Is my group doomed? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Is my group doomed? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Moparfiend
10-02-06, 04:38 PM I'm new to these boards, but not dnd I've been playing since 2nd edition with the same group. We are all 23-30 years old, have jobs one has a wife and kids, one has a kid ,I have a dog,etc so responsibilites some times mess up game day, its to be expected.
We have C-usually DMs but PCs as well
S-plays pretty consistantly
Je-plays cause his older brother S does, but enjoys it now
Me- PC and DM
J-PCS and DMs but acts crazy and throws fits over players actually controling thier guys
L- my girl and new to Dnd

So I meet L. She never played before but loves it. J states he will not play with her because "she never played 2nd or 3.0 so she will never be able to play 3.5 correctly, besides this Is MY group:rolleyes: " but hes not DMing C is. Another week or so passes and J drinks a few too many beers one night and punches S in the face over an imagined insult. S leaves they don't speak anymore. So now C, wisely in IMO, asks J not to play anymore, J gets ****** and won't call any of us back for a month or so. We continue playinf w/o him but hes missed. J calls up me and c last week, wants to play a 2 man side campaign with us 2, we agree C makes a Sorceror, I make a wu-jen, we play once and J decides C and I need to take thursday off of work to play because he has it off, I decline so does C as $ makes the world go round and all. He throws his PHB,DMG etc at me tells me to keep it and hes never playing again cause we aren't commited to DnD, and besides its a "little kids game anyway". Anybody else evr have to deal with this kind of crazy behavior inside your groups? Whats your take on this stuff?
malignor
10-02-06, 05:06 PM Eat less alphabet soup.

...

...

But seriously.
The best thing I can do is to relate a similar tale.
Group At start: Myself, "Boris", "Hork", "Jeez", "Scarecrow", "Polo"

- Chapter 1: We are all gaming happily. There are 2 primary DMs... myself and Boris. Primary place of gaming is the apartment shared by Scarecrow and Polo.
- Chapter 2: Boris convinces us to let his co-worker, "Tiny", join the group. We all kind of unload on Scarecrow, because he is a tenacious arguer, to the point where some can't stand gaming with him (though outside game, he's hilarious to hang with). Boris claims to speak for the entire group when he tells Scarecrow that nobody likes gaming with him and he's not welcome... in his own home!
- Chapter 3: We start playing at Tiny's place, since he wants to be there for his wife and newborn child (reasonable). Unfortunately, it's also a safe haven for alot of pot smoking on behalf of Boris and Tiny, so they're half-there at best. I got nothing against it, since I used to a few years back, but this was excessive, and was dragging the game down.
- Chapter 4: Tiny is DMing now (he's an old veteran). Now that Scarecrow is gone, Boris and Tiny pick on Hork with regular criticism and insults. Hork misses a couple games to write university finals and they decide to kill his character and turn the group against him, on a personal level. Backstabbers.
- Chapter 5: Polo let them know 4 weeks in advance that he can't make it. Jeez also calls in advance for the same. Since half the group isn't there, and it's Jeez's sister's birthday, I also come, figuring the game is cancelled. Boris phones with violent threats and unreasonable rage. I simply say I quit. Jeez and Polo also quit.
- Chapter 6: Scarecrow, Hork, Jeez and myself (along with another new guy) form our own gaming group. We've been happily gaming for the last 2 years. No word from Boris or Tiny (I sent a really insulting email to Boris to make sure of that). May they smoke their lives away.

I guess the moral to the story is, if you have problems with some goofball "friend" who's being unreasonable, ditch em. As long as you have a few good friends you can rely on, you don't need some psychotic loose cannon ruining the fun. It's just not enjoyable when you have to walk on eggshells for the sake of someone who needs to grow up and learn self-control. People like that should lose friends. There should be life-affecting consequences for displaying life affecting bad behaviour. Maybe they'll learn something that way. If not, let em rot alone until they do. Otherwise, you're just rewarding them for being an a**h**e. Pavlov wins... flawless victory.
Reversefigure4
10-02-06, 05:25 PM Not only do you need a new group, you need new friends.
Aeromus
10-02-06, 05:51 PM Wow, seems things should be ok without J in the group.
Totentanz
10-02-06, 06:02 PM Your group isn't doomed at all. You just have a friend (maybe not even that now) who has some emotional problems. You still have a group, you have a new player, and you have by my count 2 DM's. Play on, and leave him to worry about his issues.
PhaedrusXY
10-02-06, 07:39 PM Not only do you need a new group, you need new friends.:rofl: Mean, but very funny. I'd give it a 5 out of 6.

