Opportunities for PCs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Opportunities for PCs [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Sel_Carim
01-30-06, 02:17 AM First, I think this is a cool idea. Magic the Gathering could is a unique world which has some great potential.

My question is this, what opportunities would PCs have. Will they be playing the part of creatures, summoned by wizards in a perhaps oppresive society rueld by the magically elite? Or will they actually be playing as the wizards with ruels added to explain summoning, spell pools determined by land ownership and so on. Perhaps this question has already been answered elsewhere but here are my though on the issue.

1. Player characters are creatures in the world. This provides several interesting role playng opportunities. First there is an HUGE number of cool races available for players to be. This would provide no end of chances to create and play characters very unique to the setting. There is also a wide variety of special abilitie to add flavor to the game. There is ample chance for role playing as the world is set up. How do you as a PC handle the fact that your life is very much in control of enormoulsy poweruful wizards who can do with you as they please. They can summon you or your friend to fight for their cause one day and then sacrifice you for an added magical boost the next, not to mention the huge fireballs and other magical powers that get tossed back and forth on a regular basis. How do you feel when you home lands are sunk into the earth by a sink hole spell, not to mention the catastrophic results of a wrath of god spell. This creates a more opresive setting that can provide numerous adventure hooks. Go find an artifact at a wizards command, protect your city from a giant monster that has been summoned to bring your home into subjegation or even a freedom fighter campaign in which the players fight against the wizards who seek to control them. A GM won't have to go far to come up with a game idea.

2. On the other hand, it might be fun to explore the world from the wizards point of view thus allowing the PCs to create characters who actually are controlling the world and fight for domination of it, or just to hold onto their part of it. Admittedly, this is already covered in the CCG version of the game, but it would be fun to try it from a role playing point of view. This would also be a very unique game experience. To my knowlege there are no other RPG style game that take this point of view, that is to say giving characters the kind of power to summon armies to their sides, bind terrible creatures to their wills and cast the most devastating spells imaginalbe. (probably would give rise to a whole new level of munchanism ;) But, honestly no other RPG offers this kind of playing experience and it would be fun to play just because of that.

Given the options, I'm not sure which I would rather play, they both have some great opportunities. Perhaps there is a way to combine the two styles.

If anybody has any thoughs on the subject I for one would love to hear them!
Renkrige
01-30-06, 04:32 PM Based on the AEG hopover from CCG to RPG, Legend of the Five Rings, I can make some educated guesses at least about what the characters might be like in a Magic game.

First of all, I have to say, the idea of a Magic: the Gathering RPG is an exciting one that has seemed to be too long in coming. Though I am no expert in the setting myself (I got trounced once by a hyperactive kid who "taught me to play" by unloading his whole deck at me while laughing.) It is a compelling idea for a game though.

As for the guesses. I would assume, the titular word being Magic, that the characters will be various flavors of mages, likely working for various magical factions alligning with the various elemental flavors of lands available. Chances are you will be starting somewhere below the worldshifting uberpowers you control in the card game, but with the potential of controlling things at a much lower level. You will claim lands on behalf of your house, persuade (either through diplomacy,threats, or magical domination) beasts and races to fight under your banner. You will take on the minions (assassins and whatnot) of your enemy factions whilst gunning for their members, taking their lands, foiling their plots, absorbing their allies, and generally trying to win the war for your side whilst smashing the designs of your enemies. Player character groups will probably have to swallow down a lot of internecine hatreds in order to work together, but will likely be working against adversaries much more insidious and powerful than any of them, so the choice should be easier.

Playing as the creature cards is an interesting idea, though I doubt the developers are likely to shift that far from the implicit focus of the game: Mages and Magery.
Rny2
01-30-06, 08:23 PM Magic d20 has already been done. So's ubermagery. I'll leave Shea to provide the link(s).

. . .

Anyways, within the three levels of divinity, can the chain of command and manipulation be directed upwards (towards the forces) as well as down (towards the mortals)? How often does this occur? Would it require very specific circumstances, or does one only need will and power?

Are there limits to mundane ascension? How far can you go? Utilizing both the powers of the Kaisers and Hibryn, could a member of a mortal race develop to the level of the LAR?

