How convince the DM you're not cheating [Archive] - Wizards Community

How convince the DM you're not cheating [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Suzaku455
02-26-06, 01:46 AM Last session the dm believed I was cheating with my dice rolls because I was on a lucky streak. So he had me switch dices and put the dices I had away, well that didn't work so the other players started rolling for me. When my luck continued the DM started rolling for me behind his screen. After the session was over he took me and the person rolling for me to side and said he wasn't appreciate us cheating on a table top game and that we’re all friends. Now I wasn’t cheating nor did I cheat before in fact last two sessions I kept rolling low so I decided to buy new dice and throw my old ones away. How do I convince my DM I wasn’t cheating?

Btw joke topic
Nithendil
02-26-06, 02:03 AM This is a bit ridiculous, but if you really want to play in that particular game, offer for the DM to go to the gameshop and pick up a set of dice for you which he can keep at his place.

Difficult situation. It looks like the DM is being an :tantrum:, but he may be like me and have had a previous issue with cheaters.
TheChilliGod
02-26-06, 02:20 AM Are you rolling in plain sight?
And your dice are clearly marked, right? (About half the sets of dice I see take forever to figure out what the heck you rolled, because of gold-outlined numbers in an orange background or something similar.)
And you wait for someone else to confirm your roll, right?
And you have tried other dice to prove that they are weighted dice, right?
And all the other players have been rolling in plain sight with clearly-marked dice, right?

Tell him that, then. Tell him that there is no possible way you could have ever cheated without it being obvious.
If he suspects you of cheating still, then tell the DM to roll for you. At least you don't have to exercise your wrist anymore.
IceFractal
02-26-06, 03:29 AM So you're saying that the other players rolled for you - then the DM did, himself ... and he still accuses you of cheating? What, does he think you can telekinetically control the dice when someone else is rolling it? Because if I thought one of my players could telekinetically control dice, I wouldn't be accusing them of cheating, I'd be on the road to Vegas with them.
DarknessEternal
02-26-06, 03:56 AM If he can read the die after you roll it, how is it even an issue?

And if he can't, adjust what you're doing until he can. Then there will be no issue.
Feor
02-26-06, 10:58 AM I agree with the sentiment that if he had others roll for you, and rolled for you himself, he's just being whiney cause your good rolls ruined some great plan he had. Ask him how he thought you were cheating when he was rolling for you, offer to roll with his dice next time. If you continue on your lucky streak and he accuses you of cheating again, tell him to go to hell and find another game.

The only way I could see him still thinking your cheating once he started rolling for you is if he thought you were lying about something on your character sheet, at which point make him a copy of the sheet to keep for himself so he can check your stats.
DrMorganes
02-26-06, 11:42 AM Before you can prove you're not cheating, I think you need to understand exactly why the DM thinks you were. Call him up, tell him that you've been thinking about the last session, and that you're really confused about the cheating accusation. Ask him - nicely - to explain why he thought you were cheating. Listen to his answer. When he's done, address his position point by point. Mention all of the shuffling of dice done, with others rolling on your behalf. Ask him what you can do to prove you are not a cheater.

You may be surprised by his answer.
DerHauptman
02-26-06, 11:50 AM DM = whimp with pet plot you destroyed with your unusual string of luck.

Bad DM's hate that - I applaud when my players get hot with the dice.

I say, you can feel the power of X god running through you as yet again you striek your opponent unmercifully.

Or, again your training time has certainly paid off Redgar, you strike again with precision.

Or, again your sneak attack take purchase debilitating your foe Lidda, your life on the streets is paying its dividends tonight.

Derhauptman - Out!
Loren Pechtel
02-26-06, 12:30 PM Of course you're cheating! Put down that luckstone +5 *NOW*! :D :D
Lana "Silvertongue"
02-26-06, 01:11 PM make sure all the dice rolls are where two people can confirm, then do some of the math out loud. If you do the math out loud you can occasionally catch math errors. But if he and a friend and you all rolled well for you then you need to say that he is being out of line. Tell him you don't take kindly to being insulted as a cheat and are hurt he has serious mistrust issues. Sometimes the perception of cheating is carried on by the player, other times the DM is just paranoid. Another thought is to go ahead an get a dice box and have everyone but the dm roll in the box.
Aliquid
02-26-06, 02:16 PM Please don’t ever say “dices”
Ulorian
02-26-06, 07:17 PM Could you point your DM to this thread and have him tell his side of the story?
Duration_10_Rounds
02-26-06, 07:28 PM Hope your lucky streak continues and mess with the DM's head.
Next gaming session point at a random player each time its your turn to roll a dice ... and if everyone rolls well for you the DM will go insane thinking its a massive plot to cheat him.

