Is this common? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Is this common? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Enialis_Gryphon
02-01-07, 12:19 AM I was recently invited to play in a game. As I am cursed as the DM for the vast majority of all games. However, here is what threw me off.

This is what I was told for character creation. Roll 5D6, and drop the lowest one. I checked, and indeed, that means the stats are based off of 4D6, not 3. So, you can have up to a 24. Now, in addition to that, you reroll any ones.

The game starts at first level. The flaws option from Unearthed Arcana is used, as is the gestalt option. In addition, you can ignore up to +3 level adjustment.

Are you kidding me??? How common is craziness like this? As I said, I almost never get to play, so I use my standard character creation process. I thought mine was a little over the top. Only because I use the weapon group options. 32 point buy. Max hit points for the first three levels.

Now, I hav done some crazy games, just for fun. Even then, though, the craziest I got was 1D8+10 for each stat.

So, is this common?
Animae_Draconum
02-01-07, 12:24 AM no but if the DM knows how to play the encounters right this campaign is a blast, if he doesnt know how to play encounters this is a joke and you shoudl quit.
Enialis_Gryphon
02-01-07, 12:27 AM Quit? LOL, I never even started. I really don't intend to, either. I am really thinking this is a joke, instead of a blast.

Or, maybe it would be fun? Hmm, I might try it and see... Of course, what do you make with all that crazieness? I am sure something insane...
mtrpcic
02-01-07, 12:33 AM It all depends on how good the DM can handle the situations. You would all be overpowered level ones, but that can make things more interesting. To be honest, it's boring playing a regular level 1 compared to a 5. No true "adventurer" fights rats. Come one..they're effing rats. This way you can fight actual monsters at first level, and not the easy ones that are just jokes.
Animae_Draconum
02-01-07, 12:40 AM I have played in games like this and the DM balanced it by only giving half XP for encounters
Mitchell
02-01-07, 12:55 AM I have played in games like this and the DM balanced it by only giving half XP for encounters

That isn't balance, it just slows down the leveling.
Balance is setting up encounters that are still able to challenge these demigods. :cool:
Ramses III
02-01-07, 01:06 AM I wouldn't play in this campaign. D&D isn't a perfectly balanced game as it is, but this smacks of rank amateurism to me. You get these munchkin characters with overinflated levels of power for their ECL, and you blow through everything you encounter... the DM will either have to drastically alter how much experience the characters get, or they will level up very fast. I'm unfond of accelerating the game in such a way. My play group and I like playing through the lower levels and facing real challenges; you get a sense of character growth and development rather than just of being some crazy superhero (or whatever the 3 levels of free templates or ECL races make you).
Krusk
02-01-07, 01:18 AM I guess that could be fun, if the DM used the same system for all enemies, and buffed up all monsters. And increased all skill check DC's. But by that point why not just go with standard?

Also ignore level adjustment up to +3? i have no idea how to respond to that, thats a pretty good sign it isnt going to end well.

Anyway id suggest you give it a shot, and see how it goes. You can always leave if it sucks.

AS to how common, i hate to say it but here at my college its pretty common. my game group is one of two that does not do this. There are about 5-6 diffrent groups that game. Ive played in two of the ones that did this, and couldnt make it through a session. Too many half vampire lizard folk half dragon clerics//ninja with 16 flaws.
mato_hibiki
02-01-07, 01:49 AM Wow, lucky, all my group gets is 3d6 and rerolling ones and twos.

We fight adult red dragons at fifth level, with a party of three. None of us usually get templates, or anything with a LA.

It's true, it all depends on the DM. So, having said that, give it a shot, you don't know how it's going to turn out until you try it. ;)
Romtos
02-01-07, 08:38 AM I'm using 4d6 drop lowest or 25 PB. HP minimum half HD rounded up, if you throw higher, you're lucky. I feel almost a bad DM now. :D
Witch
02-01-07, 08:43 AM I don't see an inherent problem with it, but it's quite likely to be problematic.
UltimateReality
02-01-07, 09:10 AM Usually 5d6 is done with drop lowest 2...might wanna make sure that's clarified with the DM.

Ignoring up to 3 LA is asking for it though.

If you want a good cheesefest and the DM's half-decent, and the scheduling works out I'd give it a shot. But if your gut tells you this guy doesn't run a game you'd be interested in, don't bother.
Gr8tyrant
02-01-07, 09:34 AM I have run high stat campaigns. I have upped the point buy stystem into the fourties and allowed people to start with up to 20 in any stat before racial changes. It is fun. It is high powered and everything seems a little bit more heroic.

