Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-17-04, 11:34 AM	Hey all. I'm building a new character for a friend and he wants to base it on Judge Dredd. I got the class down (most likely fighter) but I'm wondering what kind of alignment he might have. He seems Lawful Good at first (jailed the guy for hacking into a service bot of all things) but after he got set-up, kinda turned into Chaotic Good. What do you guys think?
CzarGarrett 09-17-04, 11:46 AM	Well, given that society allowed him to kill the criminals on the spot rather than require he drag them in, then yes, LG then change over to CG
Defcon4 09-17-04, 11:48 AM	Judge Dredd is the epitome of law. Does your knowledge of Dredd come only from the movie? Nevermind. Judge Dredd is Lawful Neutral. He would jail his own mother if he caught her eating sugar (which is an illegal drug in Mega-city 1). One of the funniest scenes in the DC comics series, was when Dredd had to be re-educated (long story), and after the ordeal, the Chief Justice and another Judge was over looking Dredd over looking a huge crowd walking in one direction. They were wondering if Dredd was alright. One old lady was walking in the opposite direction, saying excuse me and being generally roughed up by the uncaring passerby. Dredd walks up to her and says: Dredd: "10 days in the iso-cubes for walking against the crowd." Old lady: hitting Dredd with her purse; "you awfull man!" Dredd: "30 days in the iso-cubes for assaulting a Judge." Chief Justice: "Dredds fine." Lawful Neutral.
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-17-04, 12:07 PM	Sad to say, yes, most of my knowledge comes from the movie. Never had the pleasure of reading his comics. And was Dredd done by an indy-company? Dark Horse, wasn't it? Anyway, thanks a lot. Oh, one more thing, as a fighter, what kind of feats would Dredd take? Or is there another class that might suit him better?
Supercilious 09-17-04, 12:47 PM	I would make him Lawful Neutral, and set him up as a Ranger or a Fighter, but fighter suits him the best.
Perseus 09-17-04, 01:14 PM	Defcon4 is absolutely correct. Lawful Neutral Dredd belives in the absolute authority of the law. Without law, anarchy reigns. The concepts of good and evil are trivial compared to the protection and structure the law provides. Remember that he did judge his best friend.
Kar-Vermin 09-17-04, 01:18 PM	I agree. A card-carrying Lawful Neutral if ever there was one. And yes, if you've seen the movie, I share your pain... :weep: Happy gaming.
Supercilious 09-17-04, 01:29 PM	I think that the JD should be an NPC in charge of a "spanish inquisition" type gestapo organization.
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-17-04, 01:58 PM	Great, but my NEW question is: What feats should my JD character take? Should I focus on melee or range? It's not like I'm gonna find a Lawgiver any where in a fantasy setting!!! Anyway, here are his stats so far. Str - 14 Dex - 14 Con - 14 Int - 12 Wis - 14 Cha - 8 Seriously, I don't think Dredd was a very, err...charismatic fellow. I'd make him stronger but I'm keeping him Human and this is based on Point Buy. Like I said, still not certain about the feats so I really need pointers.
Mister Mayhem 09-17-04, 02:21 PM	Judge Dredd is from the british comic 2000AD, not Dark Horse. Law wise, he probably deserves an alignment all of his own: Lawful Lawful! Lawful neutral will do at a pinch, although when he does break his neutrality, it is 90% likely to be on the good side. Some would argue that the society he lives in is inherently evil, thus making Dredd Lawful Evil, but I disagree. Megacity one might be incredibly strict, but the laws are there for the good of society, not for the furtherence of the judges agenda. And when the law does become evil - as it has done a few times, most memorably during the reign of Judge Cal, he is the first to stand up and fight it. ***** To say Dredd has no charisma is ludicrous - it should be one of his highest stats! This is a man who can bring an entire riot to an end by ordering the crowd to cease and desist. He can make hardened criminals surrender without having to fire a shot. He is a natural leader of men, and could easily have become cheif judge on more than one occasion - instead, turning it down because he felt more needed on the streets. For the JD RPG, Mongoose have him statted (at level 18) thus: Str 17, Dex 15, Con 15, Int 13, Wis 10, Cha 15 Skills: Balance +6, Bluff +8, Climb +5, Computer Use +2, Concentration +12, Drive +7, Intimidate +16, Jump +3, Knowledge (law) +17, Ride +23, Search +12*, Sense Motive +17, Spot +16*, Streetwise +10, Swim +5 I didn't include the feats, because (like a couple of the skills) most of them are meaningless in D&D terms. But you can find the full details here: http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/downloads.php?qsSeries=5) ****** D&D wise, I'd be inclined to make him an LN Paladin Varient if you want to play to his combat aspects (with enough INT to take plenty of skills), or an urban Ranger varient if you want to play to his investigative skills.
