Help with Feats [Archive] - Wizards Community

Help with Feats [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
greentiger
09-15-04, 05:29 PM Alright. I need a little bit of help from you people out there. I am going to be in a campaign called "The Hunt"... you guessed it, we're being hunted. I am a HJalf green dragon human sorceror level 11. we are facing some very high level characters. i need some suggestions on feats. They can be from any book, but you have to put the book it came from beside it. please give me some suggestions and why you would choose them.

Str 22
Dex 18
Con 18
Int 16
Wis 10
Cha 22

AC 31

SR 19

Any other questions just ask

Thanks guys :D
anders
09-15-04, 06:28 PM What class are you?

What level do you start with?

What characters does the rest of the group consist of?
Aerunation
09-15-04, 07:30 PM combat casting
endurance
improved toughness
diehard(if your dm allows improved toughness as the prereq)
great fort
iron will
lightning reflex
dodge mobility
:)
Shard of Suzail
09-15-04, 07:37 PM Skill emphasis is always a favourite of mine. My characters usually have one and i never regret it. Educated is always good (from the forgotten realms book) and that makes all know skills class. They are surprisingly handy things.

Knowing your enemy and the terrain always helps, so this is what i would suggest: Get yourself educated and skill emphasis on Knowledge - the planes or Knowledge - Geography. That way you can always know the local places to hide and local risks.
greentiger
09-15-04, 09:52 PM What class are you?

What level do you start with?

What characters does the rest of the group consist of?

Um...i answered that in the original post. Half green dragon human sorcerer level eleven (ecl 14). The other two people are a Half copper dragon/Quarter celestial/quarter drow monk (ecl 14) and a quarter red dragon/half celestial/quarter human cleric.

The feat Jack of all Trades lets you use any skill untrained. is that what educated does, or does it make all skills class skills? any prereq's? BTW, I am the only spellcazsting damage dealer in the group, so if there is something to help that? I have Improved Familiar because i have a pseudodragon Familiar. I also already have Improved Natural Armor.
Sildatorak
09-16-04, 04:13 AM If you are going to be hunted through the wilderness and your DM is going to make it tough for you to find manufactured material components, you'll want to take Eschew Materials.

Choose Scorching Ray as one of your spells, it is can be your best damage dealing friend when Maximized (72 damage if all 3 rays hit). I would also recommend Energy Substitution. Weapon Focus (Ray) and Point Blank Shot can also help if you are going to have a decent number of ranged touch type spells. If you don't have many rays then go with something to up save DC's.

I would go a little something like this

1a Eschew Materials
1b Point Blank Shot, Weapon Focus (Ray), or Spell Focus (Evocation)
3 Energy Substitution
6 Improved Toughness, [Greater] Spell Focus (Evocation), or one from 1b
9 Maximize Spell

If you are set on a Pseudodragon familiar then put that in at level 6, but I think that if you are the only caster then you will be better off doing something to improve your casting. You might also want to consider going for another route rather than direct damage and go with a summoner or enchanter type. It takes fewer feats to make them as effective as an evoker type.
niesl
09-16-04, 07:04 AM I agree with Sildatorak on the summoner or enchanter type.

The summoner type can summon some monsters to keep the hunters busy so you can run away and the enchanter type can hold them or you can make other people say that they haven't seen you around. (Because the DM probably won't let you kill the hunters the first few sessions)
If you go for summoner, take extend spell, so your summoned creatures stay longer. The feat that givesyour summoned creatures +2 Str and Con is also nice then (Augment Summoning 3.5 PHB)
If you go for enchanter take Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus, because most of your spells depend on failing a save or not (like charm person for example)

As said before you can never go wrong with Eschew Materials or Energy Substitution.
In combination with the Run feat you can get even more out of speed increasing spells like Expeditious Retreat.

(You could also go transmuter, so you can buff everyone and heve some nice spells that speed up travelling like Expedtious Retreat and Fly. Going that way, you can stay the hunters ahead. In that case, no particular feats come up in my mind)
Shard of Suzail
09-16-04, 09:49 AM It makes knowledge skills class skills, so the points go further and the caps are raised. Education needs you to have been raised in a city or other decent place to get trained up, as far as i know.

Sildatorak's suggestion of eschew materials is good thinking...of course, sorcerers shouldnt use material components, but thats another story.
greentiger
09-16-04, 07:55 PM Well, the thing is, We've already played one session, so i can't really change things like spells or skills or anything like that. But last game i didn't have all my feats picked yet, so thats why i HAVE to have Imp. Fam.. we've already role-played with Celeste (my pseudo) and she can't just poof. I added Imp. Nat. Armor because my AC was only 29, but i guess we could do without.

EDIT: Wait, how could i take Eschew Materials 1st when you need a metamagic to take it?
Sildatorak
09-16-04, 09:40 PM EDIT: Wait, how could i take Eschew Materials 1st when you need a metamagic to take it?

You could play 3.5 ;)

In the 3.5 phb they removed its prerequisite and changed it to be a general feat rather than metamagic. That way it automatically affects all of your spells without increasing their casting times if you're a sorc.
UltimateReality
09-16-04, 10:35 PM BTW, I am the only spellcasting damage dealer in the group, so if there is something to help that?

I would see if you can weasel the DM into allowing Spellcasting Prodigy from FRCS. It gives +2 to your primary spellcasting ability as it refers to your spells (so your save DCs and spells/day go up), but must be taken at first level. Also talk to the DM about feats from the Draconomicon, as some of them may be viable for you. (You have a breath weapon, right?) Of note in that book right away are Maximize Breath and Heighten Breath. Others may also be useful if/when you get wings.

Do not leave home without Energy Substitution (Sonic), found in the Tome & Blood book. This helps you get around immunities and resistances. I also recommend its next logical step: Energy Admixture, also in T&B. Nothing says "don't mess with me" like a fireball that deals 10d6 fire AND 10d6 sonic damage.

Because your Dex isn't all that high (for a spellcaster ;) ), I'd also look at Improved Initiative. Extend Spell and Persistent Spell (the latter of which is in both T&B and FRCS) may both come in handy, depending on your spell selection. OTOH, so may things like Extra Spell and Repeat Spell (again T&B). Chain Spell is kinda cool, and Spell Focus (from the good old PHB) and Spell Penetration (ditto) may be useful if you know you're going up against other things with a SR and high saves. Then take Greater Spell Focus and Greater Spell Penetration from the T&B. Twin Spell is also kinda nasty.... You're almost at the point where you could twin a fireball... If you're a summoner, take Augment Summoning, period. If not, don't bother.

-UltimateReality
Shard of Suzail
09-17-04, 09:19 AM These are all lovely ideas for being a powerful spellcaster, but in the long run, such feats will matter little, which is why i suggest he concentrate on skill related feats primarily.

Consider the point of the game, that the players are being hunted. A good GM will make the hunters so powerful as to make a stand up fight a guaranteed failure. Otherwise, the party would pause, turn round, kill the hunters and end the scenario as soon as the bad guys catch up with them in the first scene. Why run if the hunter can be overcome so easily?

If you must take feats, pick those that will make detection spells and useful spells work better or work longer. Combat spells will not win this fight, only clever thinking and setting up favourable situations.

The hunted quarry wins by *escaping* not by killing those that are after him. He does this by being fast, smart and rugged. Even feats like great fortitude are to be considered here as being game winning rather than optional as they usually are.

Likewise, if you are going for spell selection choices, then dont fall into the trap of just taking offensive sorcerer *blast* tools. You may not have a lot of spells, but you could be choosing well to end up as a divination specialist, abjurer or conjuror (as some have mentioned in previous threads).

See this as a chance to build an unusual sorcerer and view the terrain and time as your enemies, not those chasing you.

See if you can avoid combat completely. Run silent and Deep. Be stealthy, even if it means taking some cross class skills at great cost.

When the fox fights, the hounds win.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
greentiger 09-15-04, 05:29 PM	Alright. I need a little bit of help from you people out there. I am going to be in a campaign called "The Hunt"... you guessed it, we're being hunted. I am a HJalf green dragon human sorceror level 11. we are facing some very high level characters. i need some suggestions on feats. They can be from any book, but you have to put the book it came from beside it. please give me some suggestions and why you would choose them. Str 22 Dex 18 Con 18 Int 16 Wis 10 Cha 22 AC 31 SR 19 Any other questions just ask Thanks guys :D
anders 09-15-04, 06:28 PM	What class are you? What level do you start with? What characters does the rest of the group consist of?
Aerunation 09-15-04, 07:30 PM	combat casting endurance improved toughness diehard(if your dm allows improved toughness as the prereq) great fort iron will lightning reflex dodge mobility :)
Shard of Suzail 09-15-04, 07:37 PM	Skill emphasis is always a favourite of mine. My characters usually have one and i never regret it. Educated is always good (from the forgotten realms book) and that makes all know skills class. They are surprisingly handy things. Knowing your enemy and the terrain always helps, so this is what i would suggest: Get yourself educated and skill emphasis on Knowledge - the planes or Knowledge - Geography. That way you can always know the local places to hide and local risks.
greentiger 09-15-04, 09:52 PM	What class are you? What level do you start with? What characters does the rest of the group consist of? Um...i answered that in the original post. Half green dragon human sorcerer level eleven (ecl 14). The other two people are a Half copper dragon/Quarter celestial/quarter drow monk (ecl 14) and a quarter red dragon/half celestial/quarter human cleric. The feat Jack of all Trades lets you use any skill untrained. is that what educated does, or does it make all skills class skills? any prereq's? BTW, I am the only spellcazsting damage dealer in the group, so if there is something to help that? I have Improved Familiar because i have a pseudodragon Familiar. I also already have Improved Natural Armor.
Sildatorak 09-16-04, 04:13 AM	If you are going to be hunted through the wilderness and your DM is going to make it tough for you to find manufactured material components, you'll want to take Eschew Materials. Choose Scorching Ray as one of your spells, it is can be your best damage dealing friend when Maximized (72 damage if all 3 rays hit). I would also recommend Energy Substitution. Weapon Focus (Ray) and Point Blank Shot can also help if you are going to have a decent number of ranged touch type spells. If you don't have many rays then go with something to up save DC's. I would go a little something like this 1a Eschew Materials 1b Point Blank Shot, Weapon Focus (Ray), or Spell Focus (Evocation) 3 Energy Substitution 6 Improved Toughness, [Greater] Spell Focus (Evocation), or one from 1b 9 Maximize Spell If you are set on a Pseudodragon familiar then put that in at level 6, but I think that if you are the only caster then you will be better off doing something to improve your casting. You might also want to consider going for another route rather than direct damage and go with a summoner or enchanter type. It takes fewer feats to make them as effective as an evoker type.
niesl 09-16-04, 07:04 AM	I agree with Sildatorak on the summoner or enchanter type. The summoner type can summon some monsters to keep the hunters busy so you can run away and the enchanter type can hold them or you can make other people say that they haven't seen you around. (Because the DM probably won't let you kill the hunters the first few sessions) If you go for summoner, take extend spell, so your summoned creatures stay longer. The feat that givesyour summoned creatures +2 Str and Con is also nice then (Augment Summoning 3.5 PHB) If you go for enchanter take Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus, because most of your spells depend on failing a save or not (like charm person for example) As said before you can never go wrong with Eschew Materials or Energy Substitution. In combination with the Run feat you can get even more out of speed increasing spells like Expeditious Retreat. (You could also go transmuter, so you can buff everyone and heve some nice spells that speed up travelling like Expedtious Retreat and Fly. Going that way, you can stay the hunters ahead. In that case, no particular feats come up in my mind)
