Getting rid on an intelligent item, help needed [Archive] - Wizards Community

Getting rid on an intelligent item, help needed [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Lael
07-21-04, 12:03 AM We have a character in our party (Crow) who has an intelligent sword. Now this sword has saved our butts a lot of times, but it is starting to hamper Crow's development and causing him to start more trouble then the sword is worth.

Last game the Crow almost was able to make a will save vs the sword ego (I think) but missed by one point (I'm not sure what he rolled, but it was over 16). So the idea has come about to try and get the sword away from him, but I'm not to sure about what is the best way to do this.

My character is a 9th level cleric, and we have a 9th level wizard in the party, and between us I'm sure there is something we could do to get rid of the sword (or help Crow get rid of the sword), but I can't seem to find anything.

Anyone got any ideas on how we could do this?

My last character idea was to wait until the Crow dropped and then swoop up the sword into the bag of holding and then get rid of it in an out of the way spot (like a volcano). But that character died a while back and the bag of holding has been lost.
Nagol
07-21-04, 03:00 PM An intelligent item is a construct. As such, it is very difficult to 'turn off'.

One of the simplest ways is to get a adamantine weapon and sunder the magic weapon. Note that this works only if the weapon's hardness is below 20 -- that is it won't work if the intelligent item is made of adamantine, mithral with a +3 bonus, or normal steel with a +5 bonus. If you can get your group to coordinate then cast targeted Dispel Magics on the sword until it loses its powers and then sunder it.
wdarkk
07-21-04, 03:27 PM Whenever the character is in a "stressful situation" he can recontest the sword for control.

I'd recommend Kobolds. They're not that dangerous, you can get 20 of them easy, and you can dominate person them into attacking the guy with the sword.

After that, have him bury the thing.
Boothbey
07-21-04, 06:53 PM Disarm the character. Use a stoneshape to encase the sword in rock. Summon an earth elemental to take it deep down into the ground. Dont give Crow access to shovels for a while.
Mitchell
07-22-04, 02:28 AM He's got to sleep sometime. You may want to hire a thief to simply steal it. With your help, making sure the door is unlocked, buffing the thiefs dex, casting silence to ensure no noise, should be a snap. The best part is, the thief will probably work for the sword alone.
trapspringer
07-22-04, 01:49 PM Yea, but I bet you could talk the DM into awarding exp if you get rid of it in some creative manner such as those listed above, particularly the stone shape dealie.
dwarfpaladinmorlock
07-22-04, 09:32 PM Don't complicate the issue. Crow is your friend. He probably lets you cast spells on him all the time.

1. Buff up yourself for your contest against the sword.
2. Get Crow to accept a bull strength or other beneficial spell.
3. When he doesn't resist the spell, instead cast hold person. Since he is not resisting, he has by definition given up his save, and thus is Held.
4. Take the sword from it's scabbard, or better yet, take the entire scabbard, so you don't have to draw it.
5. Use one of the above mentioned actions to get rid of it (I like the earth elemental bit).

Problem solved, although Crow might be ****** about it when he breaks free of the hold. Don't forget to work with they other party members that agree with out to do this. You will need to work fast, as he gets a new save every round to break free of the Hold Person spell. You want the sword gone before he gets free and attacks you.
Sildatorak
07-22-04, 11:35 PM Is the weapon evil (or absolutely opposed to your party's goals in some other way)? If it isn't, you may wish to steal it so that you can give it to some less experienced adventurers so it can save their butts.

As an add-on to the "trick him into getting held" plan, you might want the wizard to have a teleport memorized so he can grab the weapon and get the heck out.
Shadowdweller
07-23-04, 08:21 PM Stick it into the earth on top of a remote hillside and leave it there. You might even end up starting a King Arthur-style legend: "The Talking Sword on the Hilltop".
Salla
07-24-04, 02:01 AM Here's your recipe for getting rid of the sword:
1. Take one fighter.
2. Buff to taste.
3. Add one Sunder maneuver. Possibly more than one.

Best done when a fight has already broken out, somewhere after the midpoint when you're sure you're winning.
Lael
07-26-04, 09:51 PM Thanks guys.

Crow is an permanet protection from evil spell item and that doesn't work, so the sword is obviously not evil.

Our biggest concearns is that it will turn on the party when a bigger badder fighter type comes along and decides that Crow is good enough for it.

The time really to gotten rid of it was long ago, and now the sword has gotten more control over Crow. If it was as simple as asking Crow to give it away, then we would have done that, put the sword likes the reputation Crow now has (he is the only original party member still alive, so he gets the blame/praise for the things we have done).

Well some other thoughts have come about with my wizard friend. The biggest one is either break enchantment on Crow to try and get him rid of the sword himself, or polymorph into or summon a rust monster to take out the sword.