Give it a shot. If it goes poorly leave. Not everyone is going to have the same game style that your last group had.
Kintara
02-01-07, 10:27 AM Well, my friends drifted to a pretty high-powered style. I don't remember the rolling method, but I remember that I was sick of rolling so many dice, so I suggested a compromise standard array of [18 18 18 16 14 14]. Gestalt characters were normal. Personally, I got sort of sick of it after a while. It's like eating a rich buttery meal for every meal, including snacks. I just lost my appetite for it.
DarkNick
02-01-07, 02:39 PM I don't know why you think this is crazy. There are many ways of playing Dnd. It is too easy to get caught up in the whole "a character of this level should be this powerful" kind of thing. I say go with what ever is appropriate for that particular game. Everything is relative. These characters might sound crazy, but within this particular campaign it will most likely will be as challenging as playing a standard character in another. But you get the added enjoyment of crafting something unusual.

Personally I think it adds variety to screw with the 'standard' stuff. Break the mold, step outside your comfort zone, enter the unknown. But if you want to be conservative don't play this game.

This is pretty common. For comparison I currently have a game where the characters roll 6d6 drop the lowest 3 - and everyone started with a fully operational ring of elemental command at 1st level (worth 200,000gp each).

(I am a little worried you would use your "standard character creation process" when really you should be going with what is appropriate for the campaign - i.e. what the DM says, otherwise you are just doing yourself or the other players over)
StevenO
02-01-07, 06:20 PM I certainly hope that isn't a common occurance.

Having an obscene character like that would produce can be entertaining but it requires a lot of work on the DMs part to make the game fun. The CR and EL systems are practically worthless with character so far from standard that all the work balancing the game falls on the DM. From the original criteria it sounds like the game is starting with ECL7+ characters; I think in most cases I'd rather start with a 7th level character than a 1st level one with godly abilities.

Such characters may be fun for a while (I'd expect high mortality rates) but more mature players will be happier with something a lot closer to standard.
Adrian_Crane
02-01-07, 07:56 PM It seems extremely high powered, and it'll take a very good DM to keep it interesting (unless you WANT to steamroll everything in creation).

The "ignore +3 LA" is what worries me. That just sounds ungodly, and of course it means you'll have nothing but +3 LA race/template combos.
DarkNick
02-01-07, 07:57 PM I certainly hope that isn't a common occurance.

Having an obscene character like that would produce can be entertaining but it requires a lot of work on the DMs part to make the game fun. The CR and EL systems are practically worthless with character so far from standard that all the work balancing the game falls on the DM. From the original criteria it sounds like the game is starting with ECL7+ characters; I think in most cases I'd rather start with a 7th level character than a 1st level one with godly abilities.

Such characters may be fun for a while (I'd expect high mortality rates) but more mature players will be happier with something a lot closer to standard.

Well, a DM has a lot of work anyway beyond low starting levels so it does not make that much difference. The CR and EL system are not that good to begin with but they would still be able to be used as a guideline (which is all they are really good for in the first place).
These characters are hardly godly - especially if you put it in the context of a world where your average beginning hero is ECL 7+. Compare these so called 'obsene' characters with epic level characters. How obsene are they then? It is all relative. I would be inclined to agree with some of what you said if these characters were placed in a 1st level adventure, but I doubt this is the case.

Not really sure why you would expect high mortality rates??:confused:

Lastly, I think I could be considered a mature player with a family of my own and over 15 years roleplaying, I certainly don't want standard. Perhaps if I was old and in a resthome I would seek the comfort of something more standard...
Cold Napalm
02-01-07, 08:31 PM Well I havent seen those combination of rules at once, but I have seen those rules (except the 5d6 drop 1) fairly often. It usually doesn't end well. My current game I run has the players at around a 40-48 point buy stats (they rolled really well) and I'm having enough trouble adjusting for just that.

So yeah I wouldn't say something like that isn't rare anymore as people like being uber powerful.
danielinthewolvesden
02-01-07, 08:48 PM I have played and run some high-powered games, such as:

36 Point buy or (your choice)
Gestalt (30pt buy)

(and in others)
4D6, drop 1, re-roll ones ( I got a 47pt point PC, the best I ever rolled!)

