Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sybill 01-02-07, 01:28 PM	So, there have been threads individually on many of these topics, but I haven't been able to find one that can explain how to combine them all into a single character concept. First off, I am playing a half-orc druid/sorcerer going into Arcane Hierophant. In a city campaign. Now, my DM was ok with this as I said I'd stick with city-friendly wildshapes and such when I get there, and my animal companion is a dog (also city-friendly). Now, playing a druid in a city would be one challenge, but take a look at my stats. Str 8, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 6, Wis 18, Cha 14. A half-orc with a penalty to strength? A 6 intelligence and an 18 in wisdom? A good charisma score? Now add on to my predicament that in just 3 levels, at level 8 when my animal companion will gain the benefits of a familiar (due to AH levels) and become smarter than my character. Did I mention I'm the party's only caster, focusing on support/healing? So basically, I'm wondering how all of these fit together. Individually, I can see how to play a high INT, low WIS character, but not with a high charisma and a much smarter dog too. Help? :raincloud And no, I'm not kidding.
EvilSqueegee 01-02-07, 01:44 PM	High INT, low WIS: There was once a man who spent 12 years overseas going to college to study theoretical physics and it's potential applications for biological inventions. He finished his studies with a consistant 4.0 average, so to speak. He then decided to take a cruise home, to relax and enjoy himself. While he was on the cruise home, however... he left all his notes on a table on the front deck and the wind picked up, blowing them all over the deck and into the sea. He had a high INT - he knew a lot of things. But he had a low WIS - not perceptive, not too streetsmart or keen. Scatterbrained. Picture this in the inverse. High WIS, low INT. Your character completely botched his "Be born into the educated life" roll. Given very little opportunity to grow into an "Acceptable" social-class, he lived life on the streets. He can't spell, barely can speak common (Seems how nobody's taken the time to educate him in it) but he knows the streets inside and out. He knows when he's about to be mugged, and he never misses anything. Highly perceptive and difficult to out-wit, but lacking any kind of 'respectible' education. And it's completely possible that he can be good with people while being nigh impossible to get the drop on, and not having any kind of "Book learnins'." A man of few words, what words he does speak usually have heavy weight to them. Keep in mind that the dog might know more about civilised society, but it still can't speak. Perhaps it solves a lot of puzzles that otherwise would stump your character, and as such the quiet, perceptive yet uneducated halforc secretly looks up to his faithful companion with a respect that most people don't realise they're describing when they use the phrase, "Man's best friend." The dog IS is best friend - it's a companion, someone your character relies on, perhaps even going so far as to say the dog could possibly be a security blanket of sorts. IT would definitely explain why the dog is both his animal companion, AND his familiar.
Paneki 01-02-07, 01:54 PM	Lets see.... First, I asume you did apply your bonus to Strength... so if you still have a penalty that is very tough. The 14 CHA can be explained this way: Since you have a wider concept of the world, your character has in fact become more social. He understands the minds of others and has been able to see himself as the others see him, thus knows how to behave and interacts in society. (or at least with others than himself) He considers himself blessed by mother earth and knows that to preserve the natural order, its imperative to interacts with others outside the druidic group. You said you know how to play a low INT high WIS character, it would be like Sancho from El Quijote. He also had about 14 CHA. You could take that as a reference, since his social status made him look almost like a half-orc. That can help. About the dog, thats rather simply. He just has more INT than you. He can remmember things better than you do and keep track of many things as well as think faster. Use your animal companion to tell your character important things he might be missing. Its like the Wizard Vs. Cleric Roleplay. One has a marvelous INT and the other the WIS. One is capable of thinking really fast and memorize enormous amounts of info. While the other has a valuable insight of his sorroundings and is not in need of thinking fast. His Deity guides him. Mother nature is all you need. A Smarter dog than yourself can give you a break from the "I don't remmember what that guy's name is" To a "I think my animal companion is trying to tell me something. What is it boy?" In a little side note, the 14 CHA gives him extra confidence. and combined to his WIS, he knows better than anyone to care little for his animal companion being smarter. Actually he can be gratefull to mother earth for allowing such companion. Other thing is that he may picture himself somewhat Exotic. Since is a half-orc Druid with a sorcerer touch. He may found himself with arcane abilities coming from deep inside him rather than the earth but still think of them as a blessing from motherearth. Hope this helps.