Last game though the sword was rather sedate, so maybe the last game he did gain some control over the sword, but we need these things as a backup.

One other thought we had was if we ever need to summon a planar ally, use the sword as its repayment :angel:
Lael
07-26-04, 10:05 PM Originally posted by Boothbey
Disarm the character. Use a stoneshape to encase the sword in rock. Summon an earth elemental to take it deep down into the ground. Dont give Crow access to shovels for a while.

I quite like that idea, thanks. Be a good way to have it "disapear".
CaoSlayer
07-27-04, 10:07 AM from the srd:
(rod of)
Cancellation: This dreaded rod is a bane to magic items, for its touch drains an item of all magical properties. The item touched must make a DC 23 Will save to prevent the rod from draining it. If a creature is holding it at the time, then the item can use the holder’s Will save bonus in place of its own if the holder’s is better. In such cases, contact is made by making a melee touch attack roll. Upon draining an item, the rod itself becomes brittle and cannot be used again. Drained items are only restorable by wish or miracle. (If a sphere of annihilation and a rod of cancellation negate each other, nothing can restore either of them.)
Strong abjuration; CL 17th; Craft Rod, mage’s disjunction; Price 11,000 gp.

Just buy one, show the rod to the sword and tell it "try to do any nasty trick and we will smash you with the rod"
Revelation
07-27-04, 11:36 AM Originally posted by Lael
Last game the Crow almost was able to make a will save vs the sword ego (I think) but missed by one point (I'm not sure what he rolled, but it was over 16). So the idea has come about to try and get the sword away from him.

Most things I'd have said have been said, except one...

OOC you know the player has failed a saving throw. How do you know IC that this rules mechanic line has been crossed? As a DM I would seriously dislike players using such OOC knowledge gratuitously, this sounds a bit like "OK, the sword was useful, but now we've failed a roll we'd best get rid of it as soon as we can"

I hope that your decision is the result of a clear and marked change in the character which you can discretely pin down to the sword and not any other stressful or threatening events that have occurred in that PC's life. If not you're just playing a computer game.
ShadowRanger
07-27-04, 12:13 PM you have yet to say what the problem with the sword is, tell us that and we can help out more
Lael
07-28-04, 09:02 PM What do you want to know?

The sword for it most part is very helpful item (espically being +3), but it does tend to make Crow go over the top all the time in his attacks, or egg him on to take on the big bad by himself, even though Crow prolly couldn't.

Two games ago, a situation occured that Crow was confused (as he has the bad fortune to not be able to save his will saves) while fighting an iron golem and some other undead nasties, and thus was taken out of the action. Because the the iron golumns magic immunity, my cleric and the wizard were useless against it and the rest of the party did not have anything to hurt the IG besides ghosttouch.

Now Crow has a real bad habbit of attacking us when he is confused, so one of the other party member (Soumon - a Lizard man Cleric / ranger) cast hold person on him after he attacked my character, and was taken out of the room. But in our withdrawl, one other party member got confused and was left remaining with the IG.

Souman took up ghosttouch and went in to get the remaining character, but on the way in, had a "conversation" with ghosttouch about why he had taken him away from Crow, and I beleive the word "rust monster" popped up (you get that from a Lizardman). Soumon then stopped his charge and returned back out of the room to us in a rather non-lizardman fashion, and placed ghosttouch on the floor infront of crow.

Fortinually the remaining character was able to survive (somehow) the IG and snapped out of his confused state and quickly exited the room. The IG never followed.

Seeing this change in Souman, the wizard use mage hand to take ghosttouch away from both of them, but ghosttouch compelled Souman to be brough back to Crow, so Souman simply went over and grabbed the sword (exerting the requred force) and returned the sword.

This is when Crow had his long aurgment with Ghosttouch about control other members of the party, and why it didn't step in when Crow was confused, and OOC failed the save by one.

However ghosttouch did make allowance to try and act more for the party Crow reported later.

So the wizard and myself got to thinking that Ghosttouch is too much of a liability for Crow and the party, thats why we are thinking of ways to remove ghosttouch. The biggest liability is that if we ever come across someone that is bigger and badder and better then Crow, Ghosttouch may want to leave Crow for this person. But other main factor is that its control Crow too much and not allowing him to develop his character.

But as I said, last game ghosttouch was more tame, so we just want to keep some "options" available.
Kaminton
07-28-04, 09:59 PM Trade it in. Seriously.

Ask it if it has a purpose for existence. Then go to the appropriate more powerful person whose goals match the weapon's, describe it, and arrange a sale or trade.

If the weapon doesn't have a special purpose, then pretty much anyone more powerful will do.

