Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Metabubbles 06-22-05, 11:34 AM	So can we sell it? I am sure this is about the most rare thing ever, so components, weapons, armor etc should be aplenty to build using him. We have a huge Dire Lion (str40+ or something, our Druid/fighter gestalt, amazing...!!!) that could actually transport (drag) the Dragon to a nearby CITY. I also just think it would be awesome for the city to see the party actually bringing the corpse to town. Our reputation's should sky rocket. Our DM posted something about the Value of the dragon and 'what should it be' somewhere, but with the search down, I was unable to find out what info he got. Anyways, How should we deal with such a creature's corpse (me being a cleric will make sure he doesn't rot) and what do you think it is worth?
Bonzai 06-22-05, 11:56 AM	I just got Dracominicon yesterday, and was looking at the Dragon Zombie template. My question on it was if it retained it's flight ability. The dragon skeleton said specifically that it didn't, but the zombie didn't say it one way or another. If it retains it's flight ability, makeing it into a zombie, awakening it, and using it as mount would be another nifty option.
Derren S. 06-22-05, 12:20 PM	So can we sell it? I am sure this is about the most rare thing ever, so components, weapons, armor etc should be aplenty to build using him. We have a huge Dire Lion (str40+ or something, our Druid/fighter gestalt, amazing...!!!) that could actually transport (drag) the Dragon to a nearby CITY. I also just think it would be awesome for the city to see the party actually bringing the corpse to town. Our reputation's should sky rocket. Our DM posted something about the Value of the dragon and 'what should it be' somewhere, but with the search down, I was unable to find out what info he got. Anyways, How should we deal with such a creature's corpse (me being a cleric will make sure he doesn't rot) and what do you think it is worth? Ask yourself, who would buy this corpse? Wizards? There are no spells which require dragon body parts as components. Smiths? Maybe for hide to make armor at 1/4 of the the value of the armor. Nobles? Unlikely. The skelleton is too big to make it into decoration Pesants? Sure. The meat will be enough to feed the whole village. Lets see, a huge dragon is about 4 times as big as a cow, so you get 40 gp. The only one who will give you something for it are Dragoncrafter (The whole corpse will probably sell for about 5000 gp) and Necromancer. Everyone else has simply no use for this corpse. And the threat of retailiation from other dragons when owning it will keep most collectors from buying it. Remember, just because something is rare it doesn't mean that it will fetch top prices or will be sellable at all. And that s the same thing I said to your DM. Is that the topic you mean? http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=445514
cambric 06-22-05, 01:02 PM	Lets see, a huge dragon is about 4 times as big as a cow, so you get 40 gp. :confused: Huge dragon just 4 times the size of a cow?? :uh-huh: I might be mistaken...but HUGE is, well...hmmm, more than 4 times the size of a cow...unless we're talking MAMMOTH cows. :D Now, the rest of what was said, it could depend on who would want it and I agree totally. Cam
Metabubbles 06-22-05, 01:05 PM	Who wouldn't want a dragon teeth necklace, walking stick etc... The thing was evil. Sure it would suck if such a person were to come upon another dragon, but that could be said with or without the jewelry of their kind. I thought there was a spot, for example, that that explained the bones could be used for bows, and would be worth X amount of GP. I guess not. So lets also assume it is worth, 40gp for food, and then 5000gp for the whole corpse(LOL, that is obviously a joke, you could pay upward of 1000gp for stuffed eagle aka 'art'), that seems hardly worth the trouble of transporting it. If we paid a mage to teleport to the far away lands to get the best deal, just getting it to somebody to buy would be a complete waste of time. So assuming all this, would you recommend to just leave it? If so, I think I will make sure we take the head, it will look great in our keep (although we have yet to establish a keep.....::sigh::.....), and great proof of our 'power', we are after all "professional Dragon Slayers".....LOL. Thanks for the input... *Sorry forgot the whole zombie thing* Wouldn't that be 'an evil act'? Just wondering? Besides I don't think I would want a nercomancer getting a hold of such a prize Although we would get XP again for defeating a Zombie Dragon...hmmm......I really don't want to die.......again........