If all is going great just sit there arms folded looking smugger than hell.... Say "Thank you" every time someone rolls well for you, do this while pointing at them and shooting a cheaky. little, Wink-&-Nod combo in their direction.
For the people who roll well for you make sure you give them ingame back handers to highten the "Up yours" your giving the DM.
Kerri_Evanwood
02-26-06, 07:45 PM I wonder what exactly this DM is afraid of. He must be ill-prepared... a well-prepared DM should know very well that a lucky streak with dice can derail even the most carefully laid plans. Thinking along the lines of "I need X (PC) to fail Y save so Z can happen..." is a very good example of a game with bad structure.

Moral of the story: always have a backup plan. I'm not sure what that has to do with the original post, but it's just a comment...
ehrin
02-26-06, 08:01 PM does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic

if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it.
IceFractal
02-26-06, 11:13 PM :censored: :surrender

Guess I fell for it - I didn't even think of it being a joke. Probably because people post topics that are actually more ridiculous than this, and not jest.
Crimson_Concerto
02-26-06, 11:20 PM does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic

if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it. :rofl:
Templetroll
02-26-06, 11:40 PM does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic

if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it.

How did you happen to see the "...small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic"?
UltimateReality
02-27-06, 12:20 AM How did you happen to see the "...small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic"?
Not all of us have our forum background set to the same colour as his text. It shows up clear as day on mine.
Kerri_Evanwood
02-27-06, 01:15 AM Not all of us have our forum background set to the same colour as his text. It shows up clear as day on mine.

Shows up well enough on my skin (Pretty Pink), but I chose to answer anyway.
Ulorian
02-27-06, 05:45 AM Whooooeeee! That's some joke! Hilarious!

MONSTER SARCASM
Hariman
02-28-06, 02:48 AM I am now going to change the color of the background in my settings so I get the joke before someone says: HA HA!!! Fooled Ya!
rockondon
02-28-06, 07:37 PM I think you should tell him that you're sorry for cheating and that you'll leave your jedi powers at home next time.

Then sit next to him so if you roll a 20 he can see it without having to go wet his diaper.
Bryarr
03-03-06, 05:13 AM Thanks for wasting my time, jerkface.

Bry
Millennium
03-03-06, 08:15 AM Actually, a regular d6 -the kind you mark by scooping small pits out of the surface of the die- is slightly biased toward the higher numbers. This is because of the way they're made: you scoop more material out of the higher-numbered sides, so they're a bit lighter. The heavier low-numbered sides will thus land face-down somewhat more often than not. This is why casino dice have the pits filled in with a material that has the same density and mass as the material that was scooped out: it negates that bias.

Truth be told, even D&D doesn't involve enough dice-rolling to make this tiny bias have any significant effect, but it is there. If you've ever heard of a brand called Gamescience, they make D&D-style dice using similar concepts to remove that bias: they're kind of overkill, but if you're a real stickler then they're just what you need.

This has been another Useless Fact (tm).

Ahem. Now, back to your specific problem. If you're rolling your dice in the open and your dice are clearly marked, then it would be extremely difficult for you to cheat. Let the DM inspect your dice: loaded dice can be very hard to spot visually, but they're much easier to detect if you can actually hold them. The slight bias of traditional dice is meaningless if the DM uses traditional dice too.

When I started playing, my DM had a d20 that once rolled a natural 20 four times in a row (different situations and players). He got frustrated by this, and said that he the next roll was a natural 20, he was going to throw the die out the window. It was, and he threw it, just as he said he would. But then he had to go out to the parking lot to get it, and when he did... you guessed it. When he found the die, it had come up 20 again.

The point behind this is that dice are strange. I could roll any die six times, and record the results. The odds of that particular combination of rolls coming up were nearly zero, and yet they came up: something had to, after all. Sometimes, players just get lucky. My wife once rolled a character whose lowest stat was 14 using the straight-3d6 method.
darkness ninja of light
03-03-06, 08:22 AM What kind of joke thread is this? Oh well. I saw the text from the beginning because I have a habit of highlighting text as I read it.

Haha, make sure to notice the hidden text underneath Ulorian's post. Brilliant.
danielinthewolvesden
03-04-06, 12:04 PM does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic

if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it.

