*The asterisk represents either a day in which the forums were down for more than eight hours, or a week in which four or more days involved more than eight hours of downtime for the forums, this skewing the activity downwards.
edit: my guess is you're using the display options to filter by "last day" - now that I've looked at it. I didn't realize that was there; usually, I'm making the range bigger, not smaller. ;)
But there is a HUGE problem with using this as a means of what to do..
If there is:
1. Low content.
2. Confusion
3. Disgust
You'll get a misrepresented sample.
Allow me to clarify further:
1. Low content: Check out the Dungeon or Dragon forums...Nothing is coming out...hence very few posts and very few views. Is this a forum that should be merged? Of course not!!! But this is not an anomaly: the forgotten realms and eberron forums will eventually have lots of posts in the same manner...and to some degree the forums themselves dictate the number of posts: have crappy forums, get crappy posts. I can't imagine that I'd go to the forgotten realms forum or the eberron forum if I had no way to find what I was looking for.
2. Confusion: This is a period of adjustment. The forums have been changed for what, less than a week? Why not take a good hard look at how they were used before?
3. Disgust: I know from some posts that some people are really irritated at the confusion and merging. I think that they might need a "cooling off" period just now. You've just reformatted the forums. A "bunch" (maybe a lot, maybe a few) of people are not happy, and don't know where to post, and frankly, might just feel like not posting at all for a few days/weeks.
It (frankly) seems that, while there is an actual desire somewhere to work with forumgoers, there is also a corporate "mission" for how the forums play out. My thoughts are to simply create a "how would you like the forums to be" thread (OR BETTER YET, FORUM), get the thoughts of everyone, and then combine those ideas with the corporate vision (which I don't begrudge WotC, but why not just make the whole process a bit more compatible).
I know during the re-org discussions, we were limited to only 6 forums for 3.5 discussion. Is that number a hard cap, or can even that section be adjusted going forward if activity demonstrates the traffic is there to support a split?
We've made the transition that we had to do. Going forward, we can add as many additional previous edition forums as necessary to support the traffic.
Let's start a new thread on splitting the character building forum where people can make their suggestions. We should also make a thread in Character Building itself, referencing our discussion here, and i'll close and sticky it so that people will hopefully notice the discussion and add their thoughts.
Good ideas.
May I also suggest/ask....
Does campaign/adventure discussion belong in the General Discussion of Fundamantals or the Adventure Workshop area?
Things like KotS and other published adventures go where exaclty? Thee seems to be much interest in them, but are they general or specifically adventure discussion topics?
Which brings yet ANOTHER question. Should there be a section for published and home made adventures? This would help when more published adventures are released so that peopel do not get crowded in trying to find help on a published adventure and being bogged down in house ruled adventures.
It could even be that published adventures belongs in the Rules Q&A section? Not sure how long until the enxt adventures come out to extend KotS but might be something to think about prior.
Also Dungeon will have adventures in it, are those adventures only meant to be in the Dungeon section when it fully launches? Seems a single place for "official" adventures may be better unless so many generate excess topics in just a single forum.
Looking forward to the CB split thread(s).
Let's start a new thread on splitting the character building forum where people can make their suggestions. We should also make a thread in Character Building itself, referencing our discussion here, and i'll close and sticky it so that people will hopefully notice the discussion and add their thoughts.
[thread=1038876]Here is the thread you asked[/thread]
I created threads to be stickied in each of the forums that might be affected directing suggestions here. Please sticky and lock the threads in the following forums:
[thread=1038877]Character Building[/thread]
[thread=1038880]Monsters[/thread]
[thread=1038881]Equipment & Magic Items[/thread]
[THREAD=1038885]Rules Q&A[/thread]
Thanks!
Does campaign/adventure discussion belong in the General Discussion of Fundamantals or the Adventure Workshop area?
AFAIK, Campaign and Adventure Workshop is for discussing published adventures and home-brewed adventures and worlds. Primarily it's for running your own or tailoring published adventures, so it goes in D&D Community.
AFAIK, Campaign and Adventure Workshop is for discussing published adventures and home-brewed adventures and worlds. Primarily it's for running your own or tailoring published adventures, so it goes in D&D Community.
So all threads based on KotS belong in the adventure workshop rather than General Duscussion of the other forums they are currently in?
I would sitll suggest a split between home-brewed and published so that people interest in playing published adventures but dont know the acronyms used for them don't end up getting spoilers for things they wish to find within the game. Some Dms might also appreciate just knowing the division exists, even though they cannot prevent hteir players from reading spoilers on the internet, they will be able to not have to worry about accidental readins as well as player by having published mixed in with home-brewed. So if you don't wish to view the information about published you can easily avoid it by not visiting that forum....just a thought.
Might mean home-brewed versions of published adventured ends up in the published adventure section, but at least it wont give spoilers throughout the entire adventure section.
Of course, this is a taste issue as well as a possible overflow issue that may occur with the initial release of 4th on the official date.
So all threads based on KotS belong in the adventure workshop rather than General Duscussion of the other forums they are currently in?
No.
If someone wants help on Dungeon Mastering in KotS, DM Advice is appropriate. If someone wants to modify one of the monster entries, Monster would be appropriate. If someone wants to alter the treasure, Equipment and Magic Items is appropriate. If someone has a question on the bull rush rules set forth in KotS, Rules Q&A is appropriate.
I would sitll suggest a split between home-brewed and published so that people interest in playing published adventures but dont know the acronyms used for them don't end up getting spoilers for things they wish to find within the game.
