D20 was a great universal system that made play easy for all. Now 8 years after 3.0 is released and made easy to play comes the brand new idea of garbage that wizards have produced. 4th edition. What a waste of paper.
How many forest could have been spared in this production by simply scraping this garbage and instead adding to a already brilliant system. Ill admit I purchaed this book and after throughly reading it cover to cover, used it to start a bonfire out back. It takes a great game and turns it into nothing more then number crunching and dice rolling. Thats it. No roleplaying aspects whatsoever. Lets examine it a little more. You have your tanking class (i.e. a paladin) that taunts individual "mobs" into atacking them instead of other players. This is all fine and good except that if the "mob" dosen't attack you then it takes damage!?! I don't know about you but this sounds alot like any MMO I have ever played. If you want to play soemthing like this go and purchase the nearest copy of Wolrd of Warcraft and then at least you'd have visuals to go along with your game play. This is only one facet that fails to deliver. The list could go on. Now to make matters worse nothing else is being used to support 3.5 at all. Sure you find a forum here or there but introducing new players without a resource for them to look up if they have questions. Also pulling all the books that are not 4th edition off the shelves and having them sent back or destroyed. It's like thier forcing us to play this "new" and "improved" garbage. To make matters worse, it's not even a complete handbook. Druids and other main classes will be released in a future printing of the players handbook. So in essence your bying the same book twice only with a few extra pages of classes. Absolutly INSANE!!!
This posting is ,I realize, only my opinion. However it is one that I have heard shared by everyone I know and anyone I have talked to that has played this "game".
Effectivly making all the books that you have purchased obsolete.
Thanks for this... without it I wouldn't have taken your post seriously. But I get it now; you're making fun of all the people who lease a new car each year because they feel that a new model coming out makes their old car unfashionable, right?
I've been playing D&D since before AD&D was released. My group loves 4e, and will never go back to 3.X. I'm confused by people who hate it who have not played it enough to make an informed decision as to it's worth. Does 4e have problems? Sure! But so does every previous version of D&D. I believe 4e is the best of the bunch, to-date, but hope that a 5e comes out in five to ten years to make the game even better. I also hope that, once the PHB II comes out, the "D&D can't exist without rules for player Druids" shouts fade away.
I run 4th edition because my group wants to, but it is not because I think 4th is inherently better.
Seraphan, I feel similarly about this. I don't like 4th. But why go and put up a thread that will continue the edition war? You don't like it. Neither do I. BUT there are those who do. 4th edition targets those people, and it's good that someone enjoys it. But making a thread like this will attract the trolls and the 4th Avengers and h4ters. We really don't need that.
I agree with you here. If you dont like it dont play it. Your not special and no one cares that YOU dont like it. Your just here to talk **** about whatever version of D&D you dont like and these boards are filled with people who love it and hate it. They just have enough sense to keep doing what they want to do instead of badmouthing what other people like.
Druids and other main classes will be released in a future printing of the players handbook. So in essence your bying the same book twice only with a few extra pages of classes. Absolutly INSANE!!!
What you just wrote here is absolutely insane. The future PHBs will be WHOLE NEW BOOKS, exclusively containing WHOLE NEW CLASSES, WHOLE NEW RACES, and WHOLE NEW FEATS.
Good God man! Actually do some research before spouting off such nonsense.
I agree with you here. If you dont like it dont play it. Your not special and no one cares that YOU dont like it. Your just here to talk **** about whatever version of D&D you dont like and these boards are filled with people who love it and hate it. They just have enough sense to keep doing what they want to do instead of badmouthing what other people like.
very nice. A 3.5 grognard and a 4th ed player that agree on something. We're having good progress. And I did enjoy 4th for a short while, so it's not like it was terrible. All of it is D&D to me. There are so many 3.5 books out there that I honestly don't care that they stopped making new ones. It's given me the chance to catch up. We all need to learn to play nicely. And this infighting will make it impossible for us nerds to TAKE OVER THE WORLD!!! :evillaugh GO MY LEGION OF NERDS!:invasion: :invasion: :invasion: :invasion: 
that argues about editions of D&D instead of playing and enjoying their preffered one
4th editon is a joke
So, as long as it makes $ for the WotC shareholders it doesn't matter what they put out.
Just switch to another system.
I suggest a Hands Across D&D convention where grognards and new players alike can enjoy their favorite version of D&D and share those versions with others.
YES! YES! YES! YES! YES! YES! EXCELLENT IDEA! And we bring beer, nachos and chili.
YES! YES! YES! YES! YES! YES! EXCELLENT IDEA! And we bring beer, nachos and chili.
As long as we are outdoors, I could only imagine the smell.
Then not 14 months later came the release of 3.5.
What? The 3.0 PHB was released in August of 2000. The 3.5 books came out in the summer of 2003.
As someone else has mentioned, the 4E PHB II is all new material, not a reprint with a few additional classes.
Play the edition you like. -_-
Seriously. I was a die-hard AD&D DM since I was 10 years old, now 11 years later 4th Edition is out, and I'm a die-hard 4th ED DM. I also play a PC in a friend's 3.5 campaign. Oh, and guess what? He's a PC in my 4th ED campaign!
I upgraded to the new edition because I skipped out on 3.5, I was so jaded by 2nd Ed that I skipped over 3.0/3.5 completely. I was extremely angry that they where discontinuing 2E books so I had no interest in 3.0 because it technically ended my favorite edition. However, now with the release of 4th, I see it as a chance to add more books to my collection, which makes me happy. :D
In a few years 4.5 or 5.0 will be out - and guess what? I'll probably upgrade to that as well. I see previous edition's sourcebooks as material I can upgrade and get ideas from for whatever edition I am currently playing.
One of the big issues I've noticed is the prevalence of people who try to bring "facts" into the equation, attempting to prove the that their opinion is "right". It is truly astounding how few people realize just how fundamentally moronic such a notion is.
And this whole "it's a corporate scheme to take our money, they don't care about us" is nothing new. Oh, it's true (at least as I see it) but it is nothing new. I, personally, had problems with wotc's business model long before 4e was announced, and many would tell you that TSR was as bad or worse.
When I learned that 4th ed was coming I was one of the ones who was worried they would really mess up a game I loved and had played most of my life. However, I still was willing to give it a chance. I really dug it. I also really like the potential insider has. Is it for everyone? No, but what game is.
As far as money grubbing and share holders. Part of a business is making money. I know it sucks, but we all have to pay the bills. They provide a service that I am willing to pay for. If they didn't I would not pay for it.
Also if they were horrible money grubbing bastards would they continue to allow other companies to profit from the D20 liscence? Sure the argument that they saw an increase in sales from the OGL can be made, but what about now?
I don't hate wizards just for being the biggest kids on the block. I do think their development teams are a bit out of touch, I do have problems with every edition. But in the end, htere is still nothing like sittin down with my buddies, breaking out the munchies and letting those dice fly! That is what it is all about right?