At the current stage of history within the realm, with the LAR being 'ancient,' is the only trace of divinity in the realm that of the dragons, and the meddlers Kaiser/Hibryn? did the divinity of the LAR become dispersed so that all beings were granted a taste, however brief, of divinity, or did the slow process through which they were lost cause the divinity to be wasted away and drained back into the heavens/ rest of multiverse?
the_one_true_shea
01-31-06, 06:38 PM This is a good example of where that get you

Now with that said... ;)

I think that if the actor of "the planeswalker" should enter the player's options. It should be one of epic option only.. in so much as the epic and divine books are brought in.

I have thought for a while that the plansewalker is simply too powerful, and too "outside" of things to make a good player character. They move mountins at "low levels.." but to emulate a true planeswalker you are looking at compleatly dropping level and experience out of the d20. All real planeswalkers are judged not by their "power" but by what they have in their pocket. .. dimensions.. eheh I crack my self up sometimes you must excuse me Now where was I?

Yes planeswalker... umm epic prestige class minume req divine rank 6.. er 3 .. er what do you think? Lesser Major or Demi? Equivalent?
Drindin
02-04-06, 01:23 AM Yes planeswalker... umm epic prestige class minume req divine rank 6.. er 3 .. er what do you think? Lesser Major or Demi? Equivalent?

the 'wizards' of the M:TG world are far to powerful to be viable character classes unless said character is a lesser diety.

This is where combining M:TG with a DND setting gets extraordinarily difficult. The ability to summon some of the most powerful creatures in the world in your sphere of influence an litterally tap the magic coursing through the land in the method they due, summoning armies to do their bidding, is simply... well, it wouldn't happen very often. Very very seldom infact. They would have to be lesser dieties. Each one has a particular sphere they influence, and they can summon the creatures under their sphere to do what they want.

The PC's would probably be given quests, such as heading off a Lords of Demise invasion, perhaps an epic-campaign might be trying to fix what the Kaiser's broke. Maybe they are seeking out the Last Kaiser to help them stop the King of Kaisers. Mayhaps they are trying to find the source of the Riz-Ira, to try and block it. Maybe the PC's exisist in a post-apocalyptic world not unlike the Darksun setting? The final battle has occured already, and all that is left is ruin?

OH! OH! OH! I KNOW!

The M:TG Game and the DND Game would be in different points of time! The M:TG Game could be the 'FINAL SHOWDOWN" Between the Rizwell and the Iradro! The PC's, however, come to exisist after this final showdown! All magic has restored itself to a new balance (The balance of elements prominent in the D20 setting) at the expense of the societies that once exisisted, and the PC's are simply trying to make work in these run-down rough-shod cities, traveling across underused roadways on horse back!

I could see it now! A troup of six characters riding two abreast, with run-down dull plate mail and a motley collection of weapons. The enter into the ruins of what was once a great city. The citizens are being ravaged by maddened cannibals, and they have to find this tribe and kill them.

Many of the creatures that once existed survived the 'Clash of Elements', and simply have changed their elements (ex: White-> none/positive/cold/air/earth, green->none/air/earth fire->fire/earth black->negative/earth/undead blue->aquatic/cold/air) but their abilities remain virtually unchanged.

Blade snakes still exisist, and are once again evolving into higher, and in some cases more primitive, life forms. This would allow us to bring in wyverns, since Kaisers and Wyvers share some common traits (undraconic, yet still dragons, tail-based weapons, no breath weapons). This would also let us bring in watered-down kaiser dragons (less magical powers, a lower-powered dragon that could be available as an intelligent mount).

It would be great!
the_one_true_shea
02-04-06, 09:57 PM The M:TG Game and the DND Game would be in different points of time! The M:TG Game could be the 'FINAL SHOWDOWN" Between the Rizwell and the Iradro! The PC's, however, come to exisist after this final showdown! All magic has restored itself to a new balance (The balance of elements prominent in the D20 setting) at the expense of the societies that once exisisted, and the PC's are simply trying to make work in these run-down rough-shod cities, traveling across underused roadways on horse back!

It would be great!

First... Awesome! I hadnt thought of this this way. M:tG is very Block based. It has a story arc to it. "Planer Invasion" etc. Three blocks right? Dragon Heresy, Rizwell & Iradro, and Epocholypse... uhh yeah E.. just thought of that.. but hows like this?

Two D&D settings. Pre-Block and Post-Block. Before the M:tG set time period, perhaps waaaay before. Like when the Kaiser were still the Kaiser and then again another D&D setting after. The presetting is "apocolypse nigh" and the postsetting is "brave new world"

Not that brave new world! A good brave new world. Perhaps "A bright new future"

The question is.. what is the consequence of the Riz/Ira epocholypse? Would the mana associations be destroyed.. no more black/red/green? Excising the mana from the equation.. after the M:tG set block.. I think we could get away with that. But do we want to?