Yes, and that's the kind of joke a troll would make. :P

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Suzaku455 02-26-06, 01:46 AM	Last session the dm believed I was cheating with my dice rolls because I was on a lucky streak. So he had me switch dices and put the dices I had away, well that didn't work so the other players started rolling for me. When my luck continued the DM started rolling for me behind his screen. After the session was over he took me and the person rolling for me to side and said he wasn't appreciate us cheating on a table top game and that we’re all friends. Now I wasn’t cheating nor did I cheat before in fact last two sessions I kept rolling low so I decided to buy new dice and throw my old ones away. How do I convince my DM I wasn’t cheating? Btw joke topic
Nithendil 02-26-06, 02:03 AM	This is a bit ridiculous, but if you really want to play in that particular game, offer for the DM to go to the gameshop and pick up a set of dice for you which he can keep at his place. Difficult situation. It looks like the DM is being an :tantrum:, but he may be like me and have had a previous issue with cheaters.
TheChilliGod 02-26-06, 02:20 AM	Are you rolling in plain sight? And your dice are clearly marked, right? (About half the sets of dice I see take forever to figure out what the heck you rolled, because of gold-outlined numbers in an orange background or something similar.) And you wait for someone else to confirm your roll, right? And you have tried other dice to prove that they are weighted dice, right? And all the other players have been rolling in plain sight with clearly-marked dice, right? Tell him that, then. Tell him that there is no possible way you could have ever cheated without it being obvious. If he suspects you of cheating still, then tell the DM to roll for you. At least you don't have to exercise your wrist anymore.
IceFractal 02-26-06, 03:29 AM	So you're saying that the other players rolled for you - then the DM did, himself ... and he still accuses you of cheating? What, does he think you can telekinetically control the dice when someone else is rolling it? Because if I thought one of my players could telekinetically control dice, I wouldn't be accusing them of cheating, I'd be on the road to Vegas with them.
DarknessEternal 02-26-06, 03:56 AM	If he can read the die after you roll it, how is it even an issue? And if he can't, adjust what you're doing until he can. Then there will be no issue.
Feor 02-26-06, 10:58 AM	I agree with the sentiment that if he had others roll for you, and rolled for you himself, he's just being whiney cause your good rolls ruined some great plan he had. Ask him how he thought you were cheating when he was rolling for you, offer to roll with his dice next time. If you continue on your lucky streak and he accuses you of cheating again, tell him to go to hell and find another game. The only way I could see him still thinking your cheating once he started rolling for you is if he thought you were lying about something on your character sheet, at which point make him a copy of the sheet to keep for himself so he can check your stats.
DrMorganes 02-26-06, 11:42 AM	Before you can prove you're not cheating, I think you need to understand exactly why the DM thinks you were. Call him up, tell him that you've been thinking about the last session, and that you're really confused about the cheating accusation. Ask him - nicely - to explain why he thought you were cheating. Listen to his answer. When he's done, address his position point by point. Mention all of the shuffling of dice done, with others rolling on your behalf. Ask him what you can do to prove you are not a cheater. You may be surprised by his answer.
DerHauptman 02-26-06, 11:50 AM	DM = whimp with pet plot you destroyed with your unusual string of luck. Bad DM's hate that - I applaud when my players get hot with the dice. I say, you can feel the power of X god running through you as yet again you striek your opponent unmercifully. Or, again your training time has certainly paid off Redgar, you strike again with precision. Or, again your sneak attack take purchase debilitating your foe Lidda, your life on the streets is paying its dividends tonight. Derhauptman - Out!
Loren Pechtel 02-26-06, 12:30 PM	Of course you're cheating! Put down that luckstone +5 NOW! :D :D
Lana "Silvertongue" 02-26-06, 01:11 PM	make sure all the dice rolls are where two people can confirm, then do some of the math out loud. If you do the math out loud you can occasionally catch math errors. But if he and a friend and you all rolled well for you then you need to say that he is being out of line. Tell him you don't take kindly to being insulted as a cheat and are hurt he has serious mistrust issues. Sometimes the perception of cheating is carried on by the player, other times the DM is just paranoid. Another thought is to go ahead an get a dice box and have everyone but the dm roll in the box.
Aliquid 02-26-06, 02:16 PM	Please don’t ever say “dices”
Ulorian 02-26-06, 07:17 PM	Could you point your DM to this thread and have him tell his side of the story?
