HELP!! My Cleric sucks when grappled. [Archive] - Wizards Community

HELP!! My Cleric sucks when grappled. [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
curan69
05-09-06, 09:26 PM OK. here is the scoop

We are playing 13th level characters, my Cleric has no ranks in concentration. (ok this may be poor skill choice on my part but i have my reasons) So What tricks can I use to help me get out of being grappled?
Gargs454
05-09-06, 09:32 PM The easiest solution would be Bull's Strength and other Strength enhancing items/effects. The increase in Strength will give you a boost to your Grapple Check.

Additionally, Escape Artist (though a cross class skill) will enable you to try to get out of a grapple, though you are still likely to be better off with a standard Grapple Check.

Finally there's the standard of stay back and avoid any on rushers at all costs. If you don't charge to the front of the fight you can help avoid getting grappled that way.
Jagd44
05-09-06, 09:47 PM In my opinion, the freedom of movement spell is the best way to avoid grapples. It is a fourth level cleric spell that takes a standard action to cast, lasts 10 min/lvl and allows you to automatically succeed on any grapple check.

There is also the 40,000 gp alternative in the form of a Freedom of Movement ring. This gold ring allows the wearer to act as if continually under the effect of a Freedom of Movement spell.

Good Luck and Good Hunting.

_____________________
If you are not taking any flak, then you are not over the target.
RadicalTaoist
05-09-06, 10:26 PM In my opinion, the freedom of movement spell is the best way to avoid grapples. It is a fourth level cleric spell that takes a standard action to cast, lasts 10 min/lvl and allows you to automatically succeed on any grapple check.

There is also the 40,000 gp alternative in the form of a Freedom of Movement ring. This gold ring allows the wearer to act as if continually under the effect of a Freedom of Movement spell.

Good Luck and Good Hunting.
Exactly.

Once he can afford to get FoM going on a regular basis, no cleric worries about grappling. Ever.
Mock26
05-10-06, 05:31 AM Win initiative and kill "them" before they can grapple you.
Priest_of_Shaundakul
05-10-06, 05:55 AM It's too late for you, but a Cleric with the Travel domain gets Freedom of Movement as a special ability x/rounds per day, which is handy in a pinch.
Count Nerindil Van Seraph
05-10-06, 07:58 AM There is always armor spikes. Cheap, easy, no one will want to grapple you and you look like a badass.

Just my 2cp,

The Count :dragon:
kelvinaw273
05-10-06, 02:50 PM Grappling is a clerical weak-point, and let's be honest they don't have many. And yes, taking no levels in concentration was not clever. I suggest you remedy this on your next level-up, and take Combat Casting as well if you have not got it.

Otherwise, immediately you can increase your chances by upping your touch AC. Kick the heavy armour, boost your dex and use rings of protection. A level in Monk will not hurt you (USE that Wisdom bonus), and you could always spin off as a Sacred Fist after a few levels Monking it (get Improved Grapple instead of Deflect Arrows).
Lincoln Hills
05-10-06, 03:01 PM Freedom of movement is a get-out-of-grapple-free card - but there are some other options. Grease (including magical armor with the slick property and oil of slipperiness) boosts your Escape Artist abilities tremendously. Fire shield (or body of the sun, or any spell that creates a "you touch me you go ouch" aura will discourage people from starting grapples even though it doesn't help you escape 'em. The rarely-employed metamagic Still Spell can be applied to any of these spells (as well as spells like blink or gaseous form) so that the spell can be used even when it's "too late" (after the grapple begins). A still polymorph self into any form with the Constrict special attack can be hilariously lethal to grapple-happy foes. A still holy smite (or chaos hammer or what-have-you) is another option - you'll take no damage from such a spell, and it can blast foes of the opposing alignment right off you.

(Most of these spells are druidic or arcane, unfortunately - but what with domains and multi-classing, you never know anymore what a cleric might have on his spell list.)
Crunchy Frog
05-10-06, 03:23 PM Primary spellcasters buy lots of Concentration always always always! Until you can cast your highest level spell on the defensive and succeed even if you roll a 1, keep putting points into Concentration.