Perhaps the idea is that post riz/ira conflux.. the rizwell and the iradro seem to dissapear. Because the reason they were so apparent and strange to view was because they had not "settled into place" yet. I would deffinatly think that massivly powerful wizards contesting over the power of the two uber elements would deffinatly leave the world in a shambles.

I mean imagine. Your a Blade Snake tribe..

[card=Blade Snake Tribe]
summon wyrm X:G::G::G:

Place X 3/3 wyrm token creatures into play.

Consequence: Summoning 5 or more token wyrms allows any player to place any one Kaiser dragon card into play at no cost.

King Kaiser needs five at a time, the smart snakes travel in fours

And you just get YOINKED out of the desert to appeare in the middle of some swamp so you can be sacrificed to a

[card=cauldren of demise]
Artifact 5 colorless.

:b::b: Sacrifice a creature to generate 5 rizwell tokens.

The Lords boil bones to make the Rizwell bubble

Not that I'm certain the lords of demise would want to transform blade snakes into rizwell (or anyone into rizwell for that matter) but its not like they are in control of their actions at that point either.

One of the things I have always thought about M:tG "conceptually" things are happening in very oblique ways. A planeswalker attacks another by destroying a city.. or crumbling a mountin.. where exactly do these monsters fight? random places all over the world. Time and space mean nothing to a planeswalker.. I imagine it would be confusing to try and track on the character level. Playing magic aint that confusing.. but it leads to really weird mental imagery.

Side note: I once got really really really jazzed by the idea of making pictures for decks. Not for cards.. for decks. Posters really (kinda like rave flyers) that portrayed the theme and peculiarity of the deck. This one: lots of rats, power coils.. and memnarch complete with two of those wands that can accept spells in them (black&blue raise dead and counter spell) I had this image in mind of Memnarch w/ rats crawling all around his feet, four power coils rising behind him.. and a clockwork dragon rampant in the sky... :cool: but.. the plansewalker.. wasnt memnarch.. memnarch the tool, the toy. Maybe I just havent read enough M:tG literature, but.. are there books that have planeswalker's as characters? Not supportive "uber npcs" but actual struggling people characters?