Is J short for Jackass? It should be, from the sounds of it. I say good riddance to him. As Totentanz says, you still have a group.
MerrikCale
10-02-06, 08:59 PM I lost track somewhere around "I'm new to these boards"
akiio
10-02-06, 09:05 PM good god man, use some names, not letters! if you're trying to protect identities, then use fake names.
Moon-Lancer
10-02-06, 09:34 PM i say, just dont play with jackass, and you should be fine. Sounds Like a bitter guy who cant get over 2e, it happens but those are the real people who cant play 3.5.
MyNameForevermore
10-02-06, 10:45 PM If things are really a problem, just sit down with the group and discuss it. Tell people that you feel like you really want to play with everyone, but that everyone is also going to have to make their own sacrifices to make the game more enjoyable for everyone else. It doesn't necessarily need to be settled by kicking someone out, most of the time just talking it out should help.
MoogleEmpMog
10-02-06, 11:01 PM Everyone but J in the initial example seems perfectly fine. The group is doomed if they adhere to the Geek Social Fallacies (http://sean.chittenden.org/humor/www.plausiblydeniable.com/opinion/gsf.html) and try to keep J involved in their games; otherwise, they should be fine.
Templetroll
10-03-06, 11:18 AM I concur with the idea: get rid of J and your gaming will improve with everyone else. Let us know how it goes.
FeceMan
10-03-06, 02:42 PM I'm new to these boards, but not dnd I've been playing since 2nd edition with the same group. We are all 23-30 years old, have jobs one has a wife and kids, one has a kid ,I have a dog,etc so responsibilites some times mess up game day, its to be expected.
We have C-usually DMs but PCs as well
S-plays pretty consistantly
Je-plays cause his older brother S does, but enjoys it now
Me- PC and DM
J-PCS and DMs but acts crazy and throws fits over players actually controling thier guys
L- my girl and new to Dnd

So I meet L. She never played before but loves it. J states he will not play with her because "she never played 2nd or 3.0 so she will never be able to play 3.5 correctly, besides this Is MY group:rolleyes: " but hes not DMing C is. Another week or so passes and J drinks a few too many beers one night and punches S in the face over an imagined insult. S leaves they don't speak anymore. So now C, wisely in IMO, asks J not to play anymore, J gets ****** and won't call any of us back for a month or so. We continue playinf w/o him but hes missed. J calls up me and c last week, wants to play a 2 man side campaign with us 2, we agree C makes a Sorceror, I make a wu-jen, we play once and J decides C and I need to take thursday off of work to play because he has it off, I decline so does C as $ makes the world go round and all. He throws his PHB,DMG etc at me tells me to keep it and hes never playing again cause we aren't commited to DnD, and besides its a "little kids game anyway". Anybody else evr have to deal with this kind of crazy behavior inside your groups? Whats your take on this stuff?
Sounds like J really screwed things up. Dump his psychotic ass.
Karma
10-03-06, 04:36 PM I think you should kick J in the balls...

Control issues, insecure, afraid of change, self-centered... possibly a mysogonist.

Kick him in the balls. Besides, you have a new player until your girlfriend cheats on you;). Should be fine since the trouble-maker has left the building.
Saberus
10-03-06, 10:48 PM J needs a shrink (and Prozac), you do not need J
J just sounds like a sexist, egocentric ***hole.