OK, enough of that rant. Now until you can gain a level or two and dump all of your newly gained skill points into Concentration, cast Freedom of Movement before any battle where you might be grappled. The Ring of FoM is good, too. The increase in size and strength from Righteous Might might deter enemies from grappling you.

A Cloak of Etherealness will get you out of a grapple whenever you want. A Cape of the Mountebank or a Helm/Boots of Teleportation will get you out of a grapple a number of times per day. You can put your favorite "anti-grappling spell" into a Ring of Spell Storing and use it while grappled. (Suggestions: Hold Person, Bestow Curse, Freedom of Movement, or get an arcane caster to put Dimension Door, Gaseous Form, or a disabling spell in it)
Koretsu
05-10-06, 04:00 PM A Cloak of Etherealness will get you out of a grapple whenever you want. A Cape of the Mountebank or a Helm/Boots of Teleportation will get you out of a grapple a number of times per day. You can put your favorite "anti-grappling spell" into a Ring of Spell Storing and use it while grappled. (Suggestions: Hold Person, Bestow Curse, Freedom of Movement, or get an arcane caster to put Dimension Door, Gaseous Form, or a disabling spell in it)

Maybe it's just me, but I think that casting Hold Person on the guy grappling you would be a bad idea.
curan69
05-10-06, 05:45 PM Well thank you all, definetely some good ideas. I think it' s little late for me to do anything about the concentration. So far the cape of the mounteback sounds like the best solution. ( I need a solution for when I'm already grappled) Of course I already have a cloak, but a vest of dimension door should cost around the same.
00_Whupass
05-10-06, 06:14 PM Yes, taking no ranks in concentration was not clever. I suggest you remedy this on your next level-up, and take Combat Casting as well if you have not got it. Quick point on this I find that Skill Focus (Concentration) is very much superior to Combat Casting. Sure, Combat Casting is a +4 to cast defensively, but Skill Focus is a +3 to all uses of the skill, including not only casting defensively, but casting during vigorous motion, or while distracted, etc. I find this versitility well worth the +1 bonus I've forgone. Therefore it is my position that Skill Focus is generally superior.
Derrhyn
05-10-06, 06:54 PM Why is it too late for you to boost your concentration skill? Next two times you level up, just spend all your skill points on concentration. That is 4 from cleric and by level 13 you probably have a positive int score as well so that's at least a couple more. that would give you at least a decent bonus to concentration.

Derrhyn

PS: When I saw the title of your post, i though it would end up in the Mature forums pretty fast.

PPS: I can't believe that it took 14 posts for somone to point that out. What's wrong with you people? :confused:
curan69
05-10-06, 09:10 PM My Cleric is Elven and only gets two ranks per level. Since we are at level thirteen I dont get another feat till level fifteen. To cast a spell while grappled would take a concentration check of twenty plus the spell level. So I would say that its a little late for me to try and catch up with ranks in concentration now.
Darth K'Trava
05-10-06, 10:01 PM Why is it too late for you to boost your concentration skill? Next two times you level up, just spend all your skill points on concentration. That is 4 from cleric and by level 13 you probably have a positive int score as well so that's at least a couple more. that would give you at least a decent bonus to concentration.

Derrhyn

PS: When I saw the title of your post, i though it would end up in the Mature forums pretty fast.

PPS: I can't believe that it took 14 posts for somone to point that out. What's wrong with you people? :confused:

We didn't want to be the first one to go there? :rofl:

One of my DMs had a cleric not have ranks in concentration. He was having to cast a spell that took rounds to fully cast. We got past his zombie guardians and summarily tore him to ribbons after one PC yanked away his spell focus and tossed it away. DM learned after that.