Derren S. 06-22-05, 01:09 PM	A cow is large and I assumed a mass increase of x4 for each size category. But after reading Enlarge Person, it might be 8 (But I swaer somewhere I have read x4). Ok, so the dragon is worth 80 gp. Or rather 80 gp at maximum as living cows are much more usefull than dead dragons. Who wouldn't want a dragon teeth necklace, walking stick etc... Ask yourself, who would want one? Except some adventurers no one would recognice that the necklace is made out of dragon bone. For everyone else its simple bone and who wears bone jewelry? Orks maybe but no one else and orks don't pay well. Bows etc are already mentioned in the dragoncrafters prices. Those bows are simply not good enough to sell them at a high price. better than normal ones but no way as good as magical bows. Don't forget that you are selling raw material which isn't worth much.
cambric 06-22-05, 01:13 PM	A cow is large and I assumed a mass increase of x4 for each size category. But after reading Enlarge Person, it might be 8 (But I swaer somewhere I have read x4). Ok, so the dragon is worth 80 gp. Or rather 80 gp at maximum as living cows are much more usefull than dead dragons. You know, you're probably right...I just LOL when I read it because I look at cows at being "medium"...but if they're large, then 4x would be close. Either or, it's not that big of deal...it just seemed funny when you think about fighting one HUGE creature or 4 cows...or I'm really tired and need a nap. Cam
evilviper77 06-22-05, 01:16 PM	If any of you have craft magic arms/armor, you could skin the dragon and make some armor with ac bonus equal to the dragons nat armor bonus, which should be very high.
Derren S. 06-22-05, 01:20 PM	The size of cows isn't stated but imo they are about as big as a bison which is large. Also in your opinion, are cows more like horses (large) or like big dogs(medium)? If any of you have craft magic arms/armor, you could skin the dragon and make some armor with ac bonus equal to the dragons nat armor bonus, which should be very high. Way outdated information! In 3.5 (or even 3.0) Dragonhide armor is simply masterwork armor which is a little bit resistent to the breath weapon energy type of the dragon (the armor, not the wearer). Except that they have no special qualities except a dragoncrafter makes the armor (Thats why he pays so much for the hide) A huge dragon has enough hide for a large hide armor or medium banded mail or small half plate or tiny full plate. In addition you can also get a single shield (all types except tower) up to huge size. All of this armor would be masterwork but otherwise have no special quality.
pertoleum 06-22-05, 01:40 PM	make capes and **** out of the hide- it could be your party's symbol
Ragey 06-22-05, 03:10 PM	*Hums and speaks* Armor of Dragonshape Dragonhide Mantle Blood Exilirs Dragonfang Weapon Dragoncraft Armor or Shield Rod of Dragon Mastery Staff of Draconic Power Boots of Dragonstriding Crimson Dragonhide Bracers ... (Which is perfect cause you killed a Red Dragon) The list goes on guy. Just ... If your going to make anything out of it, remember this: Whatever armor you make will gain +5 Resistance to Fire cause its Red Dragon Scales Since it was a huge dragon, there isn't a lot of scales to go around. Pretty much if your going to make a armor out of it, it'll either for: Two Half-Plates for Small Characters or 1 Medium Banded Mail. + Shield.
Derren S. 06-22-05, 03:16 PM	*Hums and speaks* The list goes on guy. And except for the dragoncrafted items the high price of the other items come for the enchantment and not from the dragon parts which only make up a very small part of the item. So the price doesn't increase because there are 4 items more or less which can be made out of the corpse.