Ignore one NPC level or one LA for background
(not in the same game)

All of which were fun. But what the OP describes goes beyond high-powered fun into craziness.
DarkNick
02-01-07, 10:00 PM I think the key thing is not so much what the players do, but more how the DM handles it. If you are confident in adjusting things to suit then it probably won't cause much more work than a standard game - if there is such a thing.

High power is still just a relative thing. Take OPs situation and double it - roll 10d6 drop 1, up to +6 LA for free etc... Does the origninal situation sound so crazy? What if you double it again and again and again...
Tony Vargas
02-01-07, 10:33 PM I've seen some high-stat games, 32 point buy, 3d6 six times /per stat/ take the highest, 77 points (starting at 0, 1:1 all the way up to 18), etc...

But that does sound excessive. IMX, in a campaign like that, there are two likely scenarios: 1) it's just a goofball, ooh and ah at the massive damage you did thing - fun for the first five minutes, but gets boring or 2) as butch as the characters are, the monsters make them look like snack cakes, and you're rolling a new uber-character every session. You could try it out for a session - there's a chance the DM has re-ballanced the entire game around his generous chargen, and it'll still play like a decent game - worst case, it's a few hours of your life you'll never get back.
ConradBland
02-01-07, 11:01 PM Quit? LOL, I never even started. I really don't intend to, either. I am really thinking this is a joke, instead of a blast.

Or, maybe it would be fun? Hmm, I might try it and see... Of course, what do you make with all that crazieness? I am sure something insane...

You will never know until you play in the game. But, you should drop the prejudice attitude about the game. Some really good games can be found in over the top scenarios.
Maybe the DM is into the Exalted mindset, but dislikes its craptacular rules.
Andorxor
02-02-07, 01:45 AM The free LA+3forces everyone to take a LA+3 race,or to be underpowered.It is like 3 free levels but to get them your character must look strange.Do you want to be 3 levels behind the party,without getting more exp to catch up?
Dunsel
02-02-07, 11:19 AM The free LA+3forces everyone to take a LA+3 race,or to be underpowered.It is like 3 free levels but to get them your character must look strange.Do you want to be 3 levels behind the party,without getting more exp to catch up?

IMO, this is the biggest problem. While I was reading the posts in this string, I was wondering how you could take out the LA+3 and keep it balanced. It doesn't make sense to me.

Everything else can be dealt with by a proficient DM.
Sereno
02-02-07, 11:31 AM This will, likely, only be fun if "power! Power!! POWER!!! Bash the monsters and take their phat lewt!!!" is what you're looking for in the game.

Giving the PCs such an incredible power-boost at 1st level is a warning flag, to me.
Enialis_Gryphon
02-02-07, 12:20 PM (I am a little worried you would use your "standard character creation process" when really you should be going with what is appropriate for the campaign - i.e. what the DM says, otherwise you are just doing yourself or the other players over)

I think you misunderstood what I was saying there. I am not going to use my standard character set up for his game, I was merely saying what my standard is when I run a game.
Kardanok
02-02-07, 01:04 PM I think that sort of thing should be up to the DM, and is by no means crazy. However, I personally don't think this would be a fun way to play though. Part of the fun of D&D is the immersion, and overpowered characters ruin any chance of getting immersed in the game world.
ornitholestes
02-06-07, 07:50 PM In my opinion, absolute power has little effect upon the fun of the game. Relative power on the other hand. . .

Relative power doesn't necessarily mean the character's are equal to world around them, it simply means that there are forces out there to challenge them!

Of course, I think most people would agree the meaninglessly overpowerd campaign is an easy trap for the novice to run into. However, I think that *if* the DM makes the characters power a part of the world (perhaps attaching great moral responsibility, or simply great challenges) you can have a fun and very different campaign.

I am reminded of a game I ran one summer (not in D&D, but in a home-brew system, though this is unimportant). The players were powerful semi-divine spirits created because the gods were bored. These gods decided to have a competition: whose teem would be the first to take over the world. The players had high stats , learned magic much easier then the normal population, and had special resistances that let them interact with otherwise deadly super natural creatures. They were far from invincible, but certainly a step above average mortals. Unfortunately, there were other teams backing other gods out there. . .

This turned out to be the best campaign I've ever run in any system. The players got to use lots of neat spells and powers, but also had to face equally mysterious opponents and deal with many plot twists and role-playing challenges (if you want to take on the world, no matter how tough you are you need allies!).

