the point of how needed these two players are.

Yes, our group is indeed 5 people currently (4PCs, and me). Maryk is one of those players. Another player is great at showing up, but horrible at anything other than rolling dice (he's gained the affectionate nickname of "the NPC PC").

Now there's the other two. Both of them are great RPers, and they've put so much work into thier characters, and are the most useful characters due to thier experience and intelligence. They only make up half of the party, but without them it dosn't have much of a hope for survival. In short, if we can get them to attend, then they're star players which I couldn't think about gaming without.

We live in a very small town. I've recruited every person I could think of into game. Some stuck, some didn't. After 4 years of natural selection within our gaming group, this group of 5 is all we have within a 30 minute drive. And these two players have been around scince the very beginning.

This is the first game we've actually had running scince last summer, and I'm desperate for it to work. If I cut out two players before the storyline even gets started, I'm terrified that the game will collapse.

Now, I will give defence for the absentee player (because there's really only one, which is as an effect causing the absence of the other) because he's not here to defend himself.

Our group is largely made up of older teenagers (17 being almost the universal age) and the problem player is 20. He's got a full-time job, and I understand that its hard to get to an out-of-town game when you're working nights and sleeping days. But we've tried to accomodate for his schedule as much as we possibly can - to the point when its he and not I who's determining when the next scheduled game is to be. He's got a big car, and gas is a bit pricy here in Canada. We would try to game at his place, but frankly, there's not enough room for half the group to effectively game.

I don't know what to do. We're on our last legs here, and I don't want to see the hundreds of dollars spent on books and dice (especially scince I just spent more than 100$ in the last month preparing for this campaign) go down the drain.

At the very least, I suppose that one player is better than none, right?
Elemental_Elf
12-29-05, 05:07 AM That situation sucks. Sorry if i seem rude but, damn that sucks hard. :weep: :weep: :weep: :weep: :weep:

Well if the 20 year old leaves is it all that likely that his g/f will leave? I mean if she enjoys it then it may be reasonable to say that she may stick with it.

Also you could make the 20 year old's character like a wanderer. This way he can just pop up into the campaign when he's there and when he's not, his character is off wandering the forests or something.

Beyond that... I really don't now...

I hope the situation improves for the better.
Maryk_Keiros
12-29-05, 05:35 AM I have no real clue wether or not she will leave. I see her sticking by her boyfriend, but she has been gaming longer than I have and she loves doing it. The problem is, is that the only times she is available is when he is, as they are always together. I like the wanderer comment, and it does kind of play in, he is a rogue.

Thanks for you're wishes.
Sir Todd
12-29-05, 11:17 AM It is nearly impossible to continue any game that has a number of unreliable players. So I empathize. I have seen this kill every game it happens in. Basically you have already lost at least one of those players and they just haven't told you yet. So let the player(s) go away. If you want to give them another chance go ahead. (Since they are good players in other ways). But make it clear that if they pull a 'no call, no show' again. Then they are out of the game. If it is simply a case of them taking the game for granted then this will convince them they need to shape up or ship out. But if they don't really wish to play anymore and are moving on to other things (dating qualifies). Then it is best that you know now and can put things on hold while you find someone who actually WANTS to play.

Really, if you want to preserve your sanity. Stop the game. You clearly invested a lot in this current campaign but you can't enjoy running it when you don't have any idea if the unreliables will be there or not. Save the game for a later date. There is nothing wrong with leaving it wait while the players and you make alternate arrangements.

What would I do? I would Change the regular game time to one the unreliable player can't make it to. and start running simpler campaigns allowing perhaps the two remaining players to play Gestalt characters to make up for small party issues. Or even play a board game or video game for a while.

Then make a colorfull flyer and ask if you can post it in a number of places that sell the game in your area. Start running 'stand alone' games with your current players and the new people that contact you. Just to see if they will work out. Sort of a trial under fire. If you all like the new players, Keep them. Otherwise keep waiting for new people to respond to the flyer. Trust me after 4 years you have a whole new batch of untapped players out there you simply haven't met yet.
JadeSpider9643
12-29-05, 11:48 AM Depending on the un-dependable is a recipie for a group disbanding (happened to me twice)

For more insights, consult the Phrennzy quote in my sig, then kick em out.
Dig
12-29-05, 02:02 PM your doomed, your gonna loose them sooner or later. Once they break up will be the test.

"I dont wanna be there if hes there"

"I dont wanna be there if shes there"

:weep:

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Maryk_Keiros 12-29-05, 03:47 AM	Me and the rest of the people in my game have a problem. Two of the players are extremely unreliable. 1 is unreliable through association though. The one bad one has a car, a cell phone and a job. He is notorious for not caring. For example, we were supposed to be gaming at nine o'clock. Today. It is now 12:49 am and no show or word. The problem is that he is dating the other player, so she is always with him and thus if he's not there neither is she. The job has nothing to do with him though, as we work around it. What should we do? I think booting them is too big because the group only has 5 people and we need the others. Im confused. I would love some help.
Shaggy_Shaggs 12-29-05, 03:57 AM	Ugh, I've seen this before. If it continues long-term it'll build up resentment with the players and DM until things get very ugly. Establish a specific time for sessions (weekly, monthly, whatever you can do) if you don't already have one, decide among the entire group how much tardiness should count for an absence, and give each player a limited amount (I suggest 3) of allowable unexpected absences they can use up, with the understanding that if they are absent more than that many times they will be booted out of the group. Offer them the option to temporarily leave the group (have their characters take a vacation or whatever) to get their personal issues sorted out, if necessary. Ask them if they're even still interested in playing, and make it clear that there are no dire consequences if they are not. It's possible that one or both no longer wants to play but doesn't feel comfortable saying so for fear of retribution. No matter what, don't just leave the situation as it is. If they've got to go, make it a clean cut rather than dragging it out torturously until they don't want to come back and you don't want them back, if they get the chance to later. It's understandable not wanting to lose them from the group, but you've got to ask yourself when having them becomes more of a detriment (to them and to the group) than not having them.
Rumple_Cragstan 12-29-05, 04:56 AM	Ok, I am the DM of the group in question. Maryk did a decent job, but didn't quite drill home the point of how needed these two players are. Yes, our group is indeed 5 people currently (4PCs, and me). Maryk is one of those players. Another player is great at showing up, but horrible at anything other than rolling dice (he's gained the affectionate nickname of "the NPC PC"). Now there's the other two. Both of them are great RPers, and they've put so much work into thier characters, and are the most useful characters due to thier experience and intelligence. They only make up half of the party, but without them it dosn't have much of a hope for survival. In short, if we can get them to attend, then they're star players which I couldn't think about gaming without. We live in a very small town. I've recruited every person I could think of into game. Some stuck, some didn't. After 4 years of natural selection within our gaming group, this group of 5 is all we have within a 30 minute drive. And these two players have been around scince the very beginning. This is the first game we've actually had running scince last summer, and I'm desperate for it to work. If I cut out two players before the storyline even gets started, I'm terrified that the game will collapse. Now, I will give defence for the absentee player (because there's really only one, which is as an effect causing the absence of the other) because he's not here to defend himself. Our group is largely made up of older teenagers (17 being almost the universal age) and the problem player is 20. He's got a full-time job, and I understand that its hard to get to an out-of-town game when you're working nights and sleeping days. But we've tried to accomodate for his schedule as much as we possibly can - to the point when its he and not I who's determining when the next scheduled game is to be. He's got a big car, and gas is a bit pricy here in Canada. We would try to game at his place, but frankly, there's not enough room for half the group to effectively game. I don't know what to do. We're on our last legs here, and I don't want to see the hundreds of dollars spent on books and dice (especially scince I just spent more than 100$ in the last month preparing for this campaign) go down the drain. At the very least, I suppose that one player is better than none, right?
Elemental_Elf 12-29-05, 05:07 AM	That situation sucks. Sorry if i seem rude but, damn that sucks hard. :weep: :weep: :weep: :weep: :weep: Well if the 20 year old leaves is it all that likely that his g/f will leave? I mean if she enjoys it then it may be reasonable to say that she may stick with it. Also you could make the 20 year old's character like a wanderer. This way he can just pop up into the campaign when he's there and when he's not, his character is off wandering the forests or something. Beyond that... I really don't now... I hope the situation improves for the better.
Maryk_Keiros 12-29-05, 05:35 AM	I have no real clue wether or not she will leave. I see her sticking by her boyfriend, but she has been gaming longer than I have and she loves doing it. The problem is, is that the only times she is available is when he is, as they are always together. I like the wanderer comment, and it does kind of play in, he is a rogue. Thanks for you're wishes.
Sir Todd 12-29-05, 11:17 AM	It is nearly impossible to continue any game that has a number of unreliable players. So I empathize. I have seen this kill every game it happens in. Basically you have already lost at least one of those players and they just haven't told you yet. So let the player(s) go away. If you want to give them another chance go ahead. (Since they are good players in other ways). But make it clear that if they pull a 'no call, no show' again. Then they are out of the game. If it is simply a case of them taking the game for granted then this will convince them they need to shape up or ship out. But if they don't really wish to play anymore and are moving on to other things (dating qualifies). Then it is best that you know now and can put things on hold while you find someone who actually WANTS to play. Really, if you want to preserve your sanity. Stop the game. You clearly invested a lot in this current campaign but you can't enjoy running it when you don't have any idea if the unreliables will be there or not. Save the game for a later date. There is nothing wrong with leaving it wait while the players and you make alternate arrangements. What would I do? I would Change the regular game time to one the unreliable player can't make it to. and start running simpler campaigns allowing perhaps the two remaining players to play Gestalt characters to make up for small party issues. Or even play a board game or video game for a while. Then make a colorfull flyer and ask if you can post it in a number of places that sell the game in your area. Start running 'stand alone' games with your current players and the new people that contact you. Just to see if they will work out. Sort of a trial under fire. If you all like the new players, Keep them. Otherwise keep waiting for new people to respond to the flyer. Trust me after 4 years you have a whole new batch of untapped players out there you simply haven't met yet.
JadeSpider9643 12-29-05, 11:48 AM	Depending on the un-dependable is a recipie for a group disbanding (happened to me twice) For more insights, consult the Phrennzy quote in my sig, then kick em out.
Dig 12-29-05, 02:02 PM	your doomed, your gonna loose them sooner or later. Once they break up will be the test. "I dont wanna be there if hes there" "I dont wanna be there if shes there" :weep: