How bad is... [Archive] - Wizards Community

How bad is... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Soaam
01-23-07, 11:42 PM A 5? Its easy to quantify in the physical abilities, but what about roleplaying it in the mental abilities? Specifically Wisdom. I ask this because I rolled a set (13, 13, 16, 5, 12, 15) And no matter what class I think about, I cant bring myself to putting it into Int, or Cha. Any help would be appreciated. Our party is currently going to consist of a Barbarian, a Dread Necromancer, a Cleric, a Ranger, and a Bard. I'm trying to decide what we're missing and try to fill the gap as best possible with the rolls I have. Any help with class selection would be great too. Thanks :D
mcnoo
01-23-07, 11:54 PM I'd put it in the charisma, mostly because with an INT that low you'd have a very hard time rping anything with even vague social skills, making your higher charisma less valueable.
Clever people can still be ugly and shy though
Artector
01-24-07, 12:00 AM If I were you I'd play the Bumbling Wizard. That would probably fill the gap well. Your will save would equal out because of the Wizard's good save, so you'd probably be able to pull it off fine.
Ace_of_Diamonds
01-24-07, 12:05 AM As per Gary Gygax' original intention that Intelligence approximately equals IQ divided by 10... a 5 is an IQ of 45-54, which puts them well into the "mentally retarded" range. Anything under 8 would be in that range, as the legal definition in the United States is an IQ of less than 80.
TheChilliGod
01-24-07, 12:09 AM Dude, my most favorite character ever has 4 Intelligence (after racial mods). And he rocked the socks off of the world he walked on. Okay, granted, his charisma was also rather bad, but that doesn't really matter. He was so stupid, everybody loved him for it. Like a pet or something.

Mind you, I don't think a low-int character may work for your party, given that you seem to be lacking a hard-and-fast trapfinder. Rogues and stuff usually do best with a half-decent intelligence, and unless you plan on being the party diplomat (unlikely, considering the bard), your charisma is left wide open for a-dumping. Sure, you can dump wisdom instead, but do you really want your will save to suffer?
You can be that thug kind of rogue.
Ace_of_Diamonds
01-24-07, 12:14 AM I'll agree with Chilli... a rogue with Charisma as a dump stat is a nice idea. Then you can RP him as a total loner, thug, or just downright ugly.
Krusk
01-24-07, 01:31 AM id throw the 5 into str, or con and go for a rastlin clone from dragonlance.

But id pick a diffrent school, possibly playing LG and trying to convince others they need to help those less fortunate than them. "they arent as smart as me, or as tough as you, take it easy on these thugs, they are just trying to survive"

Or a druid would work perfectly, throw it in str or dex, id suggest str. And once you hit level 5, you can wildshape that away.
Thomar_of_Uointer
01-24-07, 02:02 AM Are you familiar with Thog from Order of the Stick?

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0388.html
Yokomohoyo
01-24-07, 02:33 AM If you dont mind a level ajustment of +3 then try half dragon...

Your rolls are:
13, 13, 16, 5, 12, 15
And you could do your stats like:
5 str
15 dex
16 con
13 int
13 wis
12 cha

With the half dragon gainning Str +8, Con +2, Int +2, Cha +2 your stats could look like this:

13 str
15 dex
18 con
15 int
13 wis
14 cha

That would make a decent rouge/ranger I think.
Its in the srd (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfDragon.htm) if you need it.
Tyler Do'Urden
01-24-07, 03:38 AM Wisdom is perception and understanding. Someone with a Wis of 5 is not very perceptive. Maybe the party is at the outskirts of some city that's about to be raided and a plan is being devised, someone might say something about protecting the city. "City, what city? Oh this city, right. I thought you were talking about some other city. ...protect it from what?"

You're also a poor judge of character. Wis 5 is naive and easily led.
Lina_Inverse
01-24-07, 03:41 AM Lemme see.

Your weak willed.
You lack faith entirely.
You lack intuition.
And glasses wont correct YOUR vision problems.
CaoSlayer
01-24-07, 04:59 AM specially because spot isnt the same as seeing.

to spot isnt to see something, to spot is to notice something you see.

You can play a wormbook wizard who isnt interested at all in the outside world and just spend all the time looking at his books or thinking to himself.

There is ever a flaw that suports the role:

d20srd
Inattentive

You are particularly unaware of your surroundings.
Effect

You take a -4 penalty on Listen checks and Spot checks.
Boraxe
01-24-07, 09:27 AM Low WIS in action.

"I know the coffee is hot but I am really thirsty. OWWW!"
"Hey, a 'wet paint' sign. Yup, it's still wet. Where can I wash my hands."
"One pack of cigarettes, please."
"I guess it's okay if you don't use a condom just this one time."

INT allows you to recognize dangerous or stupid things, WIS stops you from doing it anyway.
Zumarai
01-24-07, 09:47 AM Go for the Gruyere and play a druid and put it into Str or Dex.
Ace_of_Diamonds
01-24-07, 11:42 AM "One pack of cigarettes, please."

This one made me laugh, particularly because it reminded me of Gary Gygax describing wisdom in the 1st edition DMG. "...while the intelligent character will know that smoking is harmful to him, he may well lack the wisdom to stop."
JulesCARV
01-24-07, 11:54 AM Randal Graves from Clerks. Or maybe that's actually decent wisdom combined with a quite chaotic alignment. Not sure.
Johnny_Angel
01-24-07, 06:37 PM Randal Graves from Clerks. Or maybe that's actually decent wisdom combined with a quite chaotic alignment. Not sure.

Put the 5 into charisma and have your PC speak in a manner similar to Ben Stein.

Alternatively, your low charisma could be due to a strange (unattractive) facial feature such as a unibrow or really messed up teeth. Have fun with the low score.
Thubby
01-24-07, 07:40 PM 5 wisdom...
rogue: theres probably traps here. hey thubby, go check it out
thubby: but you say there trap there
rogue: no i didn't
thubby: ok :D *walks into cave, followed by several booms, twands, and the sound of many, many blades... thubby walks back out*
rogue: i told ya it was trapped
thubby: thubby listen to tiny (his nickname for rogue) next time.
Boraxe
01-25-07, 10:58 AM 5 wisdom...
rogue: theres probably traps here. hey thubby, go check it out
thubby: but you say there trap there
rogue: no i didn't
thubby: ok :D *walks into cave, followed by several booms, twands, and the sound of many, many blades... thubby walks back out*
rogue: i told ya it was trapped
thubby: thubby listen to tiny (his nickname for rogue) next time.

A low WIS doesn't make one unable to use proper grammar nor does it make one too stupid to recall what has just told to you.
DreadArchon
01-25-07, 03:02 PM Put it in Con and then become undead. :D
Johnny_Angel
01-25-07, 03:21 PM A low WIS doesn't make one unable to use proper grammar nor does it make one too stupid to recall what has just told to you.

I agree; a low WIS would just mean that -for a lack of better words- the character wouldn't have much common sense.

It is possible to have a character who is extremely intelligent, but have a low wisdom; in that case, they would be very smart, but they would have trouble with comprehension of things such as emotion and -again, for a lack of better words- "common sense."

A good example would be a computer. A computer would have a very high INT score, but a very poor WIS score.
LCD2YOU
01-25-07, 05:06 PM Low Charisma:

Str 13 Dex 15 Con 13 Int 16 Wis 12 Cha 5

He's a good Wizard and he may be any or all of the following:

Is gruff

Taciturn

Comtemptuous

Haughty

Ugly

Snotty

Conceited and oh so much better than you

Shy

Doesn't think much of his abilities

Stand alone guy, knows the value of teamwork, not friendship

Nervous that he's never good enough

The list goes on and on

Example: He may really care for others, but he thinks of them as being unable to help themselves so here he is to help them. He'll do the thinking and he'll truly (LG) put their needs first, but comes across as a true buttmunch no matter what.

Just stay next to the cleric and don't forget Protection from Evil spells when facing ghosts. His already low charisma is a lightening rod.
Thubby
01-26-07, 11:41 AM A low WIS doesn't make one unable to use proper grammar nor does it make one too stupid to recall what has just told to you.

im well aware of that. this actualy happened to my character (who did incidentaly have a 3 int as well)

but it showed alot of low wisdom stuff happen. he wasnt paying attention (when the rogue was talking, kinda hard to portray on boards).
he couldnt see through the rogues obvious lie.
didnt think their might be traps (he didnt actualy ask if their were traps) thus lacking comon sense.
and he was easily lead.
the last part was more a sign of his low int, and a little humor (like i said, this actualy happened)
seldom_seen
01-26-07, 11:51 AM A low ability score can give you a great oppurtunity to roleplay your character in a unique way.
One of my favorite characters was a human fighter named Moric. He had an Intelligence score of 8, and I played him as a giant idiot. He also had a Strength score if 18(85), so he was a valued member of the party, and could deal out prodigious amounts of damage, but in a social setting, he was a liability. Whenever we were in town, another party member had to stick close to him to prevent problems. The other players enjoyed the additional roleplaying as well, because it allowed them to expand their imaginations along with me.
Use your lowly 5 as I did, making your character an idiot.
Or use it on Charisma, making him Half-Orc ugly, but very capable in other aspects. A truly ugly character may be initially assumed to be stupid as well, and can be used to your advantage!
If you are going to play a spell caster, make your character physically feeble, while possessing keen intellect. (think of Raistlin in the DragonLance novels).

What I am trying to say is think of your low score as a plus instead of a negative. Use your imagination and play your character well.
Demarest
01-26-07, 12:01 PM Character flaws add role-playing opportunities. They add them even more so than above average character traits. Keep that in mind when you decide. Would you like to role-play someone with low charisma, or intelligence? Which one might be more fun?
DreadArchon
01-26-07, 01:21 PM You know, the more I think about it, the more I think that Wis is the best low stat for RP purposes. It's just great fun to be completely oblivious as you wade through the game.
Gedrin
01-26-07, 11:07 PM I say put it in Cha and if you don't like it you can go to Hell.

;)
Soaam
02-06-07, 09:23 PM Thanks for all the feed back. I went with putting it into STR and going for a conjuration spec to roleplay the fact that he is weak and has people and spells doing the muscle work for him.
Thubby
02-06-07, 09:32 PM Thanks for all the feed back. I went with putting it into STR and going for a conjuration spec to roleplay the fact that he is weak and has people and spells doing the muscle work for him.

telekinesis works for that too "these arms may be weak, but my mind can move mountains". literaly
RobbyPants
02-07-07, 11:49 AM I've been liking these "low wisdom" suggestions. I had an NPC wizard once with a very high Int, but a low (7-8) Dex and Wis. The idea was that she was very book-smart, but also very clumsy and naive. Her particular weakness was in noticing "obvious" things, particularly in social interactions.

She could spout off all sorts of trivia and knowledge on command, but when it came to figuring out who was angry based off of body language or tone of voice, she was pretty clueless. She found a Rod of Wonder and decided she had to figure out how it worked through experimentation. This lead to many mishaps as she didn't plan far enough ahead to deal with any potentail damage caused.

Anyway, I'd put in my vote for the low Wis. It could be a lot of fun to RP (IMO). I'd have a lot harder time with a low Int or Cha.

Edit:
Also, a low Wis could represnt the character being very impulsive. Combined with a chaotic alignment, the character might be the sort to test the water's depth by jumping right in! This could be very fun, and also a huge head-ache for the rest of the group.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Soaam 01-23-07, 11:42 PM	A 5? Its easy to quantify in the physical abilities, but what about roleplaying it in the mental abilities? Specifically Wisdom. I ask this because I rolled a set (13, 13, 16, 5, 12, 15) And no matter what class I think about, I cant bring myself to putting it into Int, or Cha. Any help would be appreciated. Our party is currently going to consist of a Barbarian, a Dread Necromancer, a Cleric, a Ranger, and a Bard. I'm trying to decide what we're missing and try to fill the gap as best possible with the rolls I have. Any help with class selection would be great too. Thanks :D
mcnoo 01-23-07, 11:54 PM	I'd put it in the charisma, mostly because with an INT that low you'd have a very hard time rping anything with even vague social skills, making your higher charisma less valueable. Clever people can still be ugly and shy though
Artector 01-24-07, 12:00 AM	If I were you I'd play the Bumbling Wizard. That would probably fill the gap well. Your will save would equal out because of the Wizard's good save, so you'd probably be able to pull it off fine.
Ace_of_Diamonds 01-24-07, 12:05 AM	As per Gary Gygax' original intention that Intelligence approximately equals IQ divided by 10... a 5 is an IQ of 45-54, which puts them well into the "mentally retarded" range. Anything under 8 would be in that range, as the legal definition in the United States is an IQ of less than 80.
TheChilliGod 01-24-07, 12:09 AM	Dude, my most favorite character ever has 4 Intelligence (after racial mods). And he rocked the socks off of the world he walked on. Okay, granted, his charisma was also rather bad, but that doesn't really matter. He was so stupid, everybody loved him for it. Like a pet or something. Mind you, I don't think a low-int character may work for your party, given that you seem to be lacking a hard-and-fast trapfinder. Rogues and stuff usually do best with a half-decent intelligence, and unless you plan on being the party diplomat (unlikely, considering the bard), your charisma is left wide open for a-dumping. Sure, you can dump wisdom instead, but do you really want your will save to suffer? You can be that thug kind of rogue.
Ace_of_Diamonds 01-24-07, 12:14 AM	I'll agree with Chilli... a rogue with Charisma as a dump stat is a nice idea. Then you can RP him as a total loner, thug, or just downright ugly.
Krusk 01-24-07, 01:31 AM	id throw the 5 into str, or con and go for a rastlin clone from dragonlance. But id pick a diffrent school, possibly playing LG and trying to convince others they need to help those less fortunate than them. "they arent as smart as me, or as tough as you, take it easy on these thugs, they are just trying to survive" Or a druid would work perfectly, throw it in str or dex, id suggest str. And once you hit level 5, you can wildshape that away.
Thomar_of_Uointer 01-24-07, 02:02 AM	Are you familiar with Thog from Order of the Stick? http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0388.html
Yokomohoyo 01-24-07, 02:33 AM	If you dont mind a level ajustment of +3 then try half dragon... Your rolls are: 13, 13, 16, 5, 12, 15 And you could do your stats like: 5 str 15 dex 16 con 13 int 13 wis 12 cha With the half dragon gainning Str +8, Con +2, Int +2, Cha +2 your stats could look like this: 13 str 15 dex 18 con 15 int 13 wis 14 cha That would make a decent rouge/ranger I think. Its in the srd (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/halfDragon.htm) if you need it.
Tyler Do'Urden 01-24-07, 03:38 AM	Wisdom is perception and understanding. Someone with a Wis of 5 is not very perceptive. Maybe the party is at the outskirts of some city that's about to be raided and a plan is being devised, someone might say something about protecting the city. "City, what city? Oh this city, right. I thought you were talking about some other city. ...protect it from what?" You're also a poor judge of character. Wis 5 is naive and easily led.
Lina_Inverse 01-24-07, 03:41 AM	Lemme see. Your weak willed. You lack faith entirely. You lack intuition. And glasses wont correct YOUR vision problems.
CaoSlayer 01-24-07, 04:59 AM	specially because spot isnt the same as seeing. to spot isnt to see something, to spot is to notice something you see. You can play a wormbook wizard who isnt interested at all in the outside world and just spend all the time looking at his books or thinking to himself. There is ever a flaw that suports the role: d20srd Inattentive You are particularly unaware of your surroundings. Effect You take a -4 penalty on Listen checks and Spot checks.
Boraxe 01-24-07, 09:27 AM	Low WIS in action. "I know the coffee is hot but I am really thirsty. OWWW!" "Hey, a 'wet paint' sign. Yup, it's still wet. Where can I wash my hands." "One pack of cigarettes, please." "I guess it's okay if you don't use a condom just this one time." INT allows you to recognize dangerous or stupid things, WIS stops you from doing it anyway.
Zumarai 01-24-07, 09:47 AM	Go for the Gruyere and play a druid and put it into Str or Dex.
Ace_of_Diamonds 01-24-07, 11:42 AM	"One pack of cigarettes, please." This one made me laugh, particularly because it reminded me of Gary Gygax describing wisdom in the 1st edition DMG. "...while the intelligent character will know that smoking is harmful to him, he may well lack the wisdom to stop."
JulesCARV 01-24-07, 11:54 AM	Randal Graves from Clerks. Or maybe that's actually decent wisdom combined with a quite chaotic alignment. Not sure.
Johnny_Angel 01-24-07, 06:37 PM	Randal Graves from Clerks. Or maybe that's actually decent wisdom combined with a quite chaotic alignment. Not sure. Put the 5 into charisma and have your PC speak in a manner similar to Ben Stein. Alternatively, your low charisma could be due to a strange (unattractive) facial feature such as a unibrow or really messed up teeth. Have fun with the low score.