In my experience, it is a fine line between home-brewing and running published adventures. People alter published adventures to fit them in their campaign worlds. People have questions on customizing adventures to their specific players. People sometimes want to add more of a horror theme, or replace undead with fey. These questions would appropriately be in the Campaign and Adventure forum, even if it were specifically home-brewed.
People have to expect spoilers for materials that are on the market. There's nothing to be done. If you don't want to bespoiled about Keep on the Shadowfell, I don't think it's too much to ask for you to deduce that Keep on the Shadowfell=KotS
In short, it must be accepted that the forums are going to have some overlap. That's something to be embraced not combatted.
No.
If someone wants help on Dungeon Mastering in KotS, DM Advice is appropriate. If someone wants to modify one of the monster entries, Monster would be appropriate. If someone wants to alter the treasure, Equipment and Magic Items is appropriate. If someone has a question on the bull rush rules set forth in KotS, Rules Q&A is appropriate.
So the prime focus should be on those things such as the monster in general hoping they conform to the actual rules rather than rushed previews of monsters listed in the MM present for KotS so even the topic titles don't require KotS nomenclature to adress a specific monster, treasure, etc.
I guess then having the KotS helps in a way as a spoiler note just in case, but for people that leave it off.....
In my experience, it is a fine line between home-brewing and running published adventures. People alter published adventures to fit them in their campaign worlds. People have questions on customizing adventures to their specific players. People sometimes want to add more of a horror theme, or replace undead with fey. These questions would appropriately be in the Campaign and Adventure forum, even if it were specifically home-brewed.
People have to expect spoilers for materials that are on the market. There's nothing to be done. If you don't want to bespoiled about Keep on the Shadowfell, I don't think it's too much to ask for you to deduce that Keep on the Shadowfell=KotS
In short, it must be accepted that the forums are going to have some overlap. That's something to be embraced not combatted.
I wish there was more blur between home-brewing published adventures. It would show me greate DMing strengths from all players. then the RPGA could just conform to RAW as a way to play, but not everyone would use official rules cleafifications as not all will not alter things anywhere to make better sense for their groups. It isn't that I mind overlap, as I would be fine with a forum that displayed 1000 threads per page and contained everything about D&D in a single forum. :evillaugh
So maybe the thing needed is to get those forum descriptions up first before splitting or merging too much to see what traffic is generated based on If people read the descriptions to know where to post?
You can't make everyone agree or even read prescribed area to post certain things, but at least having them will help some is all I am saying.
Personally I just like the idea of seperate adventure based forums for user-created vs company published. and that is without even thinking about 3PP with the GSL.
OH BOY!Too much interest in the D&D 4e forums.
Like they say, "Its a nice problem to have."Despite multiclassing, a Controller Wizard who dabbles in Fighter is different from a Defender Fighter who dabbles in Wizard. So cross-role classing wouldnt be a problem.
-Why are people still complaining about this, instead of going with it and making it a positive thing? I don't get it...
Actually people are ceasing to complain and are NOT going with it. In fact they are moving. Quite a few have already gone here:
http://www.dragonsfoot.org/forums/index.php
And I'm sure you will all rejoice when I say I'll be there in the next couple days as well. Its obvious what the intentions are with WoTC.
The D&D Previous-Editions General forum could have a sticky thread, where players can post the addressess to websites that are dedicated to specific D&D editions. Maybe even rate each site.
Actually people are ceasing to complain and are NOT going with it. In fact they are moving. Quite a few have already gone here:
http://www.dragonsfoot.org/forums/index.php
And I'm sure you will all rejoice when I say I'll be there in the next couple days as well. Its obvious what the intentions are with WoTC.
-The effect is the same. Protest is protest. That said, "intentions" have already been explained, and quite throughly.
Otherwise, traffic is somewhat constant.
To reiterate: Character Building and Rules Q&A need to be split. 3E: Classes and Class Features should be split. Forgotten Realms and Eberron should be split. Other than that, I think forum traffic seems optimal for each of the remaining forums.
Question: Will Eberron and Forgotten Realms get a split? If so, should we solicit ideas from those communities on how their boards should be divided?
Question: Will Eberron and Forgotten Realms get a split? If so, should we solicit ideas from those communities on how their boards should be divided?
-Based on the traffic I have been keeping track of (37 Active Threads on Friday, 43 Active Threads on Saturday, 35 Active Threads on Sunday), at least the Forgotten Realms section is clearly deserving of a split. While I have not been following the Eberron boards, they, likely, are deserving of a split, too.
-As to how it should be split...I'll have to think on that one...
Forgotten Realms Fundamentals
This would be a place to discuss classes, powers, monsters, spells and other mechanics specific to FR.
Forgotten Realms Community
This would be a place to discuss nations, NPCs, organizations and religions specific to FR, as well as other FR-specific topics general to the community (like "What music should I play at my session when the Zhentarim mercenaries arrive?")
In another thread, I proposed the following...
Forgotten Realms Fundamentals
This would be a place to discuss classes, powers, monsters, spells and other mechanics specific to FR.
Forgotten Realms Community
This would be a place to discuss nations, NPCs, organizations and religions specific to FR, as well as other FR-specific topics general to the community (like "What music should I play at my session when the Zhentarim mercenaries arrive?")
-Fundamentals and General might be better names, I am thinking. I'll run these by the community, see what they think.
Worlds
• Discuss Races, Classes & Powers, Equipment & Magic Items, &c. in Core forums above
• Discuss campaign setting, cosmology, lands & towns, cultures, religions, guilds, whos who, &c. here
Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting
Eberron Campaign Setting
Other Worlds
The consensus I've heard there has been in favor of a Crunch/Fluff split. We wanted to split off the Fluff because, unlike Forgotten Realms, our timeline isn't advancing so the fluff should stay largely the same whether players are making the switch to 4E or not. It keeps our community intact while allowing those with a mind for the rules to share them with their fellows.
Char Build: Being split into 5 forums
Char Opt: Very busy, but okay for now given the nature and history of the forum.
Rules Q&A: We can't split it, since we have one official rules Q&A forum. We also want people to use the search feature to find things on this forum.
DM Advice: Nice to see the traffic here. I think it's good where it is.
Forgotten Realms: I think we're good so far, but we'll watch over the coming weeks to see how much the traffic increases.
Eberron: Looks good as a single forum for now.
Previous Edition Forums: They are looking pretty good on all accounts.
THanks for your contribution. I wholeheartedly agree with your distinction. Can you come up with a better name than "Fluff" and "Crunch". Those are insider terms that newcomers to the forum are unlikely to easile distinguish.
-My own suggestion is to simply replace the term "Crunch" with 'Mechanics', or 'Rules', and the term 'Fluff' with 'Lore'. So, there'd be the Forgotten Realms Mechanics/Rules area, and the Forgotten Realms Realmslore area, and the Eberron Mechanics/Rules area and the Eberron Eberronlore area.
Forgotten Realms: I think we're good so far, but we'll watch over the coming weeks to see how much the traffic increases.
Eberron: Looks good as a single forum for now.
I wish I could say I was surprised by this news.
I hope CM reconsiders that decision. I think FR and Ebberon need a second forum, and the problem is only going to get worse as they get 4th edition releases.
-Yeah, well...You know them...
I hope CM reconsiders that decision. I think FR and Ebberon need a second forum, and the problem is only going to get worse as they get 4th edition releases.
There's space for as many forums as the demand desires over at The Piazza ;)
There's space for as many forums as the demand desires over at The Piazza ;)
-Yeah, well, there isn't here.
Sadly, the emerging consensus in CharOp is, the Eladrin Wand-Dex-War Wizard sucks. Even those who initially spoke glowingly about Eladrin or Wand have withdrawn their initial support.
Outrageously, the Players Handbook identifies Dex as a "key ability" for the Wizard, yet the Wizard class derives virtually no benefit from it. Even the Wand mastery using Dex is an inferior choice of implements.
The Wizard has a Dex problem plus a Wand mastery problem. The Eladrin has a Wizard problem: Eladrin traits make a mediocre Wizard and fail to substantiate the Eladrins Arcane flavor.
On the other hand, the Orb-Wis-Control Wizard is awesome and may even be breakable at Epic levels. So good, opters are wandering if the Elf is in fact the best race for the Wizard class because of the Wis boost, Elven Accuracy trait, 7-square Move, etc. So far, Tiefling, Human, Elf, and in the MM1 Gnome, seem to make the best Arcane Wizard races.
These and other Wizard issues are still under discussion, but as soon as the consensus consolidates, therel be more to say on the Controllers forum. Like, how to fix the Wizard to make the key-Dex synergize better with the Wizard features, and how to fix the Arcane-personifying Eladrin to make an acceptable choice for a Wizard. Even how to fix the Orb implement (if necessary), toning it down without nerfing it into oblivion.
For years we had to live with annoying - even gamebreaking - problems with 3e races and classes. But now in 4e, I hope, as soon the problems become clear, the developers will use errata to tweak the problematic classes and races. So D&D can be as enjoyable and as fair as possible for years to come. The PH1, DMG1 and MM1 are the foundation of D&D for about the next ten years. These books must be as excellent and as robust as possible.
However at this point in time, the discussions are exceedingly technical, belong in the CharOp and dont belong in Controllers. Assessments of Wand-Dex-War versus Orb-Wis-Control, Eladrin versus Tiefling-Human-Elf, and so on, are examples of the areas under technical discussion, which show interest in the Wizard class but stay out of the Controller forum.
When respondants finally settle the main technical disputes, therel be plenty of interest and subject matter to populate the Controller forum. Especially for fixes.
Both General Discussion and Char Op forum are getting more than 50/day, which is past our "Gotta fix it now!"
I don't know Optimization well enough to recommend which thread are inappropriate for the forum, but I've been recommending threads for transfer from the D&D General forum and nothing's been done about it.
Char Op needs a knowledgeable forum lead.
Char Op needs a knowledgeable forum lead.
The grand majority of Char Op vets left for another board over the way Autumn was treated.
Create a new thread in this forum called "Character Optimization Board Threads That Need Moving" and I'll ask one of the VCLs to address the moving.
-wrecan
Also, the chart is updated and I note that Rules Q&A just slammed into triple digits. The General Discussion forum, which, in my opinion, just got worse than the old Concerns & Criticism forum, had 129 active threads in the past 24 hours.
On another note, if things keep going the way they seem, Previous Editions: Adventures, Campaigns & Encounters can probably be merged with Previous Editions General.
Wrecan: Thanks, Haldrik!
Create a new thread in this forum called "Character Optimization Board Threads That Need Moving" and I'll ask one of the VCLs to address the moving.
Aright. Im on it.
Create a sticky thread in each forum called, ASK YOUR QUICK QUESTION HERE!
This thread helps prevent people from creating new threads just to clarify one quick question.
In the CharOp forum, Surreal created such a thread (not yet sticky). The first post explains for a Questioner to start the post with a Q followed by the next number in the sequence. Respondants who know the answer then post with A followed by the same number.