Quoriil 06-22-05, 03:20 PM	Depending on the cruelty of your DM you may want to reconsider dragging it back to town intact. While the poor shmuck who is hiking around with a dragonhide cap might regret his decision when he comes upon another dragon out in the wild (Read as: torture, heal, torture and eat alive. Instead of: simply kill and eat.), you would most definitely regret broadcasting your dragon-hunter status by dragging its carcass through the wilds. At least you'd regret it in most of the games I've played.
Dark151 06-22-05, 03:27 PM	You should look at Dragon Magazine #332. It has Cutting up the Dragon by Andrew Coleman "The dragon is dead, but what do you do with the carcass? Learn about the juiciest bits and what you can make out of them."
Derren S. 06-22-05, 03:33 PM	You should look at Dragon Magazine #332. Does the article feature actual uses for dragon parts or is it just a "Dragon parts are valuable because it is a dragon" article?
Fiery_Overlord 06-22-05, 03:36 PM	Open an inn and sell "dragon cuisine", this may not be very profitable but at least it is very anime. Failing that have the local butchers smoke, salt or make dragon jerky, you'll not want for iron rations for quite a while. Mmmmmm.... Good. :-P P.S. I, personally in real life, if some weird fluke that made it possible, would eat a dragon cuisine. (though I acknowledge that it is not possible in real life)
Dark151 06-22-05, 03:37 PM	It has actual uses for dragon parts. Ex: You can have a boat with a dragons head on it and actually have it breathe the breath of that dragon. (you'll need to prereq of course)
Derren S. 06-22-05, 03:41 PM	P.S. I, personally in real life, if some weird fluke that made it possible, would eat a dragon cuisine. (though I acknowledge that it is not possible in real life) Together with the moral implications of eating a sentient beeing.
yonman 06-22-05, 03:43 PM	Well, technically by the RAW the only thing off of a dragon is the Hide. But I like to add some flavor if the PCs can get some fresh samples like blood and organs and teeth to be worth money to the right wizard. Perhaps as material components to make magic items? Decorations would be good, but for any organic material I always say that they will deteriorate unless properly preserved by magic or alchemical reagents.
Derren S. 06-22-05, 03:47 PM	Again, except for really big parts (too big in the case of a huge dragon) dragon decoration are useless as nobody would recognize them and magical components are already adressed. They are not worth that much as they are only small parts of items or only usable for weak items.
Fiery_Overlord 06-22-05, 03:54 PM	I am not a cannibal. However, would I eat a dragon? Yes. I also, if offered, would eat Dolphin. Some people consider them intelligent. Also if A.I. became sentient I would not think it would have a right to be free. Sentience does not qualify you for human rights, in my book. To purpose that it does is to flirt with eventual extinction of the human race in my opinion. By D&D definitions would that make me evil? Yes, but that does not bother me for two reasons, first survival of the species, to include my decendants, is more important to me that abstract ideas, second D&D is just a game.
Demonfey 06-22-05, 04:08 PM	Who wouldn't want a dragon teeth necklace, walking stick etc... The thing was evil. Sure it would suck if such a person were to come upon another dragon, but that could be said with or without the jewelry of their kind. I thought there was a spot, for example, that that explained the bones could be used for bows, and would be worth X amount of GP. I guess not. So lets also assume it is worth, 40gp for food, and then 5000gp for the whole corpse(LOL, that is obviously a joke, you could pay upward of 1000gp for stuffed eagle aka 'art'), that seems hardly worth the trouble of transporting it. If we paid a mage to teleport to the far away lands to get the best deal, just getting it to somebody to buy would be a complete waste of time. So assuming all this, would you recommend to just leave it? If so, I think I will make sure we take the head, it will look great in our keep (although we have yet to establish a keep.....::sigh::.....), and great proof of our 'power', we are after all "professional Dragon Slayers".....LOL. Thanks for the input... *Sorry forgot the whole zombie thing* Wouldn't that be 'an evil act'? Just wondering? Besides I don't think I would want a nercomancer getting a hold of such a prize Although we would get XP again for defeating a Zombie Dragon...hmmm......I really don't want to die.......again........ Let's see: 1 corpse of huge stature can produce MULTIPLE suits of certain armors at medium size, each claw and tooth can be made into at least a two handed weapon for a medium character if you mean huge as in the size increment for D&D and not huge as in "too large to accurately determine IG" huge. Each bone can be made into a bow if they are intact. Specific magical items need dragon skin to be made, such as crimson dragonhide bracers, which have a selling price of 5000 for just the weakest enchantment (+1), in order of enchantment: 1=5000 gp, 2=11,000 gp, 3=21,000 gp, 4=35,000 gp, and 5=53,000 gp. Then, there are the golem builders, who could always use fresh parts. Nonmagical equipment from the corpse fetch +100 gp for bows, +300 gp for dragonfang weapons, 3800 gp for a dragonhide mantle, 3000 gp light armor, 6000 gp medium armor, and 11,000 gp heavy armor. That corpse is a GOLDMINE.