All mine have ranks in concentration. At least enough to succeed without having to roll. And also Combat Casting too.
Dragonsblood
05-11-06, 12:54 AM My Cleric is Elven and only gets two ranks per level. Since we are at level thirteen I dont get another feat till level fifteen. To cast a spell while grappled would take a concentration check of twenty plus the spell level. So I would say that its a little late for me to try and catch up with ranks in concentration now.

It's not too late! Even 2, 4, or 6 ranks is better than 0. You won't get it maxed, but every point is still valuable. Next time keep it maxed from the get go.
MSW
05-17-06, 06:59 PM Look at Boots of Elvinkind and Cloak of Elvinkind. Theses are 2500gp items that add +5 to one of your skill checks. Following those guidelines, you should be able to have some item fashioned that boosts your Concentration skill by +5 for 2500gp...

Also look at the various Amulets of Health. Any of these boosts your CON ability, and results in both more hit points and pluses to your Concentration skill checks.

So for 6500gp you can boost your Concentration check by +6 and get +15 HP also. ( +5 Concentration skill boost item(2500gp), and Amulet of Health +2 (4000gp) )
hmmmm
05-18-06, 11:30 AM Or you can try not to get grappled? My cleric avoids combat entirly as he has taken a vow not to fight so getting grappled is always on the top of my list to avoid.
Dreamfeed
05-18-06, 03:40 PM I wouldn't try to boost your skill now. Level thirteen is far too late to try and max a skill. Just memorize freedom of movement, or, better yet, get something expandable to get you out of grapples. Resorting to radical measures (boosting concentration in favor for all else, getting expensive items, or multiclassing into monk-losing caster levels! what are you thinking!) cost far more then they're worth.
And remember, people not in the grapple can attack the grappling character with quite a bonus, so as long as the grappler won't pull you apart in a round, it might not even be that bad. Or last long.
solbergb
05-18-06, 09:29 PM If you had concentration, command, greater command and word of recall are all verbal only, and helpful.