Rules Q&A sets a new record with 111 active threads in a day.
Meanwhile, General Discussion drops down to a "mere" 105 active threads in a day.
With regard to the overflow in D&D General, Rules Q&A, and CharBld Hybrid forums ...
Create a sticky thread in each forum called, ASK YOUR QUICK QUESTION HERE!
I think that's a good idea.
Create a sticky thread in each forum called, ASK YOUR QUICK QUESTION HERE!
This thread helps prevent people from creating new threads just to clarify one quick question.
Done!! Great idea Haldrik!!
However, I just want to point out how surprised even I am at the rapidity with which the 3rd edition boards seem to be losing steam. Most of those boards are now at half the volume they were at only two weeks ago. I suspect that, within a year, the 3rd edition boards will be ready to be merged into a single forum.
However, I just want to point out how surprised even I am at the rapidity with which the 3rd edition boards seem to be losing steam. Most of those boards are now at half the volume they were at only two weeks ago. I suspect that, within a year, the 3rd edition boards will be ready to be merged into a single forum.
Yeah, I've been posting less lately. I have a bunch of deadlines looming. I should be back to normal in a few weeks though. ;)
At any rate, given the increased volume with the release of 4th, I don't know if we can gauge much helpful. One thing I can recommend si that Forgotten Realms needs a split. Eberron's traffic is fading back to pre-merge levels, but FR definitely warrants a second forum.
The list is updated for the week. I'm going away on vacation starying Saturday for an eight-day cruise (Yea!) with limited computer access, so I won't be keeping track of traffic during that time. Should we take the two weeks off, or should I list partial weeks?
-Have fun on that cruise.
-I'd be willing to keep track of a couple of sections for you in the meantime. A couple of us take a couple of different sections, watch the numbers, and give you the info to update when you get back.
At any rate, given the increased volume with the release of 4th, I don't know if we can gauge much helpful. One thing I can recommend si that Forgotten Realms needs a split. Eberron's traffic is fading back to pre-merge levels, but FR definitely warrants a second forum.
-Yeah, well...Mike doesn't think so, even though the numbers support it, and it's been lobbied by multiple individuals, and these numbers are just the "calm before the storm", so...
We probably dont need to subdivide CO because of its tightly interdependent calculations. However, if in the future we need to subdivide it because of heavier traffic, heres a reality check for the topics that CO tends to cover. About 2/3 of threads are discussing one or more classes. About 1/3 of threads are discussing various other statistics separately.
Breakdown of Char Opt topics
Total Striker role = 48 (23%)
Total Defender role = 27 (13%)
Total Controller role = 23 (11%)
Total Leader role = 15 (7%)
Total comparison of cross-role classes: 26 (13%)
Total Other Character Stats (non-class, non-role) = 61 (30%)
General (mentions various overall aspects of D&D): 5 (2%)
Total Striker role = 48 (23%)
- Role Striker: 2
- Role Striker (Wrk): 16
- Role Striker (Wrk Gishy): 3
- Role Striker (Rgr): 14
- Role Striker (Rog): 13
Total Defender role = 27 (13%)
- Role Defender (Ftr): 13
- Role Defender (Ftr Gishy): 2
- Role Defender (Pal): 8
- Role Defender (Pal Gishy): 4
Total Controller role = 23 (11%)
- Role Controller (Wiz): 21
- Role Controller (Wiz Gishy): 2
Total Leader role = 15 (7%)
- Role Leader (Clr): 11
- Role Leader (Wrd): 5
Total comparison of cross-role classes: 26 (13%)
- Classes (mentions various cross-role class comparisons): 24
- Classes (best base for Gish): 2
Total Other Character Stats (non-class, non-role) = 61 (30%)
- Race: 11 (5%)
- Combat statistics (attack, dmg, OA, defs, hp, &c): 11 (5%)
- Equipment: 10 (5%)
- Feats:6
- Paragon (comparisons at Paragon): 3
- Epic (comparisons at Epic): 3
- Ability Scores: 3
- Skills: 3
- Social Encounters: 2
- Char Building General (mentions various character stats) : 9
General (mentions various overall aspects of D&D): 5 (2%)
I want to point out that Forgotten Realms just leapt into the "OMG! We need to split the forum right now!!" criteria initially established by CM. I know that CM is very busy, but it's really out of hand in the FR boards and they're handling it with amazing restraint. They really need their forum split.
This will probably be my last update until a week from Monday.
I want to point out that Forgotten Realms just leapt into the "OMG! We need to split the forum right now!!" criteria initially established by CM. I know that CM is very busy, but it's really out of hand in the FR boards and they're handling it with amazing restraint. They really need their forum split.
-It's not like I (and the rest of us, really) haven't been saying that from the beginning...But, of course, "I think we're good so far, but we'll watch over the coming weeks to see how much the traffic increases.".
Is "fluff" and "crunch" the best way to divide the forum into two? It sounds like a nice way to divide it up, but I haven't been to that forum in a good long time, so I don't really know the "pulse" of what's going on there.
"Realmslore" for the fluff and something else for the crunch (even Forgotten Realms General)
Is "fluff" and "crunch" the best way to divide the forum into two? It sounds like a nice way to divide it up, but I haven't been to that forum in a good long time, so I don't really know the "pulse" of what's going on there.
-Yes. When I asked the community, that was how they wanted things to be split: 'Mechanics' and 'Realmslore'.
Mechanics: What does XYZ item do? How does XYZ spell work?
Realmslore: What year did XYZ die? What happened to XYZ?