Get him help, or not. He just doesn't come back in any case.
pyropetey9
10-04-06, 05:16 AM if J is going to cause trouble, toss him out on his rear. be prepared for a temper tantrum. i recommend finding a large sack beforehand (a burlap potato sack should suffice, if you can find one in your area), and when the tantrum starts, put it over his head and pin him down until the itchiness breaks his will to fight. if he resists, beat him with sneakers. make sure you tell him how unnecessarily convoluted previous versions of D&D were, and how much simpler the whole game is now. any further problems, please tell him to look me up if he's ever on Long Island. i'll be happy to help him recover his sanity and grip on reality, then shatter both.
MortalPlague
10-04-06, 07:23 AM if J is going to cause trouble, toss him out on his rear. be prepared for a temper tantrum. i recommend finding a large sack beforehand (a burlap potato sack should suffice, if you can find one in your area), and when the tantrum starts, put it over his head and pin him down until the itchiness breaks his will to fight. if he resists, beat him with sneakers. make sure you tell him how unnecessarily convoluted previous versions of D&D were, and how much simpler the whole game is now. any further problems, please tell him to look me up if he's ever on Long Island. i'll be happy to help him recover his sanity and grip on reality, then shatter both.

...that's frightening, man. :uh-huh:

But yeah, I agree with the sentiments presented. Dump 'J'. You don't need him, and he's only dragging your group down.
Aufenshauft
10-05-06, 04:22 PM Okay, I agree with all the 'Dump Him' comments, but wanted to add another concept into this mix:

Groups change constantly.

This is a secret taboo to think about, but it really is true while you are in this age group (which surely am not, thank you... yeah definitely;) ). The average group at this point in their life is switching from beer at the table to coffee, and 1+/week sessions of 4 hours every Wednesday to Saturday only marathons once a month.

I myself have recently experienced all but two players leaving my table, and one of them my wife. This happened because of life events and me insisting on putting a newbie DM into the captain's chair and didn't catch the underlying hate of him because nobody knew how to talk to me :rolleyes:

Not to say your friendships are doomed (though they may be sorely strained if all you have in common is the table), but it is just statistics that this happens. Keep their numbers and do things off the table, and if the table gets light, then that is the time to look for new players. That really is the beauty of the game in some ways, you can always look for new friends and you have a place to start getting to know them. If someone doesn't like the same style of playing, it is a good chance that they won't be good friends for you due to personality differences anyhow.

So, in review, boot the ****** and just take it in stride and see where new players take the group instead. You may be happy to make the change.
albinomonkeyking
10-05-06, 04:49 PM Similar story and I'll even tell who it is because it is central, we will call him Eye though.

First time: In a game with all characters over +3, Eye is a + 8 though, 4 higher than anyone else. He fights a beholder alone when he is weakened and dies, and flips out because no one has the money for true rez, storms out. Calls me the next night, says, "This is what you are going to do," He was a lvl 8, apparently what I am going to let him do is play a lvl 16 stonegiant with 2 mercurial greatswords with pluses on them for daring to kill his character....I say no, good god no, are you insane? He responds, F you you a**hole, go to hell, etc., hangs up on me.

Second time: His character taunts an enemy monk who is a beast in str, the DM warns him not to, he continues to, (he has taken dmg by the way) The monk flurries him, hits with all hits, does over 220 damage, kills his character. Eye flips out that no NPC we fight should be able to do that much dmg. (My character and anothers in that game did over that much a round) Refuses to play until the DM 'gives him' free true rez and free axiomatic template and communication with his diety (as in can speak with him whenever he wants).

Final time: Eye tells guards who won't let him in to the city he is a traveling religious man seeking god in the desert. They simply are stopping in for water. The bluff works, however, when they want to leave a few hours later they find out the city is on lockdown. Eye tries to bluff the guards that the king sent him to stop the criminal, but they are confused because he is a wandering religous man. Eye gets upset because it doesn't look like his plan won't work, accuses me of railroading, argument breaks out, Eye punches me in the face.

I haven't played with Eye since. I see him every weekend however, he is my brother. :)

If it is possible to salvage the relationship, like my case, then do it, but is is so much harder to keep friends than it is family.
FeceMan
10-06-06, 12:06 AM I see him every weekend however, he is my brother. :)
Snap.
Balseraph
10-06-06, 01:06 AM Someone with that many emotional outbursts is not going to be missed in the long run.

The group I game with and I used to hang out with a wider group of gamers, but since we left several years ago, I certainly haven't missed any of them.

