how do you repair a sundered magic weapon [Archive] - Wizards Community

how do you repair a sundered magic weapon [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Calabozo
08-06-07, 03:55 AM The DM sunderen my spiked chain +1 spell storing how can the artificer of my group repair it?
and my amulet of natural armor +1

thanks
Callix
08-06-07, 08:22 AM There are no rules for repairing magic items. You can repair the chain, but it costs normal to get it re-enchanted. May I ask, was the sundering to a purpose? What was it that smashed your precious items?
zeratulcraft
08-06-07, 08:33 AM There are rules, theyre under the feats.

CRAFT MAGIC ARMS AND ARMOR [ITEM CREATION]
Prerequisite: Caster level 5th.
Benefit: You can create any magic weapon, armor, or shield whose prerequisites you meet. Enhancing a weapon, suit of armor, or shield takes one day for each 1,000 gp in the price of its magical features. To enhance a weapon, suit of armor, or shield, you must spend 1/25 of its features’ total price in XP and use up raw materials costing one-half of this total price.
The weapon, armor, or shield to be enhanced must be a masterwork item that you provide. Its cost is not included in the above cost.
You can also mend a broken magic weapon, suit of armor, or shield if it is one that you could make. Doing so costs half the XP, half the raw materials, and half the time it would take to craft that item in the first place.
SirTodd
08-06-07, 09:10 AM They are correct. It costs the same to reforge a sundered magic item as it does to buy or make a new one. Many GMs will however give you a discount on the gold costs (but not the XP) if you have the broken item with you to have reforged. Talk to your GM and maybe he will cut you a deal.
SillyRobot
08-06-07, 09:18 AM First, you get a cleric to cast Make Whole on the item which gives you a masterwork spiked chain to use.

Then you find a friendly magic arms/armor maker and pay him half the cost of a new +1 spiked chain and have him repair it. As zeratulcraft pointed out, the cost in materials and xp to repair an item is 1/2 that charged for creating the item from scratch.
Radijs
08-06-07, 10:19 AM Huh? isn't it 1/2 normal crafting cost to repair it? Looks like that if I read the feat correctly.
runestar
08-06-07, 10:29 AM They are correct. It costs the same to reforge a sundered magic item as it does to buy or make a new one.

No, it is half the price of crafting one, which works out to be 1/4 the market price in gp and 1/50 the market price in xp.:)
SirTodd
08-06-07, 10:56 AM My bad. Clearly I haven't researched this since 3.0...
danielinthewolvesden
08-06-07, 04:30 PM The DM sunderen my spiked chain +1 spell storing how can the artificer of my group repair it?
and my amulet of natural armor +1

thanks

You can also talk to your DM OOC and ask why he is being so sunder-happy. Do you have too much loot? I mean, I can see sundering a spiked shain, but a amulet takes some serious metagaming.
Calabozo
08-06-07, 07:06 PM You can also talk to your DM OOC and ask why he is being so sunder-happy. Do you have too much loot? I mean, I can see sundering a spiked shain, but a amulet takes some serious metagaming.

He said the strategy planted for the monster in the adventures called for the sunder attempts, we are playing red hand of doom (posible spoiler here) and fought a minotaur leader of some goblinoids in an abadoned forth
Calabozo
08-06-07, 07:08 PM I forgot and after he sundered my weapon an amulet i was at -4 hp stabilized and he teletranspored the enemy goblin mage and hits me in the floor and kills my character.
danielinthewolvesden
08-06-07, 08:05 PM He said the strategy planted for the monster in the adventures called for the sunder attempts, we are playing red hand of doom (posible spoiler here) and fought a minotaur leader of some goblinoids in an abadoned forth

But how does the minotaur know that little thing hanging from your neck is a magic amulet? And, it also could well have been under your clothes/armour.

I do not understand your 2nd reply.

Invite him here and have him explain, OK?
Calabozo
08-06-07, 08:22 PM [QUOTE=danielinthewolvesden;13328419]
I do not understand your 2nd reply.
QUOTE]

I ment to say that in that same combat my character was at -4 hit points and there was a goblin wizard that insted of attack one of the other charaters he teleports next to me and hits me while I was down and kills my character.
danielinthewolvesden
08-06-07, 08:56 PM Time to talk with your DM OOC.

Or invite him here, and we will get him to explain. Maybe it's you.:P
Lawlicron
08-06-07, 09:11 PM I ment to say that in that same combat my character was at -4 hit points and there was a goblin wizard that insted of attack one of the other charaters he teleports next to me and hits me while I was down and kills my character.

I think your items being sundered are the least of your problems.

P.S. Your DM has it out for your spiked chain build. He hates you because you are making the fighter not suck. I advise punching him.
runestar
08-06-07, 10:41 PM Define sunder happy. After all, there are quite a few foes in the MM whose tactics do involve sundering.

Plus, CW has a tactical feat which gives you a bonus attack on a successful sunder, meaning that there is no reason not to open combat with a sunder attempt, given the ease with which it can be made in the game.
Varia
08-06-07, 11:37 PM It wont help the weapons issue (apart from carrying a backup or two), but for amulets and rings, I suggest wearing the amulet inside your armor dangling down your back, and then doing the Mr T thing outside your armor- 25 assorted gold chains and medallions and amulets, all with magic auras on them. Same for your rings- get lots of rings, all with magic auras, then wear your real rings on your toes. Point and laugh when the sundering monsters' head explodes from all the target choices. All that bling can also serve as impromptu brass knuckles or easy-access monster bribes. :)
danielinthewolvesden
08-07-07, 02:58 AM Define sunder happy. After all, there are quite a few foes in the MM whose tactics do involve sundering.

Why would the Minotaur sunder some dingus around his foes neck? THAT is "sunder-happy". Sundering the weapon- that can make sense.
CaoSlayer
08-07-07, 03:09 AM I always carry the rings in the feet.
Calabozo
08-07-07, 02:32 PM I always carry the rings in the feet.

I dont know if thats possible I believe you have to wear them in your hands, not sure though :thinks:
DrMorganes
08-07-07, 04:03 PM The rules don't specify that rings must be worn on fingers. They merely say you can't wear more than 2 magic rings. Wearing certain rings on the toes is a viable (and clever!) tactic for protecting them. Others, like a Ring of the Ram or a Ring of Shooting Stars would have their utility seriously hampered if worn on the toes... :D
DrMorganes
08-07-07, 04:06 PM I, too, feel a chat with the DM is in order. Minotaurs aren't known for their intelligence, and unless he was under the effect of Arcane Sight (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/arcaneSight.htm) (Range = Personal!) there's little way for him to know - or even suspect - that your amulet was anything more than a keepsake given to you by for favorite aunt...

Sundering weapons and shields is fine. Wands and staves, sure. Rings and necklaces? ermmmmm... not so much.
nightwing
08-07-07, 04:43 PM I have to disagree with that last point.

It is probably well known by most individuals of most humanoid races that priests/clerics/shamans/medicine-men/etc all seem to focus their powers through holy symbols kept on their person. Thus, when fighting such a person, it makes common sense to smash such an item if it is present as a target.

If it is under the armor, slung around to the back, in a backpack or pouch, or otherwise not immediately available, then certainly it is not sunderable, but I hope the DM takes these factors into account when that "holy man" tries to cast or turn or use any other divinely gifted ability requiring its immediate use (probably a move-action to retrieve it if it is tucked under a shirt or in a pouch/pack). Then, unless the character states that he is using another move-action to tuck it back away after using it, it will be a target hanging around his neck for the rest of the combat.

PS. I would certainly rule that rings must be worn on fingers (and NOT toes) to be active. Neither can you wear a magical helmet on your elbow, tie a magical necklace around your leg, turn your chainmail shirt upside down and wear it like pants, tie your shield to your butt, or other such things. Perhaps it doesn't say explicitly so in the RAW, but I think the intention is obvious.
Holy_Beholder
08-07-07, 04:47 PM Well considering that magic rings, amulets, capes and stuff are pretty wide spread, with the whole item slot thing, that it doesn't take a genius to figure it out.

Also, the Mr. T comment was incredibly funny.
StevenO
08-07-07, 07:29 PM I've thought the RAW is you have to effectively start all over again with a newly remade item followed up with enchanting. I'll need to double check but getting a 50% discount on normal enchanting mentioned in post #3 could also be correct and would make more sense.

When I run Sunder I treat its successful use as disabling but not completely destroying an item. Effectively, I see Sunder as something similiar to a disarm attempt made with strength instead of finesse. After an item has been rendererd useless another sunder will destroy it as normal but otherwise the item could be repaired at its normal masterwork cost.
Varia
08-08-07, 09:46 AM That quote about 50% cost to re-enchant a destroyed magic item IS from the RAW. Its listed in the PHB in each of the Craft Magic Arms And Armor, Craft Wondrous Item and Forge Ring feats, pages 92-94. The expendable item crafting feats do NOT include that text, therefore sundered wands, rods, staffs and potions cannot be re-enchanted at reduced costs. The re-enchantment rule doesnt include the cost of repairing the physical structure of the item prior to re-enchantment, which is the same as the cost of repairing a non-magical item of that type (DMG p214, right column, under the "Repairing Magic Items" heading. I trust that FINALLY ends that aspect of this discussion?

Magic rings- The DMG does say "worn on the fingers" but in truth rings are designed to be worn on digits in general, rather than fingers specifically. Some people wear rings on their thumbs, and some (admittedly few) people do indeed wear them on their toes. A quick google will dispel any doubts you may have on that score. Wearing them on fingers is merely the most common. Toe rings are the least common since rings are jewellery and meant for display, and are not often visible when out and about in comparison to fingers. But adventurers dont generally wear jewellery for display while working anyway- they wear gloves or gauntlets or boots which conceal such things rendering such considerations irrelevant. Both hands and feet can also wear magical garments (gloves/gauntlets and boots/sandals/slippers/shoes) so thats not a limiting factor. The "helmet on your elbow" thing misses the point that rings can be worn on any digit thus toes qualify, whereas helmets can only be worn on the head, so the elbow does NOT qualify. It is a blatantly flawed analogy. There is no real reason why a ring could not be worn on a toe instead, unless the specific ring does not adjust to the size of the wearer. It would be a house rule to allow it, but I see no real reason to not make such a house rule.