Just be careful if the thing's goal is to further evil, or the destruction of some race, or to rule the world... but if that's what it wants, you're screwed anyway.
CaoSlayer
07-29-04, 06:51 AM by the way, a feeblemind spell would affect an inteligent item?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Lael 07-21-04, 12:03 AM	We have a character in our party (Crow) who has an intelligent sword. Now this sword has saved our butts a lot of times, but it is starting to hamper Crow's development and causing him to start more trouble then the sword is worth. Last game the Crow almost was able to make a will save vs the sword ego (I think) but missed by one point (I'm not sure what he rolled, but it was over 16). So the idea has come about to try and get the sword away from him, but I'm not to sure about what is the best way to do this. My character is a 9th level cleric, and we have a 9th level wizard in the party, and between us I'm sure there is something we could do to get rid of the sword (or help Crow get rid of the sword), but I can't seem to find anything. Anyone got any ideas on how we could do this? My last character idea was to wait until the Crow dropped and then swoop up the sword into the bag of holding and then get rid of it in an out of the way spot (like a volcano). But that character died a while back and the bag of holding has been lost.
Nagol 07-21-04, 03:00 PM	An intelligent item is a construct. As such, it is very difficult to 'turn off'. One of the simplest ways is to get a adamantine weapon and sunder the magic weapon. Note that this works only if the weapon's hardness is below 20 -- that is it won't work if the intelligent item is made of adamantine, mithral with a +3 bonus, or normal steel with a +5 bonus. If you can get your group to coordinate then cast targeted Dispel Magics on the sword until it loses its powers and then sunder it.
wdarkk 07-21-04, 03:27 PM	Whenever the character is in a "stressful situation" he can recontest the sword for control. I'd recommend Kobolds. They're not that dangerous, you can get 20 of them easy, and you can dominate person them into attacking the guy with the sword. After that, have him bury the thing.
Boothbey 07-21-04, 06:53 PM	Disarm the character. Use a stoneshape to encase the sword in rock. Summon an earth elemental to take it deep down into the ground. Dont give Crow access to shovels for a while.
Mitchell 07-22-04, 02:28 AM	He's got to sleep sometime. You may want to hire a thief to simply steal it. With your help, making sure the door is unlocked, buffing the thiefs dex, casting silence to ensure no noise, should be a snap. The best part is, the thief will probably work for the sword alone.
trapspringer 07-22-04, 01:49 PM	Yea, but I bet you could talk the DM into awarding exp if you get rid of it in some creative manner such as those listed above, particularly the stone shape dealie.
dwarfpaladinmorlock 07-22-04, 09:32 PM	Don't complicate the issue. Crow is your friend. He probably lets you cast spells on him all the time. 1. Buff up yourself for your contest against the sword. 2. Get Crow to accept a bull strength or other beneficial spell. 3. When he doesn't resist the spell, instead cast hold person. Since he is not resisting, he has by definition given up his save, and thus is Held. 4. Take the sword from it's scabbard, or better yet, take the entire scabbard, so you don't have to draw it. 5. Use one of the above mentioned actions to get rid of it (I like the earth elemental bit). Problem solved, although Crow might be ****** about it when he breaks free of the hold. Don't forget to work with they other party members that agree with out to do this. You will need to work fast, as he gets a new save every round to break free of the Hold Person spell. You want the sword gone before he gets free and attacks you.
Sildatorak 07-22-04, 11:35 PM	Is the weapon evil (or absolutely opposed to your party's goals in some other way)? If it isn't, you may wish to steal it so that you can give it to some less experienced adventurers so it can save their butts. As an add-on to the "trick him into getting held" plan, you might want the wizard to have a teleport memorized so he can grab the weapon and get the heck out.
Shadowdweller 07-23-04, 08:21 PM	Stick it into the earth on top of a remote hillside and leave it there. You might even end up starting a King Arthur-style legend: "The Talking Sword on the Hilltop".
Salla 07-24-04, 02:01 AM	Here's your recipe for getting rid of the sword: 1. Take one fighter. 2. Buff to taste. 3. Add one Sunder maneuver. Possibly more than one. Best done when a fight has already broken out, somewhere after the midpoint when you're sure you're winning.
Lael 07-26-04, 09:51 PM	Thanks guys. Crow is an permanet protection from evil spell item and that doesn't work, so the sword is obviously not evil. Our biggest concearns is that it will turn on the party when a bigger badder fighter type comes along and decides that Crow is good enough for it. The time really to gotten rid of it was long ago, and now the sword has gotten more control over Crow. If it was as simple as asking Crow to give it away, then we would have done that, put the sword likes the reputation Crow now has (he is the only original party member still alive, so he gets the blame/praise for the things we have done). Well some other thoughts have come about with my wizard friend. The biggest one is either break enchantment on Crow to try and get him rid of the sword himself, or polymorph into or summon a rust monster to take out the sword. Last game though the sword was rather sedate, so maybe the last game he did gain some control over the sword, but we need these things as a backup. One other thought we had was if we ever need to summon a planar ally, use the sword as its repayment :angel:
Lael 07-26-04, 10:05 PM	Originally posted by Boothbey Disarm the character. Use a stoneshape to encase the sword in rock. Summon an earth elemental to take it deep down into the ground. Dont give Crow access to shovels for a while. I quite like that idea, thanks. Be a good way to have it "disapear".
CaoSlayer 07-27-04, 10:07 AM	from the srd: (rod of) Cancellation: This dreaded rod is a bane to magic items, for its touch drains an item of all magical properties. The item touched must make a DC 23 Will save to prevent the rod from draining it. If a creature is holding it at the time, then the item can use the holder’s Will save bonus in place of its own if the holder’s is better. In such cases, contact is made by making a melee touch attack roll. Upon draining an item, the rod itself becomes brittle and cannot be used again. Drained items are only restorable by wish or miracle. (If a sphere of annihilation and a rod of cancellation negate each other, nothing can restore either of them.) Strong abjuration; CL 17th; Craft Rod, mage’s disjunction; Price 11,000 gp. Just buy one, show the rod to the sword and tell it "try to do any nasty trick and we will smash you with the rod"
Revelation 07-27-04, 11:36 AM	Originally posted by Lael Last game the Crow almost was able to make a will save vs the sword ego (I think) but missed by one point (I'm not sure what he rolled, but it was over 16). So the idea has come about to try and get the sword away from him. Most things I'd have said have been said, except one... OOC you know the player has failed a saving throw. How do you know IC that this rules mechanic line has been crossed? As a DM I would seriously dislike players using such OOC knowledge gratuitously, this sounds a bit like "OK, the sword was useful, but now we've failed a roll we'd best get rid of it as soon as we can" I hope that your decision is the result of a clear and marked change in the character which you can discretely pin down to the sword and not any other stressful or threatening events that have occurred in that PC's life. If not you're just playing a computer game.
ShadowRanger 07-27-04, 12:13 PM	you have yet to say what the problem with the sword is, tell us that and we can help out more
Lael 07-28-04, 09:02 PM	What do you want to know? The sword for it most part is very helpful item (espically being +3), but it does tend to make Crow go over the top all the time in his attacks, or egg him on to take on the big bad by himself, even though Crow prolly couldn't. Two games ago, a situation occured that Crow was confused (as he has the bad fortune to not be able to save his will saves) while fighting an iron golem and some other undead nasties, and thus was taken out of the action. Because the the iron golumns magic immunity, my cleric and the wizard were useless against it and the rest of the party did not have anything to hurt the IG besides ghosttouch. Now Crow has a real bad habbit of attacking us when he is confused, so one of the other party member (Soumon - a Lizard man Cleric / ranger) cast hold person on him after he attacked my character, and was taken out of the room. But in our withdrawl, one other party member got confused and was left remaining with the IG. Souman took up ghosttouch and went in to get the remaining character, but on the way in, had a "conversation" with ghosttouch about why he had taken him away from Crow, and I beleive the word "rust monster" popped up (you get that from a Lizardman). Soumon then stopped his charge and returned back out of the room to us in a rather non-lizardman fashion, and placed ghosttouch on the floor infront of crow. Fortinually the remaining character was able to survive (somehow) the IG and snapped out of his confused state and quickly exited the room. The IG never followed. Seeing this change in Souman, the wizard use mage hand to take ghosttouch away from both of them, but ghosttouch compelled Souman to be brough back to Crow, so Souman simply went over and grabbed the sword (exerting the requred force) and returned the sword. This is when Crow had his long aurgment with Ghosttouch about control other members of the party, and why it didn't step in when Crow was confused, and OOC failed the save by one. However ghosttouch did make allowance to try and act more for the party Crow reported later. So the wizard and myself got to thinking that Ghosttouch is too much of a liability for Crow and the party, thats why we are thinking of ways to remove ghosttouch. The biggest liability is that if we ever come across someone that is bigger and badder and better then Crow, Ghosttouch may want to leave Crow for this person. But other main factor is that its control Crow too much and not allowing him to develop his character. But as I said, last game ghosttouch was more tame, so we just want to keep some "options" available.
Kaminton 07-28-04, 09:59 PM	Trade it in. Seriously. Ask it if it has a purpose for existence. Then go to the appropriate more powerful person whose goals match the weapon's, describe it, and arrange a sale or trade. If the weapon doesn't have a special purpose, then pretty much anyone more powerful will do. Just be careful if the thing's goal is to further evil, or the destruction of some race, or to rule the world... but if that's what it wants, you're screwed anyway.
CaoSlayer 07-29-04, 06:51 AM	by the way, a feeblemind spell would affect an inteligent item?