There're five of us and we've been gaming together since 2001 now, which isn't bad. :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Moparfiend 10-02-06, 04:38 PM	I'm new to these boards, but not dnd I've been playing since 2nd edition with the same group. We are all 23-30 years old, have jobs one has a wife and kids, one has a kid ,I have a dog,etc so responsibilites some times mess up game day, its to be expected. We have C-usually DMs but PCs as well S-plays pretty consistantly Je-plays cause his older brother S does, but enjoys it now Me- PC and DM J-PCS and DMs but acts crazy and throws fits over players actually controling thier guys L- my girl and new to Dnd So I meet L. She never played before but loves it. J states he will not play with her because "she never played 2nd or 3.0 so she will never be able to play 3.5 correctly, besides this Is MY group:rolleyes: " but hes not DMing C is. Another week or so passes and J drinks a few too many beers one night and punches S in the face over an imagined insult. S leaves they don't speak anymore. So now C, wisely in IMO, asks J not to play anymore, J gets ****** and won't call any of us back for a month or so. We continue playinf w/o him but hes missed. J calls up me and c last week, wants to play a 2 man side campaign with us 2, we agree C makes a Sorceror, I make a wu-jen, we play once and J decides C and I need to take thursday off of work to play because he has it off, I decline so does C as $ makes the world go round and all. He throws his PHB,DMG etc at me tells me to keep it and hes never playing again cause we aren't commited to DnD, and besides its a "little kids game anyway". Anybody else evr have to deal with this kind of crazy behavior inside your groups? Whats your take on this stuff?
malignor 10-02-06, 05:06 PM	Eat less alphabet soup. ... ... But seriously. The best thing I can do is to relate a similar tale. Group At start: Myself, "Boris", "Hork", "Jeez", "Scarecrow", "Polo" - Chapter 1: We are all gaming happily. There are 2 primary DMs... myself and Boris. Primary place of gaming is the apartment shared by Scarecrow and Polo. - Chapter 2: Boris convinces us to let his co-worker, "Tiny", join the group. We all kind of unload on Scarecrow, because he is a tenacious arguer, to the point where some can't stand gaming with him (though outside game, he's hilarious to hang with). Boris claims to speak for the entire group when he tells Scarecrow that nobody likes gaming with him and he's not welcome... in his own home! - Chapter 3: We start playing at Tiny's place, since he wants to be there for his wife and newborn child (reasonable). Unfortunately, it's also a safe haven for alot of pot smoking on behalf of Boris and Tiny, so they're half-there at best. I got nothing against it, since I used to a few years back, but this was excessive, and was dragging the game down. - Chapter 4: Tiny is DMing now (he's an old veteran). Now that Scarecrow is gone, Boris and Tiny pick on Hork with regular criticism and insults. Hork misses a couple games to write university finals and they decide to kill his character and turn the group against him, on a personal level. Backstabbers. - Chapter 5: Polo let them know 4 weeks in advance that he can't make it. Jeez also calls in advance for the same. Since half the group isn't there, and it's Jeez's sister's birthday, I also come, figuring the game is cancelled. Boris phones with violent threats and unreasonable rage. I simply say I quit. Jeez and Polo also quit. - Chapter 6: Scarecrow, Hork, Jeez and myself (along with another new guy) form our own gaming group. We've been happily gaming for the last 2 years. No word from Boris or Tiny (I sent a really insulting email to Boris to make sure of that). May they smoke their lives away. I guess the moral to the story is, if you have problems with some goofball "friend" who's being unreasonable, ditch em. As long as you have a few good friends you can rely on, you don't need some psychotic loose cannon ruining the fun. It's just not enjoyable when you have to walk on eggshells for the sake of someone who needs to grow up and learn self-control. People like that should lose friends. There should be life-affecting consequences for displaying life affecting bad behaviour. Maybe they'll learn something that way. If not, let em rot alone until they do. Otherwise, you're just rewarding them for being an ahe. Pavlov wins... flawless victory.
Reversefigure4 10-02-06, 05:25 PM	Not only do you need a new group, you need new friends.
Aeromus 10-02-06, 05:51 PM	Wow, seems things should be ok without J in the group.