Derren S. 06-22-05, 04:16 PM	Not every bone can be made into a bow only specific ones. Also the price of magical items are for the enchantment, not for the material needed to craft it. A +1 bracer needs exactly the same dragon parts as the +5 bracers. The cost of the dragon parts don't change, only the price for the enchantment. Also you are forgetting that the Pcs are selling, so they only get half of the listed price. And unless they craft those things they are selling raw materials which are only 1/3 of the final price. So the PCs get only 1/6 of the market value for selling the raw material for those items.
cambric 06-22-05, 05:45 PM	The size of cows isn't stated but imo they are about as big as a bison which is large. Also in your opinion, are cows more like horses (large) or like big dogs(medium)? Good question...I would say much larger than a dog...smaller than a horse. My best friend had over 1000 cows that they used to produce milk and such...but the steers, they were large. I think he said 1000-1500 pounds each, but the cows seemed so much smaller than them. Now that I'm home, I'm looking at the pictures in the PHB comparing sizes: I guess I would say the cows would be mediumish...Huge is the giant...so, I guess I'll back track on my previous statement about 4 cows...for some reason, it just didn't seem "right", but looking at the comparisons, I would say 4-5 cows would be about right. :embarrass Cam
yonman 06-22-05, 06:06 PM	Let's see: 1 corpse of huge stature can produce MULTIPLE suits of certain armors at medium size, If you follow the rules for creating dragon armors from hide. Read this Quote from the SRD: Armorsmiths can work with the hides of dragons to produce armor or shields of masterwork quality. One dragon produces enough hide for a single suit of masterwork hide armor for a creature one size category smaller than the dragon. By selecting only choice scales and bits of hide, an armorsmith can produce one suit of masterwork banded mail for a creature two sizes smaller, one suit of masterwork half-plate for a creature three sizes smaller, or one masterwork breastplate or suit of full plate for a creature four sizes smaller. In each case, enough hide is available to produce a small or large masterwork shield in addition to the armor, provided that the dragon is Large or larger. Note that a Huge Dragon can only produce one masterwork banded mail dragonhide armor + one shield. Also, everyone here assumes that you can eat Dragon meat, in many folklore dragon meat and parts are highly poisonous.
Loren Pechtel 06-23-05, 12:23 AM	Everyone seems to feel the dragon is too big to be a decoration. I disagree. Consider the noble who wants to proclaim his power. Take that dragon skeleton and set it up as the main gate to his estate--you walk through the dragon's chest as you enter. Of course this risks the wrath of any dragon who sees it. You better really have the power you are proclaiming.
Radijs 06-23-05, 04:19 AM	I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned this before. and thats mainly because I know there are some very twisted minds on this forum (I mean it in a good way). But wouldn't powdered dragon bone be an exellent aprodisiac? You've all seen how those creatures mate in the wild. We've got sorcerors, half dragons. Heck dragons do it with everyone.