While I also like the split of "Realmslore" for fluff and another forum for crunch - from an aesthetic point of view at least - I do wonder if such a split would actually alleviate the problem, or just move the problem to the Realmslore forum.
Is there enough Realms-specific crunch to warrant a forum? Will there be a fair amount of crunch in the campaign setting (such as new races, new powers, etc)?
-When it was first proposed, I was thinking along the same lines. I mean, a question on how to create a Forgotten-Realms related item, or to translate a Forgotten-Realms related spell from one edition to another could theoretically go to the generic threads.
-What it does is alleviate the heavy traffic, as the split between the two is about 66/33. Figure that leaves two pages for the Realmslore page, which is a good amount, and about one for the mechanics page, which is also a good amount.
This will probably be my last update until a week from Monday.
I want to point out that Forgotten Realms just leapt into the "OMG! We need to split the forum right now!!" criteria initially established by CM. I know that CM is very busy, but it's really out of hand in the FR boards and they're handling it with amazing restraint. They really need their forum split.
Yeah, going to start working on this on Monday. Too much discussion is always a nice problem to have. =)
Does someone want to start a thread discussing what they should be split into?
Realmslore Discuss the rich history and flavor of the Forgotten Realms here with other fans of Ed Greenwood's iconic campaign setting
Realms Mechanics Need to know about a race from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting? Or a power? Ask about those - and any other actual FR-themed game rules - here
Those descriptions suck, but they should give an idea.
Does someone want to start a thread discussing what they should be split into?
-They've already been decided upon by the community:
Realmslore: Discuss the lands of Faerûn, a place of great heroes and stark evil, encompassing lands of magic, mystery and high peril.
Realms Mechanics: Discuss the D&D terms, issues, and concepts that encompass the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting.
-They've already been decided upon by the community:
Realmslore: Discuss the lands of Faerûn, a place of great heroes and stark evil, encompassing lands of magic, mystery and high peril.
Realms Mechanics: Discuss the D&D terms, issues, and concepts that encompass the Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting.
Please start a new thread on this so that others may weigh in.
I think there will be. The Swordmage is to be introduced there. I would imagine there will be a lot of Realms-specific Paragon Paths and magic items. Plus, they have to explain the Spellplague, and likely there will be a bunch of FR specific races, rituals and spells.
True enough. Its certainly the most obvious way to split
Please start a new thread on this so that others may weigh in.
In the FR Board I assume cause, there is a thread there discussing it in a genereal
Please start a new thread on this so that others may weigh in.
You mean a thread like this one?
Please start a new thread on this so that others may weigh in.
-If you were paying attention, you'll see that I said "by the community", meaning that the community was already polled, via an existing thread on the topic of the forums being split. Not to sound snippity, but...
Sunday
Character Building: Defenders: 24
Character Building: Strikers: 36
Character Building: Leaders: 18
Character Building: Controllers: 24
Character Building: Hybrid: 33
Character Optimization: 47
Character Development: 17
Monsters: 37
Equipment and Magic Items: 25
Rules Q&A: 97
General Discussion: 98
DM Advice: 37
Player Advice: 12
House Rules: 26
Campaign and Adventure Workshop: 14
Astrid's Parlor: 15
Forgotten Realms: 53
Eberron: 19
Other Worlds: 10
Monster & Races: 13
Classes and Class Features: 22
Equipment: 9
Spells: 15
Adventures: 7
Prior Ed Gen: 11
Monday
Forgotten Realms: 47
-If you were paying attention, you'll see that I said "by the community", meaning that the community was already polled, via an existing thread on the topic of the forums being split. Not to sound snippity, but...
No, I hadn't seen that thread in the FR forums. But it'd probably be best if we make one here as well and link to the discussion in that thread. Thanks.
Kind of like why dogfood and sodas are on the same aisle of the grocery store, because you know everyone that owns a dog is a fat slob that drinks sodas, and everyone who drinks sodas owns a dog....
There is no reason. A sticky should be made in the FR forums to discuss it there. Eberron forum regulars should have no say in what goes on in the FR forums unless hey go there.
No, I hadn't seen that thread in the FR forums. But it'd probably be best if we make one here as well and link to the discussion in that thread. Thanks.
-Consider me parroting what the others mentioned. That said, why not simply move that thread to the D&D Community Business section, then, if it needs to be here? I am assuming that is within your power, just move that thread here, I guess.
There. Done.
Even that comes with a side serving of stupid sauce, though. Really, this isn't rocket science; this affects the FR community, so ask them what they prefer and get on with it. As an added side benefit, they've already been asked and like the idea of splitting into crunch vs fluff.
There. Done.
-Hey, I said I agree. ;)
I'm pretty swamped right now. For a lot of reasons I can't explain, it would help me if you started a thread in this forum. If you don't want to, that's fine, but it's going to delay me getting done what you want me to get done.
On the other hand, splitting forums mean that people interested in both aspects of the forums have to navigate between the two, and probably stop some people whose primary interest lies in one part of the forum from contributing to threads that sound interesting on the other as they only spend time on one subforum.
That's all a prelude to the thought that splitting the CO forum would probably be a bad idea. Most people (in my experience) who browse the forum aren't looking for any specific advice, but rather just any new viewpoints or interesting ideas that people hadn't thought of before.
The charts are updated!
If it is going to be a bit longer than 2 weeks before the forums are stable agian, you may wish to cease counting for now as no results will really matter, save to show what the most diehard database error fighters are participating in.