The point of my rambling is this: while the campaign certainly had a high power level, it never degraded into easy fights or pointless dungeon crawling. While a high powered game may be a warning sign, do not condemn it without out at least looking into things.
FntsyWlkr
02-06-07, 08:22 PM Actually this smacks of a trend that surprises me ...

I am surprised by the amount of single-minded thinking that some D&D players express.

It seems like this game is contigent on creativity and imagination, and for people to be so unwilling to take a risk on something different ... it shocks me.

It really does.
Just try it!
It doesn't cost you money. You don't get hurt.
... but in the end ... to each their own.
Icewraith
02-06-07, 09:11 PM As someone who has DMed a high power campaign before, it is my opinion that you can expect one of two things from the rules used in this campaign:

1: The DM doesn't know what he is doing, or doesn't care. The players will steamroll everything thrown at them until the dm gets so frustrated he throws a something so powerful that mathermatics (AC, SR, DR, and damage) dictate a TPK. There will be a breif period of "this is so cool" followed by boredom, far too much treasure, and finally a lot of frustration and the implosion of the campaign..

2: The DM is willing and able to do a large amount of tedious mathematics to still introduce challenging encounters. The players will have a great time, but as they increase in power the DM will find himself spending more and more time on making monsters that the party goes through relatively quickly. Challenging combat can take hours at high level. You will have a lot of fun, and may create characters that no future ones will stand up to. If you make it to epic, your DM is a talented and dogged mathemetician who will still probably burn out after awhile and need to play, and even once he goes back to dming will probably institute more sensible requirements for PCs. Some of the players may have problems adjusting to the power loss and may pine for their old characters.

I've been there and done that, and it's fun... but after awhile, you get tired of adding eight or ten to each stat, gestalting everything just to make it competitive and trying to suspend disbelief as you throw waves of gestalt-classed advanced hit die outsiders at the pcs, since the planes do technically have an infinite supply of baddies.

Which one will it turn out to be? Well- how mature and levelheaded is your DM, how well does he know the rules, and how much is he willing to put into the campaign? If he's willing to do the work, go ahead and play big. You'll probably have a great time.