Defcon4 09-17-04, 02:21 PM	Remember, charisma represents strength of personality. You don't have to be mister suave to have a high charisma. Dredd is very very intimidating. On the weapon front, you don't have a Lawgiver but you can give it your all to simulate one. How about getting EWP elven double bow, and then taking the PrC exotic weapons master so you can fire in melee without invoking an AoO. There's an enchantment in the arms and equipment guide that stores up to 100 arrows in an extra-dimensional pocket within the bow or crossbow. Get a good collection of magic ammunition and you could have your own Lawgiver-like versatility. The Justicar PrC is also an option. Maybe spend some feats on mounted combat, ride by attack, and trample so you can be on your own Lawmaster. Just remember you want to max your intimidate and use it to good effect.
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-17-04, 08:13 PM	Thanks for the ideas but my DM strictly keeps to the 3 Core books, at least for the moment. Maybe in future. Anyways, for Fantasy Dredd, think I should follow the archer's path and maybe into a PrC? Based on Mongoose Publishing's character and converting it to 3.5, I'd say a rank in Horizon Walker to represent his time travelling through the Cursed Earth? Course, that mean's putting my precious few skill points into a cross-class skill. Also, considering how damn good his saves are, a couple of ranks in Monk sound about right, though it's just for the saves since I won't benefit from her special abilities due to the armor. That or I take the Iron Will and Lightning Reflexes feat. Don't believe that there are such things as ricochet arrows but I can get hi-ex arrows using a keen composite longbow of flaming burst. Armor piercing arrows would probably be more like bypass-damage-reduction arrows. For HTH, I intend to use fists like Dredd did, unless someone else can help me by pointing out any other weapons Dredd used. Keep in mind I'm restricted to the Core books and I'm playing 3.5. Once again, thanks a lot all. :D
Mister Mayhem 09-18-04, 06:51 AM	I'd stick to a single class - Dredd has good saves on the Mongoose sheet simply because the "Street Judge" class has good saves. Remember that Dredd only uses the Lawgiver because thats the standard issue weapon of his time, not because he is a ranged combat specialist. In a fantasy setting, he would probably use a sword just as much as a bow. **** My take would be a paladin with moderate STR, DEX and CON - probably not more than 14, depending how you are generating points. A WIS of at least 12, and high CHA. This leads to a character that doesn't excel in any one stat, but has a good grounding accross the board. (Bear in mind, the mongoose JD has had 4 ability increases from level) Then I'd give him a blunt close-combat weapon, probably a heavy mace (since Dredd, in melee, would use a Daystick), and quite possibly go for Exotic Weapon: Repeating crossbow so that I could carrry pre-loaded clips of different magical ammo once I could afford them. (It can also be used easily from horseback, unlike a longbow). I'd then persuade my DM to let me swap a few class features around, as per page 110 of the PHB. I'd choose to lose Lay on hands, Remove Disease, and Turn Undead, and instead get an innate ability to deal subdual damage with bludgeoning weapons, and some extra skill points and the class skills of Gather Information, Intimidate, and Knowledge: Law.