MY point as I made in the Official Character Sheet thread, and duplicated here, is that it may be futile until the forums become stable again. This was not for Wotc or anyone else, but since you do have other things to do around here as a VCL or whatever for at least one forum, you may wish to save your time. G_Z alreayd knows the forums have errors that could be skewing the data due to forums problems.
So even with the data they may not be able to enable any changes during this maintenance period until everything works.
It was simply to save your time. Thus why I included the
If I didn't somewhat enjoy tedious tasks I wouldn't even be maintaining that char sheet thread, so I know how data collection can be fun and all....but I won't do it when the data cannot be trusted.
So again,
I wouldn't waste my time on it until after the forums become stable agian. 
But come on, Hellmute. They won't understand the corrupted data? That's a bit of a stretch, don't you think?
Sheesh! What's the world coming to when you have me defending CM...
edit: ninja'd by Zherog!
I"m all for criticizing Community Management when it's warranted. Frankly, there's enough blunders (in my opinion) to go on for quite a long time, starting with the instability itself.
But come on, Hellmute. They won't understand the corrupted data? That's a bit of a stretch, don't you think?
Sheesh! What's the world coming to when you have me defending CM...
The day listed is the day I gather the numbers. I record the numbers around 9 am and it represents the prior 24 hours. So when you look at a day it doesn't mean the number of active threads on that day, but since 9 am of the previous day.
-Gotcha.
Right now, the forums seems to be settling in, but there's still too much traffic in some boards. I still recommend the following.
1) Create a "Races" board to be placed above "Monsters"
2) Split Forgotten Realms into two boards.
-Eh, I went back, and I measured 11 for Eberron, and 7 for the Other Published Worlds.
Forgotten Realms" 59 Active Threads
Eberron: 14 Active Threads
Other Published Settings: 8 Active Threads
I didn't update because I couldn't post. I got the numbers as of 9 am yesterday (except for the DM board which was uterly unaccessible). Ill post them when I post today's numbers
-Alright.
Gamer_Zer0,
Since it appears the decision has been made (appropriately) to split Forgotten Realms, and it doesn't seem any other merging or splitting is in the foreseeable future, does it make any sense to continue this analysis, other than idle curiosity?
-wrecan
Week Seven is done!
Gamer_Zer0,
Since it appears the decision has been made (appropriately) to split Forgotten Realms, and it doesn't seem any other merging or splitting is in the foreseeable future, does it make any sense to continue this analysis, other than idle curiosity?
-wrecan
-I have fun, comparing it to the other threads. It's my baby. :D
-Also, note that there should be an asterisk for the last day. All last night (from around 9 PM on), I was not able to access the boards. I don't know when the database error problem was resolved, but it''s certainly possible that this stunted participation.
Havard
2) There have been no forum openings of closings in five weeks!
Geez, talk about shooting the messenger.
Am I the only one who thinks this thread contributes to creating a claustrophobic atmosphere around here? I miss the days when the forums were stable and you could expect your favorite forum to still be around even if you had been away for a few weeks.
This thread is an awesome tool to help make sure that WotC is as informed as possible about our what's happening in our community before we make any additional changes.
But I definitely miss the days when our forums were more stable with less downtime. We're pursuing lots of avenues to see that improved.
This thread is an awesome tool to help make sure that WotC is as informed as possible about our what's happening in our D&D community before we make any additional changes.
But I definitely miss the days when our forums were more stable with less downtime. We're pursuing lots of avenues to see that improved.
fixed ;) lol
Gamer-Zer0, is it productive to continue this analysis, or would it simply be because it's fascinating to see the numbers?
I think we're at the point where any suggestions are based on improving the quality of discussions, rather than traffic-based considerations.
I think we're at the point where any suggestions are based on improving the quality of discussions, rather than traffic-based considerations.
This certainly sounds like a turn for the better!
Havard
Given the promise to split the D&D forums, I don't know if it pays to continue. It takes time to gather this data, and I think we're at the point where any suggestions are based on improving the quality of discussions, rather than traffic-based considerations.
Gamer-Zer0, is it productive to continue this analysis, or would it simply be because it's fascinating to see the numbers?
These numbers are insanely helpful. While we try to make decisions based on improving the quality of discussion, it's always great to have some quanitative analysis to use in conjunction when making a decision.
-The information gathering, I'm just saying, should really be the duty of the section's FL, to save wrecan all that work.
It would be more work to compile the numbers from 16 different FLs.
-That it would. But, it'd give us something "official-like" to do, all the time. I don't feel like I do enough. I'm an overachiever. :D
This really is the sort of thing that should be done on the back end of the database via a script. It would take only a few minutes to write the query. Once the query is written, it would need to be scheduled, and have its output redirected someplace useful.
-If they're rescripting and reformatting the boards, as they are with all of the ongoing construction, might as well...
Any bets on how many asterisks we end up with this week?
With EricB working on the forums and discounting the nightly whatever... 0
EricB forced to do something else other than fix the forums...this week will have at least 8 asterisks.
-With the asterisks, we already have an announcement that they'll be down, so I'll put down a $100 wager...
And how many asterisks would like you to put this down on?
Remember the number you choose in this pool is finite so betting on only 1 asterisk means that 2 or more asterisks occurring makes 1 a losing bet.
:P
And given the low active thread rate I recommend that Running the Realms be immediately merged with Realmslore.
I kid... I kid...
Week Nine is done.
And given the low active thread rate I recommend that Running the Realms be immediately merged with Realmslore.
I kid... I kid...
I was reading your sentence with a very serious tone and almost spit coffee all over my screen when I got to the end.