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sel_Carim 01-30-06, 02:17 AM	First, I think this is a cool idea. Magic the Gathering could is a unique world which has some great potential. My question is this, what opportunities would PCs have. Will they be playing the part of creatures, summoned by wizards in a perhaps oppresive society rueld by the magically elite? Or will they actually be playing as the wizards with ruels added to explain summoning, spell pools determined by land ownership and so on. Perhaps this question has already been answered elsewhere but here are my though on the issue. 1. Player characters are creatures in the world. This provides several interesting role playng opportunities. First there is an HUGE number of cool races available for players to be. This would provide no end of chances to create and play characters very unique to the setting. There is also a wide variety of special abilitie to add flavor to the game. There is ample chance for role playing as the world is set up. How do you as a PC handle the fact that your life is very much in control of enormoulsy poweruful wizards who can do with you as they please. They can summon you or your friend to fight for their cause one day and then sacrifice you for an added magical boost the next, not to mention the huge fireballs and other magical powers that get tossed back and forth on a regular basis. How do you feel when you home lands are sunk into the earth by a sink hole spell, not to mention the catastrophic results of a wrath of god spell. This creates a more opresive setting that can provide numerous adventure hooks. Go find an artifact at a wizards command, protect your city from a giant monster that has been summoned to bring your home into subjegation or even a freedom fighter campaign in which the players fight against the wizards who seek to control them. A GM won't have to go far to come up with a game idea. 2. On the other hand, it might be fun to explore the world from the wizards point of view thus allowing the PCs to create characters who actually are controlling the world and fight for domination of it, or just to hold onto their part of it. Admittedly, this is already covered in the CCG version of the game, but it would be fun to try it from a role playing point of view. This would also be a very unique game experience. To my knowlege there are no other RPG style game that take this point of view, that is to say giving characters the kind of power to summon armies to their sides, bind terrible creatures to their wills and cast the most devastating spells imaginalbe. (probably would give rise to a whole new level of munchanism ;) But, honestly no other RPG offers this kind of playing experience and it would be fun to play just because of that. Given the options, I'm not sure which I would rather play, they both have some great opportunities. Perhaps there is a way to combine the two styles. If anybody has any thoughs on the subject I for one would love to hear them!
Renkrige 01-30-06, 04:32 PM	Based on the AEG hopover from CCG to RPG, Legend of the Five Rings, I can make some educated guesses at least about what the characters might be like in a Magic game. First of all, I have to say, the idea of a Magic: the Gathering RPG is an exciting one that has seemed to be too long in coming. Though I am no expert in the setting myself (I got trounced once by a hyperactive kid who "taught me to play" by unloading his whole deck at me while laughing.) It is a compelling idea for a game though. As for the guesses. I would assume, the titular word being Magic, that the characters will be various flavors of mages, likely working for various magical factions alligning with the various elemental flavors of lands available. Chances are you will be starting somewhere below the worldshifting uberpowers you control in the card game, but with the potential of controlling things at a much lower level. You will claim lands on behalf of your house, persuade (either through diplomacy,threats, or magical domination) beasts and races to fight under your banner. You will take on the minions (assassins and whatnot) of your enemy factions whilst gunning for their members, taking their lands, foiling their plots, absorbing their allies, and generally trying to win the war for your side whilst smashing the designs of your enemies. Player character groups will probably have to swallow down a lot of internecine hatreds in order to work together, but will likely be working against adversaries much more insidious and powerful than any of them, so the choice should be easier. Playing as the creature cards is an interesting idea, though I doubt the developers are likely to shift that far from the implicit focus of the game: Mages and Magery.
Rny2 01-30-06, 08:23 PM	Magic d20 has already been done. So's ubermagery. I'll leave Shea to provide the link(s). . . . Anyways, within the three levels of divinity, can the chain of command and manipulation be directed upwards (towards the forces) as well as down (towards the mortals)? How often does this occur? Would it require very specific circumstances, or does one only need will and power? Are there limits to mundane ascension? How far can you go? Utilizing both the powers of the Kaisers and Hibryn, could a member of a mortal race develop to the level of the LAR? At the current stage of history within the realm, with the LAR being 'ancient,' is the only trace of divinity in the realm that of the dragons, and the meddlers Kaiser/Hibryn? did the divinity of the LAR become dispersed so that all beings were granted a taste, however brief, of divinity, or did the slow process through which they were lost cause the divinity to be wasted away and drained back into the heavens/ rest of multiverse?
the_one_true_shea 01-31-06, 06:38 PM	This is a good example of where that get you Now with that said... ;) I think that if the actor of "the planeswalker" should enter the player's options. It should be one of epic option only.. in so much as the epic and divine books are brought in. I have thought for a while that the plansewalker is simply too powerful, and too "outside" of things to make a good player character. They move mountins at "low levels.." but to emulate a true planeswalker you are looking at compleatly dropping level and experience out of the d20. All real planeswalkers are judged not by their "power" but by what they have in their pocket. .. dimensions.. eheh I crack my self up sometimes you must excuse me Now where was I? Yes planeswalker... umm epic prestige class minume req divine rank 6.. er 3 .. er what do you think? Lesser Major or Demi? Equivalent?