Duration_10_Rounds 02-26-06, 07:28 PM	Hope your lucky streak continues and mess with the DM's head. Next gaming session point at a random player each time its your turn to roll a dice ... and if everyone rolls well for you the DM will go insane thinking its a massive plot to cheat him. If all is going great just sit there arms folded looking smugger than hell.... Say "Thank you" every time someone rolls well for you, do this while pointing at them and shooting a cheaky. little, Wink-&-Nod combo in their direction. For the people who roll well for you make sure you give them ingame back handers to highten the "Up yours" your giving the DM.
Kerri_Evanwood 02-26-06, 07:45 PM	I wonder what exactly this DM is afraid of. He must be ill-prepared... a well-prepared DM should know very well that a lucky streak with dice can derail even the most carefully laid plans. Thinking along the lines of "I need X (PC) to fail Y save so Z can happen..." is a very good example of a game with bad structure. Moral of the story: always have a backup plan. I'm not sure what that has to do with the original post, but it's just a comment...
ehrin 02-26-06, 08:01 PM	does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it.
IceFractal 02-26-06, 11:13 PM	:censored: :surrender Guess I fell for it - I didn't even think of it being a joke. Probably because people post topics that are actually more ridiculous than this, and not jest.
Crimson_Concerto 02-26-06, 11:20 PM	does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it. :rofl:
Templetroll 02-26-06, 11:40 PM	does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it. How did you happen to see the "...small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic"?
UltimateReality 02-27-06, 12:20 AM	How did you happen to see the "...small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic"? Not all of us have our forum background set to the same colour as his text. It shows up clear as day on mine.
Kerri_Evanwood 02-27-06, 01:15 AM	Not all of us have our forum background set to the same colour as his text. It shows up clear as day on mine. Shows up well enough on my skin (Pretty Pink), but I chose to answer anyway.
Ulorian 02-27-06, 05:45 AM	Whooooeeee! That's some joke! Hilarious! MONSTER SARCASM
Hariman 02-28-06, 02:48 AM	I am now going to change the color of the background in my settings so I get the joke before someone says: HA HA!!! Fooled Ya!
rockondon 02-28-06, 07:37 PM	I think you should tell him that you're sorry for cheating and that you'll leave your jedi powers at home next time. Then sit next to him so if you roll a 20 he can see it without having to go wet his diaper.
Bryarr 03-03-06, 05:13 AM	Thanks for wasting my time, jerkface. Bry
Millennium 03-03-06, 08:15 AM	Actually, a regular d6 -the kind you mark by scooping small pits out of the surface of the die- is slightly biased toward the higher numbers. This is because of the way they're made: you scoop more material out of the higher-numbered sides, so they're a bit lighter. The heavier low-numbered sides will thus land face-down somewhat more often than not. This is why casino dice have the pits filled in with a material that has the same density and mass as the material that was scooped out: it negates that bias. Truth be told, even D&D doesn't involve enough dice-rolling to make this tiny bias have any significant effect, but it is there. If you've ever heard of a brand called Gamescience, they make D&D-style dice using similar concepts to remove that bias: they're kind of overkill, but if you're a real stickler then they're just what you need. This has been another Useless Fact (tm). Ahem. Now, back to your specific problem. If you're rolling your dice in the open and your dice are clearly marked, then it would be extremely difficult for you to cheat. Let the DM inspect your dice: loaded dice can be very hard to spot visually, but they're much easier to detect if you can actually hold them. The slight bias of traditional dice is meaningless if the DM uses traditional dice too. When I started playing, my DM had a d20 that once rolled a natural 20 four times in a row (different situations and players). He got frustrated by this, and said that he the next roll was a natural 20, he was going to throw the die out the window. It was, and he threw it, just as he said he would. But then he had to go out to the parking lot to get it, and when he did... you guessed it. When he found the die, it had come up 20 again. The point behind this is that dice are strange. I could roll any die six times, and record the results. The odds of that particular combination of rolls coming up were nearly zero, and yet they came up: something had to, after all. Sometimes, players just get lucky. My wife once rolled a character whose lowest stat was 14 using the straight-3d6 method.
darkness ninja of light 03-03-06, 08:22 AM	What kind of joke thread is this? Oh well. I saw the text from the beginning because I have a habit of highlighting text as I read it. Haha, make sure to notice the hidden text underneath Ulorian's post. Brilliant.
danielinthewolvesden 03-04-06, 12:04 PM	does no one else see the small hidden type below the end of the OP's post, stating: Btw Joke Topic if not, select all the text in the OP's box, and you will see it. Yes, and that's the kind of joke a troll would make. :P