As to the ring of the ram or ring of shooting stars, what, precisely, is wrong with firing your boot 60 feet across the room or setting it on fire? :P Actually though, those are effects which do not emanate from the ring itself, they manifest away from the ring itself, so it shouldnt be a problem. There may be certain rings where that is not true, in which case you would be restricted to wearing them on your hands unless you had appropriate footwear (sandals or bare feet).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Calabozo 08-06-07, 03:55 AM	The DM sunderen my spiked chain +1 spell storing how can the artificer of my group repair it? and my amulet of natural armor +1 thanks
Callix 08-06-07, 08:22 AM	There are no rules for repairing magic items. You can repair the chain, but it costs normal to get it re-enchanted. May I ask, was the sundering to a purpose? What was it that smashed your precious items?
zeratulcraft 08-06-07, 08:33 AM	There are rules, theyre under the feats. CRAFT MAGIC ARMS AND ARMOR [ITEM CREATION] Prerequisite: Caster level 5th. Benefit: You can create any magic weapon, armor, or shield whose prerequisites you meet. Enhancing a weapon, suit of armor, or shield takes one day for each 1,000 gp in the price of its magical features. To enhance a weapon, suit of armor, or shield, you must spend 1/25 of its features’ total price in XP and use up raw materials costing one-half of this total price. The weapon, armor, or shield to be enhanced must be a masterwork item that you provide. Its cost is not included in the above cost. You can also mend a broken magic weapon, suit of armor, or shield if it is one that you could make. Doing so costs half the XP, half the raw materials, and half the time it would take to craft that item in the first place.
SirTodd 08-06-07, 09:10 AM	They are correct. It costs the same to reforge a sundered magic item as it does to buy or make a new one. Many GMs will however give you a discount on the gold costs (but not the XP) if you have the broken item with you to have reforged. Talk to your GM and maybe he will cut you a deal.
SillyRobot 08-06-07, 09:18 AM	First, you get a cleric to cast Make Whole on the item which gives you a masterwork spiked chain to use. Then you find a friendly magic arms/armor maker and pay him half the cost of a new +1 spiked chain and have him repair it. As zeratulcraft pointed out, the cost in materials and xp to repair an item is 1/2 that charged for creating the item from scratch.
Radijs 08-06-07, 10:19 AM	Huh? isn't it 1/2 normal crafting cost to repair it? Looks like that if I read the feat correctly.
runestar 08-06-07, 10:29 AM	They are correct. It costs the same to reforge a sundered magic item as it does to buy or make a new one. No, it is half the price of crafting one, which works out to be 1/4 the market price in gp and 1/50 the market price in xp.:)
SirTodd 08-06-07, 10:56 AM	My bad. Clearly I haven't researched this since 3.0...
danielinthewolvesden 08-06-07, 04:30 PM	The DM sunderen my spiked chain +1 spell storing how can the artificer of my group repair it? and my amulet of natural armor +1 thanks You can also talk to your DM OOC and ask why he is being so sunder-happy. Do you have too much loot? I mean, I can see sundering a spiked shain, but a amulet takes some serious metagaming.
Calabozo 08-06-07, 07:06 PM	You can also talk to your DM OOC and ask why he is being so sunder-happy. Do you have too much loot? I mean, I can see sundering a spiked shain, but a amulet takes some serious metagaming. He said the strategy planted for the monster in the adventures called for the sunder attempts, we are playing red hand of doom (posible spoiler here) and fought a minotaur leader of some goblinoids in an abadoned forth
Calabozo 08-06-07, 07:08 PM	I forgot and after he sundered my weapon an amulet i was at -4 hp stabilized and he teletranspored the enemy goblin mage and hits me in the floor and kills my character.
danielinthewolvesden 08-06-07, 08:05 PM	He said the strategy planted for the monster in the adventures called for the sunder attempts, we are playing red hand of doom (posible spoiler here) and fought a minotaur leader of some goblinoids in an abadoned forth But how does the minotaur know that little thing hanging from your neck is a magic amulet? And, it also could well have been under your clothes/armour. I do not understand your 2nd reply. Invite him here and have him explain, OK?
Calabozo 08-06-07, 08:22 PM	[QUOTE=danielinthewolvesden;13328419] I do not understand your 2nd reply. QUOTE] I ment to say that in that same combat my character was at -4 hit points and there was a goblin wizard that insted of attack one of the other charaters he teleports next to me and hits me while I was down and kills my character.
danielinthewolvesden 08-06-07, 08:56 PM	Time to talk with your DM OOC. Or invite him here, and we will get him to explain. Maybe it's you.:P
Lawlicron 08-06-07, 09:11 PM	I ment to say that in that same combat my character was at -4 hit points and there was a goblin wizard that insted of attack one of the other charaters he teleports next to me and hits me while I was down and kills my character. I think your items being sundered are the least of your problems. P.S. Your DM has it out for your spiked chain build. He hates you because you are making the fighter not suck. I advise punching him.
runestar 08-06-07, 10:41 PM	Define sunder happy. After all, there are quite a few foes in the MM whose tactics do involve sundering. Plus, CW has a tactical feat which gives you a bonus attack on a successful sunder, meaning that there is no reason not to open combat with a sunder attempt, given the ease with which it can be made in the game.
Varia 08-06-07, 11:37 PM	It wont help the weapons issue (apart from carrying a backup or two), but for amulets and rings, I suggest wearing the amulet inside your armor dangling down your back, and then doing the Mr T thing outside your armor- 25 assorted gold chains and medallions and amulets, all with magic auras on them. Same for your rings- get lots of rings, all with magic auras, then wear your real rings on your toes. Point and laugh when the sundering monsters' head explodes from all the target choices. All that bling can also serve as impromptu brass knuckles or easy-access monster bribes. :)