A word of warning, though... when he's done, he will have had far more practice than you in building monsters and characters that stretch the limits of the rules- all in the name of challenging the PCs, of course. The guy who took over for me is discovering this, I believe.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Enialis_Gryphon 02-01-07, 12:19 AM	I was recently invited to play in a game. As I am cursed as the DM for the vast majority of all games. However, here is what threw me off. This is what I was told for character creation. Roll 5D6, and drop the lowest one. I checked, and indeed, that means the stats are based off of 4D6, not 3. So, you can have up to a 24. Now, in addition to that, you reroll any ones. The game starts at first level. The flaws option from Unearthed Arcana is used, as is the gestalt option. In addition, you can ignore up to +3 level adjustment. Are you kidding me??? How common is craziness like this? As I said, I almost never get to play, so I use my standard character creation process. I thought mine was a little over the top. Only because I use the weapon group options. 32 point buy. Max hit points for the first three levels. Now, I hav done some crazy games, just for fun. Even then, though, the craziest I got was 1D8+10 for each stat. So, is this common?
Animae_Draconum 02-01-07, 12:24 AM	no but if the DM knows how to play the encounters right this campaign is a blast, if he doesnt know how to play encounters this is a joke and you shoudl quit.
Enialis_Gryphon 02-01-07, 12:27 AM	Quit? LOL, I never even started. I really don't intend to, either. I am really thinking this is a joke, instead of a blast. Or, maybe it would be fun? Hmm, I might try it and see... Of course, what do you make with all that crazieness? I am sure something insane...
mtrpcic 02-01-07, 12:33 AM	It all depends on how good the DM can handle the situations. You would all be overpowered level ones, but that can make things more interesting. To be honest, it's boring playing a regular level 1 compared to a 5. No true "adventurer" fights rats. Come one..they're effing rats. This way you can fight actual monsters at first level, and not the easy ones that are just jokes.
Animae_Draconum 02-01-07, 12:40 AM	I have played in games like this and the DM balanced it by only giving half XP for encounters
Mitchell 02-01-07, 12:55 AM	I have played in games like this and the DM balanced it by only giving half XP for encounters That isn't balance, it just slows down the leveling. Balance is setting up encounters that are still able to challenge these demigods. :cool:
Ramses III 02-01-07, 01:06 AM	I wouldn't play in this campaign. D&D isn't a perfectly balanced game as it is, but this smacks of rank amateurism to me. You get these munchkin characters with overinflated levels of power for their ECL, and you blow through everything you encounter... the DM will either have to drastically alter how much experience the characters get, or they will level up very fast. I'm unfond of accelerating the game in such a way. My play group and I like playing through the lower levels and facing real challenges; you get a sense of character growth and development rather than just of being some crazy superhero (or whatever the 3 levels of free templates or ECL races make you).
Krusk 02-01-07, 01:18 AM	I guess that could be fun, if the DM used the same system for all enemies, and buffed up all monsters. And increased all skill check DC's. But by that point why not just go with standard? Also ignore level adjustment up to +3? i have no idea how to respond to that, thats a pretty good sign it isnt going to end well. Anyway id suggest you give it a shot, and see how it goes. You can always leave if it sucks. AS to how common, i hate to say it but here at my college its pretty common. my game group is one of two that does not do this. There are about 5-6 diffrent groups that game. Ive played in two of the ones that did this, and couldnt make it through a session. Too many half vampire lizard folk half dragon clerics//ninja with 16 flaws.
mato_hibiki 02-01-07, 01:49 AM	Wow, lucky, all my group gets is 3d6 and rerolling ones and twos. We fight adult red dragons at fifth level, with a party of three. None of us usually get templates, or anything with a LA. It's true, it all depends on the DM. So, having said that, give it a shot, you don't know how it's going to turn out until you try it. ;)
Romtos 02-01-07, 08:38 AM	I'm using 4d6 drop lowest or 25 PB. HP minimum half HD rounded up, if you throw higher, you're lucky. I feel almost a bad DM now. :D
Witch 02-01-07, 08:43 AM	I don't see an inherent problem with it, but it's quite likely to be problematic.
UltimateReality 02-01-07, 09:10 AM	Usually 5d6 is done with drop lowest 2...might wanna make sure that's clarified with the DM. Ignoring up to 3 LA is asking for it though. If you want a good cheesefest and the DM's half-decent, and the scheduling works out I'd give it a shot. But if your gut tells you this guy doesn't run a game you'd be interested in, don't bother.
Gr8tyrant 02-01-07, 09:34 AM	I have run high stat campaigns. I have upped the point buy stystem into the fourties and allowed people to start with up to 20 in any stat before racial changes. It is fun. It is high powered and everything seems a little bit more heroic. Give it a shot. If it goes poorly leave. Not everyone is going to have the same game style that your last group had.
Kintara 02-01-07, 10:27 AM	Well, my friends drifted to a pretty high-powered style. I don't remember the rolling method, but I remember that I was sick of rolling so many dice, so I suggested a compromise standard array of [18 18 18 16 14 14]. Gestalt characters were normal. Personally, I got sort of sick of it after a while. It's like eating a rich buttery meal for every meal, including snacks. I just lost my appetite for it.