M.E. Charm 01-02-07, 01:55 PM	Is it just me who thinks that having a smarter animal companion is awfully cute and amusing? It seriously doesn't have to be something bad, and makes for great roleplay oppertunities. I agree with everything stated in the previous posts. Just on the charisma, it might be BECAUSE he's not very intelligent. Finally someone who doesn't deal in politics and diplomacy, doesn't rant about new development in his wizards guild, but someone who's honest to the bone and you can just have a laugh with. ;)
Oblix 01-02-07, 01:57 PM	Hm, first off, I'm not quite understanding your home brew attribute rolling. Now, I know everyone plays differently, and that's part of what makes D&D great. But I have no idea how you ended up with 8 for a str score with a +2 to str. In general accepted rolling rules, anything under a three is automatically considered a three. As well, with an allowance of four rolls dropping the lowest. Meaning you had to roll three twos, and a one, or four twos; then the +2. Given that you're a half orc, I'd certainly hope your character background has an explanation of why, for such a larger breed of medium sized subhuman, you are so pathetically weak. With your given rolls, I would have looked my DM in the eye and said, "reroll." Unless you're just looking for a tough time. Low Int, High Wis is rather straight forward. You're quick witted with stupid insults. You don't understand much of what people are saying, but you are quick to pick up on things. You're extremely perceptive and charismatic due to the fact that you lack the aptitude for more intellectual pursuits. You're the slack jawed obedient party member who always seems to be day dreaming, but in reality you're watching every movement of everyone around you watching for opportunity or a chance to play you're fake role of the imbecile to further pull people into lull of comfort. Without great book learning and strength you're learned how to get by on guile and perception. A druid living in a city, where he's already weak without the same aid of nature as other druids would surely become a quick witted and sly individual. eh?
Sybill 01-02-07, 02:15 PM	First, thanks for the quick responses already. To clear up: I love how the character turned out and look forward to roleplaying her, I'm just confused about how to do so, thus this post. I am using a half-orc variant from UA that changes the stats to -2 int, +2 con. The stats I rolled were: 18, 14, 12, 12, 8, 8. I chose to put an 8 in str which didn't get any modifier. This was due to the need for both high cha (sorc) and wis (druid), as well as helped out in terms of hp and suchnot from the con bonus. I just didn't feel the strength was necessary for the character. Roleplaying wise, the character is bigger and naturally tougher than those around her, but didn't really get into lifting weights much. Hardier instead of stronger.
Oblix 01-02-07, 02:23 PM	Ah, see, the rolling rules helps explain a lot, along with the variant explanation. I'm used to rolling a single stat at a time, not choosing what goes where. That aside, the above character trait I think would still be rather applicable. Depending on your alignment, you can use the high wis and cha to your advantage to manipulate people for your own carnal desires. A chaotic or evil half orc could really have some fun with low int but high cha/wis. You get to twist the situation to your favor unsuspectingly. Now, we're not talking world domination or anything. But simple tasks or choices. You are, after all, part orc with a 8 int stat. :D
Whisper_Swiftblade 01-02-07, 08:52 PM	a high char, and wis/ low int conversation. con artist: hey you , over there, come here orc: what you want (knows somethings up) con artist: how would you like to invest in some new swampland just out of town, only 10,000 gold orc: hmmm, me no know how much is 10,000. con artist: not much for what this land is worth. orc: Is land good? con artist: the best, it's realy a very good deal orc: hmmmm, ok, you show me land and me might buy con artist: show you... I mean well I would not want to get followed and let anyone but us know about the great land. orc: ohhh we not tell people, but me wanted to tell me big family to buy good land from you.... con artist: big family you say? orc: yep kogg family wander long time and need land, to keep good stuff we gots, me family real rich, we win lotsa fights wen we wondered and keep stuff after fights. con artist: realy, and where are your family? orc: dem in dat place over there. con artist: that house? are you sure? orc: yep we be dare 3 days con artist: but that house belongs to... orc: nuhu, it ours now, dare was sneeky guys dare but day gones now con artist: realy? orc: yep, you go in and look me be in dar soon two, but first me go pee con artist: i don't kno... orc: you just say you mofgs buddy and they be nice, or you could stay with me when I pee *smiles big* con artist: no i think I will just go in the house orc: ok, you do dat. at this moment the con artist walks into the headquorters of the local rogues guild and is verry quickly killed orc: hehehe an day say me dummy. see the orc might not have known if swamp land is good land or exactly how much 10,000 was , but he did know the con artist was trying to scam him, then he used his char to trick the con artist into an early grave.