Thanks for the chuckle. =)
And Lord Karsus, may I suggest that you request appropriate threads be transferred from Realmslore to Running the Realms? People won't post in the new board until they see examples of what threads belong there.
Mike - have you considered talking to one of the tech people about having them write a query for you? It would be a really easy SQL statement for them to write.
This has been suggested before, but....
As for the DDI section I think since most of them are locked forums, then is there really a point? Could you really compress them further? They really have their specific goals there as is.
I'm not checking the locked forums since the number of threads is determined by CM.
Smart move. I just hope even the speed of the DDI forums does not cause the slower ones related to Dragon or Dungeon to be combined. The only useful thing I personally could see would be having forums for the independent DDI tools when they come out, or preemptively.
The other two locked forums will have an active thread show up every time that an article (Dungeon or Dragon) is released.
Mike - have you considered talking to one of the tech people about having them write a query for you? It would be a really easy SQL statement for them to write.
This has been suggested before, but....
Yes, it has been suggested before. By me.
Yes, it has been suggested before. By me.
You too! I gave up after my first attempt. I must have never seen yours because I watched my suggesting it get ignored. Sorry bout that.It just seems silly NOt to do it that way as, well.... "work smarter, not harder"...
It just seems silly NOt to do it that way as, well.... "work smarter, not harder"...
Indeed. The query itself could be written in under 5 minutes. I'm not familiar with the table structure of the database, or I'd write it myself.
The harder part of the process would be arranging to schedule the query. Even that isn't difficult - but with all the current problems, they may not want to add another script to the nightly maintenance chain.
And Lord Karsus, may I suggest that you request appropriate threads be transferred from Realmslore to Running the Realms? People won't post in the new board until they see examples of what threads belong there.
-I am, I am. I've been on vacation since last week, so...Man, look at how the posting drops when I'm not around...:embarrass
Indeed. The query itself could be written in under 5 minutes. I'm not familiar with the table structure of the database, or I'd write it myself.
The harder part of the process would be arranging to schedule the query. Even that isn't difficult - but with all the current problems, they may not want to add another script to the nightly maintenance chain.
I think the server is Apache, but knowing how other things work around here it is Apache under windows....
That means PHP is running under ASP.
First you should NOT run PHP on a windows server. the windows version is meant for single user purposes for people wanting to work with small home LANs without needing a fulltime server.
That said I would not really know how to implement ASP to get it to query correctly, but if not using MSSQL and using MYSQL, then it wouldn't be that hard at all to include the forums dbconnect.php to access the forums, and just count the threads that have been updated since midnight of one day to the next during the archiving process when the forums are disabled anyway. Rather at the very end so you don't count thread that no longer exist.
For anyone knowing MSSQL then it wouldn't be that hard for them either, and just make an admin page within the forums that is just for giving this data.
if (WotC_IP=true){give forums statistics}
It is probably already built into vBulletin, but none of the people in CM know about it, while the actual techs can access it in the blink of an eye....
-When I took the temperature, at 3:27, on Sunday, these are the numbers I got, for the areas I hang out at:
Realmslore: 36
Running the Realms: 6
Eberron: 6
Other Published Settings: 3
Overall, I am extremely pleased with the amount of traffic we're seeing in all areas.
-You might want to have a talk with the Other Published Setting people, via a post there or something, because they are really disliking you (by proxy of things changing) right now. Completely up to you, but that might garner some more activity there. Just sayin'.
-You might want to have a talk with the Other Published Setting people, via a post there or something, because they are really disliking you (by proxy of things changing) right now. Completely up to you, but that might garner some more activity there. Just sayin'.
I've been reading those thread and I think you've been doing a good job of explaining things. I am not sure that I could add anything beyond what you've said.
Gamer Zero: Overall, I am extremely pleased with the amount of traffic we're seeing in all areas.
Yeah. Dividing the Character Building into roles proved to be a good solution.Thanks again for taking care of this. I've been preparing update reports and analysis as we reach the post-reorg 3 month mark. Overall, I am extremely pleased with the amount of traffic we're seeing in all areas.
So,a drop in activity is a reason to be happy,and i'm sure you know which area I'm talking about.
Good day, eh. And welcome to week twelve!
It's the Excel spreadhseet of Dorian Gray!
I've been reading those thread and I think you've been doing a good job of explaining things. I am not sure that I could add anything beyond what you've said.
Even if you did only end up repeating what others have said, I think it would still be appreciated, because you are actually in a position of authority in the forums, whereas the others who have been speaking on your side there don't actually have any official position in the running of the site.
If it consistently falls between five and ten, then it might be a candidate for merger (it's not a hard and fact rule). I don't even see a need to consider merging Eberron until it consistently falls below ten (and it hasn't had a daily count below ten in about a week). But since interest will peak within a year when Eberron products get released, it would seem to make no sense to merge it with another forum only to have to separate it out again less than a year later.
If Eberron gets no bounce from its sourcebooks then I suspect we will be discussing merger... a year or more from now
I'm curious, too: anyone know a reason for the drop-off? Is it just that, after the initial flurry, there's really nothing much to talk about until next year? Have they moved their discussions elsewhere?
As for the drop-off, I have no idea. Traffic in that forum is sporadic. I have a feeling (but I have not looked into it) that there are some Eberron fans who check in every few weeks, make a flurry of posts and then disappear for a few weeks. That flurry spawns conversation and then dies out with nobody to maintain it.
I suspect that if a dedicated Eberron fan were to start a series of thought-provoking threads, the overall thread count would increase. But that's just guesswork on my part. I didn't notice a migration of Eberron fans to other forums, but I haven't been watching all that closely.