Totentanz 10-02-06, 06:02 PM	Your group isn't doomed at all. You just have a friend (maybe not even that now) who has some emotional problems. You still have a group, you have a new player, and you have by my count 2 DM's. Play on, and leave him to worry about his issues.
PhaedrusXY 10-02-06, 07:39 PM	Not only do you need a new group, you need new friends.:rofl: Mean, but very funny. I'd give it a 5 out of 6. Is J short for Jackass? It should be, from the sounds of it. I say good riddance to him. As Totentanz says, you still have a group.
MerrikCale 10-02-06, 08:59 PM	I lost track somewhere around "I'm new to these boards"
akiio 10-02-06, 09:05 PM	good god man, use some names, not letters! if you're trying to protect identities, then use fake names.
Moon-Lancer 10-02-06, 09:34 PM	i say, just dont play with jackass, and you should be fine. Sounds Like a bitter guy who cant get over 2e, it happens but those are the real people who cant play 3.5.
MyNameForevermore 10-02-06, 10:45 PM	If things are really a problem, just sit down with the group and discuss it. Tell people that you feel like you really want to play with everyone, but that everyone is also going to have to make their own sacrifices to make the game more enjoyable for everyone else. It doesn't necessarily need to be settled by kicking someone out, most of the time just talking it out should help.
MoogleEmpMog 10-02-06, 11:01 PM	Everyone but J in the initial example seems perfectly fine. The group is doomed if they adhere to the Geek Social Fallacies (http://sean.chittenden.org/humor/www.plausiblydeniable.com/opinion/gsf.html) and try to keep J involved in their games; otherwise, they should be fine.
Templetroll 10-03-06, 11:18 AM	I concur with the idea: get rid of J and your gaming will improve with everyone else. Let us know how it goes.
FeceMan 10-03-06, 02:42 PM	I'm new to these boards, but not dnd I've been playing since 2nd edition with the same group. We are all 23-30 years old, have jobs one has a wife and kids, one has a kid ,I have a dog,etc so responsibilites some times mess up game day, its to be expected. We have C-usually DMs but PCs as well S-plays pretty consistantly Je-plays cause his older brother S does, but enjoys it now Me- PC and DM J-PCS and DMs but acts crazy and throws fits over players actually controling thier guys L- my girl and new to Dnd So I meet L. She never played before but loves it. J states he will not play with her because "she never played 2nd or 3.0 so she will never be able to play 3.5 correctly, besides this Is MY group:rolleyes: " but hes not DMing C is. Another week or so passes and J drinks a few too many beers one night and punches S in the face over an imagined insult. S leaves they don't speak anymore. So now C, wisely in IMO, asks J not to play anymore, J gets ****** and won't call any of us back for a month or so. We continue playinf w/o him but hes missed. J calls up me and c last week, wants to play a 2 man side campaign with us 2, we agree C makes a Sorceror, I make a wu-jen, we play once and J decides C and I need to take thursday off of work to play because he has it off, I decline so does C as $ makes the world go round and all. He throws his PHB,DMG etc at me tells me to keep it and hes never playing again cause we aren't commited to DnD, and besides its a "little kids game anyway". Anybody else evr have to deal with this kind of crazy behavior inside your groups? Whats your take on this stuff? Sounds like J really screwed things up. Dump his psychotic ass.
Karma 10-03-06, 04:36 PM	I think you should kick J in the balls... Control issues, insecure, afraid of change, self-centered... possibly a mysogonist. Kick him in the balls. Besides, you have a new player until your girlfriend cheats on you;). Should be fine since the trouble-maker has left the building.
Saberus 10-03-06, 10:48 PM	J needs a shrink (and Prozac), you do not need J J just sounds like a sexist, egocentric ***hole. Get him help, or not. He just doesn't come back in any case.
pyropetey9 10-04-06, 05:16 AM	if J is going to cause trouble, toss him out on his rear. be prepared for a temper tantrum. i recommend finding a large sack beforehand (a burlap potato sack should suffice, if you can find one in your area), and when the tantrum starts, put it over his head and pin him down until the itchiness breaks his will to fight. if he resists, beat him with sneakers. make sure you tell him how unnecessarily convoluted previous versions of D&D were, and how much simpler the whole game is now. any further problems, please tell him to look me up if he's ever on Long Island. i'll be happy to help him recover his sanity and grip on reality, then shatter both.