smoker 01-02-07, 09:48 PM	So, there have been threads individually on many of these topics, but I haven't been able to find one that can explain how to combine them all into a single character concept. First off, I am playing a half-orc druid/sorcerer going into Arcane Hierophant. In a city campaign. Now, my DM was ok with this as I said I'd stick with city-friendly wildshapes and such when I get there, and my animal companion is a dog (also city-friendly). Now, playing a druid in a city would be one challenge, but take a look at my stats. Str 8, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 6, Wis 18, Cha 14. A half-orc with a penalty to strength? A 6 intelligence and an 18 in wisdom? A good charisma score? Now add on to my predicament that in just 3 levels, at level 8 when my animal companion will gain the benefits of a familiar (due to AH levels) and become smarter than my character. Did I mention I'm the party's only caster, focusing on support/healing? So basically, I'm wondering how all of these fit together. Individually, I can see how to play a high INT, low WIS character, but not with a high charisma and a much smarter dog too. Help? :raincloud And no, I'm not kidding. I am thinking Pinky and the Brain, where dog has the brains.
kelvinaw273 01-03-07, 04:27 AM	Now, playing a druid in a city would be one challenge, but take a look at my stats. Str 8, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 6, Wis 18, Cha 14. A half-orc with a penalty to strength? A 6 intelligence and an 18 in wisdom? A good charisma score? Now add on to my predicament that in just 3 levels, at level 8 when my animal companion will gain the benefits of a familiar (due to AH levels) and become smarter than my character. Did I mention I'm the party's only caster, focusing on support/healing? So basically, I'm wondering how all of these fit together. Individually, I can see how to play a high INT, low WIS character, but not with a high charisma and a much smarter dog too. Help? :raincloud And no, I'm not kidding. Well I have heard of Hearing-Ear and Seeing-Eye dogs ... congratulations! Your half-orc will be the world's first owner of a Thinking-Brain dog! Seriously, your character should be slow-witted but have an immense store of common sense. Not much thought, but very canny perceptions. When they hit level 8, the dog will actually do a lot of the thinking for them, presenting answers to questions and solving problems while relying on your characters wisdom to spot issues and see the situation as it really is.
green_yawgmoth 01-03-07, 09:55 AM	I am thinking Pinky and the Brain, where dog has the brains."Are you pondering what I'm pondering?" "I think so, Brain, but how are we gonna get the camel into a tutu?" http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v91/yawgmoth/kittyjig.gif
Sybill 01-06-07, 11:48 AM	I definitely like a lot of the ideas here, but I'm still looking for more... How does being a druid in a city interact with this? Background-wise, I decided that she grew up in the city on the streets, thus allowing her to see the "natural" world there more clearly than others. But what besides dogs/cats/pigeons would actually be natural in the city? I mean, could a druid thrive in this type of place?
High Octane 01-06-07, 12:40 PM	Why would you make a half orc sorcerer? Anyway, high wis low int would possibly be someone with a very high amount of almost feral sense, but low problem solving or deductive thinking. Think about Tarzan. He would be low int, high wis. He would be able to sense things, but not necessarily know how to fix them. *Lady looks a little sad* Thogg the half-orc Druid: Hey lady, why you sad? Lady: Huh? Thogg: Thogg know you sad. See it in eyes. Lady: Oh well...a little...I guess... my boyfriend just left me... Thogg: Where he go? Lady: He.. broke up with me... Thogg: You sad cause you alone? Lady: Yeah.... I guess... Thogg: Well Thogg get you bunny! Lady: What? Thogg: When Thogg lonely, bunny make him less lonely! Lady: Thats... not the kind of companion I need. Thogg: Squirrel then? See how Thogg could tell a lot about the lady and could sense feelings, but could not solve the issue through any sort of knowledgable ability or understanding?
Whisper_Swiftblade 01-06-07, 06:39 PM	But what besides dogs/cats/pigeons would actually be natural in the city? I mean, could a druid thrive in this type of place? well for one RATS, do you know how many there are in a city, it is crazy. but other then that there is plenty of stone to work with. That has got some nice rp flavor to it; while the contry druid defends and is defended by the trees, you are defended by the streets themselves.