Drindin 02-04-06, 01:23 AM	Yes planeswalker... umm epic prestige class minume req divine rank 6.. er 3 .. er what do you think? Lesser Major or Demi? Equivalent? the 'wizards' of the M:TG world are far to powerful to be viable character classes unless said character is a lesser diety. This is where combining M:TG with a DND setting gets extraordinarily difficult. The ability to summon some of the most powerful creatures in the world in your sphere of influence an litterally tap the magic coursing through the land in the method they due, summoning armies to do their bidding, is simply... well, it wouldn't happen very often. Very very seldom infact. They would have to be lesser dieties. Each one has a particular sphere they influence, and they can summon the creatures under their sphere to do what they want. The PC's would probably be given quests, such as heading off a Lords of Demise invasion, perhaps an epic-campaign might be trying to fix what the Kaiser's broke. Maybe they are seeking out the Last Kaiser to help them stop the King of Kaisers. Mayhaps they are trying to find the source of the Riz-Ira, to try and block it. Maybe the PC's exisist in a post-apocalyptic world not unlike the Darksun setting? The final battle has occured already, and all that is left is ruin? OH! OH! OH! I KNOW! The M:TG Game and the DND Game would be in different points of time! The M:TG Game could be the 'FINAL SHOWDOWN" Between the Rizwell and the Iradro! The PC's, however, come to exisist after this final showdown! All magic has restored itself to a new balance (The balance of elements prominent in the D20 setting) at the expense of the societies that once exisisted, and the PC's are simply trying to make work in these run-down rough-shod cities, traveling across underused roadways on horse back! I could see it now! A troup of six characters riding two abreast, with run-down dull plate mail and a motley collection of weapons. The enter into the ruins of what was once a great city. The citizens are being ravaged by maddened cannibals, and they have to find this tribe and kill them. Many of the creatures that once existed survived the 'Clash of Elements', and simply have changed their elements (ex: White-> none/positive/cold/air/earth, green->none/air/earth fire->fire/earth black->negative/earth/undead blue->aquatic/cold/air) but their abilities remain virtually unchanged. Blade snakes still exisist, and are once again evolving into higher, and in some cases more primitive, life forms. This would allow us to bring in wyverns, since Kaisers and Wyvers share some common traits (undraconic, yet still dragons, tail-based weapons, no breath weapons). This would also let us bring in watered-down kaiser dragons (less magical powers, a lower-powered dragon that could be available as an intelligent mount). It would be great!
the_one_true_shea 02-04-06, 09:57 PM	The M:TG Game and the DND Game would be in different points of time! The M:TG Game could be the 'FINAL SHOWDOWN" Between the Rizwell and the Iradro! The PC's, however, come to exisist after this final showdown! All magic has restored itself to a new balance (The balance of elements prominent in the D20 setting) at the expense of the societies that once exisisted, and the PC's are simply trying to make work in these run-down rough-shod cities, traveling across underused roadways on horse back! It would be great! First... Awesome! I hadnt thought of this this way. M:tG is very Block based. It has a story arc to it. "Planer Invasion" etc. Three blocks right? Dragon Heresy, Rizwell & Iradro, and Epocholypse... uhh yeah E.. just thought of that.. but hows like this? Two D&D settings. Pre-Block and Post-Block. Before the M:tG set time period, perhaps waaaay before. Like when the Kaiser were still the Kaiser and then again another D&D setting after. The presetting is "apocolypse nigh" and the postsetting is "brave new world" Not that brave new world! A good brave new world. Perhaps "A bright new future" The question is.. what is the consequence of the Riz/Ira epocholypse? Would the mana associations be destroyed.. no more black/red/green? Excising the mana from the equation.. after the M:tG set block.. I think we could get away with that. But do we want to? Perhaps the idea is that post riz/ira conflux.. the rizwell and the iradro seem to dissapear. Because the reason they were so apparent and strange to view was because they had not "settled into place" yet. I would deffinatly think that massivly powerful wizards contesting over the power of the two uber elements would deffinatly leave the world in a shambles. I mean imagine. Your a Blade Snake tribe.. [card=Blade Snake Tribe] summon wyrm X:G::G::G: Place X 3/3 wyrm token creatures into play. Consequence: Summoning 5 or more token wyrms allows any player to place any one Kaiser dragon card into play at no cost. King Kaiser needs five at a time, the smart snakes travel in fours And you just get YOINKED out of the desert to appeare in the middle of some swamp so you can be sacrificed to a [card=cauldren of demise] Artifact 5 colorless. :b::b: Sacrifice a creature to generate 5 rizwell tokens. The Lords boil bones to make the Rizwell bubble Not that I'm certain the lords of demise would want to transform blade snakes into rizwell (or anyone into rizwell for that matter) but its not like they are in control of their actions at that point either. One of the things I have always thought about M:tG "conceptually" things are happening in very oblique ways. A planeswalker attacks another by destroying a city.. or crumbling a mountin.. where exactly do these monsters fight? random places all over the world. Time and space mean nothing to a planeswalker.. I imagine it would be confusing to try and track on the character level. Playing magic aint that confusing.. but it leads to really weird mental imagery. Side note: I once got really really really jazzed by the idea of making pictures for decks. Not for cards.. for decks. Posters really (kinda like rave flyers) that portrayed the theme and peculiarity of the deck. This one: lots of rats, power coils.. and memnarch complete with two of those wands that can accept spells in them (black&blue raise dead and counter spell) I had this image in mind of Memnarch w/ rats crawling all around his feet, four power coils rising behind him.. and a clockwork dragon rampant in the sky... :cool: but.. the plansewalker.. wasnt memnarch.. memnarch the tool, the toy. Maybe I just havent read enough M:tG literature, but.. are there books that have planeswalker's as characters? Not supportive "uber npcs" but actual struggling people characters?