Thubby 01-24-07, 07:40 PM	5 wisdom... rogue: theres probably traps here. hey thubby, go check it out thubby: but you say there trap there rogue: no i didn't thubby: ok :D walks into cave, followed by several booms, twands, and the sound of many, many blades... thubby walks back out rogue: i told ya it was trapped thubby: thubby listen to tiny (his nickname for rogue) next time.
Boraxe 01-25-07, 10:58 AM	5 wisdom... rogue: theres probably traps here. hey thubby, go check it out thubby: but you say there trap there rogue: no i didn't thubby: ok :D walks into cave, followed by several booms, twands, and the sound of many, many blades... thubby walks back out rogue: i told ya it was trapped thubby: thubby listen to tiny (his nickname for rogue) next time. A low WIS doesn't make one unable to use proper grammar nor does it make one too stupid to recall what has just told to you.
DreadArchon 01-25-07, 03:02 PM	Put it in Con and then become undead. :D
Johnny_Angel 01-25-07, 03:21 PM	A low WIS doesn't make one unable to use proper grammar nor does it make one too stupid to recall what has just told to you. I agree; a low WIS would just mean that -for a lack of better words- the character wouldn't have much common sense. It is possible to have a character who is extremely intelligent, but have a low wisdom; in that case, they would be very smart, but they would have trouble with comprehension of things such as emotion and -again, for a lack of better words- "common sense." A good example would be a computer. A computer would have a very high INT score, but a very poor WIS score.
LCD2YOU 01-25-07, 05:06 PM	Low Charisma: Str 13 Dex 15 Con 13 Int 16 Wis 12 Cha 5 He's a good Wizard and he may be any or all of the following: Is gruff Taciturn Comtemptuous Haughty Ugly Snotty Conceited and oh so much better than you Shy Doesn't think much of his abilities Stand alone guy, knows the value of teamwork, not friendship Nervous that he's never good enough The list goes on and on Example: He may really care for others, but he thinks of them as being unable to help themselves so here he is to help them. He'll do the thinking and he'll truly (LG) put their needs first, but comes across as a true buttmunch no matter what. Just stay next to the cleric and don't forget Protection from Evil spells when facing ghosts. His already low charisma is a lightening rod.
Thubby 01-26-07, 11:41 AM	A low WIS doesn't make one unable to use proper grammar nor does it make one too stupid to recall what has just told to you. im well aware of that. this actualy happened to my character (who did incidentaly have a 3 int as well) but it showed alot of low wisdom stuff happen. he wasnt paying attention (when the rogue was talking, kinda hard to portray on boards). he couldnt see through the rogues obvious lie. didnt think their might be traps (he didnt actualy ask if their were traps) thus lacking comon sense. and he was easily lead. the last part was more a sign of his low int, and a little humor (like i said, this actualy happened)
seldom_seen 01-26-07, 11:51 AM	A low ability score can give you a great oppurtunity to roleplay your character in a unique way. One of my favorite characters was a human fighter named Moric. He had an Intelligence score of 8, and I played him as a giant idiot. He also had a Strength score if 18(85), so he was a valued member of the party, and could deal out prodigious amounts of damage, but in a social setting, he was a liability. Whenever we were in town, another party member had to stick close to him to prevent problems. The other players enjoyed the additional roleplaying as well, because it allowed them to expand their imaginations along with me. Use your lowly 5 as I did, making your character an idiot. Or use it on Charisma, making him Half-Orc ugly, but very capable in other aspects. A truly ugly character may be initially assumed to be stupid as well, and can be used to your advantage! If you are going to play a spell caster, make your character physically feeble, while possessing keen intellect. (think of Raistlin in the DragonLance novels). What I am trying to say is think of your low score as a plus instead of a negative. Use your imagination and play your character well.
Demarest 01-26-07, 12:01 PM	Character flaws add role-playing opportunities. They add them even more so than above average character traits. Keep that in mind when you decide. Would you like to role-play someone with low charisma, or intelligence? Which one might be more fun?
DreadArchon 01-26-07, 01:21 PM	You know, the more I think about it, the more I think that Wis is the best low stat for RP purposes. It's just great fun to be completely oblivious as you wade through the game.
Gedrin 01-26-07, 11:07 PM	I say put it in Cha and if you don't like it you can go to Hell. ;)
Soaam 02-06-07, 09:23 PM	Thanks for all the feed back. I went with putting it into STR and going for a conjuration spec to roleplay the fact that he is weak and has people and spells doing the muscle work for him.
Thubby 02-06-07, 09:32 PM	Thanks for all the feed back. I went with putting it into STR and going for a conjuration spec to roleplay the fact that he is weak and has people and spells doing the muscle work for him. telekinesis works for that too "these arms may be weak, but my mind can move mountains". literaly
RobbyPants 02-07-07, 11:49 AM	I've been liking these "low wisdom" suggestions. I had an NPC wizard once with a very high Int, but a low (7-8) Dex and Wis. The idea was that she was very book-smart, but also very clumsy and naive. Her particular weakness was in noticing "obvious" things, particularly in social interactions. She could spout off all sorts of trivia and knowledge on command, but when it came to figuring out who was angry based off of body language or tone of voice, she was pretty clueless. She found a Rod of Wonder and decided she had to figure out how it worked through experimentation. This lead to many mishaps as she didn't plan far enough ahead to deal with any potentail damage caused. Anyway, I'd put in my vote for the low Wis. It could be a lot of fun to RP (IMO). I'd have a lot harder time with a low Int or Cha. Edit: Also, a low Wis could represnt the character being very impulsive. Combined with a chaotic alignment, the character might be the sort to test the water's depth by jumping right in! This could be very fun, and also a huge head-ache for the rest of the group.