Eberron's had only two weeks where it's count average count fell below ten and if you look at the early stats, it over went above 20.
If it consistently falls between five and ten, then it might be a candidate for merger (it's not a hard and fact rule). I don't even see a need to consider merging Eberron until it consistently falls below ten (and it hasn't had a daily count below ten in about a week). But since interest will peak within a year when Eberron products get released, it would seem to make no sense to merge it with another forum only to have to separate it out again less than a year later.
If Eberron gets no bounce from its sourcebooks then I suspect we will be discussing merger... a year or more from now
What about Astrid's Parlor? Based on the last few weeks, especially, it looks like Astrid's may be a candidate for merger. However, I'm guessing that CM has reasons other than thread-count for keeping that forum around. And I'm not knocking that. It's not a bad thing to create a forum in order to foster discussion or to make the boards appear friendlier to a certain category of gamers.
I'm just curious, though, about how CM decides when it's appropriate to look beyond thread-count, and when it's not.
What about Astrid's Parlor? Based on the last few weeks, especially, it looks like Astrid's may be a candidate for merger.
Merge with what? For it to be a candidate, it needs to have another forum with which it makes sense to merge.
I'm no fan of Astrid's, but the only forum with which you could merge it is General Discussion, and that forum is already too busy, with more than 25 active threads every day (and often more than 50).
wrecan:Heck, I think all the unlocked forums in that section should be merged.
Yeah, I probably agree. All the unlocked forums could merge into D&DI General.
The only topic I might want to see a separate forum for is the Gaming Table (including the Character Visualizer and Dungeon Builder) when it comes out. But until it does come out, D&DI General can definitely handle any comments.
For D&DI General, I like the idea of tagging the thread titles with a prefix.
Dragon -
Dungeon -
Compendium -
Abilities Generator -
Encounter Generator -
For now, the traffic is limited by the very few issues that have been put out. Once DDI is live and people are subscribing, I think that we will have more accurate numbers to look at.
Once DDI is live and people are subscribing
... or not. Not everyone is going to subscribe. The issues right now are free, and therefore accessible to everyone. Once you've got to pay to see them, the number of people viewing them is going to shrink.
Dragon General
Dragon Article Discussion
Dungeon General
Dungeon Adventures Discussion
While currently not much discussion goes on in the Announcements, I favor a good clean area like that where things can be read without outside chatter.
Also the Technical area sems to need to remain aas there may always be minor problems that people may need help with, and it is better to have a dedicated area for it rather than trying to ask for technical help in some hodge-podge of other talk.
DDI General pretty much leaves all the rest open.
But having the Dragon and Dungeon combined will allow for specific discussion about those things that may not fit in other forums.
Perhaps Dragon and Dungeon articles can merge into a single forum, since their threads are already prefixed (like "Dragon 366 - Feature - Ritually Speaking" versus "Dungeon 157 - Editorial - Fatality!"). So, readers would already find the article easily enough that they want to discuss.
I overslept. But it's now updated!
(I don't think he'd approve a split by edition -- neither would I.)
It's just that the new edition brought such a big change in the fluff. You wouldn't have to identify it by edition, just by reference to the Spellplague.
But I see your point. Where the settings are concerned, it's probably best to identify broad categories that cut across editions.
-Splitting it by edition is out of the question, and is not going to happen while I am FL of the area. That's just asking a massive flame-war to happen, and truthfully, isn't even making the most of the ability to split in the first place. I have about ten threads that need to be moved to Running the Realms that haven't been taken care of, because this was GenCon weekend, and the VCL hasn't been around, but the Realmslore section would still be pretty high. It'd be nice to see it split again, but as was stated, I really don't know the "best" way for that to happen.
Feel free to PM me any threads you want moved over and I can take care of them.
Feel free to PM me any threads you want moved over and I can take care of them.
-I'll give it another day, as not to bother you, but if Web isn't back by tomorrow night, I'll send a big ol' list to you.
-Anyway, back to that actual discussing, if thread levels stay fairly high as they have been, I actually did think of a third forum that would make sense: 'Forgotten Realms General Discussion', or some such. All of the discussions related to books being released, related humor threads, review threads, preview threads, all of that stuff could be thrown in there.
If the FR section was to have a new section, I would vote for a section for Forgotten Realms players. A place to talk about playing games in the Forgotten Realms, as opposed to discussing lore.
-This is what the Running the Realms section is.
I say however, perhaps it would be better to be Eberron's turn, next.
-The Eberron section does not meet the necessary criteria for forum splits.
Especialy since *other* factors come in the scene there.
I guess - but would FR meets those criteriums?
-Have you been paying attention to the conversation?
-Have you been paying attention to the conversation?
Lightly.
-This is what the Running the Realms section is.
The title of that forum is a little misleading then. It sounds like a DM's forum, with Realmslore being FR General Discussion. Doesn't sound like a place for non-DM players as it is titled.
Anything with fewer than 5 active threads/day needs to be merged ASAP, and any forum with a daily thread usage of more than 50 should also be split immediately. Anything under 10 is a candidate for merger anything over 25 is a candidate for splitting.
The title of that forum is a little misleading then.
-That's what the community liked. I forget who it was, specifically, that mentioned that. Zherog? In short, that's the section to talk about the Forgotten Realms, in relation to D&D (running campaigns, mechanical ideas, specific feats, whatever), whereas the other is to talk about the Forgotten Realms, in general.
-To recap, then:
Realmslore is between the 25 and 50?
-Solice, do you need someone to keep up the activity count?
Even doing one full week would be informative.