DarkNick 02-01-07, 02:39 PM	I don't know why you think this is crazy. There are many ways of playing Dnd. It is too easy to get caught up in the whole "a character of this level should be this powerful" kind of thing. I say go with what ever is appropriate for that particular game. Everything is relative. These characters might sound crazy, but within this particular campaign it will most likely will be as challenging as playing a standard character in another. But you get the added enjoyment of crafting something unusual. Personally I think it adds variety to screw with the 'standard' stuff. Break the mold, step outside your comfort zone, enter the unknown. But if you want to be conservative don't play this game. This is pretty common. For comparison I currently have a game where the characters roll 6d6 drop the lowest 3 - and everyone started with a fully operational ring of elemental command at 1st level (worth 200,000gp each). (I am a little worried you would use your "standard character creation process" when really you should be going with what is appropriate for the campaign - i.e. what the DM says, otherwise you are just doing yourself or the other players over)
StevenO 02-01-07, 06:20 PM	I certainly hope that isn't a common occurance. Having an obscene character like that would produce can be entertaining but it requires a lot of work on the DMs part to make the game fun. The CR and EL systems are practically worthless with character so far from standard that all the work balancing the game falls on the DM. From the original criteria it sounds like the game is starting with ECL7+ characters; I think in most cases I'd rather start with a 7th level character than a 1st level one with godly abilities. Such characters may be fun for a while (I'd expect high mortality rates) but more mature players will be happier with something a lot closer to standard.
Adrian_Crane 02-01-07, 07:56 PM	It seems extremely high powered, and it'll take a very good DM to keep it interesting (unless you WANT to steamroll everything in creation). The "ignore +3 LA" is what worries me. That just sounds ungodly, and of course it means you'll have nothing but +3 LA race/template combos.
DarkNick 02-01-07, 07:57 PM	I certainly hope that isn't a common occurance. Having an obscene character like that would produce can be entertaining but it requires a lot of work on the DMs part to make the game fun. The CR and EL systems are practically worthless with character so far from standard that all the work balancing the game falls on the DM. From the original criteria it sounds like the game is starting with ECL7+ characters; I think in most cases I'd rather start with a 7th level character than a 1st level one with godly abilities. Such characters may be fun for a while (I'd expect high mortality rates) but more mature players will be happier with something a lot closer to standard. Well, a DM has a lot of work anyway beyond low starting levels so it does not make that much difference. The CR and EL system are not that good to begin with but they would still be able to be used as a guideline (which is all they are really good for in the first place). These characters are hardly godly - especially if you put it in the context of a world where your average beginning hero is ECL 7+. Compare these so called 'obsene' characters with epic level characters. How obsene are they then? It is all relative. I would be inclined to agree with some of what you said if these characters were placed in a 1st level adventure, but I doubt this is the case. Not really sure why you would expect high mortality rates??:confused: Lastly, I think I could be considered a mature player with a family of my own and over 15 years roleplaying, I certainly don't want standard. Perhaps if I was old and in a resthome I would seek the comfort of something more standard...
Cold Napalm 02-01-07, 08:31 PM	Well I havent seen those combination of rules at once, but I have seen those rules (except the 5d6 drop 1) fairly often. It usually doesn't end well. My current game I run has the players at around a 40-48 point buy stats (they rolled really well) and I'm having enough trouble adjusting for just that. So yeah I wouldn't say something like that isn't rare anymore as people like being uber powerful.
danielinthewolvesden 02-01-07, 08:48 PM	I have played and run some high-powered games, such as: 36 Point buy or (your choice) Gestalt (30pt buy) (and in others) 4D6, drop 1, re-roll ones ( I got a 47pt point PC, the best I ever rolled!) Ignore one NPC level or one LA for background (not in the same game) All of which were fun. But what the OP describes goes beyond high-powered fun into craziness.
DarkNick 02-01-07, 10:00 PM	I think the key thing is not so much what the players do, but more how the DM handles it. If you are confident in adjusting things to suit then it probably won't cause much more work than a standard game - if there is such a thing. High power is still just a relative thing. Take OPs situation and double it - roll 10d6 drop 1, up to +6 LA for free etc... Does the origninal situation sound so crazy? What if you double it again and again and again...
Tony Vargas 02-01-07, 10:33 PM	I've seen some high-stat games, 32 point buy, 3d6 six times /per stat/ take the highest, 77 points (starting at 0, 1:1 all the way up to 18), etc... But that does sound excessive. IMX, in a campaign like that, there are two likely scenarios: 1) it's just a goofball, ooh and ah at the massive damage you did thing - fun for the first five minutes, but gets boring or 2) as butch as the characters are, the monsters make them look like snack cakes, and you're rolling a new uber-character every session. You could try it out for a session - there's a chance the DM has re-ballanced the entire game around his generous chargen, and it'll still play like a decent game - worst case, it's a few hours of your life you'll never get back.
ConradBland 02-01-07, 11:01 PM	Quit? LOL, I never even started. I really don't intend to, either. I am really thinking this is a joke, instead of a blast. Or, maybe it would be fun? Hmm, I might try it and see... Of course, what do you make with all that crazieness? I am sure something insane... You will never know until you play in the game. But, you should drop the prejudice attitude about the game. Some really good games can be found in over the top scenarios. Maybe the DM is into the Exalted mindset, but dislikes its craptacular rules.