Pfisiar 09-18-04, 07:50 AM	However, the Paladin is a rather inappropriate class for Dread. Dread doesn't differentiate between good and evil. Doesn't matter who breaks the law, just that they do so. I'm not sure that a core class really fits Dread, aside from Fighter. And honestly, Fighter is so vague that it becomes just a cop out in this case.
psionichamster 09-18-04, 10:35 AM	well, fighter seems to be about right for Dredd...he's tough, resilient, smart in a fight, and takes and gives orders easily... as far as paladin goes, you would have to flip the axes of action (hehehe) in other words, make it a law vs. chaos paladin rather than a good vs. evil pally... it could be done, but you'd need to talk to your dm considerably... as far as feats: For an unarmed/crossbow wielding Judge: Expertise tree Improved unarmed strike (and subsequent feats) Quick draw weapon focus (cross bow or unarmed strike) Endurance and diehard, too the hamster
morning star 09-18-04, 09:36 PM	first up , as a long term fan of ol' stoney face ( 1978 ) , some backround . Judge Dredd appears weekly in britain's 2000ad comic . most of the longer stories , such as the cursed earth saga and the judge child quest , are availible as collected soft cover editions AND are very adaptable to a d'n'd campaign . lets put dredd in his natural environment , mega city 1 . A huge and densely populated city , ruled over by the justice department with an iron first for the greater good of it's teeming masses and surounded on all sides by the after effects of previous atomic wars . laws domiate almost every aspect of the average citizen's life and enforcing those laws are the judges . Judge Dredd is perhaps the greatest judge to have ever worn the eagle badge . he's a tough and skilled fighter , relentless in his pursuit of the guilty , ruthless in his dealings with lawbreakers , intimidating to almost all whom he encounters and above all , epitomises the law , it's applications and all it stands for . he doesn't just enforce the law . HE IS THE LAW . the best possible d'n'd class i can imagine him to be would be the :behold: ENFORCER palidin variant that was presented in dragon 310 . it's description doesn't mention Dredd , but he was the first thing i thought of when i read the article . stat wise i'd make him str 14 , dex 16 , con 18 , int 12 , wis 16 , chr 18 Dredd was always tougher than he was stronger . he 's a smart fighter able to outwit and out manouver his opponents. he's very perceptive esp. concerning whether someones even thinking of breaking the law, and ... very , very intimidating ! i can easily imagine a fantasy version of Dredds world . maybe on the "homebrew" section ? :D
krichaiushii 09-19-04, 12:35 AM	LN - to quote the Anthrax song "Judge Dredd's the Man, he is the Law!" Consider making him a straight up monk. Some nice skills combined with nifty powers, yet secondary (to fighter sorts) combat skills mean you'll talk more than you fight - or at least start out that way.
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-19-04, 12:37 AM	Those are nice stats but impossible with a 28pt buy. Any other suggestions for stats? Also, I might go with the mace and crossbow. Also, I am kinda stuck with the Core books, as stated before (my DM doesn't even use the "Complete" supplements). I'm still thinking about putting a couple of ranks in Monk to help out his saves and increase his unarmed damage output. I know it's kinda, well, not Dredd (Dredd training with monks?) but he does get additional bonus feats. Which reminds me...which sounds more like Dredd? Stunning Fist OR Improved Grapple? Once again, thanks for all the help, especially from the Dredd experts. Keep those tips coming in!!! ***Edit*** Making him a straight up monk is kinda difficult since the class doesn't have the most important skill for Dredd; Intimidate. Also, remember that Dredd wears body armor, the nearest fantasy equivalant, IMHO, being Chainmail (offers good protection without taking too much out of Dexterity). Armor would be out of place on a pure monk since he'd lose a ton of his class features.
krichaiushii 09-19-04, 01:05 AM	Are you going for as near a fantasy-clone as possible or just a PC modeled on Dredd? I presumed the latter with my monk recommendation. With 28 point buy, I would consider the following: 4S 12 2D 10 4C 12 4I 12 6W 14 8Ch 15 An odd number makes for a nice increase at 4th level. This build is aimed at a PC that talks more than fights. For fighting, consider: 6S 14 6D 14 6C 14 2I 10 4W 12 4Ch 12 No odd numbers, but not too shabby in a brawl, plus a slight bonus to Cha and Wis skills (Intimidate and Sense Motive, most likely).