danielinthewolvesden 08-07-07, 02:58 AM	Define sunder happy. After all, there are quite a few foes in the MM whose tactics do involve sundering. Why would the Minotaur sunder some dingus around his foes neck? THAT is "sunder-happy". Sundering the weapon- that can make sense.
CaoSlayer 08-07-07, 03:09 AM	I always carry the rings in the feet.
Calabozo 08-07-07, 02:32 PM	I always carry the rings in the feet. I dont know if thats possible I believe you have to wear them in your hands, not sure though :thinks:
DrMorganes 08-07-07, 04:03 PM	The rules don't specify that rings must be worn on fingers. They merely say you can't wear more than 2 magic rings. Wearing certain rings on the toes is a viable (and clever!) tactic for protecting them. Others, like a Ring of the Ram or a Ring of Shooting Stars would have their utility seriously hampered if worn on the toes... :D
DrMorganes 08-07-07, 04:06 PM	I, too, feel a chat with the DM is in order. Minotaurs aren't known for their intelligence, and unless he was under the effect of Arcane Sight (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/arcaneSight.htm) (Range = Personal!) there's little way for him to know - or even suspect - that your amulet was anything more than a keepsake given to you by for favorite aunt... Sundering weapons and shields is fine. Wands and staves, sure. Rings and necklaces? ermmmmm... not so much.
nightwing 08-07-07, 04:43 PM	I have to disagree with that last point. It is probably well known by most individuals of most humanoid races that priests/clerics/shamans/medicine-men/etc all seem to focus their powers through holy symbols kept on their person. Thus, when fighting such a person, it makes common sense to smash such an item if it is present as a target. If it is under the armor, slung around to the back, in a backpack or pouch, or otherwise not immediately available, then certainly it is not sunderable, but I hope the DM takes these factors into account when that "holy man" tries to cast or turn or use any other divinely gifted ability requiring its immediate use (probably a move-action to retrieve it if it is tucked under a shirt or in a pouch/pack). Then, unless the character states that he is using another move-action to tuck it back away after using it, it will be a target hanging around his neck for the rest of the combat. PS. I would certainly rule that rings must be worn on fingers (and NOT toes) to be active. Neither can you wear a magical helmet on your elbow, tie a magical necklace around your leg, turn your chainmail shirt upside down and wear it like pants, tie your shield to your butt, or other such things. Perhaps it doesn't say explicitly so in the RAW, but I think the intention is obvious.
Holy_Beholder 08-07-07, 04:47 PM	Well considering that magic rings, amulets, capes and stuff are pretty wide spread, with the whole item slot thing, that it doesn't take a genius to figure it out. Also, the Mr. T comment was incredibly funny.
StevenO 08-07-07, 07:29 PM	I've thought the RAW is you have to effectively start all over again with a newly remade item followed up with enchanting. I'll need to double check but getting a 50% discount on normal enchanting mentioned in post #3 could also be correct and would make more sense. When I run Sunder I treat its successful use as disabling but not completely destroying an item. Effectively, I see Sunder as something similiar to a disarm attempt made with strength instead of finesse. After an item has been rendererd useless another sunder will destroy it as normal but otherwise the item could be repaired at its normal masterwork cost.
Varia 08-08-07, 09:46 AM	That quote about 50% cost to re-enchant a destroyed magic item IS from the RAW. Its listed in the PHB in each of the Craft Magic Arms And Armor, Craft Wondrous Item and Forge Ring feats, pages 92-94. The expendable item crafting feats do NOT include that text, therefore sundered wands, rods, staffs and potions cannot be re-enchanted at reduced costs. The re-enchantment rule doesnt include the cost of repairing the physical structure of the item prior to re-enchantment, which is the same as the cost of repairing a non-magical item of that type (DMG p214, right column, under the "Repairing Magic Items" heading. I trust that FINALLY ends that aspect of this discussion? Magic rings- The DMG does say "worn on the fingers" but in truth rings are designed to be worn on digits in general, rather than fingers specifically. Some people wear rings on their thumbs, and some (admittedly few) people do indeed wear them on their toes. A quick google will dispel any doubts you may have on that score. Wearing them on fingers is merely the most common. Toe rings are the least common since rings are jewellery and meant for display, and are not often visible when out and about in comparison to fingers. But adventurers dont generally wear jewellery for display while working anyway- they wear gloves or gauntlets or boots which conceal such things rendering such considerations irrelevant. Both hands and feet can also wear magical garments (gloves/gauntlets and boots/sandals/slippers/shoes) so thats not a limiting factor. The "helmet on your elbow" thing misses the point that rings can be worn on any digit thus toes qualify, whereas helmets can only be worn on the head, so the elbow does NOT qualify. It is a blatantly flawed analogy. There is no real reason why a ring could not be worn on a toe instead, unless the specific ring does not adjust to the size of the wearer. It would be a house rule to allow it, but I see no real reason to not make such a house rule. As to the ring of the ram or ring of shooting stars, what, precisely, is wrong with firing your boot 60 feet across the room or setting it on fire? :P Actually though, those are effects which do not emanate from the ring itself, they manifest away from the ring itself, so it shouldnt be a problem. There may be certain rings where that is not true, in which case you would be restricted to wearing them on your hands unless you had appropriate footwear (sandals or bare feet).