The main defense, as others have said, is freedom of movement. Not a perfect defense, as sometimes it won't be cast, sometimes it will have been dispelled or expired, but it is a spell a L13 cleric should prepare each and every day.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
curan69 05-09-06, 09:26 PM	OK. here is the scoop We are playing 13th level characters, my Cleric has no ranks in concentration. (ok this may be poor skill choice on my part but i have my reasons) So What tricks can I use to help me get out of being grappled?
Gargs454 05-09-06, 09:32 PM	The easiest solution would be Bull's Strength and other Strength enhancing items/effects. The increase in Strength will give you a boost to your Grapple Check. Additionally, Escape Artist (though a cross class skill) will enable you to try to get out of a grapple, though you are still likely to be better off with a standard Grapple Check. Finally there's the standard of stay back and avoid any on rushers at all costs. If you don't charge to the front of the fight you can help avoid getting grappled that way.
Jagd44 05-09-06, 09:47 PM	In my opinion, the freedom of movement spell is the best way to avoid grapples. It is a fourth level cleric spell that takes a standard action to cast, lasts 10 min/lvl and allows you to automatically succeed on any grapple check. There is also the 40,000 gp alternative in the form of a Freedom of Movement ring. This gold ring allows the wearer to act as if continually under the effect of a Freedom of Movement spell. Good Luck and Good Hunting. _____________________ If you are not taking any flak, then you are not over the target.
RadicalTaoist 05-09-06, 10:26 PM	In my opinion, the freedom of movement spell is the best way to avoid grapples. It is a fourth level cleric spell that takes a standard action to cast, lasts 10 min/lvl and allows you to automatically succeed on any grapple check. There is also the 40,000 gp alternative in the form of a Freedom of Movement ring. This gold ring allows the wearer to act as if continually under the effect of a Freedom of Movement spell. Good Luck and Good Hunting. Exactly. Once he can afford to get FoM going on a regular basis, no cleric worries about grappling. Ever.
Mock26 05-10-06, 05:31 AM	Win initiative and kill "them" before they can grapple you.
Priest_of_Shaundakul 05-10-06, 05:55 AM	It's too late for you, but a Cleric with the Travel domain gets Freedom of Movement as a special ability x/rounds per day, which is handy in a pinch.
Count Nerindil Van Seraph 05-10-06, 07:58 AM	There is always armor spikes. Cheap, easy, no one will want to grapple you and you look like a badass. Just my 2cp, The Count :dragon:
kelvinaw273 05-10-06, 02:50 PM	Grappling is a clerical weak-point, and let's be honest they don't have many. And yes, taking no levels in concentration was not clever. I suggest you remedy this on your next level-up, and take Combat Casting as well if you have not got it. Otherwise, immediately you can increase your chances by upping your touch AC. Kick the heavy armour, boost your dex and use rings of protection. A level in Monk will not hurt you (USE that Wisdom bonus), and you could always spin off as a Sacred Fist after a few levels Monking it (get Improved Grapple instead of Deflect Arrows).
Lincoln Hills 05-10-06, 03:01 PM	Freedom of movement is a get-out-of-grapple-free card - but there are some other options. Grease (including magical armor with the slick property and oil of slipperiness) boosts your Escape Artist abilities tremendously. Fire shield (or body of the sun, or any spell that creates a "you touch me you go ouch" aura will discourage people from starting grapples even though it doesn't help you escape 'em. The rarely-employed metamagic Still Spell can be applied to any of these spells (as well as spells like blink or gaseous form) so that the spell can be used even when it's "too late" (after the grapple begins). A still polymorph self into any form with the Constrict special attack can be hilariously lethal to grapple-happy foes. A still holy smite (or chaos hammer or what-have-you) is another option - you'll take no damage from such a spell, and it can blast foes of the opposing alignment right off you. (Most of these spells are druidic or arcane, unfortunately - but what with domains and multi-classing, you never know anymore what a cleric might have on his spell list.)
Crunchy Frog 05-10-06, 03:23 PM	Primary spellcasters buy lots of Concentration always always always! Until you can cast your highest level spell on the defensive and succeed even if you roll a 1, keep putting points into Concentration. OK, enough of that rant. Now until you can gain a level or two and dump all of your newly gained skill points into Concentration, cast Freedom of Movement before any battle where you might be grappled. The Ring of FoM is good, too. The increase in size and strength from Righteous Might might deter enemies from grappling you. A Cloak of Etherealness will get you out of a grapple whenever you want. A Cape of the Mountebank or a Helm/Boots of Teleportation will get you out of a grapple a number of times per day. You can put your favorite "anti-grappling spell" into a Ring of Spell Storing and use it while grappled. (Suggestions: Hold Person, Bestow Curse, Freedom of Movement, or get an arcane caster to put Dimension Door, Gaseous Form, or a disabling spell in it)