EscherEnigma 01-06-07, 07:00 PM	I think other people have already helped reconcile the stats (thinking-brain dog! is there another Pratchett fan here?) so about the 'druid in a city' bit... Having been raised and grown up there and what not, your druid doesnt' think of the city as a sterile lifeless thing that most people do. You see the city as an almost alive entity itself, how the different inhabitants of the city together create a living city, just as the inhabitants of the forests or swamp creating a living environment. It's all in perspective. Your wisdom and charisma tie into this, as you recognize that theres more to a city then mortar and stone, theres people, animals, flows of traffic and strangers. Your druid probably knows the backalleys better then anyone and is a real social person, being a busy body, always checking in with the old grandmother of poor thomson who died in the war last spring, making sure her neighbors are taking care of her and that the butcher brings her what he can spare. Things like that. The druid makes sure that the city stays 'healthy' my taking care of the people and making sure they take care of each other, helping build strong community bonds. things like that. Your druid probably wouldn't have this perspective towards other cities, at least not initially. But after a while immersing herself she could probably pinpoint just who's in charge, who has influence over who, and where to get the best darn chicken in town. She may not be able to describe very well just how she learns these things, or WHY the abbey on the corner of 4th and Copper isn't to be trusted or why the begger lady who lives under the bridge CAN be trusted, but she knows they're so. See if you can get your DM to let you take Knowledge(local). It sounds rather approprite for a city druid. Anyway, just my two cents.
red_scare87 01-06-07, 07:07 PM	Okay, so I had a revelation while watching the new Rocky Balboa movie. I had never understood how to play a low INT, high WIS character before, and then I realized halfway through the movie that Rocky Balboa himself was the perfect example of this. It's still kinda hard to explain so I'm not sure what else to tell you. Seriously, check out Rocky and he too may open your eyes.
Davith Bothain 01-06-07, 07:24 PM	...and then I realized halfway through the movie that Rocky Balboa himself was the perfect example of this. I'm honestly viewing this fellow as a Forrest Gump of sorts: a bit on the slow side (okay, maybe a lot on the slow side), endlessly insightful, and oddly likeable and charismatic. Make him grey-green, add tusks, and remove the whole "strong like an ox" thing and you've got this character.
TheAngryFish 01-06-07, 07:36 PM	A high wis low int druid is not "street smart", that is a decent analogy, but it is over used, and is the answer given for every situation of low int high wis. A druid with high wisdom and low intellegence could track down any defilers of the wild, no matter how well they cover their tracks, but his chase is eventually stopped, by the deviously ingenious conundrum created by the mechanical marvel known as a "dead-bolt lock" He can find the problem, but he can't fix it.
Undrhil 01-07-07, 03:49 AM	If you have the Hero Builder's Guidebook put out in 2000, you can look up this odd variant to the Gnome Druid: Urban Druid: Unbelievably (at least to other druids), there are occasionally other gnomes who adopt bustling cities as their protected ground. Perhaps it was your natural bent towards complex machinery or some great jest you are playing on the rest of the world, but you're one of these druids tending to the urban environment. You care for flower boxes on many sills, the city's parks and gardens, and an infinite number of mice, rats, pigeons, dogs and cats. -- (Hero Builder's Guidebook, Pg. 24) Granted, this is a half-orc, so the "natural bent towards machinery" angle would be out, but that gives some idea for what other things you would be using. Undrhil
Dareon 01-07-07, 11:10 AM	Well, half-orcs DO have a natural bent towards machinery... They're very good at bending it.
Firestar27 01-09-07, 12:15 PM	:bump:
obrysii 01-09-07, 12:25 PM	A random comment: A very good example of High Wis and Cha and very low Int would be Forest Gump. He looked at the world with a simplistic view, but he had a lot of wisdom and was very charismatic.
IceFractal 01-09-07, 01:48 PM	As for what animals would be native to a city: In addition to dogs, birds, and rats, there could be alligators in the sewers. Also, in the ECS there's a feat that lets you summon/wildshape into vermin - a giant cockroach would make sense for the city. If you run out of fitting animals, you could change the flavor on some existing choices. That's not a bear, it's a massive guard dog, and that wolverine is just a huge rat.