Shard of Suzail 09-16-04, 09:49 AM	It makes knowledge skills class skills, so the points go further and the caps are raised. Education needs you to have been raised in a city or other decent place to get trained up, as far as i know. Sildatorak's suggestion of eschew materials is good thinking...of course, sorcerers shouldnt use material components, but thats another story.
greentiger 09-16-04, 07:55 PM	Well, the thing is, We've already played one session, so i can't really change things like spells or skills or anything like that. But last game i didn't have all my feats picked yet, so thats why i HAVE to have Imp. Fam.. we've already role-played with Celeste (my pseudo) and she can't just poof. I added Imp. Nat. Armor because my AC was only 29, but i guess we could do without. EDIT: Wait, how could i take Eschew Materials 1st when you need a metamagic to take it?
Sildatorak 09-16-04, 09:40 PM	EDIT: Wait, how could i take Eschew Materials 1st when you need a metamagic to take it? You could play 3.5 ;) In the 3.5 phb they removed its prerequisite and changed it to be a general feat rather than metamagic. That way it automatically affects all of your spells without increasing their casting times if you're a sorc.
UltimateReality 09-16-04, 10:35 PM	BTW, I am the only spellcasting damage dealer in the group, so if there is something to help that? I would see if you can weasel the DM into allowing Spellcasting Prodigy from FRCS. It gives +2 to your primary spellcasting ability as it refers to your spells (so your save DCs and spells/day go up), but must be taken at first level. Also talk to the DM about feats from the Draconomicon, as some of them may be viable for you. (You have a breath weapon, right?) Of note in that book right away are Maximize Breath and Heighten Breath. Others may also be useful if/when you get wings. Do not leave home without Energy Substitution (Sonic), found in the Tome & Blood book. This helps you get around immunities and resistances. I also recommend its next logical step: Energy Admixture, also in T&B. Nothing says "don't mess with me" like a fireball that deals 10d6 fire AND 10d6 sonic damage. Because your Dex isn't all that high (for a spellcaster ;) ), I'd also look at Improved Initiative. Extend Spell and Persistent Spell (the latter of which is in both T&B and FRCS) may both come in handy, depending on your spell selection. OTOH, so may things like Extra Spell and Repeat Spell (again T&B). Chain Spell is kinda cool, and Spell Focus (from the good old PHB) and Spell Penetration (ditto) may be useful if you know you're going up against other things with a SR and high saves. Then take Greater Spell Focus and Greater Spell Penetration from the T&B. Twin Spell is also kinda nasty.... You're almost at the point where you could twin a fireball... If you're a summoner, take Augment Summoning, period. If not, don't bother. -UltimateReality
Shard of Suzail 09-17-04, 09:19 AM	These are all lovely ideas for being a powerful spellcaster, but in the long run, such feats will matter little, which is why i suggest he concentrate on skill related feats primarily. Consider the point of the game, that the players are being hunted. A good GM will make the hunters so powerful as to make a stand up fight a guaranteed failure. Otherwise, the party would pause, turn round, kill the hunters and end the scenario as soon as the bad guys catch up with them in the first scene. Why run if the hunter can be overcome so easily? If you must take feats, pick those that will make detection spells and useful spells work better or work longer. Combat spells will not win this fight, only clever thinking and setting up favourable situations. The hunted quarry wins by escaping not by killing those that are after him. He does this by being fast, smart and rugged. Even feats like great fortitude are to be considered here as being game winning rather than optional as they usually are. Likewise, if you are going for spell selection choices, then dont fall into the trap of just taking offensive sorcerer blast tools. You may not have a lot of spells, but you could be choosing well to end up as a divination specialist, abjurer or conjuror (as some have mentioned in previous threads). See this as a chance to build an unusual sorcerer and view the terrain and time as your enemies, not those chasing you. See if you can avoid combat completely. Run silent and Deep. Be stealthy, even if it means taking some cross class skills at great cost. When the fox fights, the hounds win.