Lord Schpungus 06-23-05, 11:13 AM	Man, Derren, you really are a downer. I think Derren's actually the DM and doesn't want to reward his players for creative thinking. I have to go with Zombification. Who cares if it's evil, the dragon was evil, right? A fitting end for one of the world's most vile creatures. If your DM gives you 40gp for the meat I would be quite perturbed by his heavy-handed nullification of thinking on the part of the PCs. Dragoncraft items are probably your best bet, otherwise make the armor and then pickle the meat and throw it at your enemies, bit by bit.
Derren S. 06-23-05, 12:01 PM	I am not the DM. Read the thread, then you know it. I just want to propagate logic in D&D. No one needs it -> no one buys it. Its that simple. Creative thinking has nothing to do with that. Only because a idea is creative the idea doesn't need to be good and worthwhile. I have seen many DMs who let their players succeed with complete idiotic things because they were "creative". The luxury value of a rotting corpse is rather slim. The corpse has some value as status symbol, but that won't make you rich as only a small part of it can fit this role. Here a listing who will be interested in the corpse and who not: Pesants: Generally uninterested. Might buy the meat depending on how their relation to dragons are, but won't give you much for it as food is rather cheap in D&D Adventurers: That you have the corpse shows that you are strong warriors, but they are not interested to buy it. Some might buy small things to frm the corpse to get something of that fame for himslef, but that will only be small purchases. Nobles: The only thing they would need the corpse for is a status symbol. The head would make the best piece of it as it is relativly small and recognizeable as dragon. The other things wouldn't make good wall decorations and the whole skelleton would be too big to make use of it. Wizards: They can get some material they need for base items which they can enchant later from the corpse, but as the base items are not very expensive compared to the enchantment they woun't give you much for it. And they also have the risk that no one will be interested in those items. Dragoncrafter: For them the corpse is the raw material for their work. But as a smith buys iron and make weapons out of it, so do they buy raw material with no use for everyone else and turns it into high quality items, so much of the value of dragoncrafted items comes from their work (and their risk in doing this trade). The best price they will offer you is 1/3 of the final value of the items. Less if they have to harves the dragon themself Necromancer: Probably the one with the most interest in the corpse besides dragoncrafter. They will offer you a rather large sum for it, but only if the corpse is complete and realitivly intact. Also dealing with them is not always the safest bussines and might be a moral dillema Trader: Most trader will not be interested in the corpse. Those trader who are know one or more of the above sources to whom they cansell the corpse. The Pcs won't have to worry anymore to find buyers but the trader will of want to make profit themself, so the PCs will recive only 50% of what the other sources would pay.
Drachasor 06-23-05, 12:12 PM	Well, as far as Dragons and Cows go, I think a Cow is on the short-end of the Large Catagory, and Dragons can often be on the big end of Huge (depending on age catagory). Anyhow, the Draconomicon says a Huge Dragon is 55ft. long, with a body that is 16 feet long, a neck that is 15 ft. long, and a tail that is 24 feet long. The body is also 8 feet wide with a wingspan of 30-60 feet, and stands 12 feet tall. It also weighs 20,000 lbs. This varies from Dragon to Dragon as much as 25% (it also says), but if this is a Red it is probably pretty accurat.e Anyhow, use the parts for Simulacrums. They make great mounts, and are pretty potent combatants if push comes to shove. How old was this Dragon, btw? Young Adult? -Drachasor
Ragey 06-23-05, 12:28 PM	I know! Take its head, find a good align dragon, show it to the dragon, and become a Dragonkith! Hotcha-cha... *just scurries off sadly.*
Sapper2219 06-23-05, 12:44 PM	When my party killed a Green Dragon, I skinned it, be headed it, brought it into town and had seat cusions made out of the hide and placed the head over the mantle of the bar I own... then promtly renamed the in the Green Dragon Inn.... now our warlock on the otherhand wanted to animate it.....Just such a waste of fine and memorable material!