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-19-04, 03:42 AM	I'm going for a near-as-possible fantasy clone. Hard, at least I think so. Dredd talks as much as he fights but I guess it'd be kinda hard to give him a high score. How about... 6pts Str14 6pts Dex14 4pts Con12 4pts Int12 2pts Wis10 6pts Cha14 Okay, so it's confirmed gonna be a mace and crossbow. Maybe even a sap to do non-lethal damage. I'll do a multi-class fighter/monk. 2 levels of monk for the saves, feats and increased unarmed damage. Few more things; can a Fighter/Monk holding a two handed weapon still do an Unarmed Strike by using his knees/feet/legs/etc? Also, I really don't wanna name the character "Dredd", it's "duh!" obvious. Any suggestions?
morning star 09-19-04, 06:46 AM	in the comic , there was always loads of related cultural references i.e all the city blocks where citizens lived were named after famous people from the 20th century that related to the story . for example , Dredd himself has quarters in the Rowdy Yates block , named after the character played by Clint Eastwood in TV show , Rawhide , whom was the readers #1 choice to play Dredd in a movie back in the 80's . so in keeping with this maybe name him after one of the characters played by sly stallone since he did such a sterling job of playing the man back in 95 :rolleyes: or maybe after one of the supporting characters from Dredd's world . Rico ( his "brother" ) , Fargo ( Dredd's "father" ) , Griffen ( former chief judge ) . all good names . and what's the campaign world going to be like ?
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-19-04, 08:28 AM	The campaign world is pretty much generic D&D with the Underdark, standard planes, etc. Nothing special about it. We completed (I think) the Forge of Fury module recently and my DM introduced my character by means of our next quest, which is to find a priceless diamond before the Assasin's Guild decides to kill me. Anyway, back on topic. Rocky and Rambo are way to cliche. How about John Spartan from Demolition Man? How about Hawk from Over The Top? Perhaps one of the lesser known Judges?
Perseus 09-20-04, 12:46 AM	The campaign world is pretty much generic D&D with the Underdark, standard planes, etc. Nothing special about it. We completed (I think) the Forge of Fury module recently and my DM introduced my character by means of our next quest, which is to find a priceless diamond before the Assasin's Guild decides to kill me. Anyway, back on topic. Rocky and Rambo are way to cliche. How about John Spartan from Demolition Man? How about Hawk from Over The Top? Perhaps one of the lesser known Judges? How about Marion Cobretti from Cobra? "Marion's a tough name to grow up with" "I like it" "Yeah, well I always wanted something a little tougher." 'Like what?" "I don't know, maybe Susan"
morning star 09-21-04, 07:38 AM	the problem with lesser known judges is that most of dredd's respected associates tend to be known be their surnames ( giant , anderson , hershey , mcgruder , etc ) and for the most part are women .for some one who's never "known "a woman he's got an awfully amount of of female co worker respect ! :D i'm reconsidering my advice at the moment in favour of a curtly pronouned generic "hard "name . something like Stone or Cobra or Bull etc . something an arnie or stallone 80's movie character would have been called . - - cue random villian as doors explode and henchmen die.... " F@@@ !! it's STONE !!!!! aaaahhhhhh!!! " etc " that's brother STONE , to you !!! " etc......................
Defcon4 09-21-04, 10:22 AM	Way back when i played the Dredd roleplaying game. My charecter was Judge Crucible. Feel free.
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-24-04, 04:06 AM	Anybody got a physical description for Old Stoney Face?
Mister Mayhem 09-24-04, 04:21 AM	Physically, something like Clint Eastwood in his prime. Facially, nobody knows - he never takes that helmet off "on camera" - though the reactions of criminals who have seen it suggest that it isn't pretty (understatment).
Fiery_Fighter_Drake 09-24-04, 05:37 AM	Last question; what sort of armour would Dredd where in a fantasy setting? His body armor is hardly full plate since he still maintains most of his Dexterity. I mentioned Breastplate armour but now I'm not so sure. Any suggestions?
morning star 09-24-04, 07:56 AM	dredds armour consists of a solid helmet , a fire retardent full body suit , shoulder pads , elbow pads and knee pads . in a fantasy setting i'd give him studded leather or scale . it has that fantasy / post apocalypse look and allows for a good dex modifier to be carryed onto AC . give him gauntlets as well as dredds a hands on kinda dude .and a good helmet or a form fitting hood / mask completes the image . the key to dredds look though is a permanent scowl over a rock solid chin !!!