MortalPlague 10-04-06, 07:23 AM	if J is going to cause trouble, toss him out on his rear. be prepared for a temper tantrum. i recommend finding a large sack beforehand (a burlap potato sack should suffice, if you can find one in your area), and when the tantrum starts, put it over his head and pin him down until the itchiness breaks his will to fight. if he resists, beat him with sneakers. make sure you tell him how unnecessarily convoluted previous versions of D&D were, and how much simpler the whole game is now. any further problems, please tell him to look me up if he's ever on Long Island. i'll be happy to help him recover his sanity and grip on reality, then shatter both. ...that's frightening, man. :uh-huh: But yeah, I agree with the sentiments presented. Dump 'J'. You don't need him, and he's only dragging your group down.
Aufenshauft 10-05-06, 04:22 PM	Okay, I agree with all the 'Dump Him' comments, but wanted to add another concept into this mix: Groups change constantly. This is a secret taboo to think about, but it really is true while you are in this age group (which surely am not, thank you... yeah definitely;) ). The average group at this point in their life is switching from beer at the table to coffee, and 1+/week sessions of 4 hours every Wednesday to Saturday only marathons once a month. I myself have recently experienced all but two players leaving my table, and one of them my wife. This happened because of life events and me insisting on putting a newbie DM into the captain's chair and didn't catch the underlying hate of him because nobody knew how to talk to me :rolleyes: Not to say your friendships are doomed (though they may be sorely strained if all you have in common is the table), but it is just statistics that this happens. Keep their numbers and do things off the table, and if the table gets light, then that is the time to look for new players. That really is the beauty of the game in some ways, you can always look for new friends and you have a place to start getting to know them. If someone doesn't like the same style of playing, it is a good chance that they won't be good friends for you due to personality differences anyhow. So, in review, boot the ****** and just take it in stride and see where new players take the group instead. You may be happy to make the change.
albinomonkeyking 10-05-06, 04:49 PM	Similar story and I'll even tell who it is because it is central, we will call him Eye though. First time: In a game with all characters over +3, Eye is a + 8 though, 4 higher than anyone else. He fights a beholder alone when he is weakened and dies, and flips out because no one has the money for true rez, storms out. Calls me the next night, says, "This is what you are going to do," He was a lvl 8, apparently what I am going to let him do is play a lvl 16 stonegiant with 2 mercurial greatswords with pluses on them for daring to kill his character....I say no, good god no, are you insane? He responds, F you you a**hole, go to hell, etc., hangs up on me. Second time: His character taunts an enemy monk who is a beast in str, the DM warns him not to, he continues to, (he has taken dmg by the way) The monk flurries him, hits with all hits, does over 220 damage, kills his character. Eye flips out that no NPC we fight should be able to do that much dmg. (My character and anothers in that game did over that much a round) Refuses to play until the DM 'gives him' free true rez and free axiomatic template and communication with his diety (as in can speak with him whenever he wants). Final time: Eye tells guards who won't let him in to the city he is a traveling religious man seeking god in the desert. They simply are stopping in for water. The bluff works, however, when they want to leave a few hours later they find out the city is on lockdown. Eye tries to bluff the guards that the king sent him to stop the criminal, but they are confused because he is a wandering religous man. Eye gets upset because it doesn't look like his plan won't work, accuses me of railroading, argument breaks out, Eye punches me in the face. I haven't played with Eye since. I see him every weekend however, he is my brother. :) If it is possible to salvage the relationship, like my case, then do it, but is is so much harder to keep friends than it is family.
FeceMan 10-06-06, 12:06 AM	I see him every weekend however, he is my brother. :) Snap.
Balseraph 10-06-06, 01:06 AM	Someone with that many emotional outbursts is not going to be missed in the long run. The group I game with and I used to hang out with a wider group of gamers, but since we left several years ago, I certainly haven't missed any of them. There're five of us and we've been gaming together since 2001 now, which isn't bad. :)