Koretsu 05-10-06, 04:00 PM	A Cloak of Etherealness will get you out of a grapple whenever you want. A Cape of the Mountebank or a Helm/Boots of Teleportation will get you out of a grapple a number of times per day. You can put your favorite "anti-grappling spell" into a Ring of Spell Storing and use it while grappled. (Suggestions: Hold Person, Bestow Curse, Freedom of Movement, or get an arcane caster to put Dimension Door, Gaseous Form, or a disabling spell in it) Maybe it's just me, but I think that casting Hold Person on the guy grappling you would be a bad idea.
curan69 05-10-06, 05:45 PM	Well thank you all, definetely some good ideas. I think it' s little late for me to do anything about the concentration. So far the cape of the mounteback sounds like the best solution. ( I need a solution for when I'm already grappled) Of course I already have a cloak, but a vest of dimension door should cost around the same.
00_Whupass 05-10-06, 06:14 PM	Yes, taking no ranks in concentration was not clever. I suggest you remedy this on your next level-up, and take Combat Casting as well if you have not got it. Quick point on this I find that Skill Focus (Concentration) is very much superior to Combat Casting. Sure, Combat Casting is a +4 to cast defensively, but Skill Focus is a +3 to all uses of the skill, including not only casting defensively, but casting during vigorous motion, or while distracted, etc. I find this versitility well worth the +1 bonus I've forgone. Therefore it is my position that Skill Focus is generally superior.
Derrhyn 05-10-06, 06:54 PM	Why is it too late for you to boost your concentration skill? Next two times you level up, just spend all your skill points on concentration. That is 4 from cleric and by level 13 you probably have a positive int score as well so that's at least a couple more. that would give you at least a decent bonus to concentration. Derrhyn PS: When I saw the title of your post, i though it would end up in the Mature forums pretty fast. PPS: I can't believe that it took 14 posts for somone to point that out. What's wrong with you people? :confused:
curan69 05-10-06, 09:10 PM	My Cleric is Elven and only gets two ranks per level. Since we are at level thirteen I dont get another feat till level fifteen. To cast a spell while grappled would take a concentration check of twenty plus the spell level. So I would say that its a little late for me to try and catch up with ranks in concentration now.
Darth K'Trava 05-10-06, 10:01 PM	Why is it too late for you to boost your concentration skill? Next two times you level up, just spend all your skill points on concentration. That is 4 from cleric and by level 13 you probably have a positive int score as well so that's at least a couple more. that would give you at least a decent bonus to concentration. Derrhyn PS: When I saw the title of your post, i though it would end up in the Mature forums pretty fast. PPS: I can't believe that it took 14 posts for somone to point that out. What's wrong with you people? :confused: We didn't want to be the first one to go there? :rofl: One of my DMs had a cleric not have ranks in concentration. He was having to cast a spell that took rounds to fully cast. We got past his zombie guardians and summarily tore him to ribbons after one PC yanked away his spell focus and tossed it away. DM learned after that. All mine have ranks in concentration. At least enough to succeed without having to roll. And also Combat Casting too.
Dragonsblood 05-11-06, 12:54 AM	My Cleric is Elven and only gets two ranks per level. Since we are at level thirteen I dont get another feat till level fifteen. To cast a spell while grappled would take a concentration check of twenty plus the spell level. So I would say that its a little late for me to try and catch up with ranks in concentration now. It's not too late! Even 2, 4, or 6 ranks is better than 0. You won't get it maxed, but every point is still valuable. Next time keep it maxed from the get go.
MSW 05-17-06, 06:59 PM	Look at Boots of Elvinkind and Cloak of Elvinkind. Theses are 2500gp items that add +5 to one of your skill checks. Following those guidelines, you should be able to have some item fashioned that boosts your Concentration skill by +5 for 2500gp... Also look at the various Amulets of Health. Any of these boosts your CON ability, and results in both more hit points and pluses to your Concentration skill checks. So for 6500gp you can boost your Concentration check by +6 and get +15 HP also. ( +5 Concentration skill boost item(2500gp), and Amulet of Health +2 (4000gp) )
hmmmm 05-18-06, 11:30 AM	Or you can try not to get grappled? My cleric avoids combat entirly as he has taken a vow not to fight so getting grappled is always on the top of my list to avoid.
Dreamfeed 05-18-06, 03:40 PM	I wouldn't try to boost your skill now. Level thirteen is far too late to try and max a skill. Just memorize freedom of movement, or, better yet, get something expandable to get you out of grapples. Resorting to radical measures (boosting concentration in favor for all else, getting expensive items, or multiclassing into monk-losing caster levels! what are you thinking!) cost far more then they're worth. And remember, people not in the grapple can attack the grappling character with quite a bonus, so as long as the grappler won't pull you apart in a round, it might not even be that bad. Or last long.
solbergb 05-18-06, 09:29 PM	If you had concentration, command, greater command and word of recall are all verbal only, and helpful. The main defense, as others have said, is freedom of movement. Not a perfect defense, as sometimes it won't be cast, sometimes it will have been dispelled or expired, but it is a spell a L13 cleric should prepare each and every day.