Andorxor 02-02-07, 01:45 AM	The free LA+3forces everyone to take a LA+3 race,or to be underpowered.It is like 3 free levels but to get them your character must look strange.Do you want to be 3 levels behind the party,without getting more exp to catch up?
Dunsel 02-02-07, 11:19 AM	The free LA+3forces everyone to take a LA+3 race,or to be underpowered.It is like 3 free levels but to get them your character must look strange.Do you want to be 3 levels behind the party,without getting more exp to catch up? IMO, this is the biggest problem. While I was reading the posts in this string, I was wondering how you could take out the LA+3 and keep it balanced. It doesn't make sense to me. Everything else can be dealt with by a proficient DM.
Sereno 02-02-07, 11:31 AM	This will, likely, only be fun if "power! Power!! POWER!!! Bash the monsters and take their phat lewt!!!" is what you're looking for in the game. Giving the PCs such an incredible power-boost at 1st level is a warning flag, to me.
Enialis_Gryphon 02-02-07, 12:20 PM	(I am a little worried you would use your "standard character creation process" when really you should be going with what is appropriate for the campaign - i.e. what the DM says, otherwise you are just doing yourself or the other players over) I think you misunderstood what I was saying there. I am not going to use my standard character set up for his game, I was merely saying what my standard is when I run a game.
Kardanok 02-02-07, 01:04 PM	I think that sort of thing should be up to the DM, and is by no means crazy. However, I personally don't think this would be a fun way to play though. Part of the fun of D&D is the immersion, and overpowered characters ruin any chance of getting immersed in the game world.
ornitholestes 02-06-07, 07:50 PM	In my opinion, absolute power has little effect upon the fun of the game. Relative power on the other hand. . . Relative power doesn't necessarily mean the character's are equal to world around them, it simply means that there are forces out there to challenge them! Of course, I think most people would agree the meaninglessly overpowerd campaign is an easy trap for the novice to run into. However, I think that if the DM makes the characters power a part of the world (perhaps attaching great moral responsibility, or simply great challenges) you can have a fun and very different campaign. I am reminded of a game I ran one summer (not in D&D, but in a home-brew system, though this is unimportant). The players were powerful semi-divine spirits created because the gods were bored. These gods decided to have a competition: whose teem would be the first to take over the world. The players had high stats , learned magic much easier then the normal population, and had special resistances that let them interact with otherwise deadly super natural creatures. They were far from invincible, but certainly a step above average mortals. Unfortunately, there were other teams backing other gods out there. . . This turned out to be the best campaign I've ever run in any system. The players got to use lots of neat spells and powers, but also had to face equally mysterious opponents and deal with many plot twists and role-playing challenges (if you want to take on the world, no matter how tough you are you need allies!). The point of my rambling is this: while the campaign certainly had a high power level, it never degraded into easy fights or pointless dungeon crawling. While a high powered game may be a warning sign, do not condemn it without out at least looking into things.
FntsyWlkr 02-06-07, 08:22 PM	Actually this smacks of a trend that surprises me ... I am surprised by the amount of single-minded thinking that some D&D players express. It seems like this game is contigent on creativity and imagination, and for people to be so unwilling to take a risk on something different ... it shocks me. It really does. Just try it! It doesn't cost you money. You don't get hurt. ... but in the end ... to each their own.
Icewraith 02-06-07, 09:11 PM	As someone who has DMed a high power campaign before, it is my opinion that you can expect one of two things from the rules used in this campaign: 1: The DM doesn't know what he is doing, or doesn't care. The players will steamroll everything thrown at them until the dm gets so frustrated he throws a something so powerful that mathermatics (AC, SR, DR, and damage) dictate a TPK. There will be a breif period of "this is so cool" followed by boredom, far too much treasure, and finally a lot of frustration and the implosion of the campaign.. 2: The DM is willing and able to do a large amount of tedious mathematics to still introduce challenging encounters. The players will have a great time, but as they increase in power the DM will find himself spending more and more time on making monsters that the party goes through relatively quickly. Challenging combat can take hours at high level. You will have a lot of fun, and may create characters that no future ones will stand up to. If you make it to epic, your DM is a talented and dogged mathemetician who will still probably burn out after awhile and need to play, and even once he goes back to dming will probably institute more sensible requirements for PCs. Some of the players may have problems adjusting to the power loss and may pine for their old characters. I've been there and done that, and it's fun... but after awhile, you get tired of adding eight or ten to each stat, gestalting everything just to make it competitive and trying to suspend disbelief as you throw waves of gestalt-classed advanced hit die outsiders at the pcs, since the planes do technically have an infinite supply of baddies. Which one will it turn out to be? Well- how mature and levelheaded is your DM, how well does he know the rules, and how much is he willing to put into the campaign? If he's willing to do the work, go ahead and play big. You'll probably have a great time. A word of warning, though... when he's done, he will have had far more practice than you in building monsters and characters that stretch the limits of the rules- all in the name of challenging the PCs, of course. The guy who took